Annoying noise

[Pepmyster]

Hi oh great ones! I've been hunting down a bloody noise on the bike, can't get it. Let me try to explain. At about 2500 rpm and in 2nd gear, when I full throttle the bike, what a RACKET!!! It's like  a cross between a buzz and a rattle , and, it seems to be coming from under my seat. I did the buzz-bolt, the alternator bracket, exhaust shields, you name it, done it. When I am not forcing, no noise at all, dam, it sounds brand new. Any suggestions? Thanks.

[Bighead]

Do you have the chrome swing arm covers on it? I had the same sound a few years ago and the double backed tape had come almost completely loose and would rattle to hell. Took it off and retaped no mo noise. Also had a heat shield loose on exhaust make a terrible racket one time. Just some thoughts.

[Pepmyster]

How do the swing arm covers come off?

[Bighead]

If it the ones like you see in my picture they are just held on with double back tape. If loose just tap it with your finger and you will quickly know if that is where it is coming from.

[Pepmyster]

I did tape there before and heard nothing, but, I don't mind removing them to do some tests. That noise makes me cringe............. Sound like an old bike falling apart.

[Tfrank59]

I don't know if you've tried this – it's a bit weird – but as you're going along using your left-hand try holding onto stuff down there to see if anything quiets down when you grab hold of it.  Try not to grab anything hot or rotating!    But I have found rattles on stuff that way before when it was within reach.

[Punisher]

I found a weird sounding buzz coming from a Kury spark plug valance.   On the left side, nearest to me, where that bolt holds down the valance that is not a carb tube bolt, it was buzzing like hell at certain rpm's and especially under load.   I hunted and hunted for that buzz and one day I was sitting on the ground beside the bike working on something else with it running and put my arm on top of the valance at that point and it quit buzzing.   I pried on the valance at the back and bent it enough that it didn't touch the block in the back corner (didn't crack chrome, not a visible bend) and bingo, no more buzz.

There are lots of things that will cause noises, just keep hunting for it, you'll find it.

[Pepmyster]

I'm on the hunt again today, will try these suggestions. Thanks guys, gotta cure this!~

[Firefighter]

Things can come loose and rattle loud inside the exhaust system, sometimes the sound can fool you, make you hear it in the wrong place. Listen with a stethocope or listen down a metal screwdriver maybe?

[Pepmyster]

Will do, I have one here at work when checking engines.

[Paladin528]

I still have a racket as well but only under 2500 rpm when I open the throttle.  More load more noise.  I still cannot nail it down.  Over 2500 rpm its beautiful.

[Pepmyster]

Same here, Just bloody annoying 

[Otus]

http://youtu.be/0cVlTeIATBs

[Pepmyster]

Perfect example of how I feel when I hear it!!!

[Paladin528]

I was thinking about this yesterday while doing 300 miles in the northland.
What if the Temperature sensor on the thermostat was putting a false signal to the ICU?  That signal alters the timing when the engine is cold.  if the signal from the sensor were faulty the timing could be too far advanced causing detonation (which is what mine sounds like).  That signal is nullified somewhere around 2500-3000 rpm.
Any thoughts on that possibility?

[Pepmyster]

Good thought, I thought that I was having detonation problems also, the noise does sound as such. I stopped using 94 octane fuel and this is my second tank with 87. Noise still there. Tonight I siliconed the buzz bolt , so tomorrow another test......

[Paladin528]

Mine is definately not the buzz bolt.  It only appears under throttle under 2500 rpm.  It sounds like detonation and is definatley coming from the engine itself.
I am still investigating

[cef2lion]

I have been chasing a similar noise since I got my 98STD. I had the buzz bolt tube tapped with set screws. Had all the side covers off. Radiator cover off. I had the bike painted a few years back and with all the tin off I went over everything. I had STD exhaust and switch to IS exhaust. Been under the timing belt cover and looked at pulleys and replaced the belt.

I can feel the vibration if I hold my hand on the left side covers. Mine is only under load like a hill about the same RPM. Around 2500.

I had noticed on certain morning with dense air it wasn't so noticeable. I started wondering if one of the carb was out of sync causing the engine to fight itself. I recently had the carbs off to clean and inspect. Surprised how clean they were. Replaced all hoses and did a manual sync based on Utube video. Plan to do a running sync next. Runs better but still has the buzz or vibration.

I think the STD/Tour has solid engine mounts while the Interstate has some rubber type engine mount but from what I gathered its not transferable.

Still looking as well. I had hope to ride another to see if my noise was normal. Only know of one other in my area and need to take his offer to ride that one.

[Paladin528]

It would seem that in my quest to find this annoying noise I may have introduced another.
After investigating the Buzz Bolt possibility I pulled the front cover to see if perhaps a Timing wheel had been added.  Pulled the front belt and the wheel off to have a look and it was the stock wheel.  Put that all back together and checked the tension on the belts and reinstalled the cover and the pods.  Now not only do I have the Rattling bag of marbles I also have a Buzz/Squeal right at 2000 rpm.
Good thing the radio is loud..
Back to the drawing board.

[R J]

It would seem that in my quest to find this annoying noise I may have introduced another.
After investigating the Buzz Bolt possibility I pulled the front cover to see if perhaps a Timing wheel had been added.  Pulled the front belt and the wheel off to have a look and it was the stock wheel.  Put that all back together and checked the tension on the belts and reinstalled the cover and the pods.  Now not only do I have the Rattling bag of marbles I also have a Buzz/Squeal right at 2000 rpm.
Good thing the radio is loud..
Back to the drawing board.

That sounds like it might be a tensioner pulley going SOUTH.    Not too hard to replace the bearing on the tensioner.   If ya do one, do them both.

[Pepmyster]

Nothing yet, again. Still searching. When there is no abnormal noise, the bike is soooooooo smooth.

[Paladin528]

Tensioner pulleys are in perfect shape. No wear no play and I ran them up on the bench and ho howl at all.
Tomorrow I am going deep into this.

[Ricky-D]

Whose thread is this?????

***

[Paladin528]

Multiple. With very similar issue. 

[Pepmyster]

I agree, the more we chat about tis bloody noise, the better! still haven't found mine!

[John Schmidt]

The tension pulley will squeal if too tight. When I adjust them, I just let the return spring do the work. That's about all the tension you need there. As for pulling the timing wheel, not necessary if trying see it it's OEM. The OEM isn't solid, has large cutouts in it, aftermarkets are solid.

[Firefighter]

Still think the noise could be inside your exhaust or a broken mount tab on the outside of the exhaust.

As far as detonation, these engines work good with regular gas and I doubt any ignition parts are bad causing detonation. I made my 2000 IS detonate once when turning in an intersection in 5th gear. If the engine drops at or below 1000 rpm you have to be gentle while in 5th gear.

So I understand while in second gear and at 2500 rpm you give it full throttle? Is that correct? I will try it tomorrow with my bike and let you know what happens.

When I made my engine detonate it was obvious. The valves gave a little rattle. Maybe if you get desperate, you could pull a valve cover and try it, see if you can nail down the location. Let us know any progress so we can try to help.

[Pepmyster]

Thanks for your input!

[Paladin528]

What I am seeing is this.

From a Stop 1st gear:  Apply throttle and release clutch GENTLY with slow acceleration through 2500 RPM.  Relatively quiet.  With heavy throttle application a sound like detonation  through 2500-2800 rpm at which point the noise diminishes to nothing even with WOT applied.
2nd gear: 2000 Rpm apply throttle to accelerate and a sound like detonation up to 2500-2800 rpm wher eit again quiets out
Repeat in every gear exactly the same scenario.
If I shift at higher RPM so I never end up below 2500 then all is good but that is not really the most efficient.

[Promagnaman]

Transmission gear whine...

[The emperor has no clothes]

Transmission gear whine...

+1

[Paladin528]

NOT Transmission.  Definately coming from the engine and completely different from Transmission whine.  Think Rattle not whine.

[cef2lion]

From what you are saying I have the same type noise. For me I get the noise under load such as a hill, incline, or hard acceleration. Once I level off the noise goes away. Very annoying. Its not transmission whine as I have that and know what it sounds like. Does make the noise sitting still revving the engine in neutral.

I have looked at many things but have yet to isolate it. I had changed my timing belt a few years back and checked my tensioners as well. I have yet to check my valve clearances. I had thoughts of the water pump or alternator. I have removed all the side covers and radiator screen. I checked and had the buzz bolt tube machined with set screws.

[Ricky-D]

The noise is engine straining against the load.

Perfectly natural and expected being you are so close to the engine.

***

[John Schmidt]

Just a suggestion, your choice. I'd try some hi-test gas, just use up what's in there and fill it with only a couple gallons of hi-test. Run it a bit then go through the same exercise. If it goes away with that fuel then you know you're getting detonation and it's time to start looking at the ignition circuitry....starting with the temp sensor. Do you have an I/S? Wondering if a prior owner might have installed an ICM from a Tourer or Standard, not sure why they would have since the early sparking(low RPM) is retarded compared to the I/S unit.

[Firefighter]

I took my IS out this morning and did the second gear 2500 rpm thing. The engine talks when I get on it but no noise you speak of.

What is the history?  Did this just start happening all at once?

We do need to determine if this really is detonation or something vibrating.

The book says under Ignition system: The transistorized ignition system uses an electrically controlled ignition timing system. No adjustments can be made to the ignition system. The ignition control module (ICM) varies ignition timing according to engine speed. The engine coolant temperature (ETC) sensor signals the ICM to compensate the ignition timing according to the coolant temperature.

The book stresses electrical connections and grounds. Says a faulty ignition system is often related to poor connections. Check connections first.

Also good and correct spark plugs.

Looked at the plugs, boots any water in the plug wells?

[Paladin528]

I have tried:
High Octane fuel up to 94 both with and without Ethanol.  No change
Inspected Trigger wheel which looks to be stock
found loose Carb clamps and tightened all no change
checked Buzz bolt and RTV added No change
Removed all covers and accesories No change
Checked Belt tensioners No faults
checked and replaced all fluids (needed it anyway) no change
Inspected Spark plugs and all 6 are light broun to grey indicating a slightly lean mixture.
Exhaust gaskets were replaced - No change

I have not yet done:
Carb sync
check and adjust Pilot settings
Verify wiring and signal from the ECT (engine coolant temp sensor on the Thermostat housing) to the ICU as this could cause the timing to advance during those RPM ranges

This bike was new to me this spring and actually runs great except for this.  No lack of power and gas mileage is as good as a Valk gets.

This week will see:
New intake runner o-rings
New Petcock vacuum line
New Cover Set
Hopefully new vacuum lines if I can find them locally

[Pepmyster]

WoW! You're ripping at this!!!!!

[Michvalk]

They all do it to a degree. Why don't you stop worrying and ride the bike?

[Pepmyster]

That's what I did today, went and did the whole island of
Montreal, great ride, forgot all my worries...........