Rode my friends F6B today

[Robert]

I had no idea the differences in the bikes where that noticeable from a riding stand point. I was going to buy the F6B before the Valk came out and Im glad I waited. Although both bikes are good I like the ride and feel of my C better than the B. I was just amazed at how different these 2 bikes feel with the small changes that there are between the 2.

[The emperor has no clothes]

How so ?

[rudymsmith]

I own both - so i'll jump in. The F6C is a wee bit longer, but sits lower even though the front wheel and rear wheels are taller but the Valkyrie swings around slower than an F6B.
The B rides more like a Cadillac in terms of amenities.
The C rides like a muscle car.
That's my take - I want to keep both but the Valk fits me like a glove and as long as I am moving the B is oh so nice, but when I stop, my short little legs are looking for the ground because the B spreads you out like a new Orleans hooker.

[Robert]

I own both - so i'll jump in. The F6C is a wee bit longer, but sits lower even though the front wheel and rear wheels are taller but the Valkyrie swings around slower than an F6B.
The B rides more like a Cadillac in terms of amenities.
The C rides like a muscle car.
That's my take - I want to keep both but the Valk fits me like a glove and as long as I am moving the B is oh so nice, but when I stop, my short little legs are looking for the ground because the B spreads you out like a new Orleans hooker.

Well said but a couple of other things.
The C handles better or quicker than the B, you can almost flick the C but the B takes a nudge.
The B I think is faster on top end roll on from about 80 to 110 than the C
The C is faster from the get go than the B
The B stops easier than the C although the C has bigger brakes.
The B is definitely a wing with less amenities.

  Just a few more things I have noticed today. Since he got it on Monday and has not really had the chance to ride we went on a nice trip today. Great bike, looks good eats up the road like nothing, speed is nothing and smooth like Rudy said.

 I looked at it and said did I make the right choice, and I confirmed that today and when I drove it. The few things that made me appreciate my C over the B are the handling especially in traffic, I like the looks better and smaller size, maneuverability and just less bulk.

The B is a great bike and I would not be unhappy owning it and for some it may be the right choice. I'm glad my friend got the B for him its a much better bike. The fact that if the bike falls over its got the front engine guard and the rear bag guard is much more comforting. Its definitely smoother than the C and has the ride of the wing which him not being on the bike so much appreciates.

[ledany]

I've never been crazy about the GW 1800, beemer as I was (hello Robert  ). Too much plastic, seems to me like a 1980s car, too much weight etc. Then I tried the first F6B (no ABS  , no rear drive) and was happily surprised : not as heavy as the GW, smooth in the traffic jam, on the highway and in the woods, the lower shield really cool (though I rode it under a light rain). The bike was too expensive for me (25,000 $, now 22,000 $ I think) so when the F6C came out, I rode it once, thought about it, rode it twice and traded it for  the CTX 1300 I had after my heavy crash with the R1200 GS 2013.

IMHO, if you mostly ride alone, the F6B is a good one. As I live in Paris, the F6B is far too big for the use I may have, like a big boat in a tiny river


but to be honest, the Valk is way too big either  a Ducati Scrambler could easily do the job 

[Robert]

As I live in Paris, the F6B is far too big for the use I may have, like a big boat in a tiny river

but to be honest, the Valk is way too big either  a Ducati Scrambler could easily do the job 

You have cars smaller than the F6B 

[ledany]

 

[Robert]

According to some literature published by Honda the F6C has less HP than the B, same torque but less HP.

[98valk]

The B is definitely a wing with less amenities.

 
[/quote]


and the C is definitely a wing with even less amenities than the B.  A Goldwing std as was done with the GL1100 and GL1200 Goldwings, except this time the marketing dept slapped a different nameplate than "Standard" on it, to fool people into thinking they are buying valkyrie based on the original Valkyrie concept which they are not.  Flame on.   Enjoy your rides.

[Robert]

except this time the marketing dept slapped a different nameplate than "Standard" on it, to fool people into thinking they are buying Valkyrie based on the original Valkyrie concept which they are not.  Flame on.   Enjoy your rides.

 
No flames, I think its pretty close in an update. But I do tend to agree with you about the purist idea of it being more like a Harley. I think this is actually a big plus and I am happy they decided to make appearance compromises for the sake of engineering that made the bike better. I Love my bike and is actually closer to a bike that I have always wanted than the original. The other thing I am happy about is I got all the essential engineering stuff of the wing, like engine, single sided swing arm, alternator, big radiators, rigid frame all bundled with  better aerodynamics all for less than the wing. Which I doubt I would have bought the bike if it had been the 18k sticker price. So not only do I have no regrets in my purchase but think as most reviewers do that its an excellent all around bike.

Everyday when I go over the washboard roads around here and there is not one noise from the bike and no twisting of the chassis or anything considered looseness I fall in love again. Its this kind of reassurance in a well engineered piece of machinery that keeps me enjoying my bike. It also brings confidence to stretch out a bit on turns and a bit more aggressive riding knowing I dont have to compensate riding style for poor design. I like things to work as they should for a long time without undue toil to keep them that way and that is to me something that is well engineered and thought out with compromises made in design for reliability and practicality. I have seen to much over the top stuff fail and be repaired at a astronomical cost. I have also seen stuff so poorly made fall apart, repaired only to fall apart again because of poor design.

 I also love the fact that this bike has 6 cylinders, There may be many lesser cylinder bikes more powerful but the smoothness and sound that comes from 6 cylinders is so much more satisfying. I would say that some manufactures realize they are missing this market and have tried to make more cylinders on their bikes but seem to fall short of the bar in one area or another.

So in closing, did I say I love my bike? 

There is one thing that I wish they had kept on this bike from the wing though and that is the fuel system complete with the injection ECU. I dont know why they decided to go the route they did, but I feel the bike could have been slightly faster and more refined with this system in it. I May be wrong but just a thought.

[_Sheffjs_]

Robert, still have the 1500? 

[bscrive]

The B is definitely a wing with less amenities.

 

and the C is definitely a wing with even less amenities than the B.  A Goldwing std as was done with the GL1100 and GL1200 Goldwings, except this time the marketing dept slapped a different nameplate than "Standard" on it, to fool people into thinking they are buying valkyrie based on the original Valkyrie concept which they are not.  Flame on.   Enjoy your rides.
[/quote]

98valk,

No flame suite required.

We all know that our bikes are naked wings with a Valkyrie badge slapped on to try to suck the old Valkyrie owners in to buy it.  I would have bought the bike even if it would have had a Lemon badge slapped on the side of it.    

The bike is one awesome ride and there is nothing else out there that I would rather ride.  I had a 99 Interstate and I loved that bike for the 12 years that I had it.  But, times are changing and I wanted newer technology and a new bike.  To me, the new Valk suits those criteria perfectly.

These bikes have so much more over the old Valks it is ridiculous.  The power to weight is better, the throttle response is better, my ABS brakes are better and the handling is better, especially, at slow speeds  than my old IS.  

Nothing wrong with the old Valks.  They are an awesome machine, even today, but I want new technology.  If I wanted old technology then I would have bought a HD, or an Indian.  


Brian

[Robert]

Robert, still have the 1500? 

Yes, it has a for sale sign on it while it sits in the garage. 

[98valk]

The B is definitely a wing with less amenities.

 

and the C is definitely a wing with even less amenities than the B.  A Goldwing std as was done with the GL1100 and GL1200 Goldwings, except this time the marketing dept slapped a different nameplate than "Standard" on it, to fool people into thinking they are buying valkyrie based on the original Valkyrie concept which they are not.  Flame on.   Enjoy your rides.

98valk,

No flame suite required.

We all know that our bikes are naked wings with a Valkyrie badge slapped on to try to suck the old Valkyrie owners in to buy it.  I would have bought the bike even if it would have had a Lemon badge slapped on the side of it.    

The bike is one awesome ride and there is nothing else out there that I would rather ride.  I had a 99 Interstate and I loved that bike for the 12 years that I had it.  But, times are changing and I wanted newer technology and a new bike.  To me, the new Valk suits those criteria perfectly.

These bikes have so much more over the old Valks it is ridiculous.  The power to weight is better, the throttle response is better, my ABS brakes are better and the handling is better, especially, at slow speeds  than my old IS.  

Nothing wrong with the old Valks.  They are an awesome machine, even today, but I want new technology.  If I wanted old technology then I would have bought a HD, or an Indian.  


Brian

[/quote]

actually throttle body injection is 1980s technology. why didn't Honda provide latest tech 12-hole injectors for each cylinder which they use in their other cycles? If honda did the GL1800 most likely be faster than most bikes out there.
The GL1500 semi-hemi head design is actually a better design then the GL1800 head design for power. The GL1800 heads are cheaper to manufacturer, reason Honda switched. And maybe better for emissions, I'm not sure about that though.
Every magazine test indicates the Original Valkyrie has shorter 60-0 stopping distance than the GL1800/valkyrie. The '97 Valkyrie is still in the top five shortest of all time. The new might have different feel braking aka braking torque curve but it doesn't stop in less distance.
enjoy the ride!

[bscrive]

actually throttle body injection is 1980s technology. why didn't Honda provide latest tech 12-hole injectors for each cylinder which they use in their other cycles? If honda did the GL1800 most likely be faster than most bikes out there.
The GL1500 semi-hemi head design is actually a better design then the GL1800 head design for power. The GL1800 heads are cheaper to manufacturer, reason Honda switched. And maybe better for emissions, I'm not sure about that though.
Every magazine test indicates the Original Valkyrie has shorter 60-0 stopping distance than the GL1800/valkyrie. The '97 Valkyrie is still in the top five shortest of all time. The new might have different feel braking aka braking torque curve but it doesn't stop in less distance.
enjoy the ride!

Throttle body is still better than carbs.  That's like 1901, or earlier technology.  Not sure when carbs were first used.     Also, we don't have to worry about hydrolock. 

It would have been great if Honda would have used direct injection, but I guess they did it this way to save money.

As for stopping, I had an IS and the stopping on that beast was not great at all, so for me the new Valk is way better and the ABS is a big plus. 

I am not sure if you have tried the new Valk yet, but if you haven't, take one for a test ride.  One word of advise, though, is to really hang on if you are going to crack the throttle.  The pick up and go is wild.  First time I test rode one, I wasn't ready for the pick up and go and I almost lost my grip on the bike.   My throttle response on my IS was never as good.

Brian

[98valk]

actually throttle body injection is 1980s technology. why didn't Honda provide latest tech 12-hole injectors for each cylinder which they use in their other cycles? If honda did the GL1800 most likely be faster than most bikes out there.
The GL1500 semi-hemi head design is actually a better design then the GL1800 head design for power. The GL1800 heads are cheaper to manufacturer, reason Honda switched. And maybe better for emissions, I'm not sure about that though.
Every magazine test indicates the Original Valkyrie has shorter 60-0 stopping distance than the GL1800/valkyrie. The '97 Valkyrie is still in the top five shortest of all time. The new might have different feel braking aka braking torque curve but it doesn't stop in less distance.
enjoy the ride!

Throttle body is still better than carbs.  That's like 1901, or earlier technology.  Not sure when carbs were first used.     Also, we don't have to worry about hydrolock. 

It would have been great if Honda would have used direct injection, but I guess they did it this way to save money.

As for stopping, I had an IS and the stopping on that beast was not great at all, so for me the new Valk is way better and the ABS is a big plus. 

I am not sure if you have tried the new Valk yet, but if you haven't, take one for a test ride.  One word of advise, though, is to really hang on if you are going to crack the throttle.  The pick up and go is wild.  First time I test rode one, I wasn't ready for the pick up and go and I almost lost my grip on the bike.   My throttle response on my IS was never as good.

Brian

I/S vs goldwing std is apples to oranges, just like a Busa to goldwing std would be. Non sequitur.

a throttle body injection is not better than an individual runner (IR) carb system. testing proved that years ago, almost the same overall and most of the time the IR was better if set up correctly.   fuel injection has always been about emissions and running on cheap poorly made gasoline and including lousy ethanol.
 a carburetor to this day still atomizes the fuel better than an injector. so pros and cons of both systems. your generalized statement is incorrect.

I'll stick with my modified Org valkyrie with 120HP, avg 40 mpg and shorter stopping distance. ported heads and R1 cams waiting to go on will increase minimum 10HP. hydro lock is a very,very, small % of total bikes and mileage and most likely caused by using heavy doses of seafoam or other magic fuel cleaner from the '60s which doesn't burn readily, like putting water, diesel fuel or oil. seafoam is mainly pale oil which if I remember correctly has a lower ignition point than diesel fuel.
Enjoy your ride!

[Bill Havins]

[snip]....
a throttle body injection is not better than an individual runner (IR) carb system. testing proved that years ago, almost the same overall and most of the time the IR was better if set up correctly.   fuel injection has always been about emissions and running on cheap poorly made gasoline and including lousy ethanol.
 a carburetor to this day still atomizes the fuel better than an injector. so pros and cons of both systems. your generalized statement is incorrect.

I'll stick with my modified Org valkyrie with 120HP, avg 40 mpg and shorter stopping distance. ported heads and R1 cams waiting to go on will increase minimum 10HP. hydro lock is a very,very, small % of total bikes and mileage and most likely caused by using heavy doses of seafoam or other magic fuel cleaner from the '60s which doesn't burn readily, like putting water, diesel fuel or oil. seafoam is mainly pale oil which if I remember correctly has a lower ignition point than diesel fuel.
Enjoy your ride!

Okay, if no one else will, I Call Bullsh__!

You left out more than half of the equation - Ignition!

I appreciate carbs a lot.  But with carbs you can not achieve the kind of combustion across the power band that you can with fuel injection, in large part, because of the inability to tune the spark to match the load on the engine when running carbs.

I'll be glad to go into this further if you would like, but what you have stated is totally incomplete.  Just tour the pits at major races, be they drag races, flat track, road races, or enduros and everyone is running fuel injection.  And they are burning all kinds of fuels.

Bill

[bscrive]

actually throttle body injection is 1980s technology. why didn't Honda provide latest tech 12-hole injectors for each cylinder which they use in their other cycles? If honda did the GL1800 most likely be faster than most bikes out there.
The GL1500 semi-hemi head design is actually a better design then the GL1800 head design for power. The GL1800 heads are cheaper to manufacturer, reason Honda switched. And maybe better for emissions, I'm not sure about that though.
Every magazine test indicates the Original Valkyrie has shorter 60-0 stopping distance than the GL1800/valkyrie. The '97 Valkyrie is still in the top five shortest of all time. The new might have different feel braking aka braking torque curve but it doesn't stop in less distance.
enjoy the ride!

Throttle body is still better than carbs.  That's like 1901, or earlier technology.  Not sure when carbs were first used.     Also, we don't have to worry about hydrolock. 

It would have been great if Honda would have used direct injection, but I guess they did it this way to save money.

As for stopping, I had an IS and the stopping on that beast was not great at all, so for me the new Valk is way better and the ABS is a big plus. 

I am not sure if you have tried the new Valk yet, but if you haven't, take one for a test ride.  One word of advise, though, is to really hang on if you are going to crack the throttle.  The pick up and go is wild.  First time I test rode one, I wasn't ready for the pick up and go and I almost lost my grip on the bike.   My throttle response on my IS was never as good.

Brian

I/S vs goldwing std is apples to oranges, just like a Busa to goldwing std would be. Non sequitur.

a throttle body injection is not better than an individual runner (IR) carb system. testing proved that years ago, almost the same overall and most of the time the IR was better if set up correctly.   fuel injection has always been about emissions and running on cheap poorly made gasoline and including lousy ethanol.
 a carburetor to this day still atomizes the fuel better than an injector. so pros and cons of both systems. your generalized statement is incorrect.

I'll stick with my modified Org valkyrie with 120HP, avg 40 mpg and shorter stopping distance. ported heads and R1 cams waiting to go on will increase minimum 10HP. hydro lock is a very,very, small % of total bikes and mileage and most likely caused by using heavy doses of seafoam or other magic fuel cleaner from the '60s which doesn't burn readily, like putting water, diesel fuel or oil. seafoam is mainly pale oil which if I remember correctly has a lower ignition point than diesel fuel.
Enjoy your ride!

My IS never got anywhere close to the mileage that I get with my new Valk.  I even have IS bags on the new Valk and a good size windshield.  I get about 44mpg with it and it gets better all the time.  The bike isn't even broken in yet.  I didn't have to do anything to the engine to get that MPG as well.  As for HP, well, my Valk has plenty of that for me as is.  I don't need to spend big bucks to increase the HP even if I could on this bike.

The main thing I get from you 98valk seems to be a hostile attitude towards the new Valk.  Sure, it is not the old styling, or the same feel as the original Valks, but the old Valks were Goldwing engine/transmission put in a modified Goldwing frame.  Heck, that sounds like the new Valk...

Before you knock the new valk, try one. 

Brian

[98valk]

[/quote]

My IS never got anywhere close to the mileage that I get with my new Valk.  I even have IS bags on the new Valk and a good size windshield.  I get about 44mpg with it and it gets better all the time.  The bike isn't even broken in yet.  I didn't have to do anything to the engine to get that MPG as well.  As for HP, well, my Valk has plenty of that for me as is.  I don't need to spend big bucks to increase the HP even if I could on this bike.

The main thing I get from you 98valk seems to be a hostile attitude towards the new Valk.  Sure, it is not the old styling, or the same feel as the original Valks, but the old Valks were Goldwing engine/transmission put in a modified Goldwing frame.  Heck, that sounds like the new Valk...

Before you knock the new valk, try one. 

Brian

[/quote]

wrong again! The original Valkyrie concept did not have a modified GW frame.  The only thing the Valkyrie used was the GW short block and universal joint. Everything including the frame were completely new as in a Completely new Motorcycle concept.
This new valkyire is a stripped down GL1800 with a different front wheel. It does not follow the original Valkyrie Concept. Same thing honda did with the GL1100 and GL1200 stripped down the goldwings and called them a Goldwing Standard. The deceptive marketing people slapped a valkyrie label on it to help sell it and to fool many into thinking its a new valkyrie. it is not!
I'm done.

[_Sheffjs_]

Robert, still have the 1500? 

Yes, it has a for sale sign on it while it sits in the garage. 

Is it on Craig's list or CT?

[bscrive]

The deceptive marketing people slapped a valkyrie label on it to help sell it and to fool many into thinking its a new valkyrie. it is not!
I'm done.

Sure it is...Honda put a Valkyrie decal on mine saying that it is.  It's their product, they can call it what they want.  Just because you say it's not doesn't mean anything. 

I still don't understand all the hostility.  It's a Goldwing engine and transmission, just like the original, but better.  What don't you like about that????  It's an awesome bike.

By the way, you never responded to Bill's comment.


Brian

[Robert]

Robert, still have the 1500? 

Yes, it has a for sale sign on it while it sits in the garage. 

Is it on Craig's list or CT?

Neither, its just literally sitting in my garage with a sign on it. If you know of anyone or want picx pm me.

[Crabballs]

The deceptive marketing people slapped a valkyrie label on it to help sell it and to fool many into thinking its a new valkyrie. it is not!
I'm done.

Sure it is...Honda put a Valkyrie decal on mine saying that it is.  It's their product, they can call it what they want.  Just because you say it's not doesn't mean anything. 

I still don't understand all the hostility.  It's a Goldwing engine and transmission, just like the original, but better.  What don't you like about that????  It's an awesome bike.

By the way, you never responded to Bill's comment.


Brian

All I know is I really like my bike and it meets my expectations.  I'm just going to ride the hell out of it as long as I can or until there's nothing left, hopefully that will be well after 200,000 miles!!!!

[brew1brew]

The deceptive marketing people slapped a valkyrie label on it to help sell it and to fool many into thinking its a new valkyrie. it is not!
I'm done.

Sure it is...Honda put a Valkyrie decal on mine saying that it is.  It's their product, they can call it what they want.  Just because you say it's not doesn't mean anything. 

I still don't understand all the hostility.  It's a Goldwing engine and transmission, just like the original, but better.  What don't you like about that????  It's an awesome bike.

By the way, you never responded to Bill's comment.


Brian

All I have to say about this discussion is what's the model number/designation of the old Valk? GL1500C. That makes the old valk part of the GOLDWING LINE!

Done & Done!

[98valk]

The deceptive marketing people slapped a valkyrie label on it to help sell it and to fool many into thinking its a new valkyrie. it is not!
I'm done.

Sure it is...Honda put a Valkyrie decal on mine saying that it is.  It's their product, they can call it what they want.  Just because you say it's not doesn't mean anything. 

I still don't understand all the hostility.  It's a Goldwing engine and transmission, just like the original, but better.  What don't you like about that????  It's an awesome bike.

By the way, you never responded to Bill's comment.


Brian

All I have to say about this discussion is what's the model number/designation of the old Valk? GL1500C. That makes the old valk part of the GOLDWING LINE!

Done & Done!

nice try. was never called a Goldwing by honda was always called as a New Model named Valkyrie. they used the engine designation for the model number. however this new so-called valkyrie is actually called or was since it was discontinued A Goldwing Valkyrie indicating its a stripped down goldwing and not a new model motorcycle built from the ground up as the original was.
Enjoy your ride.

[sleepngbear]

nice try. was never called a Goldwing by honda was always called as a New Model named Valkyrie. they used the engine designation for the model number. however this new so-called valkyrie is actually called or was since it was discontinued A Goldwing Valkyrie indicating its a stripped down goldwing and not a new model motorcycle built from the ground up as the original was.
Enjoy your ride.

SO WHAT??!!!! Who gives two runny craps what it's called? When the new Valkyrie came out, it caught my eye because I liked the old Valkyrie. I didn't like the new one at first, and then it grew on me, so I bought one and now I love it. I don't care what the name plate on it says, and I care even less who else does and doesn't like it.

Good Christ, go back to the 1500 forum and give it a rest already.

[RSO]

Funny cause I believed my New Valk was a stripped down Goldwing until I did more research after a co-worker parked his 2009 GL1800 next to my 2014 Valkyrie.  Correct me if I am missing something but the New Valk only shares the engine, drivetrain, and main frame (not sub frame) of the standard Goldwing. Everything else was redesigned for the New Valk.

The following items are unique to only the New Valks and are different on the Std GL1800 and FB6:

Tires, wheels, brakes, forks, rear shock, handlebars, instrumentation, gas tank, front fairing, fenders (both front and rear), seat both rider and passenger, side covers, passenger grab bars, tail lights, headlight, blinkers, optional OEM  add on (such as sissybar, luggage rack, saddlebags and mounts, fairing), exhaust pipes, kickstand, and more!

So why do many call our bikes stripped downed Goldwings? Yes Honda included in the name "Goldwing" but that doesnt make it a stripped version of the originial.  Seems to me that the New Valk has more parts that are unique to it than are common with the other Goldwing models.

Just my observation and not trying to start a war.

[Bill Havins]

RSO, you left out steering head rake angle.  It's a big issue and a major change in the frame.

Bill

[SteveH]

Gee, I love all these bikes ! I ride an 03 Standard and an 08 Goldwing . The 03 is my street fighter "hot rod" fun day rider and my Wing is for long distance 2 up touring . In a drag race , the Valk would take the Wing up to a point (higher reving and steeper gearing) , but the Wing would eventually blow by the Valk.
The Wing is actually easier to throw around at low speeds, say up to 30 mph ( less trail and rake), but oddly for the same reasons the Valk is actually more solid and planted at speed ( not that there is ANYTHING wrong with either bike at any speed .... just different).  In many ways the Wing is waisted on me because I have no use for things like sound systems, CB's etc. So, an F6B makes perfect sense and has all the great riding qualities of the Wing in a sportier looking package . However, it would be an uphill battle to convince my wife to give up the passenger seat of the Wing for long distance touring. ( she loves the Valk , but it was her idea to also buy a Wing  ...gotta go with that )
I've ridden the C and was duly impressed .... very nimble, very fast and a very different lighter feel .....
IMHO, It really doesn't matter what Honda calls them, or what marketing strategy they attempted to employ, or what bits and pieces they may or may not have .... each bike needs to be judged on it's own merit for the intended purpose and riding style and skills of the purchaser  .

[98valk]

RSO, you left out steering head rake angle.  It's a big issue and a major change in the frame.

Bill

there is no change of steering head angle that I could find. only a few minutes of change per specs, done by different tire sizes and/or suspension heights.
rake/trail
GW/F6B  29.2/4.3
GW Valk  29.9/4.5

[98valk]

Funny cause I believed my New Valk was a stripped down Goldwing until I did more research after a co-worker parked his 2009 GL1800 next to my 2014 Valkyrie.  Correct me if I am missing something but the New Valk only shares the engine, drivetrain, and main frame (not sub frame) of the standard Goldwing. Everything else was redesigned for the New Valk.

The following items are unique to only the New Valks and are different on the Std GL1800 and FB6:

Tires, wheels, brakes, forks, rear shock, handlebars, instrumentation, gas tank, front fairing, fenders (both front and rear), seat both rider and passenger, side covers, passenger grab bars, tail lights, headlight, blinkers, optional OEM  add on (such as sissybar, luggage rack, saddlebags and mounts, fairing), exhaust pipes, kickstand, and more!

So why do many call our bikes stripped downed Goldwings? Yes Honda included in the name "Goldwing" but that doesnt make it a stripped version of the originial.  Seems to me that the New Valk has more parts that are unique to it than are common with the other Goldwing models.

Just my observation and not trying to start a war.

Good Points.

[Bill Havins]

there is no change of steering head angle that I could find. only a few minutes of change per specs, done by different tire sizes and/or suspension heights.
rake/trail
GW/F6B  29.2/4.3
GW Valk  29.9/4.5

Check your numbers.  Published specifications for the bikes are:

• F6B = 29.15°
• F6C = 29.9°

Regarding trail, the listed metric difference is 15 millimeters, not ".2 inches" (5.08 millimeters).  Seems reasonable to rely on metric units for accuracy when evaluating Honda's published specifications.  They do use the metric system in their engineering department.

You might want to study the work of frame designers, including those who develop road racing frames versus trials bikes frames.  It is a very interesting science that can affect the "feel" of the bike on the "circuit," whether the "circuit" is a series of slow S-curves on asphalt, or a "switchback" after climbing over a downed tree in the mud.

After you study their work you might reconsider the difference a .75° change in rake makes "on the road."  Though subtle, it is appreciable.  And as tire profiles are changed the differences in feel can be exaggerated (sometimes unexpectedly).

Bill

[98valk]

there is no change of steering head angle that I could find. only a few minutes of change per specs, done by different tire sizes and/or suspension heights.
rake/trail
GW/F6B  29.2/4.3
GW Valk  29.9/4.5

Check your numbers.  Published specifications for the bikes are:

• F6B = 29.15°
• F6C = 29.9°

Regarding trail, the listed metric difference is 15 millimeters, not ".2 inches" (5.08 millimeters).  Seems reasonable to rely on metric units for accuracy when evaluating Honda's published specifications.  They do use use the metric system in their engineering department.

You might want to study the work of frame designers, including those who develop road racing frames versus trials bikes frames.  It is a very interesting science that can affect the "feel" of the bike on the "circuit," whether the "circuit" is a series of slow S-curves on asphalt, or a "switchback" after climbing over a downed tree in the mud.

After you study their work you might reconsider the difference a .75° change in rake makes "on the road."  Though subtle, it is appreciable.  And as tire profiles are changed the differences in feel can be exaggerated (sometimes unexpectedly).

Bill

my numbers are published #s. I wrote 29.9 and so did u. your funny!
 difference is not the goldwing frame steering head. easily it is the triple clamps with slight suspension/tire changes.
good bye!

[Bill Havins]

For those who are interested, here is a well-written article that clearly describes:

• how and where rake is measured,
• how and where trail is measured, and
• their relationship on handling.

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/4125/mngr/rake-and-trail-explained.aspx

The above is not an academic article, obviously.  The author references Dr. John Wittner, a motorcycle enthusiast who did tremendous things for motorcycle racing.

Cheers!

Bill

[Carpet]

hey, I owned the f6b, and traded it in on the valk1800. The f6b depending on what setteing you put the suspension on is a way more comfortable ride. I put the valk on a soft setting, and still a lot firmer ride. Just my observations.