Found a way to drop my gearing....

[Valker]

I have contacted a custom gear manufacturer about my Valk. I have always wanted to drop my RPMs by a significant amount when traveling. This place I found says they can make ring and gears for our final drives in my choice of ratios. I think I'll go with a 15-20% drop which will set my RPMs at about 2800-2900 at 77-82 mph which is where I normally ride. I will have to wait until they do a thorough analysis and CAD run before I know the whole price. They think it will be substantially lower than the previous transmission gears sets and much easier to do......

[NCGhostrider]

Let us know how it goes.  I would love to lower the rpms a bit on my bike.  You can't justify the cost, but if it would stretch the fuel a bit.. I could ride longer before fillups!!  Of course those winds in the panhandle of Texas might cause you to burn more fuel if it is geared higher... hmm...

see ya.

Craig
NCGhostrider
99 I/S

[TearlessTom]

Keep us /me informed. I have thought of doing the same thing.  I love my Valk but I do wish the gears were spaced a bit futher apart. Especially 5th.

Tom

[thewoodman]

Count me in / the more gear sets made the lower the unit price

[SgtBunny]

I wanted to do this at one point but after reading reviews of Mario's gear set I decided not to do it.

[Tundra]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

[TearlessTom]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

Could you be more specific?  What bad results?

[woefman]

Count me in .

My 73 year old riding buddy ( we ride goldwings gl1800) He is retired and in Colorado for summer) when he got wind I bought a Valk , he said you had to do it huh ?  I said yes, could not pass up this deal.

Anyways I know in the back of his mind he is going to take me to school. He is a former 2 valk owner, and loves them to a point. However this guy rides like no other, prefers to go 200 miles at least with no stops.

I am sure he will plan a ride where I run out of gas.

would be cool to get extra miles on a tank without him knowing.

as it sits I get way better milage then his now kids bike ( he handed down his valk to his kid).

I been getting like 36mpg ( 155 miles before reserve)

[Daniel Meyer]

It's not going to get you any significant mileage gains. It takes a certian horsepower to push you at a certian speed no matter what gear ratio you use. The only efficiency gains are the reduction in friction as the engine spins slower...not terribly significant. That's why the mario gears didn't yeild any better mileage...

Want better mileage? Fuel injection is probably the key...

[Valker]

Count me in .

My 73 year old riding buddy ( we ride goldwings gl1800) He is retired and in Colorado for summer) when he got wind I bought a Valk , he said you had to do it huh ?  I said yes, could not pass up this deal.

Anyways I know in the back of his mind he is going to take me to school. He is a former 2 valk owner, and loves them to a point. However this guy rides like no other, prefers to go 200 miles at least with no stops.

I am sure he will plan a ride where I run out of gas.

would be cool to get extra miles on a tank without him knowing.

as it sits I get way better milage then his now kids bike ( he handed down his valk to his kid).

I been getting like 36mpg ( 155 miles before reserve)

I'll let everybody know what I find out. I have several final drives in my garage, so changing back and forth would be fairly easy.
If you want a long range to go farther than your Gold Wing buddy, look into a belly tank. That's give a standard Valk 8.3 gallons. At your 35mpg, that's nearly a 300 mile range ;-)

[Valker]

It's not going to get you any significant mileage gains. It takes a certian horsepower to push you at a certian speed no matter what gear ratio you use. The only efficiency gains are the reduction in friction as the engine spins slower...not terribly significant. That's why the mario gears didn't yeild any better mileage...

Want better mileage? Fuel injection is probably the key...

Thanks, Daniel. I had figured this, but the main reason I'd like some significant reduction just for the 'sweet spot' that currently is at 65 mph to be moved to where I ride at 75-80 mph. The taller tire isn't enough of a change. Whether I do this or not is going to be determined by the final quoted price on the new gearset. If it is about the same as the Honda Gearset price, I'll do it just to try.

[f6john]

It's not going to get you any significant mileage gains. It takes a certian horsepower to push you at a certian speed no matter what gear ratio you use. The only efficiency gains are the reduction in friction as the engine spins slower...not terribly significant. That's why the mario gears didn't yeild any better mileage...

Want better mileage? Fuel injection is probably the key...

Thanks, Daniel. I had figured this, but the main reason I'd like some significant reduction just for the 'sweet spot' that currently is at 65 mph to be moved to where I ride at 75-80 mph. The taller tire isn't enough of a change. Whether I do this or not is going to be determined by the final quoted price on the new gearset. If it is about the same as the Honda Gearset price, I'll do it just to try.

I'm with you on this. I want to lower rev's at cruising speed.

[Daniel Meyer]

I'm with you on this. I want to lower rev's at cruising speed.

I'm not criticising here, just asking.

Why? The engine's perfectly happy at whatever RPM you want to run it at "in the range"...

[fudgie]

Maybe I'm not thinking right, but how will changing the rear end lower your rpm's? Wouldn't you need to change something in the tranny?  ???

[98valk]

I have contacted a custom gear manufacturer about my Valk. I have always wanted to drop my RPMs by a significant amount when traveling. This place I found says they can make ring and gears for our final drives in my choice of ratios. I think I'll go with a 15-20% drop which will set my RPMs at about 2800-2900 at 77-82 mph which is where I normally ride. I will have to wait until they do a thorough analysis and CAD run before I know the whole price. They think it will be substantially lower than the previous transmission gears sets and much easier to do......

just lowering eng rpm's will not necessarliy increase mpg. going to far below the cam's torque peak will lower mpg. plus with the lower ratio u will have to give it more throttle to get moving, possibiliy causing pinging, both which reduce mpg.
 I have modified my airbox, modified stock air cleaner, rejetted carbs all 4 circuits, mod TW & dyna ignition more hwy advance, modified intake manifolds, modded stock exhaust to glass packs, and dyna beads and I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg. These are all basic power and efficiency mods. There is a valk rider on www.gassavers.org that also gets good mpg by modifing the heads and cam advance.

[Farther]

I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg.

  That's pretty incredible.  Please elaborate.

[Momz]

65 MPH sweet spot?
My 2K I/S starts to get comfortable at 85 MPH. At 85-95, yeah the milage drops dramatically.
But any valk (or at least my two) get 40-48 MPG if you ride smoothly and keep your RPMs under 3K.

[Valker]

Most folks are assuming I want to increase gas mileage....I really don't care. I have a 250 Ninja that gets almost 80 mpg and a scooter that gets 70 mpg. I would just like the 'feel' of lower rpms......The engine sounds really good at about 2900 RPM and it feels good at that. It just 'feels' a bit busy at 3500 RPMs which is where I normally ride it. (about 77mph.)
I run mine at about any RPM and any MPH, so it would just be for my pleasure. I run mine on I-20 and I-10 in Texas with their 80MPH speed limit and normal 90-100mph traffic flow. it runs great at 100 for hours on end (I have Interstate tank), I just would like it to 'feel' happier.

[f6john]

I'm with you on this. I want to lower rev's at cruising speed.

I'm not criticising here, just asking.

Why? The engine's perfectly happy at whatever RPM you want to run it at "in the range"...

The engine is happy, I'm not. I would like an engine speed of 3000 rpm at 75. I have no problem with higher engine speeds running up through the gears as a matter of fact I quite enjoy it. Now here is the fly in the ointment. Buddy of mine just bought a 98 tourer. I rode it part way home for him and on the Interstate his bike was cruising at 70mph and 3000rpm. My 99 is turning 3000 at 61-61 rpm, so what's up with that? you can bet I'm going to be doing some tinkering to find out!

Also as further explanation for my thinking, the Mario gears were deemed to be less than favorable do to the lack of power in 5th as I understand it. So for comparison I can tell you from my experience with my 95 Impala SS. The car has a 3:08 ratio axle. Many guys are swapping 6 speeds from Camaro's and Firebirds into these cars. the 6 speeds have a .50 overdrive 6th gear. With the 3:08 rear end and a .50 overdrive the revs drop so low the car can't accelerate because it's out of it power band for the speed and weight of the car. Answer for the problem? Either a 4:10 or 4:56 rear axle. 5000 lb car pulls like crazy from a dead stop but with the 4:56 gears and .50 overdrive 6th gear it will cruise at 80 mph at 2000rpm.   Getting back to Valkyries, since our transmission gearing is both hard and expensive to change the ability to go to a little higher gear than what we have ( lower numerically) would allow us to cruise with the engine at a lower rpm and could give us a little more top end.

Who knows maybe Honda hit the magic number with the stock ratio we have and a higher gear will not be as enjoyable as what we have but I'd sure like to know for sure.

[f6john]

65 MPH sweet spot?
My 2K I/S starts to get comfortable at 85 MPH. At 85-95, yeah the milage drops dramatically.
But any valk (or at least my two) get 40-48 MPG if you ride smoothly and keep your RPMs under 3K.

Momz, what rpm are you turning at 85mph?

[f6john]

Maybe I'm not thinking right, but how will changing the rear end lower your rpm's? Wouldn't you need to change something in the tranny?  ???

Nope, just like a chain or belt driven rear end. Change the size of the pulley or the number of teeth on the sprocket and you raise or lower the engine speed relative to ground speed.

[SgtBunny]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

Could you be more specific?  What bad results?

BigBF did a writeup on this sometime back.

http://www.bigbf.com/bigbf_shop/transmission/

[woefman]

Count me in .

My 73 year old riding buddy ( we ride goldwings gl1800) He is retired and in Colorado for summer) when he got wind I bought a Valk , he said you had to do it huh ?  I said yes, could not pass up this deal.

Anyways I know in the back of his mind he is going to take me to school. He is a former 2 valk owner, and loves them to a point. However this guy rides like no other, prefers to go 200 miles at least with no stops.

I am sure he will plan a ride where I run out of gas.

would be cool to get extra miles on a tank without him knowing.

as it sits I get way better milage then his now kids bike ( he handed down his valk to his kid).

I been getting like 36mpg ( 155 miles before reserve)

I'll let everybody know what I find out. I have several final drives in my garage, so changing back and forth would be fairly easy.
If you want a long range to go farther than your Gold Wing buddy, look into a belly tank. That's give a standard Valk 8.3 gallons. At your 35mpg, that's nearly a 300 mile range ;-)

Thanks I considered the Extra Tank till I found out it had a Lift pump, but more bothering was Cutting up the tank and welding on it  I was not up for that. I don't need this bike for long Hauls I got a wing too.

also Update: Since bought this thing the mileage has been increasing , steady doses of Seafoam
just out of paranoia since bike has 5k miles and sat a lot. Owner must have started it often, I have no carb troubles to date.

now added mobil 1 oil change and this tank got me 171 miles i was too chicken to stretch it I did not hit reserve.  I need to stretch it but knew my next ride was going to eat up the reserve so I opted to add fuel.

Wondering if these California Bikes have smaller Jets , Around town i'm getting same miles per gallon as the wing. The wing improves exponentially  on trips.

[woefman]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

Could you be more specific?  What bad results?

BigBF did a writeup on this sometime back.

http://www.bigbf.com/bigbf_shop/transmission/

Wow Thanks for this Heads Up

[98valk]

Most folks are assuming I want to increase gas mileage....I really don't care. I have a 250 Ninja that gets almost 80 mpg and a scooter that gets 70 mpg. I would just like the 'feel' of lower rpms......The engine sounds really good at about 2900 RPM and it feels good at that. It just 'feels' a bit busy at 3500 RPMs which is where I normally ride it. (about 77mph.)
I run mine at about any RPM and any MPH, so it would just be for my pleasure. I run mine on I-20 and I-10 in Texas with their 80MPH speed limit and normal 90-100mph traffic flow. it runs great at 100 for hours on end (I have Interstate tank), I just would like it to 'feel' happier.

have u thought about putting the gears from a '97 GL1500 goldwing or later into your engine. 4th and 5th are more an OD gear than the valkyrie gears.
 According to Fred Rau in motorcycle consumer news june 05 article. GL1500 3rd 1.272, 4th .964, 5th .758.
Valkyries 3rd 1.291, 4th 1.00, 5th .805. 1st and 2nd are the same.

early than '97 will not work, the GW shafts are smaller from my understanding and other posts from a few yrs ago.

[98valk]

I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg.

  That's pretty incredible.  Please elaborate.

what do u want to know? which mods?

[98valk]

Want better mileage? Fuel injection is probably the key...

not always true.  a carb still atomizes the fuel better than an injector. injectors are getting close but still are not there. They have had the tech to cause a vapor since the '80s but don't use it.
Individual runner (IR) carb system which the valkyrie has is the closest one can get to fuel injection and probably setup can make more power and great mpg. Learning to fine turn the valkyrie 4 circuit carbs will produce great results. That is the beauty of a constant velocity carb, power with mpg. Some of David Vizards books have some great info.

[Valker]

Most folks are assuming I want to increase gas mileage....I really don't care. I have a 250 Ninja that gets almost 80 mpg and a scooter that gets 70 mpg. I would just like the 'feel' of lower rpms......The engine sounds really good at about 2900 RPM and it feels good at that. It just 'feels' a bit busy at 3500 RPMs which is where I normally ride it. (about 77mph.)
I run mine at about any RPM and any MPH, so it would just be for my pleasure. I run mine on I-20 and I-10 in Texas with their 80MPH speed limit and normal 90-100mph traffic flow. it runs great at 100 for hours on end (I have Interstate tank), I just would like it to 'feel' happier.

have u thought about putting the gears from a '97 GL1500 goldwing or later into your engine. 4th and 5th are more an OD gear than the valkyrie gears.
 According to Fred Rau in motorcycle consumer news june 05 article. GL1500 3rd 1.272, 4th .964, 5th .758.
Valkyries 3rd 1.291, 4th 1.00, 5th .805. 1st and 2nd are the same.

early than '97 will not work, the GW shafts are smaller from my understanding and other posts from a few yrs ago.

Well, sure. I've thought about that as I thought about adding Mario gears earlier. The difference here is that all I have to do is swap rear end units to have different gearing. That is less than an hour to do. I like simple, easy, and cheap.

[f6john]

I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg.

  That's pretty incredible.  Please elaborate.

what do u want to know? which mods?

RPM at 70 mph
Rear tire size
Air filter setup
Exhaust set-up
Ignition mods
Plug brand and #
Carb mods and/or settings
Dyno tuning?

[Farther]

I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg.

 That's pretty incredible.  Please elaborate.

what do u want to know? which mods?

  All of them!

[98valk]

what do u want to know? which mods?

RPM at 70 mph    stock
Rear tire size      stock metzler  with dyna beads 46 psi
Air filter setup     stock filter with metal screen removed. Intake air tubes modified to be straight. Airbox lid modified, stock opening sealed, two holes 1 3/4' ea drilled into front of lid. requires re-jetting and tunning.  Polished intake manifolds, 320 grit with 60 grit on the short radius, picked up a solid 1 mpg, even had to lower the idle speed. Was first mod I ever did. Did mild cleanup of casting flash of the intake port of the head to blend in with the intake manifold went in 1/4 to 1/2".  Cleaned up the inlet of the oem exhaust manifolds, weld flashing and small pieces of welding rod sticking out of the welds. Now the ID is consistent.
Exhaust set-up    stock w/thrush glass packs 2" inlet/outlet
Ignition mods      modified stock TW for 6 degrees, with dyna, curve 7, +10 degrees at hwy speeds. -10 degrees curve is +/-1 degree compared to stock I/S ICM. stock coils. did have CBR1100xx coils, but they kept burning out the dyna, although spec wise they shouldn't have.
Plug brand and #  stock at moment
Carb mods and/or settings   38 pilots, FP needles, 110 main, dial-a-jet
Dyno tuning?        only base line runs, nothing recent. first time 100hp.  at inzane II? 7/25/02, 90-95F,  was running rich at 5500rpms and up (had 112s) 97.5hp and 96.2ftlb.  no tunning was done on dyno. both runs had the exhaust mods and airbox mods, although they were slightly different and stock ICM/TW first run, second same except dyna curve 8.
my bike is a 98 standard, motorcycle consumer news and others have stated that all 98s have the calf. cams which should provide a little better mpg. don't know how true this is.
http://mysite.verizon.net/tweakmenow/af-emissions.gif    tune the carbs at 1/8 throttle for 16:1 a/f ratio.

[98valk]

It's not going to get you any significant mileage gains. It takes a certian horsepower to push you at a certian speed no matter what gear ratio you use. The only efficiency gains are the reduction in friction as the engine spins slower...not terribly significant. That's why the mario gears didn't yeild any better mileage...

Want better mileage? Fuel injection is probably the key...

Valker, to add to DM's excellent point, if this increase in engine load requires more throttle then u will be into the needle circuit while going down the hwy, whereas your mpg will really go down, like low 20s. If u can tune the carbs, by using a much larger pilot jet, so u can stay at 1/8 throttle on the hwy, it might work. Idle mixture screws would have to be most likely at 1/2 turn, so u don't foul the plugs at idle. This is the beauty of 4 circuit carbs, u can tune to just a certain rpm.  Good Luck,, keep us informed.

[Valker]

Again, I'm NOT looking at the fuel mileage. Both of my other bikes get 70mpg so I can just ride one of those if I feel stingy.

[Bagger John - #3785]

I get consistant avg of 37-40 mpg, around town, rush hr traffic, straight hwy 70-75 mph, 50+ mpg.

  That's pretty incredible.  Please elaborate.

My '00 Tourer also gets that kind of mileage. Here's the setup:

I/S ICM
Dynojet jet needles; clips set on 2nd groove from top
I/S carb springs

All other aspects of the engine are stock...'trigger wheel', air filter and exhaust included. Nonetheless, the bike makes a lot more power than before, and it starts to come on at 1700RPM. The EPA-mandated 'lean' spot around 2500 or so RPM is gone.

I'm running an I/S tank on the bike; with the mileage I'm getting I can ride the bike on the highway at 70+ MPH and not run out of fuel until I'm bored.

[valkmc]

My stock 98 std is pretty much stock, I am on the dark side and just did a clutch rebuild.  My last three tanks have all been over 37 mpg and on my way from Florida to Detroit this summer I got 41 in the mts. of N.C. and Tn.

[mikeb]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

drops the rpms 200 at 70 thats the route i went {65 series car tire}

[f6john]

I have heard of bad results with this. You could try running a 65 series car tire. (taller) This would be certainly more cost effective and give you the desired results. If you don't like it, no big deal, just switch back.

drops the rpms 200 at 70 thats the route i went {65 series car tire}

Just curious what is/ was your 70 mph rpm?

[Rocketman]

Maybe I'm not thinking right, but how will changing the rear end lower your rpm's? Wouldn't you need to change something in the tranny?  ???

Changing the gear ratio in the rear end will change the engine rpm (for a given speed, of course).  It will change that ratio for all gears at once, though.
It's the same as changing to a taller tire, but more practical to get a more dramatic change.  Any gear along the train has an effect on engine rotations per mile.

[Hellcat]

Air filter setup     stock filter with metal screen removed. Intake air tubes modified to be straight. Airbox lid modified, stock opening sealed, two holes 1 3/4' ea drilled into front of lid. requires re-jetting and tunning. 

Ignition mods      modified stock TW for 6 degrees, with dyna, curve 7, +10 degrees at hwy speeds. -10 degrees curve is +/-1 degree compared to stock I/S ICM. stock coils. did have CBR1100xx coils, but they kept burning out the dyna, although spec wise they shouldn't have.

Any write-ups out there about the air filter mod? And can you run 87 gas with your ignition mods?

[98valk]

Air filter setup     stock filter with metal screen removed. Intake air tubes modified to be straight. Airbox lid modified, stock opening sealed, two holes 1 3/4' ea drilled into front of lid. requires re-jetting and tunning. 

Ignition mods      modified stock TW for 6 degrees, with dyna, curve 7, +10 degrees at hwy speeds. -10 degrees curve is +/-1 degree compared to stock I/S ICM. stock coils. did have CBR1100xx coils, but they kept burning out the dyna, although spec wise they shouldn't have.

Any write-ups out there about the air filter mod? And can you run 87 gas with your ignition mods?

87 octane all of the time no problems.  just pop the metal screen off to increase airflow. And the filter last much longer than the 12k honda says.