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Author Topic: No more burnt out starter switch? Electrical question  (Read 2530 times)
gordonv
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Posts: 5763


VRCC # 31419

Richmond BC


« on: July 02, 2012, 12:08:54 PM »

I was visiting my brother-in-law the other week while up in Kelowna going to the Annual Valhalla Valkyrie Rally for the BC chapter of VRCC. Forget the actual lead up, but he had mentioned about adding a diode to stop the reveres voltage creating a spark/arch at the switch, when power is turned off and the electrical field collapses.

This brought to mind about how the starter switch burns out from normal use. So I thought I would ask here, and get some advise from those who have a better knowledge of these electrical issues. "old schoolers" like RJ who has a shop (if I remember right), and I know some are electrictions.


So the question would be, if we applied a diodes on the power leads going through the starter switch (head lights and starter relay) would this stop an electrical surge, which causes arching at the switch, from burning out the starter switch?

Where would we place the diode? I would think it would be down stream of the switch, on the head light/relay side of the switch.

What size diode? I would expect we would need to look at the fuse that was on each wire, and take that as the max amps, and would it be A x Volts to give a value that would give a diode size.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2012, 03:23:47 PM by gordonv » Logged

1999 Black with custom paint IS

hubcapsc
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Posts: 16788


upstate

South Carolina


« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2012, 01:20:40 PM »


Here's a solution kind of along those lines from Rattlebars...



-Mike
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Ricky-D
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Posts: 5031


South Carolina midlands


« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2012, 01:33:58 PM »

Quote
This brought to mind about how the starter switch burns out from normal use.

You are incorrect about that.

It's all the mods that riders add that eats up the switch.

If you've never added any extras to that particular system all that is ever required is an occasional cleaning of the switch and most normally, never have to clean it!

How many thousands of Valkyries on the road that have never been touched. Never hear about them.

Only the bikes that have been all screwed with and then stuff starts to happen.

Duh, 
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2000_Valkyrie_Interstate
john
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Posts: 3018


tyler texas


« Reply #3 on: July 02, 2012, 02:01:01 PM »

        2funny   the biggest problem with the honda valkyrie is with the nut
between the handle bars and the seat          coolsmiley

               whos  said that ?           ???
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vrcc # 19002
Former BMW Guy
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Posts: 523


Aut viam inveniam aut faciam.

Apple Valley, MN


« Reply #4 on: July 02, 2012, 02:05:36 PM »

Quote
This brought to mind about how the starter switch burns out from normal use.

You are incorrect about that.

It's all the mods that riders add that eats up the switch.

If you've never added any extras to that particular system all that is ever required is an occasional cleaning of the switch and most normally, never have to clean it!

How many thousands of Valkyries on the road that have never been touched. Never hear about them.

Only the bikes that have been all screwed with and then stuff starts to happen.

Duh, 

I agree 100%

JP
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Motorcycling is not, of itself, inherently dangerous.
It is however, extremely unforgiving of: inattention, ignorance, incompetence or stupidity.
Patrick
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VRCC 4474

Largo Florida


« Reply #5 on: July 02, 2012, 02:16:19 PM »

The 'start switch safeguard' is a headlight relay installed on Stds/tours to help reduce current thru the start switch..
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gordonv
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VRCC # 31419

Richmond BC


« Reply #6 on: July 02, 2012, 03:35:03 PM »

OK. I can accept all that was said. I'm interested in another IS, so I will never have this problem (fingers crossed) anyways, along with the head lights being on relays.


But how about the process I described (attempted too), about adding a diode stopping an arch when the switch is turned on/off? Is this sound eletronics? I know from electronics the addition of a very small capacitor to an IC power lead, and something about the power spike, to level the power surge, is this doing the same thing?
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1999 Black with custom paint IS

RP#62
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Gilbert, AZ


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« Reply #7 on: July 02, 2012, 06:16:56 PM »

Gordon, what your're talking about is common practice in electronics where you have solid state circuits controlling a relay.  A diode is placed across the relay coil to protect the transistors in the control circuit from the reverse current generated when the relay is de-energized.  This is called the flyback current.  Shouldn't be an issue with the start switch.  The only solid state electronics on the bike are the ICM and possibly the bank angle sensor, but they would already be protected.  The diode trick works with small coils like found in relays.  With large coils, if you're interrupting power, you need a condenser (capacitor) on the points to prevent arcing.  With coils, once current is flowing, they try to keep it flowing even if the circuit is opened.  This is why the old point type ignition system needed a condensor on the point.

Start switch problems are usually caused by oxidized contacts, weak springs and/or too much load.
-RP
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gordonv
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VRCC # 31419

Richmond BC


« Reply #8 on: July 02, 2012, 06:33:36 PM »

Thank you RP for the correct answer, that was the kind of response I was looking for (not that the others did not have a purpose).

I think I was thinking of you also when I mentioned RJ.

So this method would be used more in line with the applications of a relay, but not the small 12v ones we have on our bike. There would also be no requirment/benefit with applying this to the starter switch.

The addition of a relay for the head lights would have the biggest benefit in keeping the starter switch working longer before requiring any service, posted by hubcapsc.
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1999 Black with custom paint IS

RP#62
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Gilbert, AZ


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« Reply #9 on: July 02, 2012, 07:52:05 PM »

Thank you RP for the correct answer, that was the kind of response I was looking for (not that the others did not have a purpose).

I think I was thinking of you also when I mentioned RJ.

So this method would be used more in line with the applications of a relay, but not the small 12v ones we have on our bike. There would also be no requirment/benefit with applying this to the starter switch.

The addition of a relay for the head lights would have the biggest benefit in keeping the starter switch working longer before requiring any service, posted by hubcapsc.

I really don't see where it would be any benefit on the starter switch.  As noted, its more to protect transistors from relays.
-RP
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