2nd Gear Blues

[zackod]

Hey Guys:

 

[dinosnake]

There is no clutch cable, it's hydraulic - that's the master cylinder on the left handgrip's job.  So check your clutch fluid levels.

What could be happening is if the clutch pack is glazed, sticking and dragging, or, of course...the 2nd gear dogs or (more likely) the shift forks are bent.  The shift lever is so light on our bikes that, if I try to preload the lever for a quick-shift, it just ends up banging up to the next gear. clutchless, right away instead.  So I have to keep my toe away from the shift lever unless I'm actually ready to pull in that clutch and shift - clutchless shifts can be very hard on your gear dogs ("Don't beat your dogs!"   )

I would start by doing an oil change as my own bike is very sensitive to oil weight and quality.  My bike doesn't really like Honda oil, popping out of 1st gear from stops, and seems much happier with 5W-40 Rotella T6.

[Dragunslayer]

I would not hold my breath on Mother Honda fixing it on the house. GL1800 trannies have been plagued with transmissions that exhibit ghost shifting for years.

My 2008 GL1800 GOLDWING would pop out of gear when ridden hard on the upshift from 4-5 and then bounce around in the gearbox before settling back into 4th.

I have not experienced that in this bike but I am sure it could happen.

When I talked to the dealer they acted dumb and then quoted some memo from honda that the issue was related to people that had heel/toe shifters and were not making a positive shift.

[zackod]

Great info guys - thanks.  

[_Sheffjs_]

Wow, I did not know this would probably not be fixed by Honda. I feel it should. I have to say you will probably take a bath if you try to trade this in.  I have the extended warranty giving me 7 years total, now I wonder why I did that. One good note the warentee can be traded back for cash or transferred. 

Please keep us updated on this.     

[TallRider]

Hey Guys:

Original owner - 2014 Valkyrie with 12,500 miles.   When I downshift from 3rd to 2nd gear, and get on the throttle hard in 2nd, about 10% of the time the bike has begun to pop out of 2nd gear, then immediately goes back into 2nd.   It happens with a loud bang, the bike pauses, then drops back into 2nd, and I can continue to 3rd/4th/5th gear.   Only happens in 2nd gear, and mostly when I downshift from 3rd.   Behavior has just started in the last 500 miles.    It's un-nerving and making me not want to ride.  I know I actually make 2nd gear because when I hit the gas I move fine until the bang arrives a second/2 later.    I have 16 years street bike riding experience with over 70k miles.   15 years on dirt bikes.     I am not new to shifting gears.   

I take her into the Honda dealer tomorrow.   Has anybody experienced this?    If yes, what was the fix?   Hoping it's something simple like a stretched clutch cable that simply needs tightening.    If its the clutch pack or transmission (shifter dogs bend / 2nd gear broke a tooth - whatever), that's major $$$$ and hoping Honda will take care of it on the house.

Being unfamiliar with your riding style makes it hard to get a handle on the  problem. I personally do not use first gear or put in neutral at lights. When in neutral I waited 5-10 seconds before engaging tans after  depressing clutch. I observed a lot of riders  at lights and stopped imideatly engaging gears to take off. Not sure how gears engage would suspect slide  into each other  as apposed to engaging tip to tip. Doing this rapid engagement over tip and banging gears Coud chip or cause the teeth to create  a bevel as opposed to normally flat and cause gears to dis engage. Also if you hard shift down  may cause gear to travel through and almost disengage in  neutral poping  back in by itself. I have tried several methods of shifting finding on exceleration to slightly depression clutch back off throttle slightly and shift. This will make an almost seamless quiet shift with nothing more than a soft click bearly audible.  I always down shift with pressure  on shift arm and trans will readily drop into lower gear as it matches speed. I have been a little disappointed with noise trans issues but learned to  adapt. I by no means drive easy.  Kind of concerned myself the transmissions may have a week spot in design.

[Shrubbo]

I have had this happen a couple of times before (bang and all) but I associated it with a sloppy shift under a load which was exactly what happened with me at the time.

I have not had this happen now for several months since I adjusted for it it by making sure they were "positive" as they say. Not saying this is your problem, just saying I had similar and some retraining seemed to fix it for me and not had the issue since.

[zackod]

I may well be user error Shrubbo.  

[Shrubbo]

I have no idea or not if it is mate and that implication was not the reason for my post. I am just saying I had those exact same symptoms but mine came about because I believe I was sloppy at the time. There could be a mechanical flaw responsible but to me as I said I associated it with a poor shift.

I have crossed 38000k's now and I can say I have not experienced that horror for quite some time, since I changed my shifting style and remembered I wasn't riding a 'busa anymore.

The bullet point here is that you are not the only one who has experienced that lovely wtf moment but as to the cause well that is debatable.

[Robert]

I have no idea or not if it is mate and that implication was not the reason for my post. I am just saying I had those exact same symptoms but mine came about because I believe I was sloppy at the time. There could be a mechanical flaw responsible but to me as I said I associated it with a poor shift.

I have crossed 38000k's now and I can say I have not experienced that horror for quite some time, since I changed my shifting style and remembered I wasn't riding a 'busa anymore.

The bullet point here is that you are not the only one who has experienced that lovely wtf moment but as to the cause well that is debatable.

 

 My foot was slightly pushing the shifter up and without warning it poped out of gear and back in. You dont need to be on the clutch to shift these bikes even under load although I dont recommend it. Just with very light foot pressure you can shift it.

Another suggestion is take the side cover off and look at the linkage for the clutch it is pretty crammed in there and it is adjustable.

They did have a problem with shifter pawls on the earlier wings and modified the pawls to be even more heavy duty. That seem to cure the problems people were having on the earlier wings.

[st2sam]

YEP, sounds like a you had (have) a case of "lazy foot."  ???

To all of the above replies, yep I've been there.
It happened to me a few thousand miles ago when the bike was new and new to me.


zackod - you gotta give the lever a real good hoist.

[Kidd]

Thiis is the one thing  I do not trust on my Kerry ,the  gears  having a mind of their own .

I boast  to my friends about my bike and at least 6 have ridden her  , before they do take off ,  I have to explain  the gear problem .


I have learned to  be more conscientious when shifting  ,and  still , sometimes slight pressure of the gear lever  will make something happen

[zackod]

Unrelated topic - Has anybody checked out the upcoming BMW K1600K Bagger?    That thing looks like a V6 160 HP beast.    Me want.

[_Sheffjs_]

Like I tell my wife, and now my Honda, "it's not me, it's you".    Normally that never works out for me, but in the F6C's case, it will.   Following my instructions, the dealer was able to replicate the issue at will.   "You have a problem with your transmission".   Trans gets dropped/cracked open next week.   They already have a few parts on order.   Might need a few more depending on what they discover.  Work is Honda warranty approved.   

Zero offense taken Shrubbo.    Your and all other feedback was exactly what I was looking for. Shout-Out to Honda for stepping up to the plate.   I'll post again when I get the 411 on exactly what the issues(s) are.

Unrelated topic - Has anybody checked out the upcoming BMW K1600K Bagger?    That thing looks like a V6 160 HP beast.    Me want.

      

[Kidd]

Unrelated topic - Has anybody checked out the upcoming BMW K1600K Bagger?    That thing looks like a V6 160 HP beast.    Me want.

Only because you mentioned it , I now have .
Looks like we gotta wait for the unavailing to know more

[Shrubbo]

Like I tell my wife, and now my Honda, "it's not me, it's you".    Normally that never works out for me, but in the F6C's case, it will.   Following my instructions, the dealer was able to replicate the issue at will.   "You have a problem with your transmission".   Trans gets dropped/cracked open next week.   They already have a few parts on order.   Might need a few more depending on what they discover.  Work is Honda warranty approved.   

Zero offense taken Shrubbo.    Your and all other feedback was exactly what I was looking for. Shout-Out to Honda for stepping up to the plate.   I'll post again when I get the 411 on exactly what the issues(s) are.

Unrelated topic - Has anybody checked out the upcoming BMW K1600K Bagger?    That thing looks like a V6 160 HP beast.    Me want.

Firstly I am amazed with your Honda dealer. Honda here isn't worth a fart in a bottle.

Secondly after reading that I am think I am very lucky I stopped whatever I was doing because there sounds like something crapola in there.

Thirdly... glad it is working out for you as from personal experience I didn't think you had a hope in hell. Re Firstly

[bscrive]

Unrelated topic - Has anybody checked out the upcoming BMW K1600K Bagger?    That thing looks like a V6 160 HP beast.    Me want.

Only because you mentioned it , I now have .
Looks like we gotta wait for the unavailing to know more

With the issues K1600 owners have had with their bikes, I will stick with my valk.  You can probably buy the F6B for a lot less without having the issues. 
Power means nothing if it is in the shop. 

[TallRider]

OK, I got to quit reading posts with problems. Out on 240 mile  ride yesterday stopped at light on 2 occasion when light changed went to take off found bike in neutral had to click back in gear. Strange thing was didn't get gear bang as if I had been in neutral. I normally down shift approaching light with soft push till down shift engages.  These were not snap shifts. I do not stop in neutral or use first gear. Neutral light came  on only when I started to release  clutch. This never happened before.

[Robert]

Glad we were all correct. 

I had something happen to me today that I wanted to post so all can be careful.

I was washing my bike in kind of a hurry and blew it off then proceeded to start it and leave it running as I was wiping it off. Well as I was wiping it my hand slipped and hit the shift lever and the thing went in gear and stalled immediately thank God. It lurched forward about 1/2 inch but it scared the heck out of me. I really didn't hit it that hard and it could have been a major catastrophe. It never occurred to me that this could happen since I really didn't hit it that hard, not even hard enough to hurt my hand. So be careful anytime the bike is running with the shift lever.

[Shrubbo]

Glad we were all correct. 

I had something happen to me today that I wanted to post so all can be careful.

I was washing my bike in kind of a hurry and blew it off then proceeded to start it and leave it running as I was wiping it off. Well as I was wiping it my hand slipped and hit the shift lever and the thing went in gear and stalled immediately thank God. It lurched forward about 1/2 inch but it scared the heck out of me. I really didn't hit it that hard and it could have been a major catastrophe. It never occurred to me that this could happen since I really didn't hit it that hard, not even hard enough to hurt my hand. So be careful anytime the bike is running with the shift lever.

It didn't stall as such. That would have been the kickstand interlock saving you from a very crappy day

[Robert]

It didn't stall as such. That would have been the kickstand interlock saving you from a very crappy day

Good point thanks 

Since I was laying on the ground next to and almost under the bike if it had fallen or gone forward it could have been a pretty interesting situation.

[Psycho Steve]

I am having the 2nd gear blues too. Running Mobil 1 syn and wonder if I need to run something else. Constantly hitting neutral  between 1st and 2nd and then pops out of 2nd when I go to third. It's driving me crazy.

[dinosnake]

Yeah, try a different oil.  Mine definitely shows oil differences and maybe yours will, too

[zackod]

thanks-guys   

[sleepngbear]

The transmission is now dismantled.     I've been invited to come in for a look/see.   "2nd gear has an anomaly".    A few more parts had to be ordered.  Will be two more weeks till I get her back.    Service Manager tells me they rarely ever work on transmissions.   A testament to Honda quality.    Can't say enough good things about Honda Xtreme Powersports Tampa.   Instead of blowing me off as some idiot who can't shift gears, the service manager and his best tech actually jumped on the bike and rode her exactly per my instructions.    Since my out-of-pocket costs will be zero, Kudos also to mother Honda for standing behind their product.

Sorry you're gonna be without for so long, but glad to hear they're taking care of you. 

[zackod]

Thanks-guys

[Kidd]

I know of a F6B that had a third gear go out ,they  rebuilt the tranny

[F6Dave]

'Ghost Shifting' complaints on GL 1800 transmissions have been around for some time.  They almost always affected 4th and 5th gears.  Apparently there were enough warranty claims that Honda redesigned some 4th/5th gear parts (I think they changed the dogs) in 2014.  If you compare part numbers you'll see several changes from 2013 to 2014.

I never heard of the problem affecting any other gears, but obviously it does.  Luckily it's not very common, and Honda will cover it under warranty if it does

[Shrubbo]

The transmission is now dismantled.     I've been invited to come in for a look/see.   "2nd gear has an anomaly".    A few more parts had to be ordered.  Will be two more weeks till I get her back.    Service Manager tells me they rarely ever work on transmissions.   A testament to Honda quality.    Can't say enough good things about Honda Xtreme Powersports Tampa.   Instead of blowing me off as some idiot who can't shift gears, the service manager and his best tech actually jumped on the bike and rode her exactly per my instructions.    Since my out-of-pocket costs will be zero, Kudos also to mother Honda for standing behind their product.

Man, now that is a dealer I would go back to. Unlike mine.