Was looking at Beer's thread on VRCC history

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

I saw this picture … Charlie ( Land Elephant ) #5 from left and Paul ( Thumper ) #4 from right. Both gone now from cancer 

I can only name 9 of the 14 in this picture with me being one of them and this was one of my ride's . Guess I'm gettin' old   

[Beer van Huet]

I am sorry to hear that, Smokinjoe
I guess looking at pictures from the past doesn't only bring back good memories.
It also makes you realize how relative life is. I'm sure most of us share these feelings.
I have been a fighter pilot most of my life, greatest job in the world.
During the cold war period the Dutch Airforce consisted of 212 F-16 A/C, second largest F-16 fleet after the US.  A small group of pilots, I knew everyone of them really well.  The average age of our pilots was 23 years. We were experts in low flying, the only way to survive against the massive Soviet missile threat, those days. 500+ knots at treetop height in sometimes marginal Wx conditions.
It came with a price. I have attended 26 funerals, buddies from my Squadron and close, really close friends. People you had a beer with the night before. The first one being an instructor pilot during pilot training, who decided to wait to eject after making sure his student got out safely. Unfortunately just outside the ejection envelope. I was 20 years of age.
After a deadly crash, the base commander, chaplain and a friend of the house (pilot) would pay a visit to the widow (young family, usually one or two small kids) to tell her that her husband and his airplane was missing. We all knew that he died but you had to recover at least 12 lbs of body material to officially call him dead. You have no idea what it's like to be in a situation like that. I have been selected a few times for these occasions and I can assure you that this will remain with you the rest of your life.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

I am sorry to hear that, Smokinjoe
I guess looking at pictures from the past doesn't only bring back good memories.
It also makes you realize how relative life is. I'm sure most of us share these feelings.
I have been a fighter pilot most of my life, greatest job in the world.
During the cold war period the Dutch Airforce consisted of 212 F-16 A/C, second largest F-16 fleet after the US.  A small group of pilots, I knew everyone of them really well.  The average age of our pilots was 23 years. We were experts in low flying, the only way to survive against the massive Soviet missile threat, those days. 500+ knots at treetop height in sometimes marginal Wx conditions.
It came with a price. I have attended 26 funerals, buddies from my Squadron and close, really close friends. People you had a beer with the night before. The first one being an instructor pilot during pilot training, who decided to wait to eject after making sure his student got out safely. Unfortunately just outside the ejection envelope. I was 20 years of age.
After a deadly crash, the base commander, chaplain and a friend of the house (pilot) would pay a visit to the widow (young family, usually one or two small kids) to tell her that her husband and his airplane was missing. We all knew that he died but you had to recover at least 12 lbs of body material to officially call him dead. You have no idea what it's like to be in a situation like that. I have been selected a few times for these occasions and I can assure you that this will remain with you the rest of your life.

WOW … Thanks for sharing …. I had to google knots to mph … 575 mph at treetops high that's badass dude 

[Jess from VA]

Thanks for your service Beer.  

(I don't think the US has the 12lbs of body parts requirement.  I did two USAF B1-B (bomber) accident investigations as the legal officer, and I am happy there was no weighing out of parts included in the job.)

(A friend of mine who did one, had the intact head in the helmet (helmets work).... but I don't want to know what that weighs.)

I got a back seat ride in an F16 B model while stationed in south Turkey, and it remains one of the most amazing experiences in my life.

[Beer van Huet]

The placard speed of the Falcon is 800 knots at sealevel.
But that's at an average of around 75.000 lbs/hr fuel consumtion.
Been there a couple of times

[Beer van Huet]

Hi Jess,

Incirlik, what a small world.
I've been there several times as well for JOAP sampling ( for non insiders: after every flight the oil of a fighter jet is analysed in a laboratory for microscopic metal particles) and later as a TACEVAL evaluator.
Besides, having a hamburger with fries beats a Doner Kebab, LOL

[Skinhead]

Beer,

As said above thank you for your service, and again thank you for the time and dedication it took to put all of this together.  Since you confess to being a fighter pilot, I have to ask, How does any thing you do after flying a fighter jet excite you?  I mean the Valkyries are fun, but an F16?  I'd think you would have trouble staying awake on a Valk after that!

[Jess from VA]

Hi Jess,

Incirlik, what a small world.
I've been there several times as well for JOAP sampling ( for non insiders: after every flight the oil of a fighter jet is analysed in a laboratory for microscopic metal particles) and later as a TACEVAL evaluator.
Besides, having a hamburger with fries beats a Doner Kebab, LOL

Yep, it was Incerlik AB.  Except for sheep and some of the exotic seafood (not done wiggling), I loved Turkish food.  My favorite loaf of bread, made fresh every morning, was a few hundred T Lire, 12 cents when I first arrived.  I also brought home a blond haired, blue eyed Turkish wife, but that's another story. 

[Beer van Huet]

Hi Skinhead,

Simple, I never look back. Just trying to make most of it now and look at the future.
One thing that strikes me though is the way technology for the general public is lagging behind the military state of the art.
To give you an example, 30 years ago we visited the Marconi plant in the UK, they showed us operational 3D GPS units for fighter A/C. These were so accurate and realistic that you could easlily cruise around at groundlevel with 450 knots without even having to look outside.
Now, 30 years later, I have a Garmin Zumo 595 on my Valk and it's still a piece of sh*t. I am aware that the GPS accuracy is different for military purposes but besides that, the whole presentation is still from the stone age.
We were flying around with receivers and jammers that would make every cop with a radar or laser gun believe that you were doing 55 mph while in fact you were riding twice as fast. I am talking technology from 30+ years ago.
In military aviation, the factory (Honda) would send you a message when the compression of one of your 6 cylinders was deteriorating or a brake pad was down to it's limits.
The whole flight control (fly by wire) computer of a F-16 was run by a 48K computer. Amazing, isn't it.
I am not even touching weapons, you won't believe what the stand off accuracy and capability is now a days. 

[Beer van Huet]

Hi Jess,

I was stationed at Izmir HQ for 4 years (2003-2007) and Cynthia and I had a great time in Turkey as well.
Hospitality is still spelled with capital letters over there. I came to believe that Turkey is the key to a possible settlement in the Middle East. Pity that western politicians have really no idea how to do business in that region and are messing things up again.

[hubcapsc]

Now, 30 years later, I have a Garmin Zumo 595 on my Valk and it's still a piece of sh*t.

The user interface on those things (consumer gps units) is so limited... I've been
working at configuring a gps on a powerful 12 inch Linux tablet with numerous other bits
and pieces of open source software... I'm imagining a nice 12 inch map that's zoomed
or shrunk by a gesture that always has my location in the middle of the page... if you
were looking at it while moving down the road (which you wouldn't be doing on a
motorcycle) your location would always be in the middle of the screen as the map
moves beneath it... that might not be what everyone wants, but the point is that
the software to make gps do arbitrary things is available, just not in the pre-boxed
consumer units...

I think maybe consumer gps units are geared towards telling you how to go to B from A...
they seem to do that pretty well...

-Mike

[MarkT]

Beer,

As said above thank you for your service, and again thank you for the time and dedication it took to put all of this together.  Since you confess to being a fighter pilot, I have to ask, How does any thing you do after flying a fighter jet excite you?  I mean the Valkyries are fun, but an F16?  I'd think you would have trouble staying awake on a Valk after that!

Interesting obervation.  This is not at the same level but a similar subject.  One of the reasons I moved to Colorado was for downhill skiing.  Then 3 years later I saw a hang glider hovering over Lookout Mountain and Buffalo Bill's grave - I was in the parking lot and he was a couple hundred feet above us, just floating on the updrafts.  I took up hang gliding after that.

I lost all interest in skiing and have never skied again.  There is just no comparison in those adrenaline sports.

Thanks for your service Beer.  Love to have a beer and hear your war stories sometime.  If you would share them.  I too have some stories but not so interesting, as an aircraft armament mechanic. I suppose you would have to cross the pond and visit us either here on the Ranch or at Taos.

[Jess from VA]

Hi Jess,

I was stationed at Izmir HQ for 4 years (2003-2007) and Cynthia and I had a great time in Turkey as well.
Hospitality is still spelled with capital letters over there. I came to believe that Turkey is the key to a possible settlement in the Middle East. Pity that western politicians have really no idea how to do business in that region and are messing things up again.

Hey Beer,

Yes, during my two tours there (Ankara & Incirlik, mid 80s) I was really blown away by the kindness, generosity and courtesy of the average people, everywhere.  After sleeping off jet lag from Detroit to Ankara (mostly nonstop), I walked out of my downtown hotel and got in a taxi to go to the Oclub to eat lunch (downtown, not on base, and the weekend).  The taxi driver was happy to have an American military fare, excited to practice his pretty decent English, insisted I not waste my money and offered to take me to his home where his wife would make us both a hot lunch, and his dog had just had puppies and I could have one.  This from a total stranger and simple taxi driver impressed the living hell out of me.  And this courtesy was repeated many times, and was infectious and made me a better person for the experience.

I had business in Izmir maybe 8-9 times as defense counsel for all USAF in Turkey, and that was of course HQ Land Southeast NATO (now LANDCOM), and where I met my first Russians (happy sailors out on the town).  Like Frankfort GE, Izmir Turkey is both a a large civilian airport and combined military air base (Cigli AB), as I'm sure you know. 

Sadly, these past decades of middle eastern war, and the US wanting to arm the Kurds in Iraq (good allies and top fighters against terror) has alienated the Turks and Erdogan and I fear we Americans are not anywhere near as welcome there as we used to be.  Politics always causes trouble, and the Turks are as nationalistic as any nation on earth (which I like in general).  The godless communist Soviets are no longer the great common enemy, and conflict will always be more regional and more complex, esp in the Middle East.  I have my doubts peace can come to that region in 1000 years.  I wish I was wrong.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

From left...Kneeling black shirt ( ? ) Roy , Standing ( ? ) , ( ? ) , Vickie <---Pretty sure that's her , Charlie , Hal , Randy , Robert , Paul , Joe , Wimp , Linda , kneeling  Hubcap.


Still have three I can't name  

[Skinhead]

Hi Skinhead,

Simple, I never look back. Just trying to make most of it now and look at the future.
One thing that strikes me though is the way technology for the general public is lagging behind the military state of the art.
To give you an example, 30 years ago we visited the Marconi plant in the UK, they showed us operational 3D GPS units for fighter A/C. These were so accurate and realistic that you could easlily cruise around at groundlevel with 450 knots without even having to look outside.
Now, 30 years later, I have a Garmin Zumo 595 on my Valk and it's still a piece of sh*t. I am aware that the GPS accuracy is different for military purposes but besides that, the whole presentation is still from the stone age.
We were flying around with receivers and jammers that would make every cop with a radar or laser gun believe that you were doing 55 mph while in fact you were riding twice as fast. I am talking technology from 30+ years ago.
In military aviation, the factory (Honda) would send you a message when the compression of one of your 6 cylinders was deteriorating or a brake pad was down to it's limits.
The whole flight control (fly by wire) computer of a F-16 was run by a 48K computer. Amazing, isn't it.
I am not even touching weapons, you won't believe what the stand off accuracy and capability is now a days. 

I agree Beer, the technology is there, and amazing.  The auto industry is slowly incorporating some of those vehicle life/service monitoring features, (OnStar and the like), but look what it has done to the costs.  2d GPS is all we need on our land vehicles, although the interfaces could be improved dramatically.  It sure would be nice to have a radar jammer for the bike that said you were only running 55 or 70.  But, I'm happy with the cost vs function of our valks, if I had a military style budget, I might get creative.  Ride safe.