Front tire

[turtle254]

What's the longest lasting front tire?
8 to 9000mi is not right for a tire!

[cookiedough]

a rear tire mounted in reverse direction

either that or michelin commander if can find right size, michelin makes good long lasting tires in cars and cycles.

if only getting 9K miles out of front tire, that is NOT good at all most should last 15K miles or more for front tire anyways.

[Jess from VA]

To my knowledge, the longest lasting standard size radial front (or back) for the Valk is the Dunlop Elite 3 (E3).

Some folks (like me) think those tires are slippery when wet (but some say they are not and swear by them).  They last the longest because they have the hardest compound.

I have run two front Michelin Commander II radial fronts in a 140, the closest size possible to the correct size, and although they are great handling and sticking tires, I can barely get to 7K before they are toast (the second, I pulled at about 6500mi).  I have another hanging in my shed, and I'm not going to put it on.  

Except for a couple experimental fronts (solely to get higher mileage, though I insist on good performance too), I have always run ME880 radial fronts.  They are fantastic tires, but clearly get the lowest mileage of any correct radial size fronts... about 9K if you are lucky (at least for me, like 15 times).  The newer Avon Cobras may be just as good as the ME880s performance wise, and people seem to be able to get up to 10-12K on them. (This may be your best bet, and it is possibly the most used front by our membership.)

As noted, some have run some rear motorcycle tire bias ply (not radial) tires on the front of the correct size and got good handling and good (much better than average) mileage.  I think one is a Dunlop (not the E3).  There are probably 20 historical threads on this tire, but I always have trouble searching on here.  Maybe someone else can help out.  There is no trouble whatsoever running a (good) bias front and radial back. These rears on front are usually run reversed on the rim for cord stacking reasons on hard braking (not water dispersion).  Rear MC tires have about a third more tread depth on them than fronts, when new.

It is my experience (from reading tire threads on here for 12 years or so) that different people, living in different parts of the country, with different roads, get significant differences in consistent mileage on the same tires.  Clearly some riders are harder on tires than others, and people who live in corn country with no hills or curves get more miles than mountain riders.  But it's still quite a mystery.

I've never had a front or rear motorcycle tire on a Valk get to 10K.  And I got close to wrecking on a rear with 9K on it (sideways with brown underwear).  When I ran ME880s on back, I could barely make it to 8K.  I now run grandma's all season radial car tires in back that get 37K (and I love them).

In conclusion, 8-9K on a standard front valk radial may not be right, but it is pretty average for many of us.

EDIT: And I'm pretty fanatical about keeping all of my tires inflated up close to the max PSI on the sidewall... usually 42 front.

 

[baird4444]

    I do run the Michelins and get about 20k out of them with diligent
monitoring of the air pressures. 39-front and 43-rear has worked great
for me. I average 8 to 10k miles a year.....
           - Mike

[scooperhsd]

You get more mileage out of the tires on a Valk if you use more tire pressure than Honda recommends - I find 40 PSI front / rear with Metzler ME880's  in the correct size both front and rear give me about 10K miles, maybe a little more.

[Robert]

12 to 15k on Avons

[3fan4life]

The most mileage on a front for me has been the Elite 3 (19k) or an Avon (16k).


My front tire of choice is now the Shinko 230 Tourmaster:



I'm looking at 12-13k for mileage.

But, they're under $100 and the wet road traction is great.

I'd place it equal to or better than the Dunlop for overall grip.

The Avon is the best dry road grip by far.

But, it sucks in the rain which is where the Shinko really shines.

[phideux]

Anyone ever try a real "Double Dark Side" and put a car tire front and rear??? Will it even work?? If not, Why???

[mark81]

The most mileage on a front for me has been the Elite 3 (19k) or an Avon (16k).


My front tire of choice is now the Shinko 230 Tourmaster:



I'm looking at 12-13k for mileage.

But, they're under $100 and the wet road traction is great.

I'd place it equal to or better than the Dunlop for overall grip.

The Avon is the best dry road grip by far.

But, it sucks in the rain which is where the Shinko really shines.

I am currently running this tire also. Up until this point the E3 had been the best tire I've used but also top of the list on cost.  I have a little over 5k on the tourmaster and expect it to make it well past the 10k mark. Hopefully close to 15

[KUGO]

"There is no trouble whatsoever running a (good) bias front and radial back. These rears on front are usually run reversed on the rim for cord stacking reasons on hard braking (not water dispersion). - Jess"

Okay, Jess, I appreciate you bringing up something I've wondered about ever since non-symmetrical, uni-directional tires, for cars or bikes, hit the market long ago.  On my cars, it's very obvious how the tread should be for water dispersion purposes.  And I've had every make of performance tire there is, and it's always the same.  BUT, on bike tires the front tire is always (to MY eye) "backwards" compared to the rear (again, as it pertains to perceived water dispersion).  I've not heard the "stacking" aspects before and thought I'd bare my ignorance here versus Googling someone else's take on this elsewhere.  Does stacking refer to forces created by hard braking alone?  I've hit the brakes pretty hard on some high performance cars and have not experienced "cord stacking" or negative or destructive results.  Unless I did and didn't know it!  Any further explanation of why bike tires are always "backwards"?  Thanks!

[Jess from VA]

"There is no trouble whatsoever running a (good) bias front and radial back. These rears on front are usually run reversed on the rim for cord stacking reasons on hard braking (not water dispersion). - Jess"

Okay, Jess, I appreciate you bringing up something I've wondered about ever since non-symmetrical, uni-directional tires, for cars or bikes, hit the market long ago.  On my cars, it's very obvious how the tread should be for water dispersion purposes.  And I've had every make of performance tire there is, and it's always the same.  BUT, on bike tires the front tire is always (to MY eye) "backwards" compared to the rear (again, as it pertains to perceived water dispersion).  I've not heard the "stacking" aspects before and thought I'd bare my ignorance here versus Googling someone else's take on this elsewhere.  Does stacking refer to forces created by hard braking alone?  I've hit the brakes pretty hard on some high performance cars and have not experienced "cord stacking" or negative or destructive results.  Unless I did and didn't know it!  Any further explanation of why bike tires are always "backwards"?  Thanks!

Kugo, I reported what my googling (some time back) revealed.  And I ran the one rear I tried on front reversed and it worked like any other front, as have many) (that tire wasn't very good, but it wasn't being reversed on rim that was the problem, it was just too small of a carcass, and slippery wet or dry). 

Running a rear on front not reversed is supposed to go against the grain of how the cords are laid onto the tire construction under hard braking (which I would suppose creates a lot of g force on the carcass/cords).  That's what I read on line.  Those articles said water dispersion was not the reason for reversal (though that gets mentioned from time to time).

I've stared at rear (and front) tire treads on line, and never been able to see how reversing a rear on front will hurt water dispersion.... the tread still shoots it out the sides.

Of course the whole idea of a rear on front is to get the extra tread depth (about one third more), and hopefully, extra life.

________________

Cars run 4 tires, all the same design and size (usually), and all with the same directional mounting arrow.  It would seem to me the only way to induce any cord stacking (if any) with those would be to mount them reversed from the directional arrow, which could only be wrong, front or rear.  It might also be bad for water dispersion too, I don't know.  Since cars don't have different tread designs for fronts and rears like bikes (and even get rotated), I'm not sure it's useful to compare them.   

___________________

I didn't say bike tires are always backwards.  I said (what I read said) rear bike tires on the front of bikes should be reversed on the rim (for cord stacking, not water dispersion) .

[cookiedough]

The most mileage on a front for me has been the Elite 3 (19k) or an Avon (16k).


My front tire of choice is now the Shinko 230 Tourmaster:



I'm looking at 12-13k for mileage.

But, they're under $100 and the wet road traction is great.

I'd place it equal to or better than the Dunlop for overall grip.

The Avon is the best dry road grip by far.

But, it sucks in the rain which is where the Shinko really shines.

that shinko is what is on my bike now and am sure will go 15K or so like my last Avon Cobra did, but I let the Avon go 2-3 years too long since balancing went bad after first 3-4 years on it.

[KUGO]

First of all, Jess, THANK YOU for taking the time to give the detailed response. I may have not communicated my question well, however. I'm not talking about using a rear tire for the front, regardless of the direction it would rotate. I'm simply saying that most every modern motorcycle front tire has a tread that, to my eye, LOOKS backwards as far as me imagining water dispersing as the tire rolls forward. At least as compared to the same mfg.'s "matching" rear tire for the same application. Am I just missing something so basic that I don't even appreciate how stupid my question is? (It happened once before...)
 

PS: Getting up to five inches of snow in Central Illinois as I "speak". Nothing but white outside my window. Sigh.

[Jess from VA]

OK.  All I can say is this:

Even if I think MC tire engineers suck for making relatively expensive tires that don't last very long, I think they probably know the best way (tread patterns) to disperse water on front (or rear) tires.

I admit that when I look at some tread patterns on front MC tires, they don't make any more sense to me  than you.

The only thing I have to go on personally, is picking tires that have worked really well for me in all weather and hard rain, and even standing water, and I haven't crashed out.  Once I found them, I stuck with them. 

[3fan4life]

OK.  All I can say is this:

Even if I think MC tire engineers suck for making relatively expensive tires that don't last very long, I think they probably know the best way (tread patterns) to disperse water on front (or rear) tires.

I admit that when I look at some tread patterns on front MC tires, they don't make any more sense to me  than you.

The only thing I have to go on personally, is picking tires that have worked really well for me in all weather and hard rain, and even standing water, and I haven't crashed out.  Once I found them, I stuck with them. 

That is definitely the wheelhouse of the Shinko 230 Tourmaster.

It is the most sure footed tire that I have ever had on a wet surface.

[cookiedough]

PS: Getting up to five inches of snow in Central Illinois as I "speak". Nothing but white outside my window. Sigh.

sorry to hear you gettting the white stuff.  Keep it down south for highs in 30s all this coming week is cold enough for snow still here in April but looking forward to taking the snow tires off my vehicles next weekend and charging up my cycle batteries as well .  I checked past 2 years of snow tires taking off and was 3rd and 4th week in March, NOT so this year will be probably next weekend assuming the extended forecast next week is highs in the 50s as it should be, NOT 30s for highs like this first coming week in April.

I wonder if the shinko 230 tourmaster front BIAS ply tire is good in wet rain due to it being BIAS ply and softer compound it seems like to me vs. my previous Avon Cobra?  I got caught once this year in a HEAVY downpour doing 50-55 mph top speed and my front shinko 230 tourmaster stuck like glue, but my rear 3 year old Shinko SE890 Journey radial tire was skiddish having about 1/2 tread left tops, but a lot of that was I think due to I was revving it up too much coming away from a stop sign fishtailing the back end some at stop lights, plus I noticed a little hydroplaning over standing water puddles on the rear tire only doing 50 mph or so. 

So far, I do not think my SE890 shinko journey will last much longer than 10k as my Avon cobra did, but at 30 bucks cheaper I will continue to use Shinko since seems to last as long as the others at 30-40 bucks cheaper per tire.  I think my shinko 230 tourmaster was 90 bucks for front tire or pretty close to it. 

I put on Shinko 777's on my kids 97 honda magna and 5K miles later seems to be holding up well for price paid.  30 dollar savings is almost 1/2 the cost of labor to install one tire.

[Cracker Jack]

First of all, Jess, THANK YOU for taking the time to give the detailed response. I may have not communicated my question well, however. I'm not talking about using a rear tire for the front, regardless of the direction it would rotate. I'm simply saying that most every modern motorcycle front tire has a tread that, to my eye, LOOKS backwards as far as me imagining water dispersing as the tire rolls forward. At least as compared to the same mfg.'s "matching" rear tire for the same application. Am I just missing something so basic that I don't even appreciate how stupid my question is? (It happened once before...)
 

PS: Getting up to five inches of snow in Central Illinois as I "speak". Nothing but white outside my window. Sigh.

Easy way to tell if a motorcycle tire is mounted with proper rotation, standing in front looking at the front tire the tread will be pointing up, standing in back of the bike looking at the rear tire the tread will also be pointing up.

A front tire is mounted such that if traction is lost during braking, the road friction is pulling the water out of the tread.

A rear tire is mounted such that a tire spinning on the pavement during acceleration, the road friction is pulling the water out of the tread.

Drawing from my experience growing up on a farm tractor, the lug tread on a properly rotation tire was also looking up from the rear for the same reason. Properly rotating, a tire spinning in mud would self clean however rotating the wrong way, the tread would pack full of mud with near zero traction.

[northernvalk]

I've had great luck with the Shinko tires I've had.  As far as price for value...no other tire comes close.  The 777's I have on my magna are like road glue in the dry and wet, amazing traction that gives me full confidence to disperse tiny steel particles all over the place  My cousin has the tourmasters on his CB900c and loves them also.   

[Motodad71]

I've had great luck with the Shinko tires I've had.  As far as price for value...no other tire comes close.  The 777's I have on my magna are like road glue in the dry and wet, amazing traction that gives me full confidence to disperse tiny steel particles all over the place  My cousin has the tourmasters on his CB900c and loves them also.   

Yup I love Shinko tires, run them on my V-Strom and will be doing the same on my Valk.

[Bighead]

PS: Getting up to five inches of snow in Central Illinois as I "speak". Nothing but white outside my window. Sigh.

sorry to hear you gettting the white stuff.  Keep it down south for highs in 30s all this coming week is cold enough for snow still here in April but looking forward to taking the snow tires off my vehicles next weekend and charging up my cycle batteries as well .  I checked past 2 years of snow tires taking off and was 3rd and 4th week in March, NOT so this year will be probably next weekend assuming the extended forecast next week is highs in the 50s as it should be, NOT 30s for highs like this first coming week in April.

I wonder if the shinko 230 tourmaster front BIAS ply tire is good in wet rain due to it being BIAS ply and softer compound it seems like to me vs. my previous Avon Cobra?  I got caught once this year in a HEAVY downpour doing 50-55 mph top speed and my front shinko 230 tourmaster stuck like glue, but my rear 3 year old Shinko SE890 Journey radial tire was skiddish having about 1/2 tread left tops, but a lot of that was I think due to I was revving it up too much coming away from a stop sign fishtailing the back end some at stop lights, plus I noticed a little hydroplaning over standing water puddles on the rear tire only doing 50 mph or so.  

So far, I do not think my SE890 shinko journey will last much longer than 10k as my Avon cobra did, but at 30 bucks cheaper I will continue to use Shinko since seems to last as long as the others at 30-40 bucks cheaper per tire.  I think my shinko 230 tourmaster was 90 bucks for front tire or pretty close to it.  

I put on Shinko 777's on my kids 97 honda magna and 5K miles later seems to be holding up well for price paid.  30 dollar savings is almost 1/2 the cost of labor to install one tire.

I would just like to know how anyone could run a tire for three years or more? I have three bikes and usually have to put a set on each every year......just sayin. 

[cookiedough]

PS: Getting up to five inches of snow in Central Illinois as I "speak". Nothing but white outside my window. Sigh.

sorry to hear you gettting the white stuff.  Keep it down south for highs in 30s all this coming week is cold enough for snow still here in April but looking forward to taking the snow tires off my vehicles next weekend and charging up my cycle batteries as well .  I checked past 2 years of snow tires taking off and was 3rd and 4th week in March, NOT so this year will be probably next weekend assuming the extended forecast next week is highs in the 50s as it should be, NOT 30s for highs like this first coming week in April.

I wonder if the shinko 230 tourmaster front BIAS ply tire is good in wet rain due to it being BIAS ply and softer compound it seems like to me vs. my previous Avon Cobra?  I got caught once this year in a HEAVY downpour doing 50-55 mph top speed and my front shinko 230 tourmaster stuck like glue, but my rear 3 year old Shinko SE890 Journey radial tire was skiddish having about 1/2 tread left tops, but a lot of that was I think due to I was revving it up too much coming away from a stop sign fishtailing the back end some at stop lights, plus I noticed a little hydroplaning over standing water puddles on the rear tire only doing 50 mph or so.  

So far, I do not think my SE890 shinko journey will last much longer than 10k as my Avon cobra did, but at 30 bucks cheaper I will continue to use Shinko since seems to last as long as the others at 30-40 bucks cheaper per tire.  I think my shinko 230 tourmaster was 90 bucks for front tire or pretty close to it.  

I put on Shinko 777's on my kids 97 honda magna and 5K miles later seems to be holding up well for price paid.  30 dollar savings is almost 1/2 the cost of labor to install one tire.

I would just like to know how anyone could run a tire for three years or more? I have three bikes and usually have to put a set on each every year......just sayin. 

I have 3 bikes to ride also and considering WI can only drive 7-8 months of the year plus do not drive in the rain plus work M-Friday, ONLY leaves weekends to ride and most weekends busy doing other stuff.  Simple,  I was lucky one year to put on 5000 miles on one cycle several years ago, but most times 2-3000 miles on each cycle tops per year.

[Bighead]

I dont ride ( not drive) to work either. But as some of you get 15-20k out of a tire I guess that is how it happens.

[hubcapsc]

I dont ride ( not drive) to work either. But as some of you get 15-20k out of a tire I guess that is how it happens.

Riding to work ate my tires worse than running a 40 grit belt sander on them...



I wonder if people who have long lasting tires are unfortunate enough to have
to ride on well maintained roads all the time  ?

-Mike

[indybobm]

What effect does speed have on tire wear? Will running at 70mph result in more tire wear that running at 40mph on the same road? If it does, does wear increase at a linear rate or exponetionally like drag?

[northernvalk]

What effect does speed have on tire wear? Will running at 70mph result in more tire wear that running at 40mph on the same road? If it does, does wear increase at a linear rate or exponetionally like drag?

I am no expert but I would assume that tire wear is exponential like drag because drag direstly affect tire wear. If your bike is pushing against a force and that force increases, ypur tires would be under increased stress to maintain grip going forward.