Getting the splines to mesh - what are your hints? Help again!

[mello dude]

Hi - working to get my rear wheel back on and struggling to get the splines to re-mess. Turning out to be a beach.... I made a couple spacers to try to use the axle bolt to pull it together, but dont like how it not working out.

Ok - what are your hints for messing the spines?


Please review last posts... 

thanks!

[Bighead]

Lossen the four bolts on the diff and put tire on it will mesh. Tighten 4 bolts afternand all is good.  I

[mello dude]

Lossen the four bolts on the diff and put tire on it will mesh. Tighten 4 bolts afternand all is good.  I

The four bolts on the pumpkin and houses the drive shaft?
Essentially the bolts that go over stud 37 in the partzilla fische..

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

- I'll give it a shot..

[Bighead]

Yes

[sandy]

If you put the trans in gear, the drive unit will lock. When you spin the wheel, you'll find the splines.

[mello dude]

Yes

Quite a few cuss words going on, the nuts haven't been busted since the factory 

[mello dude]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

[Valkpilot]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

[mello dude]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

[The emperor has no clothes]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

[mello dude]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

New o- rings and greased 

[The emperor has no clothes]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

New o- rings and greased 

Just saw your other post. I forgot about all the chrome work you did. Looks excellent ! 

[John Schmidt]

Those are good hints and I use them along with another method. I slip the axle all the way through the wheel and into the left side of the swingarm, leaving out the spacer and brake mount at this time. That supports the wheel in line with the pumpkin and lets you use both hands to slide into place/mesh the splines. Once meshed, pull the axle out just even with the left side of the wheel so as to allow you to insert the spacer and brake mount. One more item....I never lift the rear of the bike more than 2-3 inches off the floor. Simply not necessary to R&R the rear wheel.

[Chrisj CMA]

Yes

Quite a few cuss words going on, the nuts haven't been busted since the factory 

If those nuts never get loosened during a wheel change you are very lucky you dont have excessive wear on the splines.  Those nuts need to be loose when you torque the axle and then you immediately retighten those nuts.  The other thing is, why not remove the final drive and service the drive shaft.  It may be well overdue.

[mello dude]

Yes

Quite a few cuss words going on, the nuts haven't been busted since the factory  

If those nuts never get loosened during a wheel change you are very lucky you dont have excessive wear on the splines.  Those nuts need to be loose when you torque the axle and then you immediately retighten those nuts.  The other thing is, why not remove the final drive and service the drive shaft.  It may be well overdue.

Thanks for the tip

[mello dude]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

Where are the shop talk articles located?

[mello dude]

Thanks to everyone on here.  . I have wrenched on a lot of chain driven bikes, but not much on shaft bikes..

[Chrisj CMA]

Thanks to everyone on here.  . I have wrenched on a lot of chain driven bikes, and not much on shaft bikes..

R/R of the drive and shaft is too easy to not do it while you have things apart

[The emperor has no clothes]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

Where are the shop talk articles located?

http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/

[Pluggy]

Those are good hints and I use them along with another method. I slip the axle all the way through the wheel and into the left side of the swingarm, leaving out the spacer and brake mount at this time. That supports the wheel in line with the pumpkin and lets you use both hands to slide into place/mesh the splines. Once meshed, pull the axle out just even with the left side of the wheel so as to allow you to insert the spacer and brake mount.

Yes.  This should have been put in the service manual.  The axle is used as an alignment tool.  Makes installing that wheel easy.

[mello dude]

Hey Bighead and Sandy --- did both of your hints - it worked! Whoo hoo!

Been a moto geek wrenching foole for 30 years and learned something new.
Mucho Thanks!  

The four drive-to-driveshaft bolts should only be tightened after the axle bolt is torqued.  If you didn't do it in that order, loosen and do it again.  (No need to disassemble.)

If you don't do it in this order, there's a possibility the drive and driven splines in the rear drive and star hub will not be well aligned and they will eventually chew each other up.

No matter what type of lube you use, no matter how much, the mis-alignment will win and ruin your drive.

Thanks for that tip - I havent torqued down anything yet.

I never would have thought of loosening the driveshaft bolts in the first place... Got to remember that!

There are some good "how to" articles in our shoptalk. You can pretty much read them all in one night. (Hope you regreased and put in new o-rings)

Where are the shop talk articles located?

http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/

Wow! What a resource! I didnt know we had that. Waaay Cool   Time for a bit of study.  

This turned out to be a great thread. 

[John Schmidt]

Those are good hints and I use them along with another method. I slip the axle all the way through the wheel and into the left side of the swingarm, leaving out the spacer and brake mount at this time. That supports the wheel in line with the pumpkin and lets you use both hands to slide into place/mesh the splines. Once meshed, pull the axle out just even with the left side of the wheel so as to allow you to insert the spacer and brake mount.

Yes.  This should have been put in the service manual.  The axle is used as an alignment tool.  Makes installing that wheel easy.

That was one method I figured out on my own a number of years back. An old military saying; "you want to find the easiest method of doing something, assign the task to the laziest guy in the outfit." I'm lazy!    I agree....it would have been nice if that method had been in the manual.  

[mello dude]

ChrisJ CMA- just read your powerpoint on the rear wheel service. Great photos and instructions. Kudos to you sir. -- Looks like I missed the 3rd O-ring. - Ok, the rear is coming back apart. Diff and shaft too...

3rd O-ring looks like #34 on the fische?  

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

Btw- how long is your red shock bar you made ? Great idea, I may as copy it.

Thanks again.  

[The emperor has no clothes]

Those parts fishes can be confusing at times. I'm not sure if that's it or not. But here are some pretty clear pics of where the 3 o-rings are. Also, don't forget the thrust washer.

http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/Elusive%203rd%20O-Ring.htm

[mello dude]

Those parts fishes can be confusing at times. I'm not sure if that's it or not. But here are some pretty clear pics of where the 3 o-rings are. Also, don't forget the thrust washer.

http://www.valkyrieriders.com/shoptalk/Elusive%203rd%20O-Ring.htm

From your pics, I have extras of the first 2 o-rings and thrust washer, but I'm unsure on trying to ID the 3rd one for replacement. The pic in the fische looks undersized.   Relatively simple to find when it's apart .

Update note -- the part number is listed in the 3rd ring article -- DUH! lol 

[Chrisj CMA]

@John - just read your powerpoint on the rear wheel service. Great photos and instructions. Kudos to you sir. -- Looks like I missed the 3rd O-ring. - Ok, the rear is coming back apart. Diff and shaft too...

3rd O-ring looks like #34 on the fische?  

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

Btw- how long is your red shock bar you made ? Great idea, I may as copy it.



Thanks again.  

I'll measure it tonight. I believe its 10" hole center to center

[Chrisj CMA]

@John - just read your powerpoint on the rear wheel service. Great photos and instructions. Kudos to you sir. -- Looks like I missed the 3rd O-ring. - Ok, the rear is coming back apart. Diff and shaft too...

3rd O-ring looks like #34 on the fische?  

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

Btw- how long is your red shock bar you made ? Great idea, I may as copy it.



Thanks again.  

I'll measure it tonight. I believe its 10" hole center to center

The one in the slide show is 9.75 center to center. I have since made a longer one that works better with stock pipes it's an inch longer. The 10" would be all you need

[mello dude]

@John - just read your powerpoint on the rear wheel service. Great photos and instructions. Kudos to you sir. -- Looks like I missed the 3rd O-ring. - Ok, the rear is coming back apart. Diff and shaft too...

3rd O-ring looks like #34 on the fische?  

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

Thanks Chris
Btw- how long is your red shock bar you made ? Great idea, I may as copy it.



Thanks again.  

I'll measure it tonight. I believe its 10" hole center to center

The one in the slide show is 9.75 center to center. I have since made a longer one that works better with stock pipes it's an inch longer. The 10" would be all you need

Thank you!  

Um, Sry I was mixing you up with John... 

[Chrisj CMA]

@John - just read your powerpoint on the rear wheel service. Great photos and instructions. Kudos to you sir. -- Looks like I missed the 3rd O-ring. - Ok, the rear is coming back apart. Diff and shaft too...

3rd O-ring looks like #34 on the fische?  

https://www.partzilla.com/catalog/honda/motorcycle/1999/gl1500c-a-valkyrie/final-driven-gear

Thanks Chris
Btw- how long is your red shock bar you made ? Great idea, I may as copy it.



Thanks again.  

I'll measure it tonight. I believe its 10" hole center to center

The one in the slide show is 9.75 center to center. I have since made a longer one that works better with stock pipes it's an inch longer. The 10" would be all you need

Thank you!  

Um, Sry I was mixing you up with John... 

Tis ok. Glad it's still helpful

[mello dude]

Ok - Did it...Had 2 of the 4 studs come loose instead of the bolts. Got new studs on the way to fix. Yay Partzilla..
But what now? (yeah I am a relative rookie on drives for shaft bikes) -
- I have pulled on the drive shaft and it doesnt want much to come loose. I looked in the FSM  for hints. Also, reinstalling the driveshaft into the U joint doesnt look like much fun to get it alined and pushed together home. .. The bike only has 20K miles on it so I really dont want to teardown any farther...
--What more hints do you have..... Many thanks in advance.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Ok - Did it...Had 2 of the 4 studs come loose instead of the bolts. Got new studs on the way to fix. Yay Partzilla..
But what now? (yeah I am a relative rookie on drives for shaft bikes) -
- I have pulled on the drive shaft and it doesnt want much to come loose. I looked in the FSM  for hints. Also, reinstalling the driveshaft into the U joint doesnt look like much fun to get it alined and pushed together home. .. The bike only has 20K miles on it so I really dont want to teardown any farther...
--What more hints do you have..... Many thanks in advance.

Give it a quick, sharp tug while holding the shaft upright. Have something soft underneath the pumpkin to cushion it's fall. There is a snap ring on the end that is impeding its removal, but a sharp tug will do it.

[mellowyellow#7933]

To re-install driveshaft to u-joint lift swing arm to horizontal or slightly above. May have to rotate shaft a little to align splines but should slide right in.

[sixlow]

Ok - Did it...Had 2 of the 4 studs come loose instead of the bolts. Got new studs on the way to fix. Yay Partzilla..
But what now? (yeah I am a relative rookie on drives for shaft bikes) -
- I have pulled on the drive shaft and it doesnt want much to come loose. I looked in the FSM  for hints. Also, reinstalling the driveshaft into the U joint doesnt look like much fun to get it alined and pushed together home. .. The bike only has 20K miles on it so I really dont want to teardown any farther...
--What more hints do you have..... Many thanks in advance.

Big BF video


http://youtu.be/Y6QUcCxOcPE

[Rosie]

As Mello Yellow said, when you go to put it back together LIFT the swing arm and it will go together easy.

[mello dude]

Big BF video


http://youtu.be/Y6QUcCxOcPE

Videos by the mime mechanic... lol.    great job! and thanks! ...... you should do more.  

[mello dude]

To re-install driveshaft to u-joint lift swing arm to horizontal or slightly above. May have to rotate shaft a little to align splines but should slide right in.

As Mello Yellow said, when you go to put it back together LIFT the swing arm and it will go together easy.

Thanks for the tip... for some reason, it reminded me of shooting a foul shot at basketball. It might go in or it might not.  - I'm waiting for some parts to arrive, so we'll see how it goes...

[Chrisj CMA]

What works for me is to sit directly behind the opening of the swing arm that the shaft goes in. You have a better sense of aim. Then if it doesn't go right in shake the final drive left right and up and down a little more violently that you might think while applying firm consistent pressure on the back of the final drive.  It will go in quick that way.  

[mello dude]

Got everything regreased, molyed, re - oringed and ready to go..
But ever struggling to get the drive shaft into the U joint.... AAAAAWWWWW!
Lots of fine words said...

Ok more hints please. 

[Bone]

With a light look into the tube and see how the end of the u joint is laying you might need to alter your attack.

[mello dude]

With a light look into the tube and see how the end of the u joint is laying you might need to alter your attack.

Agreed --- a step back and thinking wtf is going on.... .I added a scissor  jack to help balance the drive assembly.... before I was trying to balance on my knees...

Then shaking the sh!t out of it....
Pure stubborness wins! -- Got it! Whew!  A long 2 hours...