Progressive 412's and Sag

[rxvalk]

Hi all,

I bought my 98 tourer with a set of progressive 412's on it. The 412's had the standard spring on it. When I first bought it they were set on the lightest preload and would bottom out. I set them to the highest preload and did not bottom out any more. Still seemed to sag quite bit 2-3 inches when I sat on it.

 I sent them to progressive and had the HD springs put on it. I cant tell a difference. I called today to verify that they put the HD springs on there and they said they did. No other way to verify that I know of and I dont feel like spending 40.00 to ship them there and back just to double check.

I would think with the preload all the way on the 4th notch the bike would barely move when I sit on it I didn't measure but it still seems to sink a good 2 inches on the highest preload. I am 250 lbs.

So is this normal for progressive shocks. My friend has a standard with interstate shocks and it barely moves when I sit on it.

Thoughts?

[Tropic traveler]

Replaced my 90,000 mile stockers with 412's on my '97 Tourer. They felt a bit wimpy right from the get-go. Just over a year later one side was leaking.
Replaced them with a set of good used I/S shocks.... all is good now! 

Anybody want to buy 1 good {not leaking} 412 shock---- Cheap!? 

[Oklahoma_Valk]

I almost went with 412s for the cheaper price. However soon thereafter I found a set of 440s 13'' for an even better price. LOVE the 440s.

[rxvalk]

Has anyone else around my weight had the 412's with HD springs and noticed this.

[greggh]

The springs May very well be just fine...
It might be that the Driver may need to loose some weight

[rxvalk]

Thanks GreggH.

Does anyone have a Helpful take on this issue

[Jess from VA]

I''ve no experience with 412s, only 440s.  

But I do not think that HD 412s (on highest preload, or on any preload) should sag a full two inches when a 250 lb man simply sits down on the bike (even 300lb).  

First, you need a partner to try and measure them with you off and on the bike (maybe you can tape a ruler/yardstick on them to see for yourself, or access a laser level).  A butt dyno here is not accurate enough.

Second, are your shock bushings in good shape; could they be part of the compression/movement you feel when sitting on the bike? (I would hope new ones came with the HD spring rebuid)

Third, how do they ride?  If they are compressing 2" just sitting on the bike, i would think they should be bottoming on moderate to nasty bumps (go hit some on purpose).

In short, further experimentation is necessary before you decide whether to send them back or just live with them.

[rxvalk]

Jess,

Thanks for weighing in. The bushings were replaced with the spring swap. I will take it out and ride as soon as the temps get over 30 and the roads clear. They weren't bottoming out before on the highest setting with the light duty springs. So regardless of whether they swapped the springs I would assume the same result on the highest pre-load which is where I have them now.
 They just don't seem any different with the new springs as far as sag than they did with the old. I will ask GreggH (if I decide to forgive him about the weight comment) to help me measure and see where we are at. I guess I expected them to not move when I pushed down on them with my arm much less sat on the bike. Maybe thats just the way the progressives are made.

[Tropic traveler]

Thanks GreggH.

Does anyone have a Helpful take on this issue

I don't know how much more helpful I could get.
Bought stock length 412's WITH HD springs.
I weigh 248lbs, rarely ride 2 up.
Felt wimpy right from install, sagged as much as worn out stockers.
Barely lasted past warranty time before leaking.
Put on a set of nice used I/S shocks, no more wimpy ride, have lasted over 3 years & 25,000 miles since then.

Bottom line- NOT a fan of 412's.
Go with a higher quality shock or a set of I/S shocks. Do not wast your time & money on 412's.  

[rxvalk]

Hey Topic Traveler,

Sorry the helpful underlined was not meant for you Jess or Oklahoma valk. Greggh and I are long time friends as a matter of fact he helped me pull the shocks and rejuvenate the rear end bearings etc this last weekend. Thanks Gregg.

The helpful was meant for him because he was harassing me about the 10-20 lbs I have gained recently

[Tropic traveler]

No problem!
Don't want to see someone else waste $200 on a set of 412's that did not impress me at all. 

Still got the single one for sale or trade! 

[Brian]

I have been reading all these threads about the progressive shocks and have to ask WHY is everyone still buying them if they have a history of leaks. All well and good that they will repair or replace, but you have to keep a spare set on hand while these are sent out if you want to keep riding. How is Progressive staying in business if their product fails and they have to do the shock twice or more. I used to work for a service/commercial installation HVAC and engineering company that had a saying, "if you can't aford the time and money to do it right the first time how do you find the time and money to do right the second time".

Just my two cents here. I would need to read more from the guys using the Works Shocks before making this investment.

[Bigwolf]

I put a new set of Progressive 412 HDs on my 98 standard just before Inzane last summer.  The stockers were bottoming out pretty bad when the bike was fully loaded (in my case overloaded per factory specs).  And price was the deciding factor.  I would have prefered a used set of interstate shocks but was unable to find a set at that time.

Now with around 5k on these shocks, they sag roughly 2 inches when I set my 250 lb butt on the bike.  That is with the shocks set on level 2 which is where I run them with just me and a few small pieces of gear.  When Crazy B and I loaded the bike for Inzane, there was well over 500 lbs on the bike.  I had the springs set on level 4 and did touch bottom on a couple of bad bumps only.  Had the springs been set to max, I doubt we would have ever bottomed out.

With that said, I am still hoping to make the move to interstate springs when I can.

Bigwolf

[rxvalk]

Thanks all, Seems the interstate shocks are the way to go. Now I just have to find a gently used pair.

[WilliamRS]

you may need someone to measure how much actual sag there is when you sit fully outfitted on the valk. 

then set the preload on the shocks to keep the sag in the 1 to 2 inch range (depending on your preferences) 

[BF]

I've got a set of 11.5" 412's on mine and I run about 260 on my non-water retaining days.   

I wanted to try a set of shorter shocks and found this set used from another member for cheap.  Replaced the bushings with a set of Gary's bushings and have been riding on them for a little over a year now with no problems.  They are cranked to max preload.  They do seem to sag some, however I don't know by how much.  Have only bottomed out once and that was when 2-up. 

I don't have a clue how many miles are on them, but they don't leak (yet) and they ride decent. 

All of that said, if I had the bucks, I'd swap them out for a set of 11.5" Works shocks in a heartbeat. 

http://xf6-custom.com/partpages/valshock.html