rear wheel removal -need help-

[Wewaman]

Followed all the advice watched the video's but I need some help PLEASE.  I got as far as taking everything loose and when I slid my back tire to the left it fell but now I there are 5 studs that won't let the tire come out.  What now????

[Fritz The Cat]

The 5 stud thing is supposed to stay behind, not come out with the wheel. Take a big screw driver and pry/push it back into the drive. Then it will roll right out.

[Wewaman]

Thanks Fritz
 heading back out now

[The emperor has no clothes]

I've always taken the "5stud thing" out with the wheel. Make sure the hub is pushed all the way into the wheel, sometimes they come out partially or all the way. If it's pushed all the way into the wheel the whole thing will come out together. It will be tight but it comes out. Just make sure the hub is all the way in the wheel and take your time.

[Lucky Duck]

I would leave the brake caliper bracket and the spacer that slides into the wheel out. Slide the axle back into place, into the left side of the swing arm. Look under the final drive and you'll see a notch in the bottom of the plastic trim ring. Take a long screwdriver and reach it thru that notch, slide the 5 finger flange back into the wheel. You may have to turn the wheel some to find the spot that will allow the flange to move. Be careful, that black trim ring is plastic. You will be able to see in there when the splines clear the final drive. Brace the wheel and pull the axle, the wheel should come out easily.

[Wewaman]

It's out
I had to push them into the wheel and "wallah" out it came.     So after I get home from church  I will change the oil put fresh non-eth  gas in,  change the tire to CT and do the 3 o'rings and final drive  oil then crank her up and go for a ride 

[Lucky Duck]

 

[The emperor has no clothes]

It's out
I had to push them into the wheel and "wallah" out it came.     So after I get home from church  I will change the oil put fresh non-eth  gas in,  change the tire to CT and do the 3 o'rings and final drive  oil then crank her up and go for a ride 

Great, make sure you tighten things up in the proper sequence

[Wewaman]

Will do,
Thanks

[John Schmidt]

It's out
I had to push them into the wheel and "wallah" out it came.    

That's how it's supposed to be done, not by pressing that flange back into the final drive. Oh.....and it's "voila." 

[The emperor has no clothes]

It's out
I had to push them into the wheel and "wallah" out it came.    

That's how it's supposed to be done, not by pressing that flange back into the final drive. Oh.....and it's "voila." 

I think he's southern not French 

[pancho]

Be sure to PULL the final drive while you are at it, to check the lubrication in the pinion cup and driveline.

[Chrisj CMA]

The 5 stud thing is supposed to stay behind, not come out with the wheel. Take a big screw driver and pry/push it back into the drive. Then it will roll right out.

you have this backwards...the flange (the part with the studs) needs to be pushed back into the wheel, it is already stuck in the drive, thats the problem.

[Chrisj CMA]

It's out
I had to push them into the wheel and "wallah" out it came.    So after I get home from church  I will change the oil put fresh non-eth  gas in,  change the tire to CT and do the 3 o'rings and final drive  oil then crank her up and go for a ride  

might as well remove that drive and drive shaft too......that way you not only grease all the splines you cannot forget to loosen the for bolts to the drive.  Then make sure you torque the axle and then very next thing the 4 bolts

[Wewaman]

Thanks everyone for the advice .  Yes John that's the way I did it.   And since I was following your inst's in shop talk Chris I saw that they were still in the wheel  so the  suggestion to use a big screwdriver to pry it back was all the incentive I needed.  By the way I have to confess that I threw a temper tantrum that any 2 year old would have been proud of , but I was embarrassed afterwards when it came out SO easily.  Was glad my children were at the movie's , my wonderful wife just sat there smiling and shaking her head.  She is always the encourager , boy do I love her.
 Yes I got the wheel and CT sitting in the sun right now and I am on my way out to do the final drive and grease .  I am going to follow your inst's on all but the dampeners, didn't know about that.
 Thanks again I will report back when I'm done ..

Tony

[The emperor has no clothes]

Sounds like you got it under control. I've done my fair share of cussing while working on the bike also 

[Wewaman]

Yes very southern here, 
Viola sounds oh I don't know so Yankee

[John Schmidt]

Yes very southern here, 
Viola sounds oh I don't know so Yankee

Nope, not Yankee, it's Francais. And just to yank(ee) your chain a bit more now that you do have the wheel out: A viola is kinda like a large violin. As for losing it pulling the rear end apart, join the club. I've had some nearly fall out, others I nearly "fell out" it got me so ticked off. My wife says she has me down to three stages; 1. who designed this piece of crap, 2. five more minutes and it's going in the trash, 3. I got it. When she hears #2 going off from the garage, she said she knows I almost have it....whatever I was attempting. I found a long time ago the language didn't seem to help, but going in for a cup of coffee and talking to my wife for a bit then addressing the problem again always seemed to do the trick. Glad you got it out.  

[The emperor has no clothes]

Yes very southern here, 
Viola sounds oh I don't know so Yankee

Nope, not Yankee, it's Francais. And just to yank(ee) your chain a bit more now that you do have the wheel out: A viola is kinda like a large violin. As for losing it pulling the rear end apart, join the club. I've had some nearly fall out, others I nearly "fell out" it got me so ticked off. My wife says she has me down to three stages; 1. who designed this piece of crap, 2. five more minutes and it's going in the trash, 3. I got it. When she hears #2 going off from the garage, she said she knows I almost have it....whatever I was attempting. I found a long time ago the language didn't seem to help, but going in for a cup of coffee and talking to my wife for a bit then addressing the problem again always seemed to do the trick. Glad you got it out.  

Funny when I go in for a break and a coffee my wife says aren't you done with that yet!

[Wewaman]

OK I pulled the final drive and when trying to pull the drive shaft there was rust colored dust coming out of the pinion cup . When I finally got the drive shaft out and got it cleaned I noticed  small flat spots on the  edge of the teeth not enough to worry about.  Well the pinion cup looked worse it was totally dry no grease any where and I had to scrape the groove out  at the bottom and then I saw 2 holes.   After all was cleaned the teeth in the pinion cup are about 1/2 way gone.  I'm not sure but that may be what happens if you don't loosen the 4 final drive nuts.    Had  the Yamaha, Suzuki, Honda dealer put the last set of tires on and asked them to do the 3 o'rings and final drive that was 10,000 miles ago, doesn't look like they were very thorough  ..  so now what, can I change the pinion cup ? Where would I find one ? Is it OK to keep using?  it would seem that it will work till it gives way then I may need a drive shaft and pinion cup.   
This is why I am doing this myself so I can make sure it is done right.   
Please tell me what I need to do now.
Feeling bummed out   

[Valker]

Just order one from a dealer or online place. They aren't too expensive. A new drive shaft is fairly cheap also.

[pancho]

Yeah, your going to need a pinion cup and driveline,,, the problem came from no lubrication in there,, without pictures it's hard to tell how much wear you have, but from the explanation, you will need them. They are available from HDL, Partzilla, or any dealer, but Partzilla has the best prices. If they are not completely shot,, clean them up, lube them real good, and you can ride until the parts come in. Don't be too bummed, your doing your own work now and will stay on top of it,

When you order your parts, don't forget to get a new seal for the pinion cup.

[Wewaman]

called Honda and inquired about the parts; Pinion Joint 50.00, O'ring (goes under the pinion joint)4.00, Oil seal ( goes on the shaft) 12.00,  Drive shaft 153.00.  = 219.00  (not bad)
So is there any thing else that I should do while in there ? the final drive does have some old grease still in there haven't cleaned that yet but will. What is the best way to clean that , Brake cleaner? The teeth in the final drive are slightly worn, will see better when it's cleaned.   Also should I put the drive flange back on the wheel and then mate the wheel to the final drive a use an impact wrench to get the pinion joint off?  Also noticed that Clymer says not to install a new c'ring on the end of the drive shaft (was for assembly only) mine was still on there more proof that they didn't go in there 10,000 miles ago ( Thanks Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki)
Got the 205/60/16 CT installed yesterday LOOKS AWESOME

Thanks John for the French class I learned something " Viola"  talking about Violins; You tube 300 violin orchestra ;  As Tony the Tiger would say" Theeey're Great" 

also where do I find my Member # was trying Photostash but need that to proceed.  so that  cn post pic's of what I found. 

Thanks again for the advice it is Greatly appreciated.

Tony

[hubcapsc]

Drive shaft 153.00

I have a 97.

97 drive shafts cost a lot more than other years.

I can see a difference when I look at them.

I think they are all functionally equivalent though...

-Mike

[The emperor has no clothes]

called Honda and inquired about the parts; Pinion Joint 50.00, O'ring (goes under the pinion joint)4.00, Oil seal ( goes on the shaft) 12.00,  Drive shaft 153.00.  = 219.00  (not bad)
So is there any thing else that I should do while in there ? the final drive does have some old grease still in there haven't cleaned that yet but will. What is the best way to clean that , Brake cleaner? The teeth in the final drive are slightly worn, will see better when it's cleaned.   Also should I put the drive flange back on the wheel and then mate the wheel to the final drive a use an impact wrench to get the pinion joint off?  Also noticed that Clymer says not to install a new c'ring on the end of the drive shaft (was for assembly only) mine was still on there more proof that they didn't go in there 10,000 miles ago ( Thanks Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki)
Got the 205/60/16 CT installed yesterday LOOKS AWESOME

Thanks John for the French class I learned something " Viola"  talking about Violins; You tube 300 violin orchestra ;  As Tony the Tiger would say" Theeey're Great" 

also where do I find my Member # was trying Photostash but need that to proceed.  so that  cn post pic's of what I found. 

Thanks again for the advice it is Greatly appreciated.

Tony

I haven't had to remove the pinion cup but I remember someone making a wooden jig to hold the pumpkin. It was either in shoptalk or on old tech post. Do a search in tech for it. Which c clip are you referring to ,the one on the ujoint end? If so you'll need to remove to get your new seal on. If it's the clip on the pinion cup end I'm pretty sure that needs to stay on.

[HayHauler]

That wooden jig was created by hubcapsc, Mike.  Use your impact and a socket and it will spin right off.  Install the same way, unless you build the wooden jig to hold the pumpkin while you torque the nut.  Impact is much easier.  Yes, the clip needs to stay.  It keeps the pumpkin from dropping on the floor if you completely remove the 4 nuts.   
Good luck and I hope your drive splines are good to go.

Hay 
Jimmyt

[Wewaman]

thanks for the input.  I will use the impact, honda says there is an o'ring under the pinion cup - can I get to it by just removing the cup or is it farther in?  The clip is a actually called a stopper ring (page 379 #15 Clymer Manual)
15. Do not install a new stopper ring into the groove in the end of the drive shaft splines.  It is used only during manufacturing and does not need to be replaced.

[John Schmidt]

Just my opinion here, but if you're replacing the driveshaft I'd most certainly replace the pinion cup as well. A mismatch with one being part well used and the other new will cause excess wear on the new part. Often that leads to replacing both at an early date.

[The emperor has no clothes]

thanks for the input.  I will use the impact, honda says there is an o'ring under the pinion cup - can I get to it by just removing the cup or is it farther in?  The clip is a actually called a stopper ring (page 379 #15 Clymer Manual)
15. Do not install a new stopper ring into the groove in the end of the drive shaft splines.  It is used only during manufacturing and does not need to be replaced.

I think the clymers is incorrect. I would put the ring on the shaft. You probably don't need a new one though. I would wait for more expert advice here before putting it back together.

[HayHauler]

This is what the Honda Manual says...

DRIVE SHAFT ASSEMBLYIINSTALLATION
lnstall the new stopper ring.
lnstall the new oil seal and pack 0.5 g (0.02 oz) of grease onto
the splines.
lnstall the spring, washer and snap ring.
Install the drive shaft into the pinion joint until the stopper ring
seats in the pinion spline groove.
NOTE
Make sure that the stopper ring is seated properly by
pulling on the drive shaft lightly.
Be careful not to damage the drive shaft oil seal.

You can re-use the stopper ring, no need to buy a new one, unless yours is bent out of shape.

Hay  
Jimmyt

[Wewaman]

   Things are looking up    I just took the Pinion cup off and it is SHOT about 1/2 of all the teeth are worn.  I didn't see the O'ring under the cup so the old one will have to do.   But the drive shaft only has minimal wear but I will heed your advice John and buy a new pinion cup and Driveshaft  and oil seal, thanks for giving me that gentle nudge  
Jimmy you sir are correct   I took the stopper ring off of the shaft and guess what ? it just falls out.  So I will use the old stopper ring on the new driveshaft if it doesn't come with one.  
I got everything cleaned and drained the final drive oil but there was not very much in there so I will have to see how much 150cc looks like when I put it back in.  I replaced all 3 O'rings and will be greasing everything up when the new parts come in. ( honda says 3-5 days for parts to arrive)  Everything takes alot longer than I figured but this is my first attempt   so I feel that my future attemps will be quicker.   But the peace of mind knowing that from here on out everything will actually get done the way it's suppossed to is worth all that I'm gong thru.  
March will be 1 year since I have ridden the Valk so I am  excited about my progress and things are coming together nicely.  
Again Thanks to Everyone who has chimed in with your words of inst's and encouragement.
I am truely Greatful,
 Tony

[Wewaman]

Thanks Pancho
 Partzilla  is the way I am going, about 1/2 the cost of Honda.

Wewa

[indybobm]

Everything takes alot longer than I figured but this is my first attempt   so I feel that my future attemps will be quicker.  

Nothing wrong with taking your time. For me, it's a chance to clean everything up, check things I do not see during the summer, etc. With the crappy winter we are having in Indiana (and other places) nothing else to do anyway. At least I get to touch the bike.

Get in the habit od double-checking everything you do, maybe even making a checklist. You do not want to get everything buttoned up, see something laying on the bench and wonder if that should have been put in there.

[hubcapsc]

You do not want to get everything buttoned up, see something laying on the bench and wonder if that should have been put in there.

Yeah... there's people with ruined rear wheels that got put back together without
that flimsy looking little plastic ring (thrust washer)...

I had some final drives down at the house that I refurbished... when I carried one
up to where I was working on my bike I didn't bring the distance collar with me...
I could tell before I got the bike off the jack that something was wrong, but still...
there's no extra parts 

-Mike

[Wewaman]

I have been known to have done that myself a time or two    thanks for the reminder

will order the parts tommorrow after I "double check"  that I'm ordering the right parts according to the pics on partzilla, and not just take the Honda guys suggestion as to what he thinks I'm talking about. 
 

[valkyriemc]

"I got everything cleaned and drained the final drive oil but there was not very much in there so I will have to see how much 150cc looks like when I put it back in"

You can fill it with the bike vertical or measure it out. People have over filled the rear end by leaving bike on kick stand during fill. Just a thought. Maybe you already knew that! G/L

[Chrisj CMA]

"I got everything cleaned and drained the final drive oil but there was not very much in there so I will have to see how much 150cc looks like when I put it back in"

You can fill it with the bike vertical or measure it out. People have over filled the rear end by leaving bike on kick stand during fill. Just a thought. Maybe you already knew that! G/L

If I need to fill a Valkyrie final drive while its on the bike I do both.....fill in on the side stand so its leaning, AND measure out and pour in 150cc, that way NONE leaks out and there is no mess to clean up

[Wewaman]

  I have been busy helping my buddy install an irrigation system Thurs, Fri, and today so I haven't got to work on the Valk.    But I will use the extra cash to buy the parts from Partzilla.   Chris  I will fill the final drive when I get the proper measuring device. 

I am starting to get a little nervous because I have taken the carbs off and cleaned them all, inside and out,  did a De-smog and now I am servicing the final drive and driveline.   I still have not put the tank back on to fire it up.   This is my first attempt at everything so I'm just hoping everything will work when it's done. 
But I'm starting to feel like all this will be WELL worth the effort because I am doing the work myself and no short cuts were taken. 

Thanks to everyone for your input I wouldn't have tried it without you.  Still have alot to do but  I am trudging along .
Thanks again,
 Tony

[Wewaman]

ordered my 3 parts today $90.00  from Partzilla    
patiently awaiting arrival    Going to Tallahassee tomorrow will try to find a camera store to buy a measuring device.   then wait some more
Days are getting longer woooo hoooo  

[pancho]

Good thing you got in there and found the problems now Tony,,, you will be in the wind soon, and have the confidence that everything you looked at is in good condition.