Promise not to laugh...anyone own a Prius?

[therapist]

I am not a tree hugging yuppie (not that there is anything wrong with that) but these gas
prices are bugging me...as much the principle as the expense.  Test drove a new Prius and the
techno-geek in me liked it.  So, no flaming comments please from those who have never driven one.  If you own one, please give me a review.  I put a refundable deposit on it and told the guy I would sleep on the decision, so need to make a move tomorrow.

Thanks

[T-Bird]

I always think about what a trade difference would be....then figure how many gallons of fuel it would buy. It doesn't pan out for me. Do the math.

[sugerbear]

don't personally own one but, i like the car, i like the way it looks, and have talked to people who do own one. haven't heard ONE bad thing about them.

if you like it, go for it, and don't let anyone make your mind up for you( unless their paying for it)

that's my opinion and worth just what you paid for it

[Michael K (Az.)]

Ron, I think Thunderbolt has one, maybe. Go to the Fl. board and give him a shout.

[solo1]

I know little about them but Consumer Reports says that the battery pak in the Prius is lasting longer than originally thought.

However, my thoughts are this.  For an increase of about 12 mpg more with the Prius over most standard fuel efficient cars, is it work the extra complexity and higher costs down the road.?

In the past I had a Toyota Echo (manual) that got 42 mpg on the highway.  Absolutely nothing to do with your question, tho, LOL.

wayne

[Bobbo]

If you do a lot of start and stop city driving, hybrids like the Prius can save a lot of fuel.  On the open road, there isn't much difference than many other economy cars.  There is a conversion kit that makes it run on electric only if you stay under 50 MPH and 40 miles.  I've heard this might be standard in newer models.

[MarkT]

The Prius is all about feeling good about doing your part to save the world.  The actual numbers don't work.  You also have added HUGE complexity to your ride.  Might not be a problem if you get a long warranty and unload it before the warranty and the batteries run out.  BTW, the saving-the-world thing - that doesn't pan out either, at least for plug-in hybrids (which I understand they are working on, for the Prius) & all-electrics.  The electricity comes from coal-fired plants mostly, which are WORSE for the planet.  Along with the carbon pollution to mine the coal and freight it to the plants.

My brother has one.  A bleeding heart liberal if there ever was one.  A defrocked campus pastor (for boinking a married member of his congregation - oh yeah, minor point - he was married too), hypocrite, Vietnam draft dodger and "proud of being a coward".  (His words, not mine.  Though he's right on that.)  He said he was going to buy a Prius.  I said then I have to buy a Boss Hoss to make up for him.  Carbon Credits and all that.  And he did.  

If you have a good reason to get the car, but would rather not be seen as smug and high-minded, you can always park down the street, get really dark tinted windows and wear one of those Groucho-style  glasses-nose-mustache disguises.  Believe me - you WILL be seen as smug.  

There's a reason they named it Prius.  Appropriate to re-spell it  "Pious".  

pious (pì´es) adjective
1.   Having or exhibiting religious reverence; earnestly compliant in the observance of religion; devout. See synonyms at RELIGIOUS.
2.   a. Marked by conspicuous devoutness: a pious and holy observation. b. Marked by false devoutness; solemnly hypocritical: a pious fraud.
3.   Devotional: pious readings.
4.   Professing or exhibiting a strict, traditional sense of virtue and morality; high-minded.
5.   Commendable; worthy: a pious effort.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition copyright © 1992 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from InfoSoft International, Inc. All rights reserved.


Now I'm gonna tell you how I REALLY feel.

Actually I sort of applaud those who care about the planet enough to try to do something about it.  I just don't think the Pious is the answer.

[Thunderbolt]

It now has 52000 + miles on it.  I've changed the oil every 5000 miles and have recently put a new set of tires on it.  No problems at all.   I don't remember the package no., but mine doesn't have the Nav package and super duper everything, but does have cruise and an input for your Ipod.  If you don't drive over 20 miles to work, you won't be able to justify it monetarily, I drive 30 miles each way 5 days a week.  
Still wierd that it shuts down at traffic lights.  Also the transmission doesn't shift, it just goes........kinda like a golf cart.  I have gone a lot faster on the Valk than I have in the Prius.!!!  
If I keep it under 60 and drive like Grandpa (wait I am a Grandpa) I get 50-52 mpg.  If I mix in some Interstate driving, it drops a couple of mpg.  I imagine if you did Interstate all the time, you would be around 40-42.
The batteries are warrantied for 8 years or 100,000 miles.  I heard that they were down around $1500 or so.  I have done all the maintenance kinda like the Valk, just oil and an air filter.  You are supposed to change the coolant for the inverter cooler at 60,000, I might let them do that, not sure.
Any other questions email me.  If gas keeps going up, it may be a good choice after all.
Prius Chat is the best board I have found on the net.

[Brad]

I like you am concerned about the high price of fuel.  I am considering a VW tdi.  The hybrids scare me with all the extra electronics and the expensive batteries.  Gets great MPG and has a real engine.

[big d]

 i am in the process of possibly buying a new car also for fuel economy. the car i am looking at is the volkswagen jette deisel. my brother just got one a year ago and is getting 50-55 mpg. i am shocked he can drive that reserved.(he is a bit of a lunatic driver. very hard on them). i have driven vw's since my '97 jetta and love them. after the jetta i bought an '04 passat and when that was rear ended i got an '07 passat.  not only are they reliable but hold resale value. the other thing i worry about with these hybryds is what happens to the batteries after they are no longer good, land fill?, so much for the environment.  just my  $.02. what ever you decide i hope you enjoy the vehicle.

[six2go #152]

Why would/should anyone laugh? Rides, either 4 wheel or 2 are a personal choice. I drive and ride what I darn well please and if someone has a problem with it they can just CRAM IT. 

[eric in md]

sounds good , just buy a honda civic its get 35 around town  i pass all the gas  stations some times i think it makes gas .. also honda just can out with a power wheels to think its called  honda crz

[Marcel]

Gas needs to at least be 5 dollars a Gallon to make out financially.

So keep that in mind.

A good 4 cylinder anything beats the kind of prices they are asking for those.

Oh by the way screw the planet, let's ride our gas sucking Valks.

Cause it makes me feel good.

[therapist]

I do not have one but a friends father has one in GA.  Great ar for the dad since he drives all over and it has paid him back.  Problem is that he needs new batteries at the tune of $5 THOUSAND dollars plus install.  There goes the savings.  I rode in it with two other guys and that thing barely had enough power to haul us.  Scary. 

I looked into the battery thing, 8 year warranty and $3200 for a new one, but they expect it to be much cheaper in the future as that battery type is replaced by lithium.  The 2010 has more power and a special button for passing...still no Valkyrie 

[therapist]

I'm not trying to save the world, just the money in my wallet 

The Prius is all about feeling good about doing your part to save the world.  The actual numbers don't work.  You also have added HUGE complexity to your ride.  Might not be a problem if you get a long warranty and unload it before the warranty and the batteries run out.  BTW, the saving-the-world thing - that doesn't pan out either, at least for plug-in hybrids (which I understand they are working on, for the Prius) & all-electrics.  The electricity comes from coal-fired plants mostly, which are WORSE for the planet.  Along with the carbon pollution to mine the coal and freight it to the plants.

My brother has one.  A bleeding heart liberal if there ever was one.  A defrocked campus pastor (for boinking a married member of his congregation - oh yeah, minor point - he was married too), hypocrite, Vietnam draft dodger and "proud of being a coward".  (His words, not mine.  Though he's right on that.)  He said he was going to buy a Prius.  I said then I have to buy a Boss Hoss to make up for him.  Carbon Credits and all that.  And he did.  

If you have a good reason to get the car, but would rather not be seen as smug and high-minded, you can always park down the street, get really dark tinted windows and wear one of those Groucho-style  glasses-nose-mustache disguises.  Believe me - you WILL be seen as smug.  

There's a reason they named it Prius.  Appropriate to re-spell it  "Pious".  

pious (pì´es) adjective
1.   Having or exhibiting religious reverence; earnestly compliant in the observance of religion; devout. See synonyms at RELIGIOUS.
2.   a. Marked by conspicuous devoutness: a pious and holy observation. b. Marked by false devoutness; solemnly hypocritical: a pious fraud.
3.   Devotional: pious readings.
4.   Professing or exhibiting a strict, traditional sense of virtue and morality; high-minded.
5.   Commendable; worthy: a pious effort.

The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Third Edition copyright © 1992 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Electronic version licensed from InfoSoft International, Inc. All rights reserved.


Now I'm gonna tell you how I REALLY feel.

Actually I sort of applaud those who care about the planet enough to try to do something about it.  I just don't think the Pious is the answer.

[sheets]

Company car; 98,000 miles on a first generation Prius. Not a single hiccup. I've never zero'd out the mpg history. After nine years, lifetime average bounces between 45 and 46 mpg. All kinds of driving... mountainous hill climbing roads to city traffic to hours of cruise control set at 65-70. Kind of hard on tires though. My only issue is the small tires... feels like driving a go-cart at times. If it had slightly larger wheels would make a difference in handling on two lane roads and rural freeways. Overall, I like it and would strongly consider purchasing one for my own personal use. Ymmv, 

[highcountry]

No Prius, but I have a 2002 Corolla with 125K on the clock and it gets 35-40 mpg.  Point being, check the difference in price between the two cars ($7-10K) and the gas savings and how long it will take to recoup the difference in savings.  Also, maintenance on hybrid especially brakes in much higher.  Another point, depends on what kind of driving you will be doing.  The electric motors aren't much help on the highway, the savings comes from driving around town.

OTOH, there are other considerations such the environment, greenie status, etc.

[Valkahuna]

If you live in a state where it snows regularly, Hybrids are not such a great idea. Electric motors develope max torque at even very low rpm. So,  on initial takeoff, on slippery surface, the wheels spin. But... the traction control/engine management system notices that the wheels are spinning, so it applies brakes, and slows things down.

Now the car can't get over the mound of snow it created in front of the driven wheels. Google it, and you will find many reports by confused drivers trying to come up with all the wrong reasons of why their cars don't do well in snow. I liked one that I read, where the owner said something to the effect that the Prius did not do well in snow becuase it was designed to be efficient, and therefore it had to be aerodynamic (all true) so therefore it had a smooth belly pan (also true) that made the car ride up onto snow with no weight left on the tires. Now, that may be true if you had six inches plus of "heavy" snow on the ground. But even on small accumulations the performance in snow is not good.

I came really close to buying either a Camry or Altima Hybrid since I drive a lot. I know two dealers that sell Nissan and Toyota that I have done a good bit of business with. The point is that they knew that I would buy something from them if I did not buy the Hybrids. In both cases they told me that they generally just "push" the Hybrids when they have to move vehicles to clear the lots after snow storms. It's all because of the instant torque that is a characteristic of the electric motor, and the fact that all the Hybrids start off in "Electric" mode.

The cars are trendy, but as others have said, there are alternatives that do as well or better if all things are considered. Just my opinion, but I did a lot of research on the subject.

[therapist]

Thanks for the info, that was what I was really looking for, actual owner experience.  This is a leftover, new 2010.  It isn't the top of the line either, but has everything I need.  They are offering 0.9% financing for 60 months and a good price.  It was driven in the Cherry Festival parade by a Blue Angels Pilot, but is still considered new as it's never been titled.  300 miles on the odometer.  I guess I just am in awe of the technology involved, plus the display is like playing a video game, with the winner being whoever gets the best MPG (which would be me and my bank account).  

The dealer is 60 miles away but if I have any issues under warranty, they will send a car to be left as a loaner, take mine and fix it and bring it back.  Plus 2 years of oil changes/tire rotation type stuff is included (I would have to take it there for that stuff).  

Still haven't decided...time to sleep on it (also looking at the Chevy Cruze Eco).

It now has 52000 + miles on it.  I've changed the oil every 5000 miles and have recently put a new set of tires on it.  No problems at all.   I don't remember the package no., but mine doesn't have the Nav package and super duper everything, but does have cruise and an input for your Ipod.  If you don't drive over 20 miles to work, you won't be able to justify it monetarily, I drive 30 miles each way 5 days a week.  






Still wierd that it shuts down at traffic lights.  Also the transmission doesn't shift, it just goes........kinda like a golf cart.  I have gone a lot faster on the Valk than I have in the Prius.!!!  
If I keep it under 60 and drive like Grandpa (wait I am a Grandpa) I get 50-52 mpg.  If I mix in some Interstate driving, it drops a couple of mpg.  I imagine if you did Interstate all the time, you would be around 40-42.
The batteries are warrantied for 8 years or 100,000 miles.  I heard that they were down around $1500 or so.  I have done all the maintenance kinda like the Valk, just oil and an air filter.  You are supposed to change the coolant for the inverter cooler at 60,000, I might let them do that, not sure.
Any other questions email me.  If gas keeps going up, it may be a good choice after all.
Prius Chat is the best board I have found on the net.

[John Schmidt]

Lady next door has one, loves it. Makes trips to Michigan twice a year in it and raves about the economy. When she first got it, I had to tease a bit....told her there was a problem with electric overload on the horn and turn signals. Said every time you honk the horn the car slows down and with the turns blinking it will surge. I could only keep a straight face for a few seconds.

[therapist]

This was one of my main considerations, living her in Northern MI.  My research showed that most owners had few issues with snow, and if they did, they switched to snow tires and it was solved.  The dealership I dealt with even told me they have the rims and tires in stock, that many people just do the switch every winter.  It's really not any different than any front wheel car, other than it is lower to the ground and uses low rolling resistance tires, which are known for good mileage, not good traction.  I'm trying to do my homework on this, but always end up going with what my gut tells me.  I do have some concerns but everyone should take a test drive in a 2010 or 2011, they really are pretty cool.

If you live in a state where it snows regularly, Hybrids are not such a great idea. Electric motors develope max torque at even very low rpm. So,  on initial takeoff, on slippery surface, the wheels spin. But... the traction control/engine management system notices that the wheels are spinning, so it applies brakes, and slows things down.

Now the car can't get over the mound of snow it created in front of the driven wheels. Google it, and you will find many reports by confused drivers trying to come up with all the wrong reasons of why their cars don't do well in snow. I liked one that I read, where the owner said something to the effect that the Prius did not do well in snow becuase it was designed to be efficient, and therefore it had to be aerodynamic (all true) so therefore it had a smooth belly pan (also true) that made the car ride up onto snow with no weight left on the tires. Now, that may be true if you had six inches plus of "heavy" snow on the ground. But even on small accumulations the performance in snow is not good.

I came really close to buying either a Camry or Altima Hybrid since I drive a lot. I know two dealers that sell Nissan and Toyota that I have done a good bit of business with. The point is that they knew that I would buy something from them if I did not buy the Hybrids. In both cases they told me that they generally just "push" the Hybrids when they have to move vehicles to clear the lots after snow storms. It's all because of the instant torque that is a characteristic of the electric motor, and the fact that all the Hybrids start off in "Electric" mode.

The cars are trendy, but as others have said, there are alternatives that do as well or better if all things are considered. Just my opinion, but I did a lot of research on the subject.

[Bigmac2]

We have had our Prius sine Feb 06  have had no problems with it just put some gas in it and go oh we did have to put some tires on it  changed the wipers once too we will wait till we get closer to the end of the battery warranty 8 year /100000 mi before we trade it in for another one

[sheets]

as an aside...  I've referred to my company car as the "golf cart" all along. 0 to 10 mph in city traffic... on battery power. No noise -- just go. I've driven over my two separate mountains (10 miles each; up then down - of 6 -- 8%) a number of times during 2 -- 4 inches of fresh falling snow, not plowed, with no traction devices installed. I was actually quite surprised that I made it with no spin-outs and getting stuck. Slowly motor along with no drastic changes in acceleration or deceleration ("B" for brake)... and all is good in the 'hood. Yrmv,   

[Valkahuna]

It's a lot different than another front wheel drive car. It's electric. Also, any time  a stealer tells you it's no problem, since they have wheels and tires in stock, that tells you that there is a problem. Just saying. Also, are you reading where all the guys are saying that they will trade it when new batteries are needed? How good are all those dead batteries for the environment?  Just another issue - hazzardous waste. Funny how the greenies won't build nuclear power plants because of waste products, yet embrace this "stop gap" technology in spite of the same end issue.

This was one of my main considerations, living her in Northern MI.  My research showed that most owners had few issues with snow, and if they did, they switched to snow tires and it was solved.  The dealership I dealt with even told me they have the rims and tires in stock, that many people just do the switch every winter.  It's really not any different than any front wheel car, other than it is lower to the ground and uses low rolling resistance tires, which are known for good mileage, not good traction.  I'm trying to do my homework on this, but always end up going with what my gut tells me.  I do have some concerns but everyone should take a test drive in a 2010 or 2011, they really are pretty cool.

If you live in a state where it snows regularly, Hybrids are not such a great idea. Electric motors develope max torque at even very low rpm. So,  on initial takeoff, on slippery surface, the wheels spin. But... the traction control/engine management system notices that the wheels are spinning, so it applies brakes, and slows things down.

Now the car can't get over the mound of snow it created in front of the driven wheels. Google it, and you will find many reports by confused drivers trying to come up with all the wrong reasons of why their cars don't do well in snow. I liked one that I read, where the owner said something to the effect that the Prius did not do well in snow becuase it was designed to be efficient, and therefore it had to be aerodynamic (all true) so therefore it had a smooth belly pan (also true) that made the car ride up onto snow with no weight left on the tires. Now, that may be true if you had six inches plus of "heavy" snow on the ground. But even on small accumulations the performance in snow is not good.

I came really close to buying either a Camry or Altima Hybrid since I drive a lot. I know two dealers that sell Nissan and Toyota that I have done a good bit of business with. The point is that they knew that I would buy something from them if I did not buy the Hybrids. In both cases they told me that they generally just "push" the Hybrids when they have to move vehicles to clear the lots after snow storms. It's all because of the instant torque that is a characteristic of the electric motor, and the fact that all the Hybrids start off in "Electric" mode.

The cars are trendy, but as others have said, there are alternatives that do as well or better if all things are considered. Just my opinion, but I did a lot of research on the subject.

[Brad]

Volkswagen Jetta Meets Prius commercial - funny

[Magellon]

I don't own one but I have driven many of them. I was a Toyota service advisor when the 1st and 2nd gen prius came out. One of the biggest things i recall was people having to change the way they drove to get the BEST mpg, just like Thunderbolt says.

I even had many of them get EXTREME. They would play games like, how long can I drive though the Safeway parking lot before the gas motor kicks in. Or the best was when the low fuel light came on, many people thought it would be like there old gas car and could get another maybe 30 miles before they would run out of gas, but the 1st gens once you run out of gas or shortly after the light comes on you would get maybe 1 or 2 miles on the battery thats it game over call AAA.

In Toyota school (yes they sent us to school) we were always told the Hybrid battery is good for the life of the car and the warranty is 8 years or 100k miles, NOT the battery needs replacing at 8yr or 100k like so many people have asked me.

Sheets was right about the tires, they were junk on the 1st gens. Had a lot of heated discussions about those. Sheets check the forms, I've had several customers change tires and rims but don't recall what size they changed to.

I rarely change the brakes on ANY hybrids, most times when I had to it was because people rode the brakes and overheated them  and that will warp ANY rotor, hybrid or non.

 Also Thunderbolt I would take it to the dealer for the coolant change, just ask them to do ONLY that. The system can be very difficult to burp all the air out, I'v had COME BACKS because the tech did not do it right.

You may also try to RENT a Prius. Our dealership has a rental dept. See if your local dealer has one and rent it for a day or 2, then you'll get a good feeling of what its really like to drive.

I also agree with six2go, If you like the car or bike who cares what anyone else thinks, buy it. Drive it.

Gas mileage is varies widely. I've always seen the stop and go traffic and around town drivers get the best. Commuters do ok but not as good.

Bottom line is, there were and still are people who LOVE and HATE the PRIUS. I think it is a good car and that TOYOTA makes a good product even with all the recalls they had last year. I've had many of them and still have a 91 corolla with only 125k on it and my son drives a 93 4Runner, (gutless wonder that it is) with 225k.

And as for solo1's Echo, I have several techs who would buy that car in a hart beat real cheap and use it for a commuter.

Good Luck with your decision.
Magellon

[RoadKill]

My mom has had one for about 50k. She is happy therefore the rest of us love it,'Cause if Momma aint happy.......

[Dogg]

I still wouldnt own one, nor ride in one. I refused to even pull one in the shop for an oil change cuz its "ghey"...


but, that just me. more power to ya. gimme a jetta tdi anyday that hybrid crap is for the rainbow sticker loving happys wearing crocs...

[GiG]

Ron:

There are many reasons not to own a Prius:

_You live in a small town, not much traffic. Hybrids are more attractive for city dwellers in congested areas.
_When you travel on the freeway to Wyandotte, there will be no advantage to have a hybrid.
_The MAIN Reason: Toyota stole the battery technology from my former company. Every time a Prius is sold, Totota has to pay a royalty to Cobasys, Inc (an American company) for stealing the Nickle Metal Hydride battery technology. The royaties were awarded through the courts in lieu of terminating the Prius. This has not been widely reported, but is well documented. Toyota is an extremely scummy corporate citizen, and their safety cover-ups and corporate theft are just now coming to light.
There may be an advantage if you lived in NYC, Boston, or LA, but rewarding and encouraging the Japanese to steal our hard earned technology is just wrong.

[therapist]

If I posted that I traded in my Valk for an electric scooter would you laugh?  This kind of felt
like the same thing 

Why would/should anyone laugh? Rides, either 4 wheel or 2 are a personal choice. I drive and ride what I darn well please and if someone has a problem with it they can just CRAM IT. 

[therapist]

Wow...autohomophobia...that's a new one 

I still wouldnt own one, nor ride in one. I refused to even pull one in the shop for an oil change cuz its "ghey"...


but, that just me. more power to ya. gimme a jetta tdi anyday that hybrid crap is for the rainbow sticker loving happys wearing crocs...

[therapist]

That is very interesting about stealing the technology.  I also read where they stole some stuff
from Honda hybrid technology.  That's not cool.  But, as to the buy American deal, I tried that for years and got to know all the guys in the service department by first name.  When I had a few foreign cars over the years, mostly trouble-free driving.  I am hoping the American boys woke up after their near demise and have made changes.  I do like what I read about the Chevy Cruze and may test drive one today.   My wife was not real excited about the Prius, all that high tech stuff put her off a little.  So, most likely, I will nix the deal.  Thanks to everyone for your input!

Ron:

There are many reasons not to own a Prius:

_You live in a small town, not much traffic. Hybrids are more attractive for city dwellers in congested areas.
_When you travel on the freeway to Wyandotte, there will be no advantage to have a hybrid.
_The MAIN Reason: Toyota stole the battery technology from my former company. Every time a Prius is sold, Totota has to pay a royalty to Cobasys, Inc (an American company) for stealing the Nickle Metal Hydride battery technology. The royaties were awarded through the courts in lieu of terminating the Prius. This has not been widely reported, but is well documented. Toyota is an extremely scummy corporate citizen, and their safety cover-ups and corporate theft are just now coming to light.
There may be an advantage if you lived in NYC, Boston, or LA, but rewarding and encouraging the Japanese to steal our hard earned technology is just wrong.

[NCGhostrider]

Been in a few, they are neat cars.   Not my preference, the math doesn't work as mentioned above.  Also, if you are worried about carbon foot print, do some some further research, see what is actually involved with the car, the disposal of the batteries, what happens when you wreck one etc.   I don't have an opinion on this part, just offering a suggestion... a lot of things aren't as good as they seem ecologically.

A side fact, first responders have had to learn to properly deal with the hybrid/electric power cars, they represent new problems when they wreck, and the voltages are of course lethal.  

Hell, my buick gets in the 30's on the highway, and I am large and in charge...lmao!!  

Buy what you want, its your car!!!!   They are like opinions, in most cases...


C

[Ice]

I am Sorry guys, I know this is a serious post, but as Peanut said, "when a Prius drives by, the engine screams, Immmmmmmmmmgggggaaaahhhhhhyyyyyyyyyy" and thats all I know about the Prius

[Dogg]

LMAO@ ICE!!!! so true, peanut is the REASOn I wouldnt own one.lol. besides, wait til someone screws up your lugnuts and you have to buy those special auto-grounding lug nuts just so you can drive it again!! man I tell ya...

[fudgie]

A coworkers has a Ford Fuc*us for his 120 mile commute to work. He hates it but gets better mpg then his f-250 4x4.

I for one would never own a car. I'm a truck guy. Dad had a old camry that got good mpg. He recently bought a 2008 Mercedis (which does not fit his hunting/farm/rail road worker type) and gets far better mpg then the Camry. It has a 100k mile warrenty and was thousands less then a new Buick SUV.

[six2go #152]

If I posted that I traded in my Valk for an electric scooter would you laugh?  This kind of felt
like the same thing 
Nope, not at all. I would figure you were doing what needed to be done at the time.

[NITRO]

I like you am concerned about the high price of fuel.  I am considering a VW tdi.  The hybrids scare me with all the extra electronics and the expensive batteries.  Gets great MPG and has a real engine.

+1 there. I think I'll go with the Jetta SportWagon TDI next. I don't understand why more makers don't sell diesels.

[RoadKill]

I like you am concerned about the high price of fuel.  I am considering a VW tdi.  The hybrids scare me with all the extra electronics and the expensive batteries.  Gets great MPG and has a real engine.

+1 there. I think I'll go with the Jetta SportWagon TDI next. I don't understand why more makers don't sell diesels.

+2   I would LOVE a 1985 Toyota diesel truck as a daily driver...Never sold in the U.S.! Spoiled ass Americans wouldnt buy them and the EPA would have had a coronary at the thought of it ! 

[therapist]

Just realized i never put "closure" to this thread.  In February of 2011, we bought a new Malibu LTZ.  We have had 50K of trouble free driving ever since. It was lousy in the snow until I got rid of the "low rolling resistance" OEM tires.  Smooth, comfortable on trips, averages 26/27 MPG in mostly city driving.  However, gas prices soared shortly after we made our decision.  I hate to think how much money we could have saved with the Prius.