Sad day to be a New Yorker.......8-(

[Stanley Steamer]

There will always be "Bad Apples" in any line of work, but I can't see myself standing behind a co-worker who I knew had done wrong.....especially in this field......turn a blind eye on some smaller stuff, and then before you know it, where do you draw the line??.....

"Another officer in the crowd said, "I'll tell you this. The relationship between this department and the district attorney's office is never going to be good after this."

Then who loses??.....everyone!

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/ny_crime/2011/10/28/2011-10-28_nypd_officers_gather_at_bronx_courthouse_in_support_of_indicted_cops_in_ticketfi.html#ixzz1c76j47Ic

[The Anvil]

Dirty cops are worse than common criminals. Common criminals don't take oaths on their honor to uphold the law. A cop forfeits their dignity when they break the law.

[fiddle mike]

I can't say that I'm shocked. There's a reason cops in general are called the "Blue Gang".

[Oss]

well I dont agree with the principle that all cops who let a ticket go are crooks

and I am not defending someone who is in it for money  thats wrong

but lets look at some examples

The brass makes cops quotas and they cops dont like it but they do what they are told

So some people get creative

Anyone ever get a PBA card or get out of jail badge ?

Who has mentioned their father, husband brother is on the force to escape a ticket?

what LEO gets a ticket on their way home from work in another jurisdiction? or for that
matter a fireman or ems worker

How many times is the officer asked not to show up for court so a ticket can be dismissed

The point I am making is there are shades of grey  

edit

And what is wrong with the concept of discretion? Judge has it and dont tell me they dont
fix things and dont tell me the DA never does either

an LEO can give a warning or a ticket
IF HE DOES NOT ACCEPT A BRIBE to kill a ticket what is wrong if there is no
other complainant?  Consequences of a ticket are no longer just a little fine
They are points, possible loss of job, thousands of dollars and the points stay on
for years  I am not talking of a case where someone was hurt, or an accident
just your garden variety ticket on the road which is what the tix scandal is about
and no money I believe is in that scandal
end edit

Now paying money to squash a ticket IMHO crosses the line

but 500k for bail?  and lose a pension you put 17 years in for  thats insane

by the way nobody ever fixed nothing for me or my family

you can have your own opinion

[The Anvil]

well I dont agree with the principle that all cops who let a ticket go are crooks

and I am not defending someone who is in it for money  thats wrong

but lets look at some examples

The brass makes cops quotas and they cops dont like it but they do what they are told

So some people get creative

Anyone ever get a PBA card or get out of jail badge ?

Who has mentioned their father, husband brother is on the force to escape a ticket?

what LEO gets a ticket on their way home from work in another jurisdiction? or for that
matter a fireman or ems worker

How many times is the officer asked not to show up for court so a ticket can be dismissed

The point I am making is there are shades of grey

Now paying money to squash a ticket IMHO crosses the line

but 500k for bail?  and lose a pension you put 17 years in for  thats insane

by the way nobody ever fixed nothing for me or my family

you can have your own opinion

Calling it your job or saying "it's done all the time" doesn't make it okay though. There really are no shades of gray, just degrees of offense. Right is right and wrong is wrong. Speeding is a wrong and so is child molestation, but they're obviously not on the same plane.

That said, taking care of a ticket on the side is one thing but when it becomes systematic it's a problem. Why have the laws at all if those in power can just pick and choose when to enforce them and when not to?

[ptgb]

"Thousands of hours of investigations", "over 1000 pages of court documents", the "monitoring of over 10,000 phone calls", 300 total tickets "fixed" (when I would imagine NYPD write 100's of thousands of them). - source New York Times

And most telling.... from the New York Times article.... "None of the indicted officers were accused of accepting bribes or gratuities."

Do you know how many times your average prosecutor (DA) either dismisses charges or reduces something pretty serious to a very minor charge because they are friends with the guy's defense attorney or knows someone that knows the defendant??? What a bunch of hypocrites.

Don't get me wrong, if you are violating departmental rules... then get charged and punished administratively, but these guys being charged criminally with over 100 counts each for this?!?!?

Please.


... But then again, some people will revel in this only because of their general hatred for cops.

[Stanley Steamer]

Some of my cop buddies here were I work at Athens/Clarke County have tried numerous times to get me to transfer to their Dept.......it's just not something for me.....and I appreciate the tough job they have......One of them is my neighbor just down the street and earlier this year, a low-life ner-do-well shot him in the face and then killed another ACCP Officer as he drove up to back my neighbor up..... ......the guy is complaining about his court assigned lawyers not being "good" enough to trust with his life when he had NO regard for theirs.... ......what a low life thug.....

I realize there can be plenty of blame for the DA's office, the Judges....and the system in general.....and I can understand the cops frustrations when they arrest these punks over and over  for them only to be let go a short time later....I guess the whole system could stand re-working.....

I know it's a small percentage of cops that are crooked and if I were working with them and knew about it, it would eat me up too much to let it slide.....but then some of the others might hold that against me and the day I needed back up, ooops, I didn't hear the radio.....I KNOW it has and does happen....my Paw-in-law has told me many stories of the stuff he saw as a Athens police officer and then Sheriff's Deputy back in the late 60's, early 70's.....a different time to be sure...


http://onlineathens.com/local-news/2011-10-27/accused-cop-killer-hood-demands-new-lawyers

[The Anvil]

... But then again, some people will revel in this only because of their general hatred for cops.

Then again, some people just expect the police to do their jobs properly. Crazy world we live in.

[ptgb]

Then again, some people just expect the police to do their jobs properly. Crazy world we live in.

Don't get me wrong, if you are violating departmental rules... then get charged and punished administratively, but these guys being charged criminally with over 100 counts each for this?!?!?

I guess you missed pretty much the entire point of my post

Not saying anyone of these guys should have been given commendations and a parade for their actions. This should have been handled as a violation of departmental policies and procedures, not some far-reaching criminal enterprise.

If you or someone you know gets a break, it's "police discretion", but if it's someone else, it's "corruption"... right?

[The Anvil]

I guess you missed pretty much the entire point of my post

No I did not.

Not saying anyone of these guys should have been given commendations and a parade for their actions. This should have been handled as a violation of departmental policies and procedures, not some far-reaching criminal enterprise.

A criminal act is a criminal act, whether committed by a police officer or a civilian and should be treated accordingly. One here or there? That's an administrative issue. A regular pattern is systematic and indicative of something bigger and possibly criminal.

If you or someone you know gets a break, it's "police discretion", but if it's someone else, it's "corruption"... right?

I have never asked for or received preferential treatment in any matter involving the law (and I have plenty of contacts I could call in favors to). In fact, when pursuing my Massachusetts Class A firearms permit I could have called an individual and had it taken care of immediately but I paid for a lawyer instead like anyone else. I don't like asking for favors from anyone. So no, not right at all.

[R J]

Some of my cop buddies here were I work at Athens/Clarke County have tried numerous times to get me to transfer to their Dept.......it's just not something for me.....and I appreciate the tough job they have......One of them is my neighbor just down the street and earlier this year, a low-life ner-do-well shot him in the face and then killed another ACCP Officer as he drove up to back my neighbor up..... ......the guy is complaining about his court assigned lawyers not being "good" enough to trust with his life when he had NO regard for theirs.... ......what a low life thug.....

I realize there can be plenty of blame for the DA's office, the Judges....and the system in general.....and I can understand the cops frustrations when they arrest these punks over and over  for them only to be let go a short time later....I guess the whole system could stand re-working.....

I know it's a small percentage of cops that are crooked and if I were working with them and knew about it, it would eat me up too much to let it slide.....but then some of the others might hold that against me and the day I needed back up, ooops, I didn't hear the radio.....I KNOW it has and does happen....my Paw-in-law has told me many stories of the stuff he saw as a Athens police officer and then Sheriff's Deputy back in the late 60's, early 70's.....a different time to be sure...


http://onlineathens.com/local-news/2011-10-27/accused-cop-killer-hood-demands-new-lawyers

From the picture  it looks like he is Black, or of Color.

So where is Jesse Jackson and his cohorts?

[R J]

I issued a lot of verbal warnings in my Tenure.    Oh, trust me, they did not get off the 2nd time around.


After seeing a lot of these people at my retirement, I think it helped.

Now, is that corruption in your eyes?  I'm curious, but hate to side rail this post, so I'll just drop it here..

[The Anvil]

I issued a lot of verbal warnings in my Tenure.    Oh, trust me, they did not get off the 2nd time around.


After seeing a lot of these people at my retirement, I think it helped.

Now, is that corruption in your eyes? 

Depends. An officer is certainly within his rights to use discretion under certain circumstances. THAT is the time for discretion and courtesy. Though if you're letting people off for tear-assing through school zones because you know them? Well then yes, that's corruption. Though as previously mentioned there are different levels of right and wrong. It's "corruption" but not on the same plane as planting evidence or stealing.

Thing is, if the officer felt strongly enough about it to write the ticket and make it a matter of public record then it should either be owned up to or have it's day in court.

 

[fudgie]

Around here, we protect our own. If I or my partner do something solo, we fall together.

[Stanley Steamer]

I issued a lot of verbal warnings in my Tenure.    Oh, trust me, they did not get off the 2nd time around.


After seeing a lot of these people at my retirement, I think it helped.

Now, is that corruption in your eyes?  I'm curious, but hate to side rail this post, so I'll just drop it here..

I'm not talking about "warnings" and officer discretion.......but outright ticket fixing isn't a good thing.....no matter who did it....and like was mentioned below, it could have been handled administratively as long as it wasn't very egregious behavior.......

A couple of guys in the Leisure Services dept. where I work lost their jobs last year for taking $$ for falsifying records of hours for some community service workers.....giving them credit for hours never worked...it was investigated and they found out the CSW's were seeking out these two guys dept. to work in to avoid having to actually do all their time in exchange for $$.....they changed the system to where the CSW's are now assigned to places NOT of their choosing.....and everyone who works them had to take training in ethics and rules......I'm not sure if those two Ex-employees had charges brought against them or not......

[Stanley Steamer]

Some of my cop buddies here were I work at Athens/Clarke County have tried numerous times to get me to transfer to their Dept.......it's just not something for me.....and I appreciate the tough job they have......One of them is my neighbor just down the street and earlier this year, a low-life ner-do-well shot him in the face and then killed another ACCP Officer as he drove up to back my neighbor up..... ......the guy is complaining about his court assigned lawyers not being "good" enough to trust with his life when he had NO regard for theirs.... ......what a low life thug.....

I realize there can be plenty of blame for the DA's office, the Judges....and the system in general.....and I can understand the cops frustrations when they arrest these punks over and over  for them only to be let go a short time later....I guess the whole system could stand re-working.....

I know it's a small percentage of cops that are crooked and if I were working with them and knew about it, it would eat me up too much to let it slide.....but then some of the others might hold that against me and the day I needed back up, ooops, I didn't hear the radio.....I KNOW it has and does happen....my Paw-in-law has told me many stories of the stuff he saw as a Athens police officer and then Sheriff's Deputy back in the late 60's, early 70's.....a different time to be sure...


http://onlineathens.com/local-news/2011-10-27/accused-cop-killer-hood-demands-new-lawyers

From the picture  it looks like he is Black, or of Color.

So where is Jesse Jackson and his cohorts?

Even Jesse wouldn't be stupid enough to have anything to do with this guy.......he is 99.9999999% guilty........and the video cam from the officer's cars will bear that out I'm sure.....he is thought to have killed one of our ACC workers 3 months before the day he car jacked someone....and fled and when he was cornered, he shot my neighbor twice(once in the face)...he lived and is back at work... and then killed the other cop before he could even get out of the car....I had just seen Buddy that morning at breakfast...not knowing it'd be the last time I'd see him again......

this peckerhead hid out for a few days while a massive manhunt went on to find him and being the chickenshit he is, he conveniently made sure a LOT of media was in attendance before surrendering to police.....and "supposedly" had a lot of "Hostages" in the apartment with him at the time.....I hope they prosecute the ones who helped hide him!!!!.......He damn sure didn't want to get shot himself and made sure too many cameras were there for that to happen.......

[Rocketman]

I couldn't read the article because the page was gone.  Therefore, I won't address this particular case or its punishment, but:

The difference between "officer discretion" and unethical/illegal is the motivation.  If there's a conflict of interest, i.e., personal gain, then it's unethical at least.  I don't limit personal gain to financial.  If you're letting off the guy because he's your brother in law, your personal gain is that you don't have to hear about it from your wife when you get home.  If you're letting off the guy because he's a fellow cop, your personal gain is the strengthening of the concept that might get you out of a ticket when the roles are reversed.  If you're letting off the guy because he's the mayor's son, your personal gain is not getting fired (although in this case, the vast majority of the ethical breach is on the mayor's side, for making you fear that repercussion.)  Of course, if you're letting the guy off because he handed you a wad of cash, the personal gain is obvious.  I was in a vehicle where the driver was pulled over, and the office asked the driver what frat he is in, and stated outright if he was in the right frat, he wouldn't have gotten the ticket.  Anytime that punishment is not given out due to reasons completely unrelated to either the crime of the punishment itself, there's a serious problem with the system.
However, if you're letting the guy off because it wasn't a serious enough offense to garner a ticket in your discretion, then everyone has an equal shot, and the case was judged on its merits, not on who you are or who you know.

That being said, Valkyrie riding cops should never ticket other Valkyrie riders.  That's just wrong.
[KIDDING!!!!]

Mark

[Stanley Steamer]

I thought this might be informative for the folks out there that have seen these decals on the back of personal cars and didn't know what they mean......

http://thegeorgiaspeedingticketkiller.com/thin_blue_line.php

After my original, small town bank was bought out by one of the national chains, I finally moved my accts to the same bank my Wife has worked at for almost 18yrs.......and I have never mentioned to anyone in the branches that she works there too....I don't want ,nor expect,  special consideration just because of that....they should give all their customers the same good service....the way it should be......they have always done right by me as it is......