I smell gas!!

[cajundood]

Recently I had a problem with the OEM petcock. I've since replaced the diaphragm as well as the fuel line from the tank to the tee as well as each side of the tee.
I have hose clamps on everything.
I smell gas when i ride and at first couldn't tell where it was coming from.
I finally noticed a dampness on the line BETWEEN the carburetors. Now I didnt replace those because it looked as though I would have to remove the carbs to do so, nor can i see what type of line is used.

The gas smell is really bothering me though, so I think I'm not gonna have a choice but to remove the tank and air box so i can get to this area to investigate. The black line i purchased was automotive fuel line which was thick and not very flexible, so I'm gonna go with something a little more flexible. (clear 8mm fuel line maybe?)

Amy insight on whats used to connect the fuel in the area between the carbs?
thanks all

[Ricky-D]

Solid hard rails with seals on the ends.

***

[9Ball]

+1...not a quick and easy fix either.

[cajundood]

  Wonderful 

Having second thoughts now, about taking it down.

[Hoser]

See if the vent tube is hooked up and not kinked, the triple outlet about half way down is supposed to have one outlet unplugged.  I'm assuming you had the tank off, correct?  Hoser  

[Joevalk]

Intake o-rings

[Denny47]

O rings on fuel rail. Carb bank has to be removed and carbs separated. A major pain in the uh huh.

[salty1]

+1 fuel rail leak(s)   

[Brian]

When my fuel rail o-rings started leaking I had a puddle of gas in one of the casting cavities on top of the engine block. My local hardware store had o-rings of the correct size. That was over 5 years ago and no problems todate.

[salty1]

When my fuel rail o-rings started leaking I had a puddle of gas in one of the casting cavities on top of the engine block. My local hardware store had o-rings of the correct size. That was over 5 years ago and no problems todate.

Glad to hear those O-rings from the hardware store worked. However, I would use O-rings available from Redeye Technologies as they resist breaking down when bathed in fuel.

[cajundood]

Well........I guess I'll pull the tank, box and carbs.   
If I don't do it now, I never will. Its a good time of the year to do it even though winters arent bad here thus cutting into riding time.
Bike has never been taken down with 76k /miles on her, but I'll go ahead and pull all that smog crap out while i'm in there.
wish me luck 

D00D

ps
anyone know the part numbers or vendor to get the o-ring seals from??

[Ricky-D]

Those seals, referred to as O-rings are not really O-rings because they are not toroidal, but rather have a non uniform cross-section for better application and sealing.

Use what you want, but I suggest to get OEM in this instance, or if available aftermarket clones.

And I would only suggest to replace the ones that are leaking from that rail so you don't need to take apart the whole carburetor assembly.

Just one more note here: There have been a few other threads regarding this same problem you are experiencing and a few have just run the bike for a while and the leaks did stop. Probably from swelling up a bit.  Now, in your case where you disturbed the rails, the conditions (situation) may have changed so leaving them alone for a while may not work.

In any case, what you decide to do is in your realm, but I'd suggest to just let them alone for a bit, as long as they are not dripping excessively and see what happens.

***

[salty1]

Well........I guess I'll pull the tank, box and carbs.   
If I don't do it now, I never will. Its a good time of the year to do it even though winters arent bad here thus cutting into riding time.
Bike has never been taken down with 76k /miles on her, but I'll go ahead and pull all that smog crap out while i'm in there.
wish me luck 

D00D

ps
anyone know the part numbers or vendor to get the o-ring seals from??

Rich at Redeye has what your looking for. He has the desmog kits too. I've used a lot of what he offers and it's worked well for me.   
http://redeye.ecrater.com/

[Oklahoma_Valk]

Rich at Redeye has what your looking for. He has the desmog kits too. I've used a lot of what he offers and it's worked well for me.  
http://redeye.ecrater.com/

+1

I recommend contacting a member in your area who has done this build before, if you arent proficient in carb mechanic skills.


Also, +1 on what RickyD said.

[Brian]

When my fuel rail o-rings started leaking I had a puddle of gas in one of the casting cavities on top of the engine block. My local hardware store had o-rings of the correct size. That was over 5 years ago and no problems todate.

Glad to hear those O-rings from the hardware store worked. However, I would use O-rings available from Redeye Technologies as they resist breaking down when bathed in fuel.

I did this repair over a weekend and got lucky that the hardware store had them. At the time of this replacement I was not a member on this board so I did know about redeye. I have used their products since then, just not for this application. I did question gasoline use for these o-rings before I bought them. Our hardware store here is used a lot by our local farmers. Not too mention that they have a large distribution warehouse supplying stores up and down the east coast. I appreciate the heads up.

[Brian]

Those seals, referred to as O-rings are not really O-rings because they are not toroidal, but rather have a non uniform cross-section for better application and sealing.

Use what you want, but I suggest to get OEM in this instance, or if available aftermarket clones.

And I would only suggest to replace the ones that are leaking from that rail so you don't need to take apart the whole carburetor assembly.

Just one more note here: There have been a few other threads regarding this same problem you are experiencing and a few have just run the bike for a while and the leaks did stop. Probably from swelling up a bit.  Now, in your case where you disturbed the rails, the conditions (situation) may have changed so leaving them alone for a while may not work.

In any case, what you decide to do is in your realm, but I'd suggest to just let them alone for a bit, as long as they are not dripping excessively and see what happens.

***

If jumping into removing the carbs to replace the 0-rings I personally recommend replacing them all. Who is to say that you wouldn't disturb one that wasn't leaking before. Putting gas on the lines and the carbs before putting the assembly back on the bike is recommended. Just my two cents.

[flsix]

I just finished a desmog on mine and used the Shinny desmog kit #8464393 from Redeye. Good instructions and the parts seem to be well made. I also used what they call a Frankenfilter also from Redeye #5138850. This is a pre formed gas line with a replaceable inline filter (Fram) that was a good fit. Something I didn't get was a quick disconnecter for the gas line, it might be easer to connect using that. It's also available from Redeye. Get two packs of Vacuum caps #3301919 to block off the lines that are removed when you take off the pair valve and the rest of the smog junk. If you are pulling the carb banks you'll need to remove the intakes. There's an O-ring under each intake and if they have not been replaced before you can get all six O-rings in the Intake O-ring Kit #2064055.
I don't have anything to do with Redeye, just passing along the same info that was given to me about three weeks ago by another VRCC member.
Good luck with the carb work.

[salty1]

I just finished a desmog on mine and used the Shinny desmog kit #8464393 from Redeye. Good instructions and the parts seem to be well made. I also used what they call a Frankenfilter also from Redeye #5138850. This is a pre formed gas line with a replaceable inline filter (Fram) that was a good fit. Something I didn't get was a quick disconnecter for the gas line, it might be easer to connect using that. It's also available from Redeye. Get two packs of Vacuum caps #3301919 to block off the lines that are removed when you take off the pair valve and the rest of the smog junk. If you are pulling the carb banks you'll need to remove the intakes. There's an O-ring under each intake and if they have not been replaced before you can get all six O-rings in the Intake O-ring Kit #2064055.
I don't have anything to do with Redeye, just passing along the same info that was given to me about three weeks ago by another VRCC member.
Good luck with the carb work.

+1 AND be sure to synchronize yours carbs when all your finished.

[Poor Ol Harry]

Because I suffered a hydrolock,I pretty much lived all of above good advice ,I felt the petcock had as much to do with hydrolock as the other factors so I replaced it with a manuel Pingel & the only regrete is I could have saved myself alot of down time had I only started with the pingle,but thats just my take on my experiance

[cajundood]

Well....Let's see how bad I can screw this up. 

Ordered the fuel rail kit & DESMOG kits from redeye.
Probably start pulling everything down next week. I noticed all of the vacuum lines are split on the ends so i'll order some new blue silicone hose to go back with.
anyone know how many ft. total of the 5/32" line i need to get? (looks like approx. 8 ft. so i guess i'll get 10 to be safe.

[salty1]

If you do the desmog, you have no vacuum lines to replace. The vacuum lines on carbs 3&4 will be removed and the port on the carb capped just the other carbs. The only exception would be the line off carb 6 that goes to the OEM petcock.  ???  I believe redeye has that line also.  If you Pingel the bike, then that line also goes too. Sure nice when it's all cleaned up. 

[cajundood]

so let me get this straight.........desmog eliminates all of the vacuum lines? (minus the #6 petcock line)
i just rebuilt the oem petcock diaphraghm but have an electric fuel shutoff ready to be installed.

[cajundood]

Because I suffered a hydrolock,I pretty much lived all of above good advice ,I felt the petcock had as much to do with hydrolock as the other factors so I replaced it with a manuel Pingel & the only regrete is I could have saved myself alot of down time had I only started with the pingle,but thats just my take on my experiance

Harry
The diaphraghm went out on mine and i was lucky to release the starter before any damage was done.
i was able to remove the #6 plug and expel the gas with no damage.
The reason i went back with the oem petcock was. I'd probably never remember to shutoff the fuel everytime i got off the bike, which is why i got an electric shutoff to install. I'll just have to trust the new diaphragm to work well.

[flsix]

If you desmog the only vacuum line left will be for the OEM petcock. You will not need much new line. It will really clean up the area between the carb banks.

[salty1]

If you desmog the only vacuum line left will be for the OEM petcock. You will not need much new line. It will really clean up the area between the carb banks.

+1    My favorite setup is the OEM patcock in series with a Dan Marc electric shutoff valve. 

[cajundood]

If you desmog the only vacuum line left will be for the OEM petcock. You will not need much new line. It will really clean up the area between the carb banks.

+1    My favorite setup is the OEM patcock in series with a Dan Marc electric shutoff valve. 

Yes....I ordered the Dan Marc a couple of months ago when I almost experienced the hydrolock. but never installed it. since replacing the fuel lines have now disturbed the fuel rail o rings, I will go ahead and install the bugger.

[salty1]

Sorry about the fuel rails.     After the desmog and before you install the Dan Marc, place the Dan Marc in the space where the pair valves were located. You'll need longer feed lines to the fuel rails from the T which is also the attachment point for the Dan Marc. The OEM fuel line may have to be shortened if the Dan Marc valve isn't placed far enough forward. Make sure everything is "downhill". 

[cajundood]

yes, I'll install the dan marc right before the T. actually i ordered a new brass T off of Fleabay to replace OEM plastic one that has hardly any barb on it at all.

[Brian]

I used the redeye vacuum line kit to cap the vacuum ports on the intakes. When I went back to remove them to synch the carbs they easy tore. I do not recommend them. I went back with thicker tubing. Never have I lost a home made vacuum cap using short pieces of tubing and screw that fits tight for the plug. I am sure others here have come up with other suggestions as well.

Good luck with the carbs.

[cajundood]

OK.....finally have the time to try and tackle this job.
all the kits have come in.
took one last ride to empty the tank. could smell gas the whole time and now bike runs a little rough.

got the bike on the stand, removed the tank and just got the airbox out. 
wth is that air dam doing there??? the reason i wanted to do a desmog was to clear out the clutter on top of the motor to allow for better airflow, but air dam has it all blocked off anyways..
down here in louisiana, i can pretty much ride year round.....and the summers are very hot. it seems like the bike would run cooler with that air dam removed..... COMMENTS??? 

after wrangling out the airbox, i noticed one of the air rail connections had come off...(explains the roughness)

So....Do the carbs have to come off as one unit or can i just remove the #6 in order to replace the o-rings? I'd prefer not to disturb the fuel rail on the front carbs since they aren't leaking.

[BradValk48237]

I wouldn't take it off if I were you.... It keeps alot/most of the hot air from the radiator blowing back on the motor and YOU....

The PO of mine had removed it and I replaced it and it made a difference to me.

Up to you , but its a pain replace right once its out...

Just my 2 cents

Brad

[salty1]

I wouldn't take it off if I were you.... It keeps alot/most of the hot air from the radiator blowing back on the motor and YOU....

The PO of mine had removed it and I replaced it and it made a difference to me.

Up to you , but its a pain replace right once its out...

Just my 2 cents

Brad

Leave that radiator cowling in place, just my pinion.

[Oklahoma_Valk]

Cajundood,

Don't remove the air dam. Carbs come off as a unit, and if I were you I would order the FULL carb rebuild kit including bowl gaskets and carb bowl screws. If you replace one fuel rail o ring.....replace em all. The job needs to be done completely in order to be done right. The rebuild kit is about $65 and will be the best money you spend for your Valk.

In regard to your desmog, the red eye kit is great. I tried the vacuum caps for a few hundred miles. They cracked very quickly, causing my bike to run rougher than it should. The heating and cooling causes the rubber to crack. Recently I went down to my local hardware store and found 6 small hex-head bolts and washers that matched the thread size of the barbs on which the vacuum caps are usually mounted. I removed the vacuum barbs on the back of the intake runners, and replaced them with these hex head bolts. The bolts are 5 mm diameter. They are described as "M5" size at the hardware store. The bolts are only as deep as the threads on the barbs were, so they do not penetrate the tube of the intake runners. They are flush with the walls of the runners. Attic Rat suggested this to me. My bike runs extremely well now. This advice is optional, though.

I recently installed a Dan Marc valve as well. Again, that is an excellent mod. I wired it using a relay, and used the common black and white ground wire on top of one of my coils as the "switch-on" wire for the relay. There are many write-ups on this subject. It seems to be the mnost common way to power the dan marc.

In my oppinion, to do the job right, you need:

1) complete desmog
2) carb clean/full rebuild using the redeye kit (this includes cleaning the bowls, jets, and replacing all o-rings)
3) dan marc valve
4) petcock rebuild kit ( and good hose, if you plan to use the petcock vacuum function)

Personally, I converted my petcock to full manual, ran it that way for several months, and then installed a dan marc valve to use in combination with my full manual OEM petcock. The Pingel is expensive, but I'd own one if I wasnt such a cheap skate.

This whole project can be quite the can of worms, but with help from the VRCC it's a managable can of worms. I just recently did all of the above, over the course of 3 months. My only regret is that I did not do all mods once, and I did not do them all correct the first time.

when all is finished, you will have to reinstall the airbox. In order to attach the air box boots to each individual carburetor, I put a 2x4 on top of the airbox, and threw a ratchet strap over the top of it. I hooked the ratchet strap to the engine guards on each side of the bike, then ratcheted the air box down a bit, and easily installed the intake tubes. Easily as can be done, anyhow. John Schmidt offered this tip.

when bike is reassembled (and before you remove vacuum barbs on runners) you MUST sync the carbs. Sure, you can sync them visually on the workbench, but the valk is SO precise. It needs to be synced using a vacuum gauge. I purchased a Morgan Carbtune 4 column, for this task. I tried to make my own single vacuum gauge, with no success.

Hope Ive been some help. Dont be scared to use the PM button if you get overwhelmed.

Okie

[salty1]

In regard to your desmog, the red eye kit is great. I tried the vacuum caps for a few hundred miles. They cracked very quickly, causing my bike to run rougher than it should. The heating and cooling causes the rubber to crack. Recently I went down to my local hardware store and found 6 small hex-head bolts and washers that matched the thread size of the barbs on which the vacuum caps are usually mounted. I removed the vacuum barbs on the back of the intake runners, and replaced them with these hex head bolts. The bolts are 5 mm diameter. They are described as "M5" size at the hardware store. The bolts are only as deep as the threads on the barbs were, so they do not penetrate the tube of the intake runners. They are flush with the walls of the runners. Attic Rat suggested this to me. My bike runs extremely well now. This advice is optional, though.

Not a bad idea, but with those ports removed there is no way to synchronize your carbs other than a bench approach. I think it would be difficult to remove the threaded plug and reinstall the vacuum port. I've had no trouble yet with redeye's vacuum caps. FWIW.

[Oklahoma_Valk]

I should have mentioned I DID sync my carbs before removing the vacuum barbs (ports). Once the engine cooled down, it was pretty easy to remove the barbs and replace them with the hex head bolts. I'll try to post some photos today, maybe help visualize things.

okie