Well Crap......Bad News......

[Detn8er]

Remember all the pissin' and moanin' about Boeing building a plant in South Carolina.....  Well lookie here what happened today. Course if you listened to the naysayers all the parts and wiring are probably wrong and backwards and the damn thing will probably at some point just start flying backwards.   

http://www.wltx.com/news/article/188114/2/First-787-Built-in-SC-Takes-Test-Flight

[Master Blaster]

If all states were right to work we might just become competitive agan as a nation.  Union made has just about driven all our manifacturing away.

[old2soon]

While we as a people are getting somewhat better in the manufacturing game it is MAN MADE and hence not perfect. But i would much rather fly in an American designed and manufactured aircraft than ANYTHING else out there. Flamesuit on now and thank you. RIDE SAFE.

[doubletee]

While we as a people are getting somewhat better in the manufacturing game it is MAN MADE and hence not perfect. But i would much rather fly in an American designed and manufactured aircraft than ANYTHING else out there. Flamesuit on now and thank you. RIDE SAFE.

If it's not Boeing, I'm not going.   

[old2soon]

While we as a people are getting somewhat better in the manufacturing game it is MAN MADE and hence not perfect. But i would much rather fly in an American designed and manufactured aircraft than ANYTHING else out there. Flamesuit on now and thank you. RIDE SAFE.

If it's not Boeing, I'm not going.   

  You sir need to be writing slogans for them. RIDE SAFE.

[doubletee]

While we as a people are getting somewhat better in the manufacturing game it is MAN MADE and hence not perfect. But i would much rather fly in an American designed and manufactured aircraft than ANYTHING else out there. Flamesuit on now and thank you. RIDE SAFE.

If it's not Boeing, I'm not going.   

  You sir need to be writing slogans for them. RIDE SAFE.

I'd like to take creative credit for that, but in all honesty I can't. I remember seeing it on bumper stickers and posters many, many years ago (like in the '70s).   

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

If all states were right to work we might just become competitive agan as a nation.  Union made has just about driven all our manifacturing away.

Abolishing minimum wage would create jobs ....So would slavery ...Take away the union and that's what you will have 

[tonyfan70]

While we as a people are getting somewhat better in the manufacturing game it is MAN MADE and hence not perfect. But i would much rather fly in an American designed and manufactured aircraft than ANYTHING else out there. Flamesuit on now and thank you. RIDE SAFE.

What? No faith in Tupelov?

I joke, I joke.

[junior]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

[DIGGER]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

[2step]

If all states were right to work we might just become competitive agan as a nation.  Union made has just about driven all our manifacturing away.

Not in the industry I work in  (COAL MINING), I'm UNION and proud of it. Ky. is not a right to work state and we do very well with union and non union.

[Dubsvalk]

Constitutionally, every state should be a right to work state.  Everyone should have the right to join a union because they want to, not because they won't be allowed to work if they do not.  Do the research and see the lengths unions go to to control our politicians.  Don't be blind to what their true motive is.  I realize that many Americans have earned good livings for themselves and their famlies as union workers.  But that doesn't make unions good for America.  IMHO.
Dubs

[DIGGER]

Constitutionally, every state should be a right to work state.  Everyone should have the right to join a union because they want to, not because they won't be allowed to work if they do not.  Do the research and see the lengths unions go to to control our politicians.  Don't be blind to what their true motive is.  I realize that many Americans have earned good livings for themselves and their famlies as union workers.  But that doesn't make unions good for America.  IMHO.
Dubs

I disagree again, I think they serve a purpose.   In the industry you are in, what ever it is, just think how much more you could be making if everyone in you industry banded together and said "We aint working for less than $x. "  I think you are missing out on the more money you could be making.   JMHO

[Chrisj CMA]

Constitutionally, every state should be a right to work state.  Everyone should have the right to join a union because they want to, not because they won't be allowed to work if they do not.  Do the research and see the lengths unions go to to control our politicians.  Don't be blind to what their true motive is.  I realize that many Americans have earned good livings for themselves and their famlies as union workers.  But that doesn't make unions good for America.  IMHO.
Dubs

I disagree again, I think they serve a purpose.   In the industry you are in, what ever it is, just think how much more you could be making if everyone in you industry banded together and said "We aint working for less than $x. "  I think you are missing out on the more money you could be making.   JMHO

Exactly Unions use their power to force employers to pay more than the market can sustain, thats why states are going broke, and Unions cost way too much.  Its not about the workers geting more (thats the impression they want to project) whats its all about is POWER and MONEY

[G-Man]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

[DIGGER]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

You are close, I was born in 1950.   I worked construction for over 40 yrs now UNION.   Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

[G-Man]

Constitutionally, every state should be a right to work state.  Everyone should have the right to join a union because they want to, not because they won't be allowed to work if they do not.  Do the research and see the lengths unions go to to control our politicians.  Don't be blind to what their true motive is.  I realize that many Americans have earned good livings for themselves and their famlies as union workers.  But that doesn't make unions good for America.  IMHO.
Dubs

I disagree again, I think they serve a purpose.   In the industry you are in, what ever it is, just think how much more you could be making if everyone in you industry banded together and said "We aint working for less than $x. "  I think you are missing out on the more money you could be making.   JMHO

Think about how much less your property taxes would be (75% of my county's budget goes to pay county employees past and present), how much cheaper an automoblie would be (we saw what GM pays out in benefits to past and present employees), no baggage fees (and now carry-on fees), or how much less any product or service would be if just the union alone was out of the picture.  The union requires highly paid people to run it, moderatley paid people to do all the paper work, office space, computers, phones, pens and paperclips, heat and a/c, etc., all paid for by the union members and really, by the consumer.

People aren't going to work for "slave" wages and under poor conditions.  We see how folks in this country are these days.  They would rather take the unemployment than work a full for week at $10 or $15 an hour or walk away from homes that aren't worth what they paid.  There's no "desperation" to work as we've become a society that will gladly pay you not to work for 3 years, giving you additional help for food and housing.  (Aaaaaand think of all the union workers employed in the unemployment and welfare industries)

[G-Man]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

You are close, I was born in 1950.   I worked construction for over 40 yrs now UNION.   Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

At no cost???  Don't you pay union dues?  Your union dues pay for your benefits and pensions, it's not free.  You are contributing to these things from every paycheck you receive.  Go back to my earlier post.  You are also paying for the union employees salaries and benefits, their office space and supplies, their pensions, their education (that unions pay for), etc. 

[steve 3054]

The problems with Unions is they are greedy and ONLY think of themselves....yes at one time I was a Union member...my neighbor is a postman...$37 per hour union...to put an envelope in a box...oh the pain and suffering this must cause his body....    The Post Office is now broke and he refuses to discuss a pay decrease...he would rather have NO job than to take a 10% cut and KEEP his job...seems alittle short sited to me.....

[DIGGER]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

You are close, I was born in 1950.   I worked construction for over 40 yrs now UNION.   Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

At no cost???  Don't you pay union dues?  Your union dues pay for your benefits and pensions, it's not free.  You are contributing to these things from every paycheck you receive.  Go back to my earlier post.  You are also paying for the union employees salaries and benefits, their office space and supplies, their pensions, their education (that unions pay for), etc. 

the contractor I work for pays 100 percent for my insurance. And yeah, the union leaders get paid out of my union dues, they don't work for free.   In the Houston area I pay the union about $3000 out of my check. per year.  I make about $20,000 more than a non union electrician......do the math.

[Varmintmist]

On the other hand, you can be union, PAY for your health care, get a whopping 1.25% raise (up from the previous contract) (btw, non union areas make 2.00/hr more) have the union negotiate away double time, travel, and then, keep all the scattered areas under different locals and contract times, so that none of them CAN go out because they would be filled by supervision from across the country in about 5 seconds.  When you complain. they tell you that the money you put in is for a different local's (companys) strike fund, not yours. God forbid you try to assert you BECK rights. Your money will fund democrat causes and you don't have a choice.

Who's the slave?

[Big Ed]

I'm just glad its...

Made in USA...!!!

[czuch]

Right to work, non union here. They wanted to go from Machinists to Teamsters. I was all for that but they had to de-certify for a year. "To many guys would lose their jobs". I was told. Dont think for a minute the healthcare is free, That would be additional wage were it not taken out. Maybe ,if you searched aroung you could find a better deal.
We also went on strike so the unionfurher could have a strike under his belt so he could advance. The graft is astounding. The guys got NOTHING but 70 days with no work. No other related facility stood in any kind of "Solidarity" I felt bad for them but theyre all big boys and make their own decisions. except when its time to vote and every choice they recommend has "D" behind the name.
I know the drivel about weekends and holidays, ad nauseum.

[art]

If all states were right to work we might just become competitive agan as a nation.  Union made has just about driven all our manifacturing away.

BS

[art]

Right to work stste dosen't mean you have the right to work,it means the employer has the right to fire you for no reason.If he had a bad day and you rub him the wrong way your history .I know this because it happened to me in Az. a right to work state .I got injured on the job and six months later I was fired and could not collect unemployment.He told me I was laid off and told the unemployment office I was fired.I was screwed.That would not happen in a union shop.Small los as I was getting about $15 less per hour than my last employer in Ca.

[doubletee]

Right to work stste dosen't mean you have the right to work,it means the employer has the right to fire you for no reason.If he had a bad day and you rub him the wrong way your history .I know this because it happened to me in Az. a right to work state .I got injured on the job and six months later I was fired and could not collect unemployment.He told me I was laid off and told the unemployment office I was fired.I was screwed.That would not happen in a union shop.Small los as I was getting about $15 less per hour than my last employer in Ca.

Is that "right to work" or "at will?" Indiana is an "at will" state; either party can terminate the relationship for any, or no, reason so long as there is no contract and no discrimination.

[art]

Az. is a right to work state,Ca.is a pro working man state

[doubletee]

My point is that "right to work" doesn't mean the employer has the right to fire you for no reason. As I understand it, "right to work" means you cannot be forced to join/participate in a union in order to work in a particular company. I've been wrong before, though.....once or twice.   

[Jess Tolbirt]

well lets see now.. i joined IBEW in 1983,,in 2003 i had to declare bankruptcy,,the union cost me everything i had worked for,,sat on the books for 3 years and finally my name got to the top of the list,, got a long call that lasted 29 days,,,another 3 years? dont think so,,went non union and have a great life now working for great people,,,the unions had their place but in todays economy not so much,, high wages are driving manufacturing out of our country,,,

[Serk]

My point is that "right to work" doesn't mean the employer has the right to fire you for no reason. As I understand it, "right to work" means you cannot be forced to join/participate in a union in order to work in a particular company. I've been wrong before, though.....once or twice.   

Correct... Right to Work just means you can't be forced to join a union.

Right to Work != At Will Employment

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Right-to-work_law

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/At_will

[sugerbear]

so the guy/girl putting hog rings on seat covers for new cars at $35 hr.
or the teacher trying to teach kids at $$20 hr and paying for supplies out of their own pocket

which is more important? that should tell if your union or not.

unions were necessary years ago. but at what point do they say, ok, now it's balanced?

the company needs to make money too. squeeze too hard and the company will move to another country. the unions would have you believe the company is a bottomless pit of money. there has to be a balance somewhere.

[DIGGER]

well, we all have to make our own decisions.  My decision has always been to try and make as much money as I can, end up with something in retirement, and enjoy my family and grandchildren along the way.........so far all has gone as planned.....and I owe most of it to the IBEW LU 716 out of Houston.    40 yr member this year.    Hope you all can say the same when you retire......I mean that too.    Life is short, enjoy the things you can........my Valk is part of that life's enjoyment......there.....it's Valk related.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

well lets see now.. i joined IBEW in 1983,,in 2003 i had to declare bankruptcy,,the union cost me everything i had worked for,,sat on the books for 3 years and finally my name got to the top of the list,, got a long call that lasted 29 days,,,another 3 years? dont think so,,went non union and have a great life now working for great people,,,the unions had their place but in todays economy not so much,, high wages are driving manufacturing out of our country,,,

I've been a Teamster for 25 years no way could I make the money I make at any factory around here in fact most of the factories here hire you as temporary so they don't have to give you crap . No insurance ,no vacation etc....Smokin'joe <----Union worker and damn proud of it.

[hubcapsc]

Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

http://www.boeing.com/careers/benefits/us_benefits.html#health

Nothing's free, even if you're in a union.

I don't know how to check if the South Carolina Boeing employees make as much as the ones
in Washington do. We have a great standard of living in SC, though, gas (and lots of stuff) is
cheaper here than any other state. Might not be able to compare salaries without some kind
of adjustment... It is hard to imagine that the people with all the good jobs at the Boeing plant,
the BMW plant, the Michelin plants, etc, are being "taken advantage" of... Having a decent job
and living in South Carolina is like being in Heaven on earth 

I'll never own a business, anywhere. If I did, it would be up to me who to hire, when to fire
them, and how much to pay them.

-Mike

[Valkernaut]

I'm gettin old - but I remember .12 cents per loaf bread - before unions! Close to $5.00 in places now....

[Davet261]

I've worked in the construction field for the better part of my life, in the builders trade union.  I was a union sheet metal worker for 15 years.  I still work for a mechanical contractor with employes union sheet metal and union pipefitters, but am no longer in the union.  

To become a journeyman in either trade you must complete 5 years of school, to be properly trained and certified to perform the tasks necessary to complete the work correctly.  

The company I work for mainly works in hospitals and schools, but do work in state and federal buildings along with some commerial buildings.  

I keep seeing posts about right to work states, and how necessary it is to give equal opportunitys for all, which I totally disagree with, it takes years of schooling and on the job training to become experts in these trades.

We get quite a bit of work from commercial buildings, we make quite a bit of money because of the non union, private contractors that do work in them.  Lots of our work comes from going back in and demolishing hvac and piping private contractors install hvac backwards, upside down, or without dampers, replace piping on boilers the start leaking, first part of those jobs are demo and that costs the customers more than if they would have just hired professionals to begin with.


We just completed the new Childrens Hopital and are now building the new Ohio State Hospital, we are not hired because of our wages, we are hired because of our experience.  With the right to work laws, so many non union contractors would have to hire off the streets to fill positions, with no training or experience.  A lot of immagrents would be hired for low wages, and of that money lots of it would be sent back to their homes where their families are, taking more money from US.

Maybe you dont want worry about who installed the medical gas pipe, who installed the hvac in the clean room operating rooms.  Id think twice before I or one of my loved ones was on an operating table wondering if the med gas was contaminated, or the operating room was full of germs when they come at me with the mask to put me or my loved one under with work done by private contractors.

I also seen in an earlier post where someone said the union workers make all the money and the company workers make less because of the higher union wages, I beg to differ, I am now a manager working in the builders trades and I make more money now than I ever did in the union so where the company people make less, I am proof that is wrong.

I will be 56 this November, on my 57th birthday I will be eligible to start drawing my pensions, one is a local and one is a national pension, plus I have an annunity from the union.  I will continue to work and will be drawing around 1500 extra a month on my pensions.  The union has been very good to me.

[Jess Tolbirt]

this to Dave 261,
you said, We get quite a bit of work from commercial buildings, we make quite a bit of money because of the non union, private contractors that do work in them.  Lots of our work comes from going back in and demolishing hvac and piping private contractors install hvac backwards, upside down, or without dampers, replace piping on boilers the start leaking, first part of those jobs are demo and that costs the customers more than if they would have just hired professionals to begin with.

i will have to call that one BS....are you saying that a bunch of no nothings installed a bunch of HVAC stuff backwards?
you have to be able to read prints and everything has to be inspected before the next phase starts,, the details even tell you how it goes,,,something aint right there,,

and weather we are union or not we are still the same people,,,unions go to their schools and non union goes to their schools,, for a while here the IBEW was sending their guys to the ABC school here because it was a much better school...

[junior]

Constitutionally, every state should be a right to work state.  Everyone should have the right to join a union because they want to, not because they won't be allowed to work if they do not.  Do the research and see the lengths unions go to to control our politicians.  Don't be blind to what their true motive is.  I realize that many Americans have earned good livings for themselves and their famlies as union workers.  But that doesn't make unions good for America.  IMHO.
Dubs

I disagree again, I think they serve a purpose.   In the industry you are in, what ever it is, just think how much more you could be making if everyone in you industry banded together and said "We aint working for less than $x. "  I think you are missing out on the more money you could be making.   JMHO

you sound like my old union rep 

[junior]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

You are close, I was born in 1950.   I worked construction for over 40 yrs now UNION.   Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

untill our wonderfil president decides that someone elese needs it mor than you do. and dont get me going on that 401 k plan..............thats the biggest rip off that ever came along

[junior]

yea i would really love to work under union rule................pay them so you can work,pay them so they can voice what they think is in your best intrest,decide that you are going on strike (while you are in the bread line and your house is being foreclosed on) while the union rep is going to the bahamas for the 4th time this year. working for the unions is a form of slavery. they own you, control your every move. under union rule is like living being a jew living under hitlers rule, you never know when you are going to be sent to the gas chamber

Gotta disagree .......you seem to think these "Union Thugs" rule the roost.....you are very wrong.   They are elected by the members to represent them......they don't take long vacations at our expense.....if they did they wouldn't get re elected by the membership.   Without this representation to stand up against Slave owners we would be working for less than minimum wage and working 7 days a week 12hrs a day.....just like they did before there were Unions.   I'll gladly pay these "Thugs" to represent me and my career.   I don't know what kind of work you do but if they started paying you half of what you make and working you 12 hr days 7 days aweek you would gladly pay for someone to represent you if it would make your conditions better.   Our representation is the same as professional players use.  They can get the players one heck of a lot more than the players could get for themselves......it's money well spent.

That sounds like you're living back in the 40's and just reciting union/leftist soundbites.  Yup, 12hour days, 7days a week, bad water, dirty air, etc,. etc.  I wonder if the non-union folks who built that plane worked under those conditions?  Did they really work all those hours and days?  Were their working conditions really dangerous?  Were they repeatedly whipped and beaten into producing more?   

And not all unions are so wonderfully run as some seem to think.  my dad and brother were in a union that delivered mail and newspapers.  They both got their jobs by having their names magically climb the shape list for a fee and their votes.  Both of which they gladly obliged so they could reap the rewards of higher pay and good benefits.  Through contract negotiations with the most highest profiled New York company who prints the most widely read and recited left wing newspaper in the country, the union driving jobs were abolished and non-union, subcontracted, companies came in to deliver the newspapers instead.  Brother has been un/underemployed for over 3 years now.  Go Union!

You are close, I was born in 1950.   I worked construction for over 40 yrs now UNION.   Yeah, I think the non union workers you are talking about are being whipped and beaten into forced labor.   Do they have health insurance provided at no cost?  Guarantee you they are working for less money per hr.    Do they have a 401k (they probably do) but I'll bet you they don't have a monthly retirement of anykind when they get old.    When I retire in a couple yrs I'll have my 401k, a monthly retirement check, and I'll bet you they won't get it.   Yeah, I think they are being taken advantage of.

At no cost???  Don't you pay union dues?  Your union dues pay for your benefits and pensions, it's not free.  You are contributing to these things from every paycheck you receive.  Go back to my earlier post.  You are also paying for the union employees salaries and benefits, their office space and supplies, their pensions, their education (that unions pay for), etc. 

the contractor I work for pays 100 percent for my insurance. And yeah, the union leaders get paid out of my union dues, they don't work for free.   In the Houston area I pay the union about $3000 out of my check. per year.  I make about $20,000 more than a non union electrician......do the math.

i have worked around union electricians and they are worse than union truckdrivers bunch of lazy SOBs that ever walked the face of the earth..................thats just MHO