Rostra Electronic Cruse Control

[OldOneEye]

I ordered a Rostra Electronic Cruse Control from Murphs kits.
It’s a universal application no vacuum required kit. I got it installed hardware wise, but it seems that my configuration of wiring hookup is not up to par.
Has anyone installed on of these on your bike. What are your switch settings, does your “amber diagnostic led” ever come on? (next to the switches)
The unit seems to have no “power” the control pad has the LED on but I think that is from the +12 I ran to it
my dark blue wire to a ground side of a coil.
the Violet wire to the “Cold” side of the Brake light
the Red wire from the control pad to the “hot” side of the Brake light
Black=ground
Brown =+12 switched relay

At least I can show you a couple of pics of the install (click img for larger view)

under seat


the bracket attached were the smog was


The curve going down


Under rear tank area


above side area (side panel)



Thanks

[Novavalker]

I don't know of anyone installing a Rostra on a Valkyrie. Is your bike an Interstate, Tour or Standard?
I found this link for a Concours installation. It requires a signal off the speed sensor.
http://www.murphskits.com/catalog/docs/Rostra%20install.htm

 

[OldOneEye]

Its a standard, and yes i did not hook up the labeled "optional vss sensor" wires to anything

[Novavalker]

"Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS):  Rostra Gray wire: The VSS is a signal generated by the bike as a function of well,... vehicle speed."

I don't see how it can be an optional hook up. The unit picks up the speed of the vehicle through VSS wire. Does a Standard have a VSS wire? If you don't connect the VSS wire how does it sense the vehicles speed?
It also talks about hooking up the clutch but don't connect the clutch wire until after you do the diagnostic test. Sorry If I'm not much help. Maybe someone here with a Standard can chime in.

[Novavalker]

I looked at the HDL site on the standard and it uses a cable (mechanical) from the speedometer to the front wheel. I don't think the Rosta will work on Standard. It should work on an Interstate which uses a vehicle speed sensor (VSS).

[PhredValk]

Check the instructions. I have the vacuum model CC100, and there is a dip switch setting for Standard Transmission which lets the unit work by coil pulses instead of speedometer speed.
Fred.

[chrise2469]

This is from the manual on Rosta's site.
F. Gray Vehicle Speed Sensor (VSS) Wire
The Gray Vehicle Speed Signal (VSS) wire is how the GlobalCruise “knows” how
fast the vehicle is moving. The Pulses Per Mile/Kilometer (PPM/PPK) are a
characteristic of the vehicle and must be set accordingly (See Page 7). If VSS cannot
be located on the vehicle then an auxiliary road speed sensor must be used
[Signal Generator or Magnet & Coil Pick-Up Kit (Kit# 250-4165)]. If you use an
auxiliary speed sensor, plug it into auxiliary speed sensor connector (J in Figure 34)
and trim the Gray VSS wire as not to pick-up any stray signals.

http://www.rostra.com/manuals/250-1223Form4565F.pdf

Looks like you need the aux speed kit.  
http://www.rostra.com/manuals/250-4160_59A-02361G.pdf
Which is gonna be kinda hard to mount since it needs a magnet attached to the driveshaft and a sensor to read the magnet.

Sorry I can't help you much.

[N0tac0p]

OK, so if you do happen to have an I/S, is the rostra a simple plug and play?  you know a couple wires, hook up and clamp the actuator and ride? 

anythings to watch out for, hints, etc?

[R J]

OK, so if you do happen to have an I/S, is the rostra a simple plug and play?  you know a couple wires, hook up and clamp the actuator and ride? 

anythings to watch out for, hints, etc?

Did you enlarge the 1st picture?    It looks like electricians nightmare in that loom.

There are like 4 little holes in the left side of the front wheel.    I don't have the brand of cruise control as yours, but mine uses little magnets in those hole for a sensor.

Mine is the pricey one from Australia, I've had it on MGM for over 200K miles with NO problems what so ever.   It still holds a true + or - of 2 MPH on hills.  It has been $$$$ well spent in my case.   It was a TRUE plug and play.  Not having to jury rig anything.

[OldOneEye]

I doubt I need the speed kit. I think I just need to play with it, get the electrical tester out and verify my wiring. Most of the wires are color coded, 6 of them went up to the control pad leaving just a couple for sensing.

Like Fred said. It could be as easy as a dip switch set wrong.

If you are interested here is the manual www.rostra.com/manuals/250-1223Form4565F.pdf

Setting the switches is most likely going to be the trick, "gain” and "Engine / Setup timer" will be what I tune in. Once I figure it out then It will be Plug-N-play for most of our bikes

I got this quote from a V-Srtom Board:
“
"Gain" is how the unit reacts to road conditions and motor size. If the bike surges, go to a higher setting until it stops. There are four different settings from "Extra Low" to "High"....My bike is smooth as silk on High.

"Engine / Setup timer" is how fast the servo retracts the cable in when you push set. A number of settings from Low to High. I had it set on mid, but when the "set" button was pushed the bike would slow down about 10 mph then rush back up to the set speed......Makes for an "interesting" ride........"Extra High" was the setting for my bike...........

So, the verdict.........This unit is the balls. Much smoother than my vacuum unit was and hold the speed rock steady no matter the terrain. Up hill, down hill, it just stays right there at the set speed.
"

I am working 12 hour days this week and I have a Twin City Motor Cycle club ride this Saturday so Sunday will be the day for me to work on this.

I do want to add one more thing, I see that there is a switch that senses when I pull the clutch. I what to find that wire under the seat and use it as another way to kill the CC, Anyone know what wire/color and were it connects? I will dig through the schematic tomorrow

[olddog1946]

I agree that you should not need the VSS signal, you can use the coil to sense engine rpm which translates to speed. You could indeed use the magnets and the pickup as a fail safe though. I personally would mount the magnets and wiring to the pickup along the swing arm to the back wheel as it could be made much less noticeable.

I can't tell from the pics but it looks like you have the control head just sitting loose behind the battery. I believe you'll need to get it mounted solidly to effect constant and consistent speed control.

When I get around to putting in a cruise control, the rostra is the one I would install.


UPDATE: I went to your manual and perused it a bit. According to it you need the VSS signal and the Tach is a backup..so you may actually need to hookup the VSS using magnets and the coil.  I know the older units would work on the tack signal alone and I still suspect that the rostra will as well.

[OldOneEye]

olddog1946 the reviews are up in the air as far as it being a "backup", I know that the wires visible in the first photo but the label is turned down, but it has written on it "optional VSS" I will take a better photo of the wiring tonight.

there is a guy on a goldwing site that implies that its nothing more then a counter so almost anything that pulses can be used. Its a little bit of voodoo until you get it working the way you like.
http://www.goldwingfacts.com/forums/forum9/30381.html

[Bigwolf]

Quote from OldOneEye:

my dark blue wire to a ground side of a coil.

What I read in the Rostra manual says dark blue wire goes to the tach.  So I am wondering why you chose to hook it to the ground side of a coil instead of the tach leed.  Remember, the coils are grounded through the ICM which advances and/or retards timing depending on engine speed and engine temp.  Also, there is a residual voltage spike when the ICM disconects the ground.  This spike could reach as high as 150 volts.  I believe you will find this connection to be a BIG problem.

Bigwolf

[OldOneEye]

Quote from OldOneEye:

my dark blue wire to a ground side of a coil.

  I believe you will find this connection to be a BIG problem.

Ha that could be it. Now I need to find the tach leed.

[N0tac0p]

HAS anyone install the rostra "electronic" cruise on their I/S?

[OldOneEye]

Here are two pics I took that show the optional connector and also the wiring in general, I will wire loom them and label everything before I am done.

wire mess... as you can see after i hooked up the controller lots of the wires are already utilized.

connector

[rfink02]

Inquiring minds would love to know if you've had a chance to road test...

[OldOneEye]

Inquiring minds would love to know if you've had a chance to road test...

It still is not Sunday yet. I will re-hook it up and see if I can get the diag LED to work for me, I still need to find the location and color code of the tach wire and clutch wire.

so right not the wire harness is detached from the unit, if you want to look up the wires it would save me time on Saturday.

Jeff

[Joe Hummer]

It still is not Sunday yet. I will re-hook it up and see if I can get the diag LED to work for me, I still need to find the location and color code of the tach wire and clutch wire.

so right not the wire harness is detached from the unit, if you want to look up the wires it would save me time on Saturday.

Jeff

Jeff,

The attached link is to the wiring diagrams for the Standard/Tourers. 

http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/schematics/rpage01.html
Sheet S4 shows the clutch switch.  You may have to put in a relay in order to make it work as it is buried in a circuit. 

Sheet S5 shows the Tach wiring. 

Joe

[Mr.BubblesVRCCDS0008]

I have the old audiovox unit. It runs off of impulses from a  coil to hold speed by keeping engine rpms at the set rpm.The light on my control pad comes on as soon as the switch is pressed to turn unit on. I've install 4 of the older units and all are still working great. I'm sure with a little troubleshooting yours will come arround. Also these units use the brake light curciut as a ground thru the bulb element so if light is on the ground is lost and unit disengages. Please let us know when you get it working as I have at least two buddies that want to install the newer units.

[rfink02]

Hey OldOneEye,

Did you get it working?

[OldOneEye]

Hey OldOneEye,

Did you get it working?

Not yet, got distracted with the 9year old wonderful daughter out of school, that makes my life glow, and other family stuff. I did hookup a vss substitute (an old bike magnetic speed sensor that was already there) but have not gone through the diagnostic, fathers day is wide open so I hope to make progress this weekend 

I did get to the point in the testing sequence that VSS was ready to test but no love.
I have decided that a standard does need a "VSS" type signal that is not standard on a "standard", I did take a good photo of my labeled wiring that I will past later.

l8r.

[OldOneEye]

I found time this weekend, but no luck
I found the wire to get signal from the computer for tach. and I used an old bike computer pickup to give a pulse for the wheel.

I followed the instructions for diagnostic but I get NO pulse from the wheel pickup, I was able to use my multi meter to test that the wheel signal is going to ground but the unit will not blink the led.

On page 20 "troubleshooting" I get to step 8 where I have the bike up on a stand and spin the wheel, but no flash

Questions:
would the rostra "vss substitute" magnet pickup work any different? (on then off?)
I need to try the diag for the switch bank but I think its working, got an led and the switches seem to test ok.
What am I missing?


Computer connection for tach signal


cold side of break, goes hot with break engage


hot side of break this feeds the switch and the unit +12v fused


all wires identified


wheel pickup (its a simple read switch that has been stuck to my swing arm for years with a couple of magnets stuck to the roater that activate it on and off.) hard to see in this photo.

[olddog1946]

Are you sure the pickup is working?  If you can test both leads of the reed switch with the wheel turning, you should show a pulse, (open then closed or continuity then open) and then you'd have to figure out how often you get that pulse and set the dip switches accordingly....and have the thing set to sine wave signal. I also believe the more magnets you have installed the better/smoother the unit will work.

[Gryphon Rider]

I highly suspect the Rostra VSS input is designed not for a reed switch, but rather for a sensor coil with the magnet generating a current in the coil when it passes by.

[OldOneEye]

Are you sure the pickup is working?  If you can test both leads of the reed switch with the wheel turning, you should show a pulse, (open then closed or continuity then open) and then you'd have to figure out how often you get that pulse and set the dip switches accordingly....and have the thing set to sine wave signal. I also believe the more magnets you have installed the better/smoother the unit will work.

I did test it with my multi-meter. I get a ground every time it hits a magnet. I tried both square and syn wave setting. I added a magnet at every bolt on the roter so there are 6? magnets

What are all your switch settings set to?

Also I notice that my head/control pad LED is dim all the time until I press the OFF then it is high(brighter) as long as I press the button, thin back to dim. its the only button that does that, all the other buttons never change the LED brightness.
I still might have a wiring gremlin in that setup.

Thanks

[OldOneEye]

I highly suspect the Rostra VSS input is designed not for a reed switch, but rather for a sensor coil with the magnet generating a current in the coil when it passes by.

considering that the VSS can be received from the "cars computer" VSS generator, I don't see this as the problem, especially at slow speed (switch on then off). but what do I know...... I will go on my 3 day ride without CC this weekend.    when I get back maybe I can figure it out.

Still wondering about the controller LED?

[OldOneEye]

I will be at Inzane, so if someone is interested in looking at my setup to help me figure out what I have set wrong, I am open to the help.
I have tested with my magnet setup with both gnd and +12 pulses with no reaction from the self diagnostic.

I arrive Monday some time. See ya then.

[bentwrench]

It may be a long shot,but when I switched to an led brake lamp my audiovox cruise stopped working.It seems the unit would not recognise the led as a ground on the cold side of the brk. switch.I needed to install a relay to grd. that circuit and open upon brk switch activation.If your running leds you could try grounding that wire temp.just to see if it wakes it up.Good Luck
bw

[olddog1946]

Oldone I, did you have any chance to get that cruise figured out while at Inzane?  The reason I asked, is that I just bought a ton of cruise parts (sensors, pickups, swtiches, etc.) and should be getting all that crap in the next day or two. If there is anything you might need give me a holler, I will only need one or two parts for a cruise I'm putting in my 29 SSK and the rest is excess..so feel free to holler.  Update: the stuff is here, so let me know if you need anything.