charging problem

[raja]

High gang, not been around for a while. Just enjoying my 99 interstate till now. 50000 and now no charging. Just sent Alt off to Ken. Wife and I started using heated gear last year. Ken claims 40 amp alternator output is mostly used up by the bike and not much left over. I ordered a 65 amp. Has anyone else had this problem? My other big question is  the audio radio backup 15 amp circuit is drawing .8 amps key off. Book says .1 amp max.  I hook the meter to it and it initially draws 5 amps and drops quickly to .8 amps. key off.  Anybody have a clue that might help me?

[Michvalk]

First thing I would do is check wiring connectors and fuse connections for corrosion. Then clean the battery connections (both ends)  Check the connections on the dash, and there is a connector in front of the battery that gets corroded. Not sure EXACTLEY where it is, but can get wet and corrode. I can't think of anything else that would create a draw, except for maybe a bad radio.

[raja]

Thanks for the heads up, Michvalk. I'll tearing into it tomorrow. Don't know the connection your talking about but will check it out. Need all the advice I can get. Trouble shooting electrical is always the worst.

[jer0177]

Here's my post about killing that gremlin (with pictures and processes):

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,25289.msg432828.html#msg432828

I don't see anywhere in the wiring diagram that the +12VDC for the stereo brain goes through this connector though, but it may.  I definitely know the neutral indicator and the backlight for the stereo display do - I was having problems with both of those.

[raja]

I new I could count on you fine folks to point me in the right direction. Better than running blind. I'll give it a look see in the morning. Will report back. Thanks jerO.

[raja]

Just took that block apart. It was brand new looking. No sign of corrosion. could it still be the problem ??? I guess I will have to check all the grounds I can find. I know in auto electrics, most of the problems are in the grounding circuits.

[jer0177]

Just took that block apart. It was brand new looking. No sign of corrosion. could it still be the problem ??? I guess I will have to check all the grounds I can find. I know in auto electrics, most of the problems are in the grounding circuits.

You're one of the lucky ones - slather it in di-electric grease before you re-assemble it to keep the moisture away from the contacts and prongs, wrap it up in electrical tape very well and you should be good to go with that.

As for the other problem, I'll meter mine tomorrow and let you know what I find - it could be normal for the quick drop from 5 to .8, and then it may take it longer to "go to sleep" and work its way down to .1 (or there could be an issue with the meter).

[raja]

Thanks jerO. I think it's time for me to go to sleep. I'll wait for your results before tear anymore apart. There must be a power supply in the meter system memory that requires power from the main battery. ???

[valkyriemc]

I would check and re-furb the frame ground, unbolt & clean while your at it.

[Ricky-D]

Help me understand.

Are you referring to an aftermarket add-on?

***

[raja]

RickyD. I'm just guessing about  the LCD meter display. The only accessories I've added are GPS and heated riding gear.  I thing the riding gear took out my alternator. I have a higher output one coming from Ken Meming.

[jer0177]

The riding gear probably didn't "take out" the alternator.  It was probably on it's way out on it's own.  There are some of these that have/had bad windings.

I used my meter to check the current draw for the audio backup circuit, and the most it pulled was .18A.  I removed the 15A fuse (3rd from bottom on main fuse block) and used the meter to complete the circuit to measure the current draw. 

[raja]

  I really appreciate your efforts jerO. I know now that the draw isn't normal. I'll tear into it some more. Look for a weak ground , hope I can find one, otherwise , maybe new meter time. I will get back with the results. I'm sure the cure will help someone else on this great site.

[Ricky-D]

audio radio backup 15 amp circuit

I don't recognize this at all.

I guess I need to pull out the owners manual to see what you're talking about.

***

Ok, I went and looked at the owners manual.  It says nothing about what you refer to.

I think you are referring to something else, have a modification you fail to note, or, are doing something that can ruin the radio circuitry.

[raja]

RickyD, I'm referring to the digital instrument display and the audio circuit on my Interstate. If you disconnect the battery, you loose the memory on the radio but not the mileage record on the meter. Why is the audio backup circuit fused at 15amps There must be something that needs this heavy a draw. ???

[Ricky-D]

audio backup circuit

Where do you find this?

***

[raja]

RickyD,  Interstate wiring diagram, power distribution. Under right hand side cover is a fuse box.
 8 fuses, one is a 15amp fuse, red/ yellow wire, goes to radio and audio panel. Also CB which I don't have.

[jer0177]

RickyD,

On the Interstate, behind the right side cover, there is the factory fuse block:


Inside that fuse block, there is a 15A circuit for the "Audio Backup", it's the 3rd fuse up from the bottom.  It keeps the time for the display and the presets/audio adjustments for your stereo on the Interstate.

Tourers and Standards don't have this.

[raja]

Can anyone tell me were all the ground locations are on a 99 Interstate? I found the one over the coils. Wire diagram shows more but having a tough time finding them. I still think I have a ground problem. I've checked all the gang connecters, even the ones on the fairing. All are in great shape, no corrosion. Want to make sure all the grounds are good before tearing out the LCD.   

[Michvalk]

I see no reason to pull the LCD panel. You should be able to remove the speaker panels and get to the connecter through there. The radio is under the seat on top of the battery box. Check all the connections on the radio. There has to be a bad connection, or the radio is bad. The radio work OK otherwise? might be a bad connnection in the radio itself. If the only place there is a power draw is with the radio, you can test for power draw without the fuse in for the radio, and test for power draw at the battery. Just some other ideas

[raja]

Michvalk, The radio is removed from the bike and the amp draw is from the front of the bike. I still need to locate all the frame grounds.

[RP#62]

http://www.rattlebars.com/valkfaq/schematics/rpage08i.html

-RP

[Ricky-D]

Ok, RP's post is good - see sheet eight (

Any parasitic draw should be minimal all the time with the key off.

***

[pocobubba]

We had a similar problem with my wifes  Wing , it ended up being a stuck relay

[raja]

Thank you RP  The  wiring diagram will help a lot. Pocobubba: can you tell me the relay that was your problem?

[jer0177]

Thank you RP  The  wiring diagram will help a lot. Pocobubba: can you tell me the relay that was your problem?

It would most likely be one that's fed by your parasitic circuit - and there isn't one that's fed by the Audio Backup circuit according to the wiring schematic.

[raja]

jerO: What is the parasitic circuit your referring to. I have checked all the solenoids, grounds,  diodes, and connecters. I installed the battery and hooked up the radio. The radio and LCD display seam to function correctly. At this point I'm letting it set with the battery tender on. 
New battery came up to full charge in a short time. I'm completely stumped.  Thank you all for your help. This gremlin is playing nasty. I do understand auto electrics, I completely wired my 39 Chev coupe. 

[jer0177]

jerO: What is the parasitic circuit your referring to. I have checked all the solenoids, grounds,  diodes, and connecters. I installed the battery and hooked up the radio. The radio and LCD display seam to function correctly. At this point I'm letting it set with the battery tender on. 
New battery came up to full charge in a short time. I'm completely stumped.  Thank you all for your help. This gremlin is playing nasty. I do understand auto electrics, I completely wired my 39 Chev coupe. 

They had wire in 1939??   

What I was referring to is that if you've got a parasitic draw caused by a stuck relay, and you've narrowed down the draw to the Audio Backup circuit (by checking draw through that fuse cavity), the relay causing the draw would have to be part of that circuit, and there aren't any external relays as part of that circuit.

There was a hint given by Michvalk - don't test across the fuse cavity - pull all the fuses, test at the battery and install only one fuse at a time.  Don't forget the 30A in the starter relay, and the main strap fuse, as well as the 3 up the side of the main fuse block in the IS.

[raja]

By gully , they did have wire in 39, but I replaced it with a complete harness out of a 78 Monty Carlo. Handy that it was all color coded. Even used the fuse box. As for the Valk, I will check the fuses once again , the way you say. thanks again for hanging with me.

[raja]

I just checked all the fuses individually. Only the audio backup 15 amp fuse showed a draw. When the battery is hooked up initially, the draw is around 6 volts then drops quickly to .22 volts. I don't know what that is in amps. I don't have a analog meter. The digital meter can't handle the initial load. I'm going to install the new alternator when it gets here and assume that the draw is normal. The radio and all the LCD components operate normally. If someone could check their IS at the battery and see what draw is at the negative cable, I'd appreciate it. You need to disconnect the negative cable and put the meter positive probe on the cable and the meter negative probe on the battery negative post. Use the 12volt range on the digital meter. Thanks

[Ricky-D]

I think you're Ok!

***

[raja]

Well gang, I'm back on the road again. Thanks for all the advice. Ken Heming send me a new HO alternator. great service and price. I installed it in a few minutes using the technique I stated on Hoser's Alt advice # 5. Give it a try and avoid some frustration. Bike is charging fine. I guess the slight amp draw is normal. New battery is holding charge. While waiting for the new amp, I serviced the rear splines, put on new tire, new wheel dampers, and new rear brakes. I should be good for another 10,000 miles

[GJS]

Been following this thread.

Glad to hear your on the road again.

If you have a .8amp draw on a 12.6 volt battery, your using 10 watts of power.
This will kill your new battery after a week or two of no charging.
I suspect it is enough of a draw to keep a trickle charger warm.

My best guess has already been speculated on. The relay's coil that  keeps that circuit alive.

This one will continue to haunt you until you find it. If it is the relay, it may die in the near future. The extra current draw will be keeping it warm. That's an idea! Go out in the morning and feel all the relays for warmth. Replace anything warm to touch. 10watts should be very noticeable.

Good luck

GJS

[raja]

Thanks for the advice GJS. I'll check the relays. Haven't checked out the amp draw sense getting it back together. 

[PhredValk]

By my calculations, using the provided site, the IS has more than 250 Watts to spare for accessories and add ons.

http://www.powerlet.com/learningCenter/excessCapacity
Fred.

[raja]

Great web site Phred, but I wounder how much spare watts there are at 2500-3000 rpm were I think most people cruze. The 1800 wing has 1100 watts. Has to be for more juice at lower rpms. I installed a 65 amp alternator to get more watts at a lower rpm. Maybe It's overkill.