Rear Wheel Service 4.5K original miles. 1st time for me, your thoughts welcome

[whitestroke]

New Tires and rims chromed by the PO. Thought it would be a good idea to look inside.  When spinning wheel up on lift, i hear what sounds like plastic rubbing. Outer rim of final drive maybe ?
If I take off 4 screws holding on final drive on swing arm it should pull out right ?



Looks well lubed




Splines look good to my untrained eye?




Chromed spot where thrust washer sits is flaking off.




I scraped the rest of chrome off with a screwdriver and cleaned it up with some steelwool.  The star when inserted feels snug no slop at all.  No need to pull off plate and look inside?

[eric in md]

looks great .. no need to pull off plate .. get some miles on it first .. lube it back up . pull drive shaft out of hub look in there also ..  next put it all back together then ... after axle is tight . tight the four hub nuts last ..

[gordonv]

looks great .. no need to pull off plate ..

No need to pull, but while the rim is off, put a screw driver (something) into the hole and see if the dampener moves very much. You want it snug.

[whitestroke]

Thanks Eric and Gordon
Will try to wiggle dampners. 
After tightening axle should you spin tire (to align) before tightening 4 hub bolts?

I'm going to replace the thrust washer.  Should I also replace the 3 o-rings?
Also need to buy some Moly paste for the splines and axle assembly.

If tomorrow I pull drive shaft and splines are lubed nicely I'll just push it back together and call it good ?

[Chrisj CMA]

If tomorrow I pull drive shaft and splines are lubed nicely I'll just push it back together and call it good ?

Well, not really.....the most crucial part is the pinion cup....you have to yank the drive shaft out of the final drive to check those.  I can send you a slide show of the whole process if you shoot me an email

chrisj357@cox.net

[F6MoRider]

The trust washer looks like it was exposed to grease by the dark inner ring.  Was it covered on both sides by moly paste when you removed it?

The splines do look well lubed but it looks like grease as opposed to moly paste. The amount of grease that looks to have spun out of the splines would make me wonder if the o-rings were sealing or if an excessive amount of grease was used. There should be some spin out, even with paste, but with only 4500 miles, I'm thinking I'd see more paste than grease.

[hubcapsc]

If tomorrow I pull drive shaft and splines are lubed nicely I'll just push it back together and call it good ?

Well, not really.....the most crucial part is the pinion cup....you have to yank the drive shaft out of the final drive to check those.  I can send you a slide show of the whole process if you shoot me an email

chrisj357@cox.net

Yep, check the pinion cup... you're probably good because of so few miles... once, I pulled
my final drive off, and the seal from the pinion cup was off, just floating around on the
shaft... it was bad...



The seal makes the pinion cup part of the sealed-off system that gets lubed with
final drive oil... the oil comes and goes to the pinion cup by the holes in the the
bottom of the cup...



The manual specifies some tiny amount of grease (2 grams) to put in the pinion cup,
so don't put so much grease in there that the holes get plugged up... if you hold your
final drive so that the pinion cup is pointing down, and shake it a little, final
drive oil will spurt out the holes and you'll know they're clear.

-Mike

[whitestroke]

Looking Good, Slight tug pulled shaft out of final drive, the seal is tight on shaft and outer edge of seal spins in cup. That is different.




This end slides in universal joint on the motor side, just addin a small amount of moly grease




This is final drive side cup.




This end goes in cup and looks well lubed, I'm not messin with it, just puttin it back together as is.





Thanks Chris
You jolted my memory, you sent me slideshow previously, made it easy.

[Chrisj CMA]

glad to help....I have even updated the new one some........many have asked for it so far, I just want to help those that are willing to do this themselves so its done right  

[whitestroke]

The trust washer looks like it was exposed to grease by the dark inner ring.  Was it covered on both sides by moly paste when you removed it?

The splines do look well lubed but it looks like grease as opposed to moly paste. The amount of grease that looks to have spun out of the splines would make me wonder if the o-rings were sealing or if an excessive amount of grease was used. There should be some spin out, even with paste, but with only 4500 miles, I'm thinking I'd see more paste than grease.

There's the thrust washer for you when I pulled off star.

[Chrisj CMA]

The trust washer looks like it was exposed to grease by the dark inner ring.  Was it covered on both sides by moly paste when you removed it?

The splines do look well lubed but it looks like grease as opposed to moly paste. The amount of grease that looks to have spun out of the splines would make me wonder if the o-rings were sealing or if an excessive amount of grease was used. There should be some spin out, even with paste, but with only 4500 miles, I'm thinking I'd see more paste than grease.

There's the thrust washer for you when I pulled off star.

Yes, you are supposed to put a small amount of grease on the thrust washer...wont hurt a thing......looks good

[whitestroke]

It may be the factory lube job.  Bike only has 4500 miles. PO put new tires on before I purchased and there was no words spoken about service to rear wheel.

[whitestroke]

Couple more questions:
#1. The axle collar/spacer in picture is offset from the center. Does this matter?

2. The 4 screws that get tightened last, how does that align anything?  They tighten the final drive to the swing arm and there is no free play at all at final drive and swing arm for anything to move/align.

[Bigwolf]

Also need to buy some Moly paste for the splines and axle assembly.

I hope you have better luck finding that stuff than I did.  I pulled my final drive out just to check everything. Then I went to town to buy some moly paste but apparently nobody within a hundred miles of me stocks that stuff.     Now I am sitting here with my bike in the air waiting on moly paste while great riding days are slipping by.  I had to go online and order some moly paste.  At least the guys at Guard Dog are getting it shipped right away.

#1. The axle collar/spacer in picture is offset from the center. Does this matter?

That spacer will be centered by the axel when you put the axel in.

2. The 4 screws that get tightened last, how does that align anything?  They tighten the final drive to the swing arm and there is no free play at all at final drive and swing arm for anything to move/align.

Posted on: June 04, 2012, 10:40:31 PM
 Posted by: whitestroke

There is some free play around the bolts that hold the final drive to the swing arm. This free play allows the final drive assembly to rotate slightly at that mating surface which can then cause the axel to be on a bind when it is installed and tightened to spec.  Looking from the back of the bike, it is possible for this slight bit of free play on the bolts to allow for the final drive assembly to be forcing the axel a little higher or a little lower on the left side of the bike than on the right.  When this happens, the drive flange, "star"  as you called it, does not sit evenly against the thrust washer.  Also, this condition causes the splines of the drive and the driven flange to rub against each other a lot more than normal causing excessive wear.

Bigwolf

[F6MoRider]

The trust washer looks like it was exposed to grease by the dark inner ring.  Was it covered on both sides by moly paste when you removed it?

The splines do look well lubed but it looks like grease as opposed to moly paste. The amount of grease that looks to have spun out of the splines would make me wonder if the o-rings were sealing or if an excessive amount of grease was used. There should be some spin out, even with paste, but with only 4500 miles, I'm thinking I'd see more paste than grease.

There's the thrust washer for you when I pulled off star.

The trust washer should have moly paste on both sides.  Looks like it was either not lubed on at least one side (the side shown here) OR it was squeezed out?  Some folks paste the inside of the flange, stick the trust washer into the paste, then paste the wheel hub side so both sides get paste. I do it this way as well.

Because of age alone, and not necessarily wear, I'd replace the 3 o-rings.  Don't forget to loosen the 4 bolts before reassembly and tighten them last.  The aligns the shaft to the pumpkin correctly.

Honda dealer should have the moly paste or be able to order it.  I get mine through Guard Dog, they were very responsive and helpful when I needed them.

[John U.]

Many of us have used synthetic waterproof grease such as Belray or Green grease with great results. If the lack of moly troubles you get some Honda moly paste or Belray assembly lube and mix some with the waterproof grease. I've been doing that for 5 years on two Valks with no problems. The grease and splines always look good when disassembled.

[Valkpilot]

2. The 4 screws that get tightened last, how does that align anything?  They tighten the final drive to the swing arm and there is no free play at all at final drive and swing arm for anything to move/align.

They don't align things if you tighten them after the axle is torqued, but they can mis-align things if you tighten them first.

By inserting the axle and tightening it to proper torque value first, all the interal bits; spacers, drive splines, driven hub, bearing sides, etc. will mate at right angles to the long axis, both aligning themselves correctly and forming a strong column, side to side.    Then the four nuts, that simply keep the pumpkin from separating from the swing arm, can be tightened.

Tightening the four nuts that hold the pumpkin to the swing arm before doing this risks positioning the pumpkin at an angle, due to free play in the holes of the swing arm flange, so that the pumpkin (and drive splines) cannot achieve good alignment with the driven hub and other parts.  This can cause abnormal wear to happen very quickly.

[whitestroke]

Thanks Valkpilot great explanation, makes sense.   




All cleaned up and ready for grease.  I used Guard Dog 525 Grease.  They also have a Paste but Owner recommends the grease for the splines.  It was very thick and sticky, don't think it will fly-off.





Elusive 3rd o-ring goes on 2nd collar from center





Thrust Washer and O-ring.  The old Thrust Washer was 40 thousandths thick same as new one.





Star O-ring



Went for a test ride to see the U.S.S. IOWA pull into it's new home. 5 minutes from my home !!   
Thanks for the help along the way.  Who needs a Manual with all this interactive help.