Desmog Question... How long does it take?

[Jabba]

I did a search and didn't find anything.  But I confess to not being a search ninja.

I am having some carb issues... and have wanted to do a desmog anyway.  I have a road trip coming up that coincides with Inzane... so I got till then to get this crap rectified.  It's on my IS, and it's not TERRIBLE.  Squealy doesn't think there is even anything wrong with it... but I can tell it ain't right.  I have a 20 oz bottle of techron in 3/8 tank of fuel right now hoping to get the issues resolved... but it could be vacuum lines I guess.  they all LOOKED ok when I had the tank off, and airbox out of it 2 weeks ago. 

The bike seems like it's JUST starting to run out of gas ALL the time.  I have shimmed the fuel cap open, double/triple checked the vent tube, ran most of a tank of techron treated fuel thru it, and nothing is seeming to help.  I don't WANT to take it to someone to work on the carbs... but I will if I have to.  It was fine when I put it up last fall, and I treated the fuel with Seafoam then.  This year I had the fuel leak issue... http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,55373.0.html

And now the runability.

If anyone has any other good advise... I am all ears.  I am a passible mechanic, but I am a little slow... But I am too dang busy to attack the carbs.  If I have to do that, I'll have to pay someone...

Thanks guys!

Jabba

[cef2lion]

Have a look at your petcock if its stock. Make sure vacuum line to it in good shape. I had some issues like you described to the point one day it quit running. I had to rebuild petcock as diaphragm was bad limiting fuel flow.

[R J]

Jabba, you can not look at those hoses and say they are OK.   Ya got to feel them.

Probably hard as brick bats right now and any little movement will split them on open.

How old are the hoses?     Anything over 3 years need replaced.

This piece of crap computer won't let me search when I'm doing something else on this site, so I'll give you the task instead.

You can buy regular rubber auto wiper hose, or get another type, brain took a fart & I can't think of the type hose, but mylar come to mind. 

What ever the hose is.  I put it on MGM about 6 or 7 years ago and it is still nice and soft and flexible, WITH NO splits or holes.

When I did my hoses I bought a roll of it.   I used it on mine and then passed it around till it was gone.

[Jabba]

You can buy regular rubber auto wiper hose, or get another type, brain took a fart & I can't think of the type hose, but mylar come to mind. 

What ever the hose is.  I put it on MGM about 6 or 7 years ago and it is still nice and soft and flexible, WITH NO splits or holes.

When I did my hoses I bought a roll of it.   I used it on mine and then passed it around till it was gone.

Tygon?

I suspect that those hoses are from the factory... circa 1999.

I have a Pingel in my pile of parts that I bought with the intent of installing on the IS.  Just have not done it yet.  I was gonna do it when I did the desmog... but I might as well try it huh?

I need to run the rest of the gas out of the tank first though. 

The bike does it AS SOON as you twist the throttle though.  That makes me think it's NOT in the fuel supply hoses.  But rather in the carbs themselves.  But WTF do I know?  Less and less everyday I think... 

Jabba

[Joe Hummer]

The hose is a 5/32" washer fluid/vacuum lines.  You won't be able to use the stock spring clamps on it, but I haven't used them in YEARS...since I started using this tubing.  As RJ said...it lasts much longer than the stock tubes.  I got mine at O'Reilly's and they cut me 6 ft off their bulk roll.  Enough to do a couple of bikes...easy.  

Joe

[cef2lion]

Even if my stock petcock repaired. THe other day. Started bike and left for work. I hadn't turned on petcock and it started to starve for fuel. I turned it on and it took a long time for it to pick back up. Had this happen a few times and best thing I found was to stop and turn off the bike. Close and open petcock and restart the bike.

You issue could be other things. Just putting out a possible suggestion to you.

[Chiefy]

I used the shiny kit from Redeye and it took about 4 hours. 

[Jabba]

I used the shiny kit from Redeye and it took about 4 hours. 

There we go... now... are you a "fast" mechanic?  Or... not so much so?

It takes me less than 2 hours to do a rear end service, including the driveshaft and pinion cup.  But I have a FEW of those under my belt now... 

Jabba

[Chiefy]

I used the shiny kit from Redeye and it took about 4 hours.  

There we go... now... are you a "fast" mechanic?  Or... not so much so?

It takes me less than 2 hours to do a rear end service, including the driveshaft and pinion cup.  But I have a FEW of those under my belt now...  

Jabba

No, I'm not fast.  I always look the instructions over a couple of times, then read each step as I go.  There is nothing I hate more then doing a project twice because I didn't follow the directions.

[JC]

The desmog shouldn't take more than a few (3-4) hours if you have all the stuff to do it on hand. I was able to do my Cali model in one afternoon.

You mentioned you had the tank off a couple of weeks ago, so you might first check the fuel line for a slight kink, just in case.

[hubcapsc]

I desmogged this way: http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/desmog.htm

And then later I helped Stanley Steamer replace the vacuum lines on his bike with the redeye kit...
and we used "the string trick" from here: http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/AirBox%20VentHose/venthose.htm

Anywho... it doesn't hurt anything to desmog, but it doesn't really help, either, and you
can get rid of vacuum leaks pretty easy without desmogging...

-Mike

[IamGCW]

Mine took 2 hours.   I am quick at most jobs, but I also replaced the air filter and rebuilt my petcock. 

Your issue sounds like the petcock is not flowing enough fuel.  Try a run with a full tank and select reserve (higher head pressure).  If it runs better then look at the petcock.

Gil

[Cracker Jack]

Whether you select reserve has no effect on head pressure to the carbs, a popular myth. There will be no difference in "fuel" or "res" if there is no restriction difference in the two ports and the fuel level in the tank is above the "fuel" port.

The head pressure on the carbs in our configuration is solely determined by the fuel level in the tank.

Cracker Jack

[Michvalk]

I did a search and didn't find anything.  But I confess to not being a search ninja.

I am having some carb issues... and have wanted to do a desmog anyway.  I have a road trip coming up that coincides with Inzane... so I got till then to get this crap rectified.  It's on my IS, and it's not TERRIBLE.  Squealy doesn't think there is even anything wrong with it... but I can tell it ain't right.  I have a 20 oz bottle of techron in 3/8 tank of fuel right now hoping to get the issues resolved... but it could be vacuum lines I guess.  they all LOOKED ok when I had the tank off, and airbox out of it 2 weeks ago. 

The bike seems like it's JUST starting to run out of gas ALL the time.  I have shimmed the fuel cap open, double/triple checked the vent tube, ran most of a tank of techron treated fuel thru it, and nothing is seeming to help.  I don't WANT to take it to someone to work on the carbs... but I will if I have to.  It was fine when I put it up last fall, and I treated the fuel with Seafoam then.  This year I had the fuel leak issue... http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,55373.0.html

And now the runability.

If anyone has any other good advise... I am all ears.  I am a passible mechanic, but I am a little slow... But I am too dang busy to attack the carbs.  If I have to do that, I'll have to pay someone...

Thanks guys!

Jabba

Mine gave me the same problems. I rebuilt the stock petcock, replaced vacume tubing, and went through the vent line, ECT. Noticed some brown sludge around the intake at the head. I replaced the intake O-rings, and finally fixed the problem. I think it was leaking enough to drop the vacuum to the petcock, and not making it open all the way. That's my story

[Thunderbolt]

I usually do the desmog when I take the carbs off to clean them up so never timed just the desmog.  But I can take the tank and carbs off and remove all the upper air lines and plug them and make a gasket for the two lower center cylinders in an afternoon.  I usually let the epoxy in the heads cure overnight.  If the carbs have been cleaned and ready to put back on I can do it the next morning. 
Be sure you change the small hoses on the side of each carb to the "cut" valves.  Each are about 1 1/2" long.  Same hose as vacuum lines.  I use the windshield washer lines 5/32" and no clamps.  They usually look good from the side but if you look at them from the end you will see a lot of small splits.

[Valkpilot]

Whether you select reserve has no effect on head pressure to the carbs, a popular myth. There will be no difference in "fuel" or "res" if there is no restriction difference in the two ports and the fuel level in the tank is above the "fuel" port.

The head pressure on the carbs in our configuration is solely determined by the fuel level in the tank.

Cracker Jack

Not at all true.  The main fuel intake is higher than the reserve intake port.  There will be a head pressure differential of at least the weight of one gallon of fuel between main and reserve.

[Cracker Jack]

The myth is alive and well!

[pancho]

Hey Jabba,,, I go along with those that suggest the petcock is causing your problem. What you are describing is what will happen when a diaphragm in the petcock is leaking vacuum to the point is is impeding fuel flow.

[GJS]

[/quote]

Mine gave me the same problems. I rebuilt the stock petcock, replaced vacume tubing, and went through the vent line, ECT. Noticed some brown sludge around the intake at the head. I replaced the intake O-rings, and finally fixed the problem. I think it was leaking enough to drop the vacuum to the petcock, and not making it open all the way. That's my story
[/quote]

 

Thats how it went for me too! Replaced the intake o-rings/gaskets and all was better.

GJS

[BradValk48237]

Desmog should take you 2 hours is depending on how you do it.. If you are used to taking the tank and air box off.... its easy.....

Took off Tank, Airbox, and Pods to do it... plus some chrome covers etc.

I used Freeze Plugs- (14mm??? Some wonderful member gave them to me) , new vacuum caps from Redeye and re-used the caps on the bottom by cutting off the tubes and filling the hole with JB weld..... My version from all the info I read on here...

 I used side cutters and a Dremel tool with a cutting wheel to get rid of the tubes and used a large screw and rubber washer to plug the hole on the bottom of the air box

10mm socket to lightly pound the caps into the holes.

Did get new gaskets for the modified/plugged vacuum connection on the bottom of the cylinder head.. did not remove the pipes.... had round end allen wrenches and a socked with a U-joint/wiggle adapter
Hardest part was getting the damn air box back in and hooked up.

Cost about 10 bucks and the longest part was waiting for the JB weld to dry.....

But... I agree with alot of the comments about the petcock..... bet thats the problem...

I had rebuilt the damn thing once and 4 ish months later the new diaphragm went bad.... tiny crack under that spacer that snaps onto it to connect to the other seal-thingy.. symptoms- starving fuel at high speeds and sometimes seemed to run out at idle, etc.

I used the old diaphragm as a seal, cut out the middle of it, and JB welded the holes on the back of the cover( vacuum line connection and breather hole) and removed the rest of the vacuum guts (spring, seal, etc) and put it back together to make it a manual petcock.... have not had starving or fuel issues since.... once again, only cost was the JB weld.....

I just now turn it off before I turn off the key, but I have a cover set in the saddlebag.. just in case.

Hope it helps.

B

[flsix]

Jabba put that Pingle on and the Shinny kit from Redeye with new vaccum hoses and make sure the fuel line isn't kinked and you will be a happy man.
John Schmidt suggested I change the slow jets from the stock 35's to 38's while I had the carbs apart and it all seemed to help.

[Regis]

I rebuilt the stock petcock, but went ahead and put an electric fuel shutoff valve in the feed line . Now I don't even touch the petcock unless I switch to reserve . The thing I like about the desmog is that the pair valve doesn't chirp anymore , and I wasn't paying to replace the reeds in it .

[Jabba]

I have resolution...  

I will post in another thread...

Jabba

http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,56209.new.html#new

[Valkpilot]

Whether you select reserve has no effect on head pressure to the carbs, a popular myth. There will be no difference in "fuel" or "res" if there is no restriction difference in the two ports and the fuel level in the tank is above the "fuel" port.

The head pressure on the carbs in our configuration is solely determined by the fuel level in the tank.

Cracker Jack

Not at all true.  The main fuel intake is higher than the reserve intake port.  There will be a head pressure differential of at least the weight of one gallon of fuel between main and reserve.

The myth is alive and well!

I was wrong.  Because the outlet is the same for both intakes, the head pressure is the same.

[Jabba]

I was wrong.  Because the outlet is the same for both intakes, the head pressure is the same.

 

Now you're on it...

 

Jabba