Clutch Issue?

[99valk]

I have a 99 standard with 37k miles.  My clutch seems to have gone on vacation without any warning and I would like to know if anyone else has experienced a similar issue.  After riding for about 30 minutes I stopped in first with the clutch in and suddenly the bike chunked forward and stalled.  I put the bike in neutral and restarted it.  I clutched and put the bike in 1st and instant chunk and stall.  I got the bike home and after it cooled down I bled the clutch until no old fluid remained. After bleeding I started the bike and tried to put it in 1st with same miserable results.
I usually bleed the system every 2 years so the fluid was not really bad.  I have no leaks that I can see and the fluid was not low.
The clutch gave no signs of slipping or failure.
Any thoughts or suggestion.  Something really cheap or simple would be great. I know that my weekend will be spent taking the clutch apart unless someone has any other suggestions.

[Mr.BubblesVRCCDS0008]

Have you changed levers lately?  You might check the bushing in the clutch lever. Also check the pin that the slave cylinder moves. Does the clutch feel any different now then before. I hope it is something simple. You could have lost the slave cylinder or master cylinder may not be moving any fluid.

[99valk]

I will check the bushings tonight, but since fluid came out at a normal flow during the bleeding I did not think that the master was the issue.  I guess the only way to check the slave or push rod is to remove the slave.
the clutch feel has not changed at all and I have not touched the stock levers.

[Ricky-D]

It sounds like you are saying that when you pull the clutch lever the clutch is not disengaging.

So the question would be: Is the pressure still present at  the lever when you pull the lever. There is a distinct difference between a clutch lever moving the clutch innards and a clutch lever that is doing no work at all.

This is important to help localize where your problem is.

[six2go #152]

My clutch acted very similar to that a few weeks ago, only I had a few more "symptoms": With bike in gear & lever pulled in, the bike would "creep" forward. Very difficult to downshift, almost impossible to find neutral, clutch would "shudder" when taking off from a stop, clutch would start to engage when only releasing the lever 1/4 inch or less where before it wouldn't start to engage until about the halfway point. Since I'm not a mechanic and don't want to be, I took it to my "very trusted" dealer. They found that some of the rivets holding the clutch plates had sheared off the heads. Some of the plates showed a very strange wear pattern(gouged) where the rivets must have gotten between them & chewed them up. I told the dealer to "make it new again". I got new plates, basket, springs, and several other parts that I don't remember. Anyway, for the "paltry sum" of $1012.00 everything is working like new again. This is the first money I have spent on a REPAIR on my Valk in 11 years & 87,000 miles.

[Patrick]

of your post it appears that the clutch was operating correctly without any chatter or shutter upon release.. Then I would be surprised if there was a mechanical issue with the clutch[ but I'm usually surprised by something every day].. Its sounds to me like you a hydraulic problem somewhere..

[99valk]

bleeding the clutch did push fluid out the bled value with a steady stream.  I realize that there is no real pressure on the slave at that point so it may be that I have lost all pressure from the master to the slave under load.  Any way to check if the pressure at the slave is strong enough to engage the clutch?  Taking the slave off is easy enough.  I guess I can check if the slave is putting out strong pressure after I take it off the housing.
Ricky-D - the lever feel has not changed.  it feels like it is working properly, but I know that the clutch is not engaged since putting it in gear while the engine is running is causing the bike to stall.  if I have the bike in gear and turned off, then try to roll the bike with the clutch in is does take enough pressure to allow the bike to roll.  the bike will not roll if the clutch is out as expected.  Make sense?  There seems to be some pressure from the handle, but I don't know if it is enough to work under load while the bike is running.

[Scott from FL, now in Maine]

Forgive me if this sounds foolish, but is there a chance that your kick stand switch failed? I asked because mine did this after changing the clutch lever and brake lever for new chrome style, I had the same results as you and spent half a day trying to find a clutch problem, only to finally find a bad stand switch. It really felt like my clutch wasn't working and stalled with a clunk every time I put it in gear and also, like yours, rolled fine with the clutch in. Good Luck, will be watching to see how it works out 

[99valk]

Thanks for the thought Scott.  I ask for a simple solution and I thought you gave me one until I tried to get my big meaty hands in the space in front of the battery to disconnect the side stand sensor and test it.
Wanted: small japanese mechanic with hand from a Barbie that can actually get at some of the locations on this bike.  One hour sitting in a 90 degree garage bending my fingers in ways they are not suppose to bend and I still don't have the connector off.  Maybe the bike nome will do the work while I sleep tonight.  I QUIT

[Scott from FL, now in Maine]

Another thing to mention. If I recall right the signal from the side stand goes thru the switch by the clutch lever I think. Be sure your wires haven't slipped on that switch too. If I haven't gotten that backwards, you should be able to check the signal from the side stand on the clutch lever switch wires with a meter. Someone please correct me if I am backwards  

Just checked the manual. On the standard under the seat on the left side (you may need to remove the left side cover too) there is a green wire connector. In that connector you should find a yellow/black wire and a green wire. You should have continuity between those two wires with the side stand retracted. Might be easier to check there than to get at the switch itself   

[mikeb]

put it in gear pull the clutch in if it rolls its the kickstand switch  no roll its the clutch! 

[Ricky-D]

bleeding the clutch did push fluid out the bled value with a steady stream.  I realize that there is no real pressure on the slave at that point so it may be that I have lost all pressure from the master to the slave under load.  Any way to check if the pressure at the slave is strong enough to engage the clutch?  Taking the slave off is easy enough.  I guess I can check if the slave is putting out strong pressure after I take it off the housing.
Ricky-D - the lever feel has not changed.  it feels like it is working properly, but I know that the clutch is not engaged since putting it in gear while the engine is running is causing the bike to stall.  if I have the bike in gear and turned off, then try to roll the bike with the clutch in is does take enough pressure to allow the bike to roll.  the bike will not roll if the clutch is out as expected.  Make sense?  There seems to be some pressure from the handle, but I don't know if it is enough to work under load while the bike is running.

With that statement I would think there is no problem with the clutch.

It's hard to tell sometimes if the motor shuts down from an electrical disconnect or from the tranny kicking into 1st gear with the clutch engaged.

It would seem as Scott has hit upon your problem and the shutdown of the motor is from an electrical disconnect.

[Ricky-D]

Here's an active thread right now. It's on the very subject as here.

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,4720.msg34523.html#new

[99valk]

Bike nome was kind and made the disconnect of the side stand connection very easy this morning.  The side stand switch tests fine and works exactly as the manual describes.  I also tested the clutch switch and that worked fine.
I did some more moving of the bike in gear with the clutch in and there is now an unhealthy grinding sound that I did not hear before.  I think that the clutch is working under light load, enough to shift to neutral or into first, but when the engine is actually running it goes back on vacation and sits by the pool drinking beers.
I will let you know what I find as I start to dig deeper.
Thanks for all the great suggestions.  this site is very helpful.

[greggh]

I had had similar problem with mine.
Pull in the clutch put in gear and it would leap forward and die, then eventually the clutch would not pull in all the way.  Took it to the shop they flushed and refilled the clutch fluid and all was fine for a month.
Then one night the fat lady started smoking out the exhaust really bad. Shut it down, trailered it home, did the same about the posting here and VOAI and then just took it to the shop.
Clutch rivets had sheared off and plugged some of the oil journals, bad clutch. $860.00 later the fat lady was singing again.

I suggest having a mechanic look at it. Unless you have the ability to tear it apart yourself?

Just my 2cents.

[99valk]

You were right Greg!
Could not find time to work on it so I took it to the dealer last week (I know it took a large gulp to swollow my pride and take it in).  They keep it two days and declared her healthy.  Picked it up and on the way home the clutch lever would not pull in more then half way and the clutch was slipping.  So much for the experts!  This dealer actually use to maintain the police Valks for the city.  I guess those mechanics are no longer working there.
Took the clutch cover off and found five rivit heads stuck in the oil on the cover.  looked in the oil that drained in the pan and found several more.  After removing the clutch center found that the pressure plate had lost ten of the sixteen rivits with three of the springs totally loose.  Over $400 in parts ordered including a new clutch inner because of damage caused by loose springs gouging the grooves.
Taking the inner clutch out was actually really simple, about two hours work.  most of the time was removing stuff to get at the clutch.  If you do the work yourself you do not need a special tool to remove the inner clutch bolt.  just use an impact wrench and the bolt spins right off.
All the parts are suppose to be in this Friday so I know what I will be doing this weekend.  I hope it goes back together as easy as it came apart.
I really need my Valk fix.     My attitude sucks when I don't get my regular Valk fix.