Have you ever wondered how YOUR helmet tests??

[LadyDraco]

This was very cool... The Nolans scored very well 
I was very shocked  on Schuberth! 


http://sharp.direct.gov.uk/home

[Thespian]

 Wow, I wear a Fulme, and it's not even on the list ??? wonder if I'm safe.

[BF]

I have a couple HJC AC-2 half helmets and an Arai Profile full face.  Neither where on the list....but I'm comfortable with my choices. 

[Momz]

Sorta makes you think about the choices you've made. And do you really want to have your state or Federal government mandate your personal choice.

LET THOSE WHO RIDE DECIDE!

[DarkMeister]

Totally bookmarked that link. Thanks!!!

[Lyn-Del]

No half helmets could I find on the list, so apparently they're not rating those.  Just full-face and modulars.

My Shark rated 4 stars, the Nolans did well (from Tracy said) but my HJC full face didn't rank as well.

Mostly, I don't wear a helmet, so what can I say?  No lectures, please.  I know the risks and choose to accept them.

[R J]

Wow, I wear a Fulme, and it's not even on the list ??? wonder if I'm safe.

Do you mean Fulmer?   That is mine also.

[DIGGER]

My son recently told me that he had an old motorcycle helmet 3/4 style and he set it up on the ground and shot a 22 cal rifle at it a bunch of times.   He said that not one bullet penetrated the helmet, just dings........I would have thought it would have gone through.

[Thespian]

Wow, I wear a Fulme, and it's not even on the list ??? wonder if I'm safe.

Do you mean Fulmer?   That is mine also.

 Yea missed the R. I have a long rather than round face and it fits better than anything I've try'd.

[98valk]

http://www.nhtsa.gov/cars/testing/comply/fmvss218/index.html

http://www.webbikeworld.com/motorcycle-helmets/motorcycle-helmet-faq.htm

http://www.smf.org/cert    list of snell certified helmets which also must meet the DOT regs

[BigAl]

Not meant to discredit anyone or any one idea of safety.

Interesting facts on helmet safety and physics behind a helmet.

Yes I wear a helmet.

http://www.bikersrights.com/statistics/notsafe.html

Woman are twice as likely to die in a motorcycle accident as a man is. Most likely due to neck size of hte female.

    
 
 
 
 








 MOTORCYCLE HELMETS
ARE NOT SAFE!

By Steve "Red" Barron

The present testing standard for motorcycle helmets (FMVSS-218) was created almost 30 years ago. The helmet manufacturer's are required to perform all motorcycle helmet testing in a laboratory on a headform. The result is a motorcycle helmet designed to pass the testing standard which is to protect a headform in a laboratory. The testing does not simulate what would happen to a motorcyclist wearing that helmet in the event of an actual accident. The present testing standard does not exceed a simulated impact speed of 13.66 mph, nor does it take into account the stresses that would be transferred to a motorcyclist's neck and spinal cord, the reduced vision and hearing, the effects of a chin strap around the throat, or the effect on the brain when the helmet bounces. As many State's (including California) have enacted laws that mandate motorcyclist's wear a helmet (or become a criminal), the testing standards should reflect what, exactly a helmet will do to a motorcyclist in the event of an actual accident.

If the safety of the motorcyclist is the primary concern, then the testing standards should reflect that As it stands now, the safety Nazi's say that helmets are safe, when the real troth is that helmets can only be proven to protect a headform in a laboratory. Until the testing standards are designed with the motorcyclist's safety as the primary objective, motorcyclist's who ride in mandatory helmet law States will be required, by law, to wear a helmet that is designed to protect a headform, not a motorcyclist. If the testing used crash dummies with sensors (to detect possible injuries), in realistic accident situations (like a car turning left in front of the motorcyclist), we could determine if, in fact, helmets can actually cause injuries. The laws of physics state that a 4 pound helmet, at 50 mph, becomes 200 pounds upon impact. This is a law that cannot be repealed by anyone and it is an indication that the present motorcycle helmets are not as safe as some would claim. One of the requirements of FMVSS-218 is an impact test performed by dropping the helmet (and headform) onto an anvil from a height of no more than 72 inches which simulates an impact speed of 13.66 mph. Using a Newton equation' for a 170 pound rider, with deceleration of the brain being the controlling factor, the following helmet thicknesses would be required:

IMPACT
VELOCITY HELMET
THICKNESS
4 MPH  1"  
10 MPH  1.8"  
15 MPH  4"  
20 MPH  6.5"  
30 MPH  15"  
40 MPH  29"  


The current 1" thick helmets weigh from 2 to 4.5 pounds. If the testing were done at an impact speed of 20 mph, the helmet would have to be at least 6" thick, and weigh 15 to 20 pounds in order to pass testing. The current 4 pound helmet puts a terrible strain on the neck without impacting anything And upon impact, the bending momentum to the neck will more than double. The neck is the weakest link, and FMVSS-218 does not take this into account (as the required headform has no "neck" at all, nor does it simulate a human body at all, as it's only a headform) There have been many motorcyclist's who have become a quadriplegic due to the effects of wearing a helmet. A female motorcyclist wearing a helmet is twice as likely to die ice as likely as a male motorcyclist (this is probably due to the smaller, weaker neck of a female).
Another requirement of FMVSS-218 (S5.4) is that a helmet provides no less than 105 degrees peripheral vision. A drivers license test requires 140 degrees peripheral vision, and a motorcyclist with only 105 degrees peripheral vision is considered to be legally blind Also, when wearing a helmet, the acute decrease in hearing would prevent a person from receiving a drivers license. Therefore, according to DMV regulations, when wearing a helmet a motorcyclist is legally deaf & blind!

Helmet's are not a safety device for motorcyclist's, and mandatory helmet laws are nothing more than a mandatory dress code with the ability to cause injury and death. But a helmet will protect a headform in a laboratory (up to 13.66 mph), unfortunately, headforms do not ride motorcycles.
 

[Psychotic Bovine]

No offense to anyone, but that article that Al quoted appears to have been written by a 12 year old.
Almost all of it was bs.
First off, no helmet can protect a head at any forward speed.  The helmet is designed to protect your head from the impact associated with hitting the ground, not a stationary object that you rode into, or rode into you.
This "expert" also says that helmets reduce vision and hearing.  Total rubbish.  I have no problem hearing traffic, sirens, etc while wearing a helmet.  Also, the viewing area of a helmet is easily greater than your peripheral vision.  The author tries to throw out some basic physics that have nothing to do with how a helmet protects the wearer.  I could probably make up some numbers based on coefficient of drag,thickness, etc and "prove" that human skin protects you from road rash better than wearing leather.  To me, it's simple:  drop a watermelon from 5 feet and see what happens.  Cover the watermelon in 1 inch of Styrofoam and test it again.  What happens?
Motorcycle racers, car racers, parachutists, and fighter pilots all wear helmets.  Are they all putting themselves at greater risk?
If someone doesn't want to wear a helmet, that's fine with me.  But, don't make up "facts" that say wearing one is dangerous.

[98valk]

No offense to anyone, but that article that Al quoted appears to have been written by a 12 year old.
Almost all of it was bs.
First off, no helmet can protect a head at any forward speed.  The helmet is designed to protect your head from the impact associated with hitting the ground, not a stationary object that you rode into, or rode into you.
This "expert" also says that helmets reduce vision and hearing.  Total rubbish.  I have no problem hearing traffic, sirens, etc while wearing a helmet.  Also, the viewing area of a helmet is easily greater than your peripheral vision.  The author tries to throw out some basic physics that have nothing to do with how a helmet protects the wearer.  I could probably make up some numbers based on coefficient of drag,thickness, etc and "prove" that human skin protects you from road rash better than wearing leather.  To me, it's simple:  drop a watermelon from 5 feet and see what happens.  Cover the watermelon in 1 inch of Styrofoam and test it again.  What happens?
Motorcycle racers, car racers, parachutists, and fighter pilots all wear helmets.  Are they all putting themselves at greater risk?
If someone doesn't want to wear a helmet, that's fine with me.  But, don't make up "facts" that say wearing one is dangerous.

+10

[rainman]

I wear a helmet when I have to or if riding in the rain. But like I have always said that the differents
is.........a open casket or a closed casket. It is just like being told you have to wear a seat belt.
this is the land of the free.  let each one of us make our own minds up how we want live or die

[BigAl]

University of Tennessee did a study but apparently did not publish the study on the Cloud(INternet).

But the study showed a helmet that performed best at protecting the brain of a human, was a Hockey Helmet.

But they are not DOT Legal, so the best helmet to protect your head has been deemed illegal.

Figures.

Not really interested in your safety, just helmet manufacturers bottom line.

The best helmet to keep you alive is the full open faced helmet, per their testing and statistics.

Not keeping you from scraping your little nose but to keep you breathing and functional, ALIVE.

Because the full face is heavier, it tends to cause broken necks in more than a few cases.


So if you want to stay alive not just paralyzed and pretty, wear a full open face helmet.

Not my finindings a University Study.


The previous though full of typos, is real and factual, but political  in nature, to keep you making the choices in your life and not a politician.

[BigAl]

Helmet is a false sense of security, safety courses, meticulous motorcyle maintenenance, techniques to make you visible, and

a lot of blessings from above(OR LUCK IF YOU WILL) is what keeps you alive.

Relying on a hlemet only will get you mamed or killed.

But get the best helmet you can buy if all else fails then the safety gear must be there and able to perform

so you may be able to learn from your mistake(OR OTHERS MISTAKES MOST LIKELY) and keep in the wind.

(Helmets have saved my life at least 8 times that I can document, so it's your call of course, unless you live in a helmet state)

[DarkMeister]

Waddayamean by "full open faced helmet"? 3/4 helmet that goes over the ears but no chin?

[BigAl]

Actually 3/4 helmet is close.

But the full is a lttle less than that.

But I imagine a 3/4 helmet would test just the same as a full.

I would trust either one for the same results and a helmet is again a false sense of security.

I have been told that it would not make any difference the way I ride, naked is about the same at 80mph and hitting anything.

I wear one to shade the sun off my head, keep rain at bay, oh yeah and it's the law.

No choice where I live.

SO to maximize the safety imposed on me by a legislative body who probably does not even ride, I wear the one least likely

to KILL me, not keep me pretty like I most assuredly am.

I modeled for the Tshirt Pic here.

[98valk]

University of Tennessee did a study but apparently did not publish the study on the Cloud(INternet).

But the study showed a helmet that performed best at protecting the brain of a human, was a Hockey Helmet.

But they are not DOT Legal, so the best helmet to protect your head has been deemed illegal.

Figures.

Not really interested in your safety, just helmet manufacturers bottom line.

The best helmet to keep you alive is the full open faced helmet, per their testing and statistics.

Not keeping you from scraping your little nose but to keep you breathing and functional, ALIVE.

Because the full face is heavier, it tends to cause broken necks in more than a few cases.


So if you want to stay alive not just paralyzed and pretty, wear a full open face helmet.

Not my finindings a University Study.


The previous though full of typos, is real and factual, but political  in nature, to keep you making the choices in your life and not a politician.

some of your info is old and out dated urban legends, like the broken neck statement.

I can tell u from experience of a past fellow worker who had a honda huricane 1000. He went face first into an I-95 concrete support foundation. I-95 in philadelphia is elevated. skid marks indicated he was doing at least 60 mph when he hit. he survived. he was wearing, Thank God, a full face Shoei helmet. They gave him last rites that night. they had to drain fluid off his brain. he survived. he had a cracked lower jaw. He survived. He never rode again, he got married and has two children. He Survived thanks to God Almightly and the Full Face Helmet.
He didn't break his neck, nor did he have any type of neck injury. He survived.

[MartinT]

I wear a helmet when I have to or if riding in the rain. But like I have always said that the differents
is.........a open casket or a closed casket. It is just like being told you have to wear a seat belt.
this is the land of the free.  let each one of us make our own minds up how we want live or die

It is not so much about the freedom to choose to live or die, it is what happens afterwards if you're the breadwinner and the family now needs community support or welfare to survive, or, worse, you don't die and become a burden to society for hospital cost, revalidation, etc. Not wearing a helmet is also a risk to society, not just your own. This is a major factor behind helmet and seatbelt laws. As has been said so many times, freedom is not free.

M

[Momz]

Getting out of bed has it's own risks.

There is no such thing as a "safe" helmet,...the best we as riders can do is to minimize our risks.
It needs to be up to the individual, not the government as to your own level of risk.

Last week I could have suffered severe head trauma while falling onto a glass table. Do we need mandatory indoor helmet laws?

[solo1]

The article written by Steve Barron in Big Al's post is a prime example of a little knowledge is dangerous.

His lack of  knowledge of physiics and his bias is amazing.  I was an environmental tech and engineer and was involved in shock testing 'black boxes'  The setup for testing them was similiar to testing helmets.  In both cases G levels measured in peak G's along with duration, measured in milliseconds,  were two of the main paramteers in testing.  Barron's comments were slanted toward making a case against wearing helmets. Completely biased!!

Tests are done to come as close as possible to the real world so as to create a standard.  Tests are modified as needed to fit the real world. Tests are not absolute, especiaily helmet tests.

If I recall, the brain can withstand a brief G force of 200g's at so many milliseconds. In any case the helmet is  designed to process the energy of a higher g level and spread that peak g over a longer period of time lowering the peak g level in the process.  It does this by permanently and progressively crushing the inner foam layer, resulting in a lower level peak g level. All helmets are practically designed to protect in a GLANCING blow, The direct blow is a repeatable standard only. Helmet cannot be designed for a very high G level direct blow, it simply wouldn't work.  A g level that would render the helmet useless would also result in immediate death if the head is unprotected......It would be similiar to a Threat II kevlar vest which would stop handgun bullets but not high power rifle bullets. A vest for stopping high power rounds would be much heavier until you reach the point of impractibility.


My argument here is not whether you should wear a helmet, that's your choice, but that helmets do exactly what is required of them .  Helmets save lives!  They don't interfere with vision and they don't mute sounds to the dangerous point.  If you don't wear a helmet, that's fine, just don't make false claims about them to justify not wearing one.

We had a sign over the door of our lab that said "One Test is worth a thousand expert opinions"

If you look at the unbiased facts, helmets save lives. PERIOD.

[fudgie]

Helmets and seat belts are the same. You can die wearing them or not wearing them. Seen it alot of times.

[DIGGER]

I've had a lot more friends die without a helmet due to brain injuries than I have had with friends who have crashed wearing a helmet......my self included......when I crashed at 60 mph in a curve and got all busted up I was still wearing the helmet when they got me to the emergency room.    It was pretty scratched up from sliding down the pavement.....the doctor told me that considering my other injuries, 2 broken collar bones, 5 broken ribs and a crack in my liver, that I would not have survived a head injury also.     To me it's not about personal freedom, it's about protecting my body, especially my head, when driving one of those there dangerous motorcycles.......common sense should prevail.

[hubcapsc]

The article written by Steve Barron in Big Al's post is a prime example of a little knowledge is dangerous.


The laws of physics state that a 4 pound helmet, at 50 mph, becomes 200 pounds upon impact.

I hope I never get hit with a helmet going 50 mph!

-Mike 

[solo1]

Fudgie, neither a seat belt or a helmet is a guarantee that you'll live through an accident so you're right in that respect.

[BigAl]

If a person thinks for a second they can see as well in a full face helmet as good as you would in a DOT half helmet.

You need to try it and see.

Cops wear the half helmet in the line of duty for  reason.

You can see ,,hear and conduct your motorcycle business better in a half helmet, that is supposing you are behind a windshield.

If not the full face is a trade off for better wind protection.

It's amazing what you miss in a full face helmet.

[BigAl]

I buy Harley Brand, made by ,,,,,,,,,who really knows.

Don't know who makes the LEO Brand.

That would be a good question to ask a LEO but not when they have you pulled over.

[fudgie]

Alot of DOT 1/2 helmets out there.
 Gotta agree with Al tho. I can see and move better with a 3/4 then a full face. Ditched the FF after getting the 3/4's. Since long put those away and went with a $30 'beanie/novelty' helmet to use in MI & NE. Love'm. So comfy and light. Sales lady even gave us DOT stickers to put on them.  We use them once a year, maybe, other then that I prefer my visor or sock cap beanie. I know, what if we wreck? I dont plan on walking away. What a way to go tho....riding with the one I love, doing what we love together.

My HD bud t-bones a blazer at 45 mph 3 novembers ago. He never left the bike. Blazer had to be towed. Got a bruise on the head from the shield and broken his throttle wrist. Kit went and saw him in the ER. He was so pissed that he didnt die. He also want to go out doing what he loves and lives for. Riding.

If its your time to go, you will go. You cannot out ride the Reaper. 

[musclehead]

I got a nolan, looks like I lucked out.

we're kinda fragile and we have freakishly big brains, and we like to go fast. not a good combo!

wear the gear, hope that it works as advertised.

[Thulsa Doom]

Been down before.
Full face HJC here.
Do whatever you want but IMO the chin bar is important protection.

[solo1]

I wore a full face Shoei before I got the modular Nolan.  It was a pita to take my glasses off when putting on the Shoei.  Occasionally I wear a Nolan open face but I like the protection of the Nolan  modular.

To each his/her own tho.

[Chrisj CMA]

seems like a bunch of less than real useful info to me.  I think the fit and actual condition of the helmet is much more important.  You can buy the best rated bucket, but if its not the right shape for your head, no good.  Or if its been beat to death and has fractures....no good.  
Over here we have DOT.  DOT ratings are fine and as long as its a DOT helmet Id pay more attention the the fit and function than these test scores.  I buy HJC now because it fits my head perfectly.  I actually liked the Fulmar I had for function, but it wasnt the right shape for my head.  I never took a hard impact with it but Id rather have this lower score HJC that fits perfectly than the Fulmer (or any other) that doesnt

[BigAl]

HJC and Fulmer fit my pumpkin great as well.

I use both.

I have a DOT and Snell Rated full helmet (FULMER) that I covet the most, as I have windshields on both of my Harleys as of

 Yesterday.

So full size is enough for both now.

Snell on puncture resistance and DOT on impact resistance.

Makes for a pretty good brain bucket.

You got that right Fudgie, Grim Reaper is waiting for each of us. You can't outthink that fellow.

I can't help but remember that guy on a bike hit and went under a BMW and the Car and bike were on fire, not engulfed but on fire NO HELMET.

Let me get that out,,,,NO HELMET


Pulled out by good samaritans from underneath the damn car, lifted the car off of him, wakes up in a hospital and I think he had a broken clavicle.

Collar bone was all.

Try to explain that chain of events.

[BigAl]

You got that right Fudgie, Grim Reaper is waiting for each of us. You can't outthink that fellow.

I can't help but remember that guy on a bike hit and went under a BMW and the Car and bike were on fire, not engulfed but on fire NO HELMET.

Let me get that out,,,,NO HELMET


Pulled out by good samaritans from underneath the damn car, lifted the car off of him, wakes up in a hospital and I think he had a broken clavicle.

Collar bone was all.

Try to explain that chain of events


This amateur video is good except for the people going OMGosh all through it.

They don't even know the guy is trapped under the car till he is pulled out.

The tank on the bike is emitting  a boiling gas flame, it just did not blow, fire fighters call this a BLEVE, it just did not blow.

All of these people escaped the grim reaper they probably did not even realise the situation and acted as a team.

Heroes all.

Amateur video shows biker rescued from burning car	powered by Aeva

[Chrisj CMA]

Alot of DOT 1/2 helmets out there.
 Gotta agree with Al tho. I can see and move better with a 3/4 then a full face. Ditched the FF after getting the 3/4's. Since long put those away and went with a $30 'beanie/novelty' helmet to use in MI & NE. Love'm. So comfy and light. Sales lady even gave us DOT stickers to put on them.  We use them once a year, maybe, other then that I prefer my visor or sock cap beanie. I know, what if we wreck? I dont plan on walking away. What a way to go tho....riding with the one I love, doing what we love together.

My HD bud t-bones a blazer at 45 mph 3 novembers ago. He never left the bike. Blazer had to be towed. Got a bruise on the head from the shield and broken his throttle wrist. Kit went and saw him in the ER. He was so pissed that he didnt die. He also want to go out doing what he loves and lives for. Riding.

If its your time to go, you will go. You cannot out ride the Reaper. 

Iffin its yer day ITS yer day youre gone.  If its not yer day, you will LIVE....will it be with an alive brain or one not so alive, thats my concern

[98valk]

You got that right Fudgie, Grim Reaper is waiting for each of us. You can't outthink that fellow.

I can't help but remember that guy on a bike hit and went under a BMW and the Car and bike were on fire, not engulfed but on fire NO HELMET.

Let me get that out,,,,NO HELMET


Pulled out by good samaritans from underneath the damn car, lifted the car off of him, wakes up in a hospital and I think he had a broken clavicle.

Collar bone was all.

Try to explain that chain of events


This amateur video is good except for the people going OMGosh all through it.

They don't even know the guy is trapped under the car till he is pulled out.

The tank on the bike is emitting  a boiling gas flame, it just did not blow, fire fighters call this a BLEVE, it just did not blow.

All of these people escaped the grim reaper they probably did not even realise the situation and acted as a team.

Heroes all.

Amateur video shows biker rescued from burning car

I guess your against wearing a hard hat or steel toe boots on the job site, cause certain things falling will still crush your toes inside the boot and push your head down past your shoulders.

[BigAl]

If it's your time was the point.

Not to say you should or should not wear anything.

I wear a helmet and do so even when it is not the law.

I have tried it without a helmet and the sand and rocks kicked up by cycles in front of you hurts when it hits your head.

[BIG--T]

I just bought my first full face and after wearing an open face about all my life and most of the time-not- just for trips, rain and cold. My new full face resricts my vision a lot and is also very quiet.

I agree with some on the board about the grim reaper, we all have our appointed time. So bikes, cars, planes, shot by a jealous husband, 18 wheeler running over you, plane falling on you,  car runs though your house killing  ya  (happens alot here), fall over dead from a massive heart attack and about a millon more things!

Nudder werds, I ain't werried bout it!

[BIG--T]

This was very cool... The Nolans scored very well 
I was very shocked  on Schuberth! 


http://sharp.direct.gov.uk/home

Thanks for the link. I was looking for something like that when I bought mine less than a month ago. I was shocked at Schuberth especially what they cost and thought Shoei would have done better too! I bought a Bell and they ALL have 5 stars across the board so I just lucked up!