One year of ownership -- want faster acceleration -- Power Commander?

[postoak]

The Valkyrie is quick, but I've gotten used to it and want "more".  Has anyone put a Power Commander on the 1800?  How much difference will it make in get-up-and-go?

[Bill Havins]

Postoak,

I had a Power Commander III USB on my '98 Moto Guzzi EV (it was on the bike when I bought it).  What a bunch of gadgetry!  I have nothing really good to say about Power Commanders.  And I have nothing really bad to say about them, either.  IMHO they are really just a way to "tinker."

If you want to take full advantage of a PC, plan on spending some real money on getting some sort of air-fuel ratio monitoring system that will allow you to "prove" that your adjustments have really caused the changes you hoped to see (optimized A/F ratio at XXXX RPM at XX% throttle, etc.).  In addition to money, plan on spending a tremendous amount of time making "test runs" and additional adjustments.

As you are aware, I am about as much a "geek"/DIY-er/maker as you will ever meet.  I eventually jerked the PC off of my Guzzi and gave it away.  Total piece of gadgetry.

You can get your scooter dyno-tuned after the PC is installed.  And it is said that that yields the greatest benefit.  But it depends on who is doing the tuning - completely and absolutely!

If you want to do it "just for fun" then go for it!  By the way, I have a Innovate Motorsports LM-2 unit I'd be glad to sell if you really want to get into playing with a PC.

You may be able to wring another 5% of power out of your engine.  And you may be able to quicken the acceleration of your scooter an appreciable amount.  But be aware it is a whole bunch of gadgetry.  It costs money and time.  For me it turned into a time hole.  And I may be a bit closer to "end of life" than you - no time to waste.

Good luck!

Bill

[postoak]

Thank you Bill -- very enlightening.

[ledany]

In France only, Valks were limited to 106 HP until january 2016. I could try to have a second hand german ECU of a Valk or a GW in order to have 116 HP but it would cost me 500 $ I guess and I confess I'm a little bit lazy. Some of you in the US say the Valk is fast, even the fastest they've ever seen. 

I'm not the fastest on the road, so be it !   

But I might change my opinion if ever an HD passes me 

[Bill Havins]

Postoak,

I'm procrastinating on starting another task, ahem....  So I looked at the Dynojet site - the latest PC does not list the GL1800 as an application.  So, you would have to go with a PC V (Revzilla lists them, for example).  The "autotune" feature is said to "revise" the fueling map for you.

Please understand that PCs adjust fueling, that's all.  They don't touch ignition timing, and, to me, that's a big deal.  So, at most, a PC will add a bit of fuel where the map is lean.  I question if they reduce fuel anywhere along the power band, but they might, I don't know.

It would appear they have removed their handlebar-mounted monitor/adjustment device from their product lineup.  So, if you want to manually adjust the PC's map, you end up using Tunerpro Software (I think) on your computer.  Oh boy!  The learning curve can be steep, and, if not used appropriately, can lead to engine damage.

There is a fellow in Australia (member name "Beetle" on the WildGuzzi forum) who is renowned for tweaking Moto Guzzi maps.  His approach has always been to enhance "rideability" and performance.  He uses a software called Guzzidiag (a variant of Ducatidiag: http://www.von-der-salierburg.de/download/GuzziDiag/).  I believe Beetle always attends to both fueling and ignition timing, as well as other issues.  Take a look at some of the stuff going on with Guzzidiag (there are some youtube videos, I believe).

You won't be able to use Guzzidiag.  But you will begin to appreciate what goes in to creating an ECU map that optimizes "rideability" and performance.

Okie-dokie fine.  Gotta' stop procrastinating.

Bill

[Leathel]

When my last bike had the ICM play up I looked at these guys, I thought I didn't get a reply so went OEM, only to find there reply in my spam folder and it was half the cost of OEM with a programmable system with a computer link cable (my old bike was not FI)

http://www.ignitech.cz/en/

they do FI/Ign units and may be worth contacting to see if they can do one suitable if you know someone who is good at tuning on the dyno?

the non FI system was $150 to NZ from memory but that was 5 years ago

[Robert]

I too was looking at the power commander and Bill got it right when he said it does nothing for the ignition. Any change to a non turbo non blown or supercharged ride will be minimal. The engine at most will gain 5 to 8 hp and that will be at a cost of at least 500.00, hardly a bargain in hp at this point. The reason is the fuel system may be a bit lean in certain areas that could be richened up but it would cost mpg and really, usually most fuel injection systems like to stay at 14 to 1. To get power and feel the difference you could go as low as 12 to 1 but that would not be all the time. The current OEM fuel mapping is pretty good at keeping it in range.

The timing on the 1500 made quite a bit of difference and in fact any improvement in mileage was mostly because the timing was advanced. This is what I was wondering about with the 1800 since the fuel range that it can run on by octane rating is pretty low. So there may be some improvement to be had in the timing.The problem is that there is no easy way to change the timing on this engine since there is a crankshaft and camshaft position sensor. If you change the timing with the crank position sensor being moved it will show a check engine light. Any change has to be done with the ECU mapping and not a physical change in the sensors.

For all these reasons and the ones that Bill stated I too wanted a bit more out of my bike, but like the other mods I was thinking about its not really a top priority and not really worth it.

I am thinking about changing out the exhaust but I really like the sound or lack of, now. So about the most I would do is put on the Loops but that too is a issue since these bikes have the exhaust joined by a crossover pipe and that would be removed if the loops were installed. I dont know for sure but that may not be a good thing with a stock exhaust.

These are the reasons I pretty much just keep my bike stock.

[goldstar903]

http://www.guhlmotors.com/

Talk to the man. 

[Robert]

http://www.guhlmotors.com/

Talk to the man. 

I was also interested in doing this but at last report I read, he was not able to take off the speed limiter and a couple of other issues, including the code on the Valkyrie being different than the wing. If you know if these issues were able to be overcome then please let us know.

A good ECU mod can make a world of difference in the running of a vehicle but it still will not be able to give big gains in HP or torque, they are more like welcome tweeks.

[sleepngbear]

I too was looking at the power commander and Bill got it right when he said it does nothing for the ignition. Any change to a non turbo non blown or supercharged ride will be minimal. The engine at most will gain 5 to 8 hp and that will be at a cost of at least 500.00, hardly a bargain in hp at this point.

With fuel management devices such as the PC, the gains are not so much in power as they are in responsiveness and rideability. Back a few years I added a Cobra FI2000 to my VTX1800, and it made a world of difference. The bike was extremely lean, made worse when I added an exhaust, to the point that it would almost stall when taking off in a hurry from a dead stop. Dangerous. The FI, which only added fuel in three separate 'pots' (idle, mid-throttle, WOT), got rid of that hesitation completely and generally made the throttle more responsive. While it didn't add any HP or torque, it still vastly improved the feel of the bike. They're almost a must-have if you're going to modify a bike's intake and/or exhaust. By themselves they don't gain you any HP, but they help other mods that do.

Honda is notorious for factory-tuning their bikes as lean as possible and still run. Though I haven't found any signs of it on my Valk, so I don't know if a PC would make that much of a difference on it or not.

[98valk]

faster?? u need to buy a different bike, cause any little increase u get, u will be accustomed to it in no time, and will want more, but more will not be avail.
to really go faster it needs mild head work and larger ID exhaust head pipes.
 sport tourers in/near the 10s in the 1/4.
 FJR 0-60 3.18sec, 1/4 11.07
concours  0-60 2.91sec  1/4 10.56
'14 valkyrie with a light rider and on a good day 0-60 3.41  1/4 11.65

and then there are some 1000+cc sport bikes people convert to sport tourer duty

VFR1200 and busa both under 3sec 0-60, busa 1/4 in 9s.

[Kidd]

what's he trying to get , faster to 60mph or faster  from 60 to 100mph
My guess is the latter
Faster to 60mph  , their claim is 3.3sec  , that's fast enough for me  as I seldom go faster than 0 to 60 in 5 seconds   , although  , I'd love it if it'd go faster from 60 to a 100mph , that's where it needs help .

I agree , buy another bike like a Vmax , that would solve all your problems

[postoak]

I'm going to leave it alone.  If I buy a go-fast bike it'd probably be a Yamaha xsr900.

[Kidd]

I am selling my Infiniti QX50  because I can not drive it slow , it will not let me drive slow.

If I had a faster bike ,  I would just get into a lot of trouble

Still  , would love to another 50hp  in the 'Kerry motor , but then , I would just get into trouble

As it is now  , I am probably  gonna get into trouble , anyway , been lucky as far

[goldstar903]

http://www.guhlmotors.com/

Talk to the man. 

I was also interested in doing this but at last report I read, he was not able to take off the speed limiter and a couple of other issues, including the code on the Valkyrie being different than the wing. If you know if these issues were able to be overcome then please let us know.

A good ECU mod can make a world of difference in the running of a vehicle but it still will not be able to give big gains in HP or torque, they are more like welcome tweeks.

I am not claiming anything with the ECU re-flash. Speaking with an experienced tuner like Mr. Guhl might give him something to think about.