MAYBE an insight to the WHY of the opioid crisis

[old2soon]

Warning-LONG and NOT Valkyrie related!                                                                                    Lady neighbor directly across the street from me fell on Thanksgiving day 2017. End result-broken hip. She fell a year and a half before that breaking a hip. Net result-both hips broken year and a half apart. Gwen is now 71 and thin-maybe skinny.
         The first hip break healed up good and she went on about her business. Did I mention she IS for lack of a better description independent and feisty. Most of the reason we are Friends.
          The Thanksgiving day hip break is what I'm on about here. Tween me and the ambulance we've had her to the emergency room for pain and lack of motion issues a number of times. One instance stands out-left our houses round 8 P M on a Sunday night and got back home just before 0300 Monday. Two different back braces and MORE drug scrips.
           EVERY effin time we went to the E R more drug scrips and placating words-zero action. Bout a week and a half ago she got referred to a neuro surgeon and he determined Part of her problem was Maybe some collapsed discs. He set up an appointment for Gwen the next day at the pain clinic.
           When she came out of the pain clinic she was still hurting BUT they had determined one of the bones in the hip break from Thanksgiving was cracked as was her coccyx. She goes in for a pre surgery consult in about 2 hrs and the surgery tomorrow morning.
           ALL and I mean ALL the E R and her own dr have been doing is throwing drugs at her. In fact I am driving her to the Hospital in West Plains Mo here in awhile and tomorrow i HAVE to haul my butt outa the sack at 0500 to drive her to the surgery.
            As an aside Gwen is also a STRONG Woman and she did NOT fill most of the scrips. The one or two she did fill made her-her own words-loopy.
           I am receiving much better care from my V A facilities then Gwen is receiving from the private sector. Maybe some spill over from o care? NOT Sure BUT I have my suspicions.
           If this missive comes off as a rant BUT helps someone here or a family member of someone here OR gits ya ta thinkin bout such stuff-well Just Maybe-ah hell-it IS Still a rant! 
                 RIDE SAFE
           And B T W-Gwen has GOOD insurance she is the widow of a retired Army Enlisted man. Although she IS loath to use said insurance. Did I mention she IS independent And feisty.
            She can NOT wait to git back movin around and drivin herself. She is known here bouts as THE garage sale queen! 

[Serk]

I'm just gonna leave this here...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gzExCueDSnk

(Full quote with intro question here, if you're in to that sort of thing: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U-dQfb8WQvo )

[¿spoom]

Dunno how accurate the number are, but I saw an editorial where the writer claimed that the US has about 10% of the world's population yet consumes around 80% of the world's prescribed opioids. If true, I think the root cause may be obvious...

[Black Dog]

I had a Total Shoulder Replacement (left) done back in November of '17... Honestly, the pain was much better 3 days after surgery, than it was prior to the operation.  New joint, much smoother and minimal pain.  They sent me home with a script for 60 Oxy's, TO GET ME THROUGH THE WEEKEND!!!   I really didn't need, or use any (I had a 'drip ball' I wore around my neck, that administered a constant flow of medication, enabling me to get by without the pills...

When I commented to my nurses at a follow up, they said it was because they didn't want me to need more during the weekend...  Sixty pills?  That would have killed me, in a weekend.

Black Dog

[The emperor has no clothes]

Dilaudid saved my ass when nothing else would touch the pain of a herniated disc. I was very thankful for it. As far as why people enjoy the feeling, I don’t get it. I didn’t .

[..]

People make choices. They decide. Weak people make bad choices.

[The emperor has no clothes]

There are plenty of people who are addicted to cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, etc. I doubt they could all be classified as weak.

[..]

There are plenty of people who are addicted to cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, etc. I doubt they could all be classified as weak.

You really aren't very good at communication.

DID I WRITE ALL?????

[The emperor has no clothes]

There are plenty of people who are addicted to cigarettes, alcohol, drugs, etc. I doubt they could all be classified as weak.

You really aren't very good at communication.

DID I WRITE ALL?????

If I care to address your comments I will quote them.  otherwise it’s just a statement.

[phideux]

One of the points you made was about taking her for repeated trips to the ER. The ER is not the place for chronic issues, it is not the place for orthopedic management, it is not the place for diagnostics, it is not the place for pain management. The ER is for emergencies. Chronic pain and running out of your monthly pain meds 2 weeks early is not an emergency.
That is one of the biggest problems, nowadays everyone goes to the ER for everything. In your case the ER does not have the Orthopedic resources or Neurological resources to help your friend and her issues. I'll guarantee you that every time you took her there the last things they told you, and I'm sure it is on her discharge paperwork is. "here is a short term, 2-3 day prescription for some pain medicine, you need to follow up with whatever doctor you need to follow up with".  I can't tell you how many times I've said those same words to countless people but 2 days later they are back in the ER looking for more pain meds. First question, did you follow up with your doctor???? Guess what the answer always is???

[Bighead]

One of the points you made was about taking her for repeated trips to the ER. The ER is not the place for chronic issues, it is not the place for orthopedic management, it is not the place for diagnostics, it is not the place for pain management. The ER is for emergencies. Chronic pain and running out of your monthly pain meds 2 weeks early is not an emergency.
That is one of the biggest problems, nowadays everyone goes to the ER for everything. In your case the ER does not have the Orthopedic resources or Neurological resources to help your friend and her issues. I'll guarantee you that every time you took her there the last things they told you, and I'm sure it is on her discharge paperwork is. "here is a short term, 2-3 day prescription for some pain medicine, you need to follow up with whatever doctor you need to follow up with".  I can't tell you how many times I've said those same words to countless people but 2 days later they are back in the ER looking for more pain meds. First question, did you follow up with your doctor???? Guess what the answer always is???

+10

[old2soon]

One of the points you made was about taking her for repeated trips to the ER. The ER is not the place for chronic issues, it is not the place for orthopedic management, it is not the place for diagnostics, it is not the place for pain management. The ER is for emergencies. Chronic pain and running out of your monthly pain meds 2 weeks early is not an emergency.
That is one of the biggest problems, nowadays everyone goes to the ER for everything. In your case the ER does not have the Orthopedic resources or Neurological resources to help your friend and her issues. I'll guarantee you that every time you took her there the last things they told you, and I'm sure it is on her discharge paperwork is. "here is a short term, 2-3 day prescription for some pain medicine, you need to follow up with whatever doctor you need to follow up with".  I can't tell you how many times I've said those same words to countless people but 2 days later they are back in the ER looking for more pain meds. First question, did you follow up with your doctor???? Guess what the answer always is???

              Even AFTER the E R visit her personal dr prescribed MORE drugs. The gal that delivered her 2nd back brace suggested the Neuro Surgeon and after that lead her to the Pain Clinic. Gwen goes in tomorrow at 0630 for fusion of 2 discs. You might have a small idea of how cursed GOOD that bit of news-surgery-is to Gwen. Did I also mention she Might be just a bit hard headed?  While I was involved peripherally I am NOT in any way shape or form her care giver nor am I related. I am Just a neighbor and a Friend. Did I mention she Might be a bit hard headed?  RIDE SAFE.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

After over a decade of staying away from doctors my diabetes got too bad to control with diet alone and I had to go to find a doctor.

Now I have diabetes meds which are able to control my sugar as long as I get plenty of exercise and stay away from most carbs. I really like my doctor. But, I get the feeling he is pressured to write prescriptions. I get the same feeling from my eye doctor.

I don't think doctors have much control anymore. I think the hospitals they are associated with, the drug companies and the insurance companies are in collusion (to use a popular word) to maximize their profits and take as much of our money as possible.

Even though my LDL is 129 which should be acceptable I have now been prescribed statins (which I won't take) for it. My understanding is the level at which these drugs are prescribed has been dropped enough to put almost everyone over 50 on them. My guess is it was big pharma lobby money that got that level dropped and the doctors are required to follow those guidelines right or wrong if they want to be associated with certain hospitals, referred by other doctors and able to work with certain insurance.

When doing a little research it appears that 30% of people who try these drugs stop taking them because of side effects. And that once you stop taking them you are more likely to die in the next decade than if you had never taken them to begin with. Talk about a racket, that sounds like heroin without the high.

It used to be that a family could accumulate a certain amount of wealth from generation to generation by passing on what you have earned and not spent to your descendants. With the help of drug dependency, crazy high med bills, nursing homes and the like the medical community has learned how to grab that wealth away from families and accumulate it in the medical community instead.

What's the biggest money making business on the face of the earth? I don't know but my guess is cancer. Wonder why a cure hasn't been found? I don't.

[The emperor has no clothes]

After over a decade of staying away from doctors my diabetes got too bad to control with diet alone and I had to go to find a doctor.

Now I have diabetes meds which are able to control my sugar as long as I get plenty of exercise and stay away from most carbs. I really like my doctor. But, I get the feeling he is pressured to write prescriptions. I get the same feeling from my eye doctor.

I don't think doctors have much control anymore. I think the hospitals they are associated with, the drug companies and the insurance companies are in collusion (to use a popular word) to maximize their profits and take as much of our money as possible.

Even though my LDL is 129 which should be acceptable I have now been prescribed statins (which I won't take) for it. My understanding is the level at which these drugs are prescribed has been dropped enough to put almost everyone over 50 on them. My guess is it was big pharma lobby money that got that level dropped and the doctors are required to follow those guidelines right or wrong if they want to be associated with certain hospitals, referred by other doctors and able to work with certain insurance.

When doing a little research it appears that 30% of people who try these drugs stop taking them because of side effects. And that once you stop taking them you are more likely to die in the next decade than if you had never taken them to begin with. Talk about a racket, that sounds like heroin without the high.

It used to be that a family could accumulate a certain amount of wealth from generation to generation by passing on what you have earned and not spent to your descendants. With the help of drug dependency, crazy high med bills, nursing homes and the like the medical community has learned how to grab that wealth away from families and accumulate it in the medical community instead.

What's the biggest money making business on the face of the earth? I don't know but my guess is cancer. Wonder why a cure hasn't been found? I don't.

There were at least $3.5 billion in disclosed payments from drug companies to doctors made between 2009 and 2013, according to an independent news organization called ProPublica.

[Crackerborn]

I had a knee replaced at the end of Feb. The nurses could not believe I wouldn't take whatever pain medication available for my overnight in the hospital. One went so far as to suggest I would not sleep without some drug in me. My MD knows me better, he never even prescribed any pain meds. The relief of no arthritis, no bone on bone everyday pain made no meds necessary.  Maybe if more tried living with the everyday aches and pains without overmedicating themselves, there would be less abuse. Don't get me wrong, there is a place for pain medication, but not to the extent it is used now.

Just a side note, the muscle cramps from having to retrain the leg muscles to walk correctly after almost 10 years of walking incorrectly to protect the knees, made me rethink my pain threshold.  .

[old2soon]

    My ex b I l-needle dependent diabetic morbidly/grossly obese 2 heart surgeries already REFUSES to quit diet soda IS playing 2 perhaps 3 doctors against each other. I not Only believe he is addicted I KNOW he is addicted. If he feels a "pain" when he gits his-well large-keester outa bed he washes his pain pills down with a latte. A very SWEET latte. I M H O-all the things I've stated for him I believe THAT'S the way he WANTS it. Granted-some or a lot of addictions ARE self inflicted. Others demand and git pain pill scrips.                   A Dr. I know up near my Brothers place retired because he told us about 13  15 year old children coming in and asking for pain pills for mom and/or dad. Very Specific about WHAT they were asking for-nudder words-Well COACHED.            Most of the people that I knew on drugs in another life did not want help-they just wanted to stay high. Some of them are in the ground.        Happy that Gwen is as Strong as she is. RIDE SAFE.

[fudgie]

One of the points you made was about taking her for repeated trips to the ER. The ER is not the place for chronic issues, it is not the place for orthopedic management, it is not the place for diagnostics, it is not the place for pain management. The ER is for emergencies. Chronic pain and running out of your monthly pain meds 2 weeks early is not an emergency.
That is one of the biggest problems, nowadays everyone goes to the ER for everything. In your case the ER does not have the Orthopedic resources or Neurological resources to help your friend and her issues. I'll guarantee you that every time you took her there the last things they told you, and I'm sure it is on her discharge paperwork is. "here is a short term, 2-3 day prescription for some pain medicine, you need to follow up with whatever doctor you need to follow up with".  I can't tell you how many times I've said those same words to countless people but 2 days later they are back in the ER looking for more pain meds. First question, did you follow up with your doctor???? Guess what the answer always is???

Yes! I wish half the US would read this yearly. 

[fudgie]

She was referred to pain control so her doctor don't have to prescribe her any more meds. That's a good thing. Its better to have pain control regulate the meds instead of a few doctors.
At least in Ind the doctors are to look the pt up online and see where they have been getting their narcs. They are not to give them more and pts are not to 'doctor hop' to get more.

[..]

2 kidney stone events about 12 months apart.

Prescribed Oxy for the first one. Didn't use one

Still in the cabinet ready for use during the 2nd one. Didn't use one.

Both times I did use some Aleve to take a little bit of the edge off.

Oxy still in the cabinet if needed.

[Jess from VA]

an insight to the WHY of the opioid crisis

It's because an amazing number of people prefer to go through life half to full buzzed rather than sober.  It's that simple.

The why behind that varies widely, but the vast majority of opioid use is not for actual chronic physical pain.  Opioids are not intended for chronic mental distress or anxiety or depression or boredom.  They have other dope for that, but people don't enjoy that buzz anywhere near as much as opioid.

The thing about opioid use I have learned from my pretty limited use (dentistry) is that it stops you from having bowl movements; I mean like concrete, and maybe for days without some other laxative or high colonic treatment.  Fiber and stool softener do nothing for me but add bad GI upset (and nothing moves).  With the level of opioid abuse extant, I'm surprised we don't hear of people actually exploding.    

[The emperor has no clothes]

an insight to the WHY of the opioid crisis

It's because an amazing number of people prefer to go through life half to full buzzed rather than sober.  It's that simple.

The why behind that varies widely, but the vast majority of opioid use is not for actual chronic physical pain.  Opioids are not intended for chronic mental distress or anxiety or depression or boredom.  They have other dope for that, but people don't enjoy that buzz anywhere near as much as opioid.

The thing about opioid use I have learned from my pretty limited use (dentistry) is that it stops you from having bowl movements; I mean like concrete, and maybe for days without some other laxative or high colonic treatment.  Fiber and stool softener do nothing for me but add bad GI upset.  With the level of opioid abuse extant, I'm surprised we don't hear of people actually exploding.    

Maybe not exploding, but blowing their rectum out. I had never experienced this in all my years until I was taking dilaudid. I had no idea it was a side effect. Man, o man. That scared the crap out of me (figuratively) . I still don't get the reason for abusing it. I found it not a pleasurable high at all.

[Robert]

Some good news for everyone and something not covered in the news.

Today, my Administration is launching the most sweeping action in history to lower the price of prescription drugs for the American People. We will have tougher negotiation, more competition, and much lower prices at the pharmacy counter! https://t.co/xdakX43a4d

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cds8h9DbTdc

[3fan4life]

The current opioid epidemic was caused in part by the Federal Government.

Around 2013 the Feds began to "crack down" on Dr's for over prescribing opioid painkillers.

Between legislation, tracking and actually putting Dr's in jail they managed to be successful in greatly reducing the amount of prescription pills available on the street.

This did not go unnoticed by the drug cartels.

They began to flood our streets with Heroin and they made it cheap.

A dose of Heroin can be had for about $10 while a single Oxycontin tablet can bring $25.

On top of this the Heroin is being cut with Fentanyl.

So you have one of the strongest and most addictive natural opioids known being cut with a synthetic opioid that is even stronger.

Some of the Heroin is being cut with Carfentanil which is a thousand times stronger than Fentanyl.

This mixture is almost always fatal to the user.

The death toll is staggering, over the last 3yrs approximately 180,000 people in the US have died from an opioid overdose and the numbers are increasing exponentially.

Not everyone that is using Heroin today started using it simply to get high.

Many Heroin addicts are or were people that turned to Heroin when the prescription pain meds that they were taking for chronic pain were cut off due to tightening government regs.

What's even crazier is that the Federal Government doesn't follow its own rules.

I am a VA Patient and I suffer with some chronic pain issues.

If I would let them the VA would supply me with all of the prescription opioid painkillers that I wanted.

It has been a real struggle to get them to treat the problem instead of just covering it up.

What's even crazier is that the few pain meds that I have let them give me were shipped to me in the mail.     

[Robert]

Found an interesting story that applies and gives an interesting perspective on the situation.

What’s It Like To Do Heroin And What’s It Like To Be Addicted To Heroin

http://cavemancircus.com/2018/05/10/whats-like-heroin-whats-like-addicted-heroin/

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Found an interesting story that applies and gives an interesting perspective on the situation.

What’s It Like To Do Heroin And What’s It Like To Be Addicted To Heroin

http://cavemancircus.com/2018/05/10/whats-like-heroin-whats-like-addicted-heroin/

Damn. That's about as disturbing as anything I have ever read. A former customer of mine told me a couple of years ago he was selling all his firearms except what he needed for self-defense. He said he had to so they wouldn't be stolen. He was an elderly gentlemen who lived in small town Indiana. He said things were getting stolen out of his yard and off his porch. His neighbors were getting broken into. An LEO told him their were so many heroin addicts in the area stealing to supply their habit that they couldn't do much about it. At the time, I found it hard to believe, now I don't.  

[NewValker]

Few years ago one of my co-workers took a 2nd job to provide money to his heroin addicted son. The kid was almost 30. He needed $75.00 a day for his habit, and in return he wouldn’t commit any crimes that his father had to bail him out of.
No idea where the kid is today, but Dad worked himself into an early grave...
Sad,
Craig

[..]

Found an interesting story that applies and gives an interesting perspective on the situation.

What’s It Like To Do Heroin And What’s It Like To Be Addicted To Heroin

http://cavemancircus.com/2018/05/10/whats-like-heroin-whats-like-addicted-heroin/

Damn. That's about as disturbing as anything I have ever read. A former customer of mine told me a couple of years ago he was selling all his firearms except what he needed for self-defense. He said he had to so they wouldn't be stolen. He was an elderly gentlemen who lived in small town Indiana. He said things were getting stolen out of his yard and off his porch. His neighbors were getting broken into. An LEO told him their were so many heroin addicts in the area stealing to supply their habit that they couldn't do much about it. At the time, I found it hard to believe, now I don't.  :'(

In the NETFLIX series "Dope" one episode features IN and the heroin crisis. Not good.