I heard an interview with Paul Ryan

[musclehead]

humble beginings, very humble. he worked at McDonalds, painted houses, worked as a fitness trainer.

he's one of us......  scary for the left I'm sure.

[Patrick]

' Fitness trainer ' ,, he ain't one of me !!    .. I was concerned when he was first announced,, but,, the more I watch the more I like him..

[Bob E.]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

[Gear Jammer]

Something he's "NOT" is Obama or Biden 

[musclehead]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

"very wealthy"? after his dad died his mom went to school got a degree started a business and grew it from there. how many VERY wealthy kids can you name that had to work at MickeyD's to make ends meet? 

I'll take anyone who has worked for a living over someone who said working in the private sector was like being behind enemy lines (Obama)

that's why one of my original choices was Cain, his dad  worked 3 jobs until he could afford to live on 2.

[Trynt]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

Ryan attended St. Mary's Catholic School in Janesville WI throught 7th grade. While Catholic schools in the Upper Midwest are indeed private few (who are familiar with them) would consider them elitist or necessarily superior to area public schools.  He attended Joseph A. Craig High School which is a public school. He attended college at Miami Univ (Ohio) which also public. Ryan's great-grandfather, in 1884, founded a earth moving company now known as Ryan Incorporated Central. However Paul's "branch" of the family has not been involved in the company. So while Ryan may or may not have "very wealthy" relatives, his immediate family was not among them. Janesville is a small rural WI city of about 64K and is not part of a larger metropolitan area. So declaring his childhood neighborhood as "affluent" certainly doesn't mean Park Avenue in this instance. I'm thinking Mayberry may also have an affluent hood.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_A._Craig_High_School
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_University
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janesville,_Wisconsin

[G-Man]

Something he's "NOT" is Obama or Biden 

[SANDMAN5]

Something he's "NOT" is Obama or Biden 

[Bob E.]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

"very wealthy"? after his dad died his mom went to school got a degree started a business and grew it from there. how many VERY wealthy kids can you name that had to work at MickeyD's to make ends meet? 

I'll take anyone who has worked for a living over someone who said working in the private sector was like being behind enemy lines (Obama)

that's why one of my original choices was Cain, his dad  worked 3 jobs until he could afford to live on 2.

Well, here's the link to the "family business" for starters.  http://ryancentral.com/

And while his immediate family isn't directly involved in the business, you can't tell me that his great grandfather didn't take care of all his kids and grandkids when he passed away.  Furthermore, his grandfather was a federal attorney with political ties to President Coolidge.  His dad was an attorney as well.  And they lived in an affluent town where the median household income is about 50% higher than the town where I grew up.  Yeah, a real "blue-collar" upbringing.    Plus, I'm real sure he was supporting his entire family on that $3.25/hr he was probably making at McD's back then.  Just because his mom made him get a job to learn some responsibility and earn some spending money while in high school (a good thing, if you ask me), that doesn't mean that they were just barely scraping by, or that he "had to work to make ends meet".  One clue is the fact that, according to him, he was able to save all of his SS Survivor benefits to pay for his college.  A friend of my mom's lost her husband with a young teen-age son.  And they barely got by until they eventually had to sell their house and move in with her adult daughter.

Furthermore, I don't consider highschool and college jobs "working for a living".  Sure, it's work and it's a valuable learning experience.  I did it too.  But it's more like "working for party money."   I've had a job since the week I turned 16 and was able to get hired, even earlier than that working for my grandfather on the farm.  And continued working in college.  The only year I didn't work was my freshman year because Penn State required that I live in the dorms and didn't allow freshmen to have a car, although I still worked on breaks and summers.  But I sure wasn't supporting myself on it, let alone a family.  And other than that, Ryan went straight to DC and got involved in politics as soon as he graduated college.  So, I'm not ready to don him with any "private sector man of the year" awards.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing Ryan for any of this.  It is commendable that he was able to be successful even after tragically losing his father.  But to suggest that he had a "very
humble beginnings" is just a fantasy.

[Bob E.]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

Ryan attended St. Mary's Catholic School in Janesville WI throught 7th grade. While Catholic schools in the Upper Midwest are indeed private few (who are familiar with them) would consider them elitist or necessarily superior to area public schools.  He attended Joseph A. Craig High School which is a public school. He attended college at Miami Univ (Ohio) which also public. Ryan's great-grandfather, in 1884, founded a earth moving company now known as Ryan Incorporated Central. However Paul's "branch" of the family has not been involved in the company. So while Ryan may or may not have "very wealthy" relatives, his immediate family was not among them. Janesville is a small rural WI city of about 64K and is not part of a larger metropolitan area. So declaring his childhood neighborhood as "affluent" certainly doesn't mean Park Avenue in this instance. I'm thinking Mayberry may also have an affluent hood.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_A._Craig_High_School
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_University
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janesville,_Wisconsin

Hi Trynt!  Catholic schools around here aren't cheap.  My stepdaughter's was up to about $3800 a year when we pulled her out.  And I saw a news report where they showed his childhood home and his neighborhood.  It was pretty nice.  Plus as I already posted, according to wiki, Janesville had a median household income nearly 50% higher than that of the town I grew up in.  And I didn't grow up in the slums.  While he might not have been super rich, he was far from poor...or humble.

[musclehead]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

"very wealthy"? after his dad died his mom went to school got a degree started a business and grew it from there. how many VERY wealthy kids can you name that had to work at MickeyD's to make ends meet? 

I'll take anyone who has worked for a living over someone who said working in the private sector was like being behind enemy lines (Obama)

that's why one of my original choices was Cain, his dad  worked 3 jobs until he could afford to live on 2.

Well, here's the link to the "family business" for starters.  http://ryancentral.com/

And while his immediate family isn't directly involved in the business, you can't tell me that his great grandfather didn't take care of all his kids and grandkids when he passed away.  Furthermore, his grandfather was a federal attorney with political ties to President Coolidge.  His dad was an attorney as well.  And they lived in an affluent town where the median household income is about 50% higher than the town where I grew up.  Yeah, a real "blue-collar" upbringing.    Plus, I'm real sure he was supporting his entire family on that $3.25/hr he was probably making at McD's back then.  Just because his mom made him get a job to learn some responsibility and earn some spending money while in high school (a good thing, if you ask me), that doesn't mean that they were just barely scraping by, or that he "had to work to make ends meet".  One clue is the fact that, according to him, he was able to save all of his SS Survivor benefits to pay for his college.  A friend of my mom's lost her husband with a young teen-age son.  And they barely got by until they eventually had to sell their house and move in with her adult daughter.

Furthermore, I don't consider highschool and college jobs "working for a living".  Sure, it's work and it's a valuable learning experience.  I did it too.  But it's more like "working for party money."   I've had a job since the week I turned 16 and was able to get hired, even earlier than that working for my grandfather on the farm.  And continued working in college.  The only year I didn't work was my freshman year because Penn State required that I live in the dorms and didn't allow freshmen to have a car, although I still worked on breaks and summers.  But I sure wasn't supporting myself on it, let alone a family.  And other than that, Ryan went straight to DC and got involved in politics as soon as he graduated college.  So, I'm not ready to don him with any "private sector man of the year" awards.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing Ryan for any of this.  It is commendable that he was able to be successful even after tragically losing his father.  But to suggest that he had a "very
humble beginnings" is just a fantasy.

ok you got me, but it is humbling for a man to work for a paycheck and I think it allows him to connect with the working man much better than your average politician.

[big d]

Bob, since when is having money a bad thing. Oh, that's right, since Obama got into office. It used to be the norm for all Americans to strive for a better life. Now you are thought of as a criminal and out of touch.

[Romeo]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

Ryan attended St. Mary's Catholic School in Janesville WI throught 7th grade. While Catholic schools in the Upper Midwest are indeed private few (who are familiar with them) would consider them elitist or necessarily superior to area public schools.  He attended Joseph A. Craig High School which is a public school. He attended college at Miami Univ (Ohio) which also public. Ryan's great-grandfather, in 1884, founded a earth moving company now known as Ryan Incorporated Central. However Paul's "branch" of the family has not been involved in the company. So while Ryan may or may not have "very wealthy" relatives, his immediate family was not among them. Janesville is a small rural WI city of about 64K and is not part of a larger metropolitan area. So declaring his childhood neighborhood as "affluent" certainly doesn't mean Park Avenue in this instance. I'm thinking Mayberry may also have an affluent hood.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_A._Craig_High_School
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miami_University
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janesville,_Wisconsin

Hi Trynt!  Catholic schools around here aren't cheap.  My stepdaughter's was up to about $3800 a year when we pulled her out.  And I saw a news report where they showed his childhood home and his neighborhood.  It was pretty nice.  Plus as I already posted, according to wiki, Janesville had a median household income nearly 50% higher than that of the town I grew up in.  And I didn't grow up in the slums.  While he might not have been super rich, he was far from poor...or humble.

How can you possibly know if he is a humble man or not? Have you met him. Have you spoken with him? You guys are too much.

[RP#62]

I'm still having flashbacks from my Catholic school experience.

-RP

[musclehead]

I'm still having flashbacks from my Catholic school experience.

-RP

do you still have nun nightmares? 

[cookiedough]

I think Paul Ryan went to Craig H.S. in Janesville WI which is about 30 miles from me.  His family might have been better off than most in Janesville, but definitely not rich by any means.  Janesville is definitely not a metropolis of rich folks by any means but hard working blue collar workers for the most part.    Been to Janesville 1,000's of times in my life and not too many parts of Janesville I would consider wealthy.  Paul Ryan is probably more down to earth than most politicians and was a good choice, but then again,  he is still a politician and I don't put much faith in any politician.

[oZ]

Bob E, where did Obama get his money and oh believe me he's rich so again explain where he got his money! (Loaded question, I know where he got his money)

Your political leanings truly interest me, on almost all subjects but politics I find you interesting and obviously intelligent. Even when you are commenting on politics your writing indicates a high level of intelligence.

So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

Call me old fashion but I truly think our rights come from God or not being too spiritual from nature and not from the government.

No man, party or government has the natural right to tread on me, or my family.

Communal living may be right for some, share the work and the benefits, but I believe again we have the right as living beings to chose if we want to live in a a collective... or not.

Obama has lost a large percentage of the black vote due to his stand on gay marriage. America's youth have all but abandoned him. I see so many college graduates sitting in there old bedrooms staring at fading Obama Posters unable to get jobs with there educations.

I'm watching my wife's family in complete awe, all Irish Catholics who voted for Obama the first time around now hell bent with their bellies full of fire to remove this hater of Catholics who wants the government to force their Catholic organization to pay for abortions.

I listened to Obama talk about the horrid 10 trillion dollars America owed when he took office but some how he's managed to add another 5 trillion to that debt.

The time spent on unemployment benefits has more than doubled since he's been in office.

And maybe I am so biased because I've seen over 1000 employees in the hospital system I work in lose there jobs since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, a direct impact and I feel personal attack on health care in America.

And his health care plan intends to remove 700 billion from Medicare, shoot I wait all these years paying for something I'm not going to get as his plan is to move us old farts into Medcade (sp?) or some part of his Affordable healthcare scheme.

But all that read this, if the ACA/Obamacare is not revoked I just can't wait for your experience when some government bureaucrat steps between you and your own doctor concerning decision on your care.

Okay, I'll get off my damn soapbox now.

[Jabba]

What I know about Paul Ryan is that he introduced a budget, in a time when NONE of the people in charge had the balls to do so.  A controversial budget that ALMOST all of the me too Republicrats hated.

The man showed his courage there if you ask me.

That's enough for me.

I am still gonna vote for Gary Johnson... but I hope he and Romney win since the RIGHT guy doesn't have a prayer.

Jabba

[the inspector]

I'm with OZ on this subject, he said it all.

[bscrive]

We, up here in Canada, need a change in your gov't.  If Obama keeps going the way he is, you guys won't have any money yo buy our exports and that will be bad for us.

[BF]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

At least we know what Romney's and Ryan's background and past actually are......unlike Obama that keeps his past sealed. 

What's Obama hiding Bob?

btw......+100000000 what oZ said. 

[BF]

Everything I need to know about Paul Ryan......

   

Paul Ryan's Playlist Starts with 'AC/DC' and Ends with 'Zeppelin'

[salty1]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

Soooo! What's your point? He has my support for all the reasons given above.

[musclehead]

Bob E, where did Obama get his money and oh believe me he's rich so again explain where he got his money! (Loaded question, I know where he got his money)

Your political leanings truly interest me, on almost all subjects but politics I find you interesting and obviously intelligent. Even when you are commenting on politics your writing indicates a high level of intelligence.

So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

Call me old fashion but I truly think our rights come from God or not being too spiritual from nature and not from the government.

No man, party or government has the natural right to tread on me, or my family.

Communal living may be right for some, share the work and the benefits, but I believe again we have the right as living beings to chose if we want to live in a a collective... or not.

Obama has lost a large percentage of the black vote due to his stand on gay marriage. America's youth have all but abandoned him. I see so many college graduates sitting in there old bedrooms staring at fading Obama Posters unable to get jobs with there educations.

I'm watching my wife's family in complete awe, all Irish Catholics who voted for Obama the first time around now hell bent with their bellies full of fire to remove this hater of Catholics who wants the government to force their Catholic organization to pay for abortions.

I listened to Obama talk about the horrid 10 trillion dollars America owed when he took office but some how he's managed to add another 5 trillion to that debt.

The time spent on unemployment benefits has more than doubled since he's been in office.

And maybe I am so biased because I've seen over 1000 employees in the hospital system I work in lose there jobs since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, a direct impact and I feel personal attack on health care in America.

And his health care plan intends to remove 700 billion from Medicare, shoot I wait all these years paying for something I'm not going to get as his plan is to move us old farts into Medcade (sp?) or some part of his Affordable healthcare scheme.

But all that read this, if the ACA/Obamacare is not revoked I just can't wait for your experience when some government bureaucrat steps between you and your own doctor concerning decision on your care.

Okay, I'll get off my damn soapbox now.

valid questions asked many times, the answers aren't forthcoming not from the left. the other question is why isn't Obama running on his record and what does he have planned for the country in his second term??

[Bob E.]

Bob E, where did Obama get his money and oh believe me he's rich so again explain where he got his money! (Loaded question, I know where he got his money)

Sure, he's rich now, but certainly didn't start out that way.  He is the beneficiary of our great American system of investment in our youth and their education and was able to attend the best of universities, even though he grew up in a poor, single-parent, mixed-race home.  It didn't hurt that he was intelligent enough to make the most of those opportunities.  He worked at a law firm for 10 years and eventually ended up at Columbia University where he wrote a couple of books.  I believe the year he was elected, I think I remember that his income was a couple million, primarily from the sale of those books and lectures.

Your political leanings truly interest me, on almost all subjects but politics I find you interesting and obviously intelligent. Even when you are commenting on politics your writing indicates a high level of intelligence.

Thanks.

So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

I guess mainly because those assertions are not true.

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

I'll answer this question with another...Who makes up that 50%?  Seniors on SS?  College kids?  Stay-at-home-moms?  The disabled?  Veterans? Do you really want to go after those folks and accuse them of being "on the dole"?  Furthermore, do people like Romney, who pay capital gains but pay little to no "income" taxes count in that 50%?  I saw a stat that showed that over 1400 people with incomes over $1M actually paid zero income tax or even got a refund.  Did you know that many people who are "on the dole" actually are people who work?  But they aren't making enough money to even cover their personal and dependent standard deductions?  There was a report, I think it was from Ohio, that the number of those people was actually about 75%.

Call me old fashion but I truly think our rights come from God or not being too spiritual from nature and not from the government.

Believe what you want, but the fact is that our government is secular, not theocratic...thank God.

No man, party or government has the natural right to tread on me, or my family.

Not sure what you are getting at here...

Communal living may be right for some, share the work and the benefits, but I believe again we have the right as living beings to chose if we want to live in a a collective... or not.

So, is everyone supposed to build their own roads?  Teach their own kids? Hire their own personal fire and police?  What about utilities?

Obama has lost a large percentage of the black vote due to his stand on gay marriage. America's youth have all but abandoned him. I see so many college graduates sitting in there old bedrooms staring at fading Obama Posters unable to get jobs with there educations.

Have you seen the recent poll showing Obama with 94% of the black vote, compared to Romney's 0%?  Getting those folks out to vote is certainly another thing, but it isn't like they all are turning Republican either.

I'm watching my wife's family in complete awe, all Irish Catholics who voted for Obama the first time around now hell bent with their bellies full of fire to remove this hater of Catholics who wants the government to force their Catholic organization to pay for abortions.

Wow...that's pretty far out there.  When exactly did he make them pay for abortions?  I thought it was only contraception, a rule that already existed without controversy in something like 28 states, and a service that most Catholic institutions already provided making them seem a bit hypocritical.

I listened to Obama talk about the horrid 10 trillion dollars America owed when he took office but some how he's managed to add another 5 trillion to that debt.

How much of that debt is due to legacy spending due to legislation passed before he came into office?  How much of that debt is due to 2 wars that were ongoing when he took office?  How much of that debt is due to the economic collapse that reduced gov't revenues to historic lows?  He could have passed zero policy, and the debt would be the same or worse than it is now.

The time spent on unemployment benefits has more than doubled since he's been in office.

We have been in a recession, you know.  Why would this not be the expected outcome?  Furthermore, what would you suggest be done when folks run out of unemployment benefits?  They would just qualify for welfare, then.  Is that any better?

And maybe I am so biased because I've seen over 1000 employees in the hospital system I work in lose there jobs since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, a direct impact and I feel personal attack on health care in America.

We've had this conversation before and I'm still not sure which parts or policy within the ACA are contributing to your hospital firing all these people?  My mom is a nurse, and her experience is quite different.  They are having trouble hiring enough good nurses and aides.  But all I keep hearing about is this big mystery boogie man that nobody has been able to clearly identify without just reciting the talking points, many of which are either deceiving or outright false, that Republicans have repeated enough times to become at least anecdotally true.

And his health care plan intends to remove 700 billion from Medicare, shoot I wait all these years paying for something I'm not going to get as his plan is to move us old farts into Medcade (sp?) or some part of his Affordable healthcare scheme.

Again, a distortion from the Republicans.  According to the CBO, the savings in future payments to providers and insurance companies, which is what this $700 is, actually extends the solvency of Medicare 8-12 years.  Additionally, the ACA has actually expanded benefits to Seniors by closing the prescription donut hole and eliminating copays for preventative care.  Benefits to seniors were not cut.  Also, in negotiating the law and getting all of the big players to buy off on it, most providers agreed that the reduction in uninsured (and therefore non-paying) customers would clearly offset the reduction in future payments.

But all that read this, if the ACA/Obamacare is not revoked I just can't wait for your experience when some government bureaucrat steps between you and your own doctor concerning decision on your care.

Yeah, I've heard this arguement.  However, how is this different than the insurance co bean counter doing the same thing?  The fact that this was happening...alot...is one reason the ACA was so necessary.  Furthermore, look at how politically toxic it is for anyone who messes with SS and Medicare.  Do you really think that the American public would stand for their reps doing that?

Okay, I'll get off my damn soapbox now.

[Bob E.]

Let's not get carried away, here.  While he may have worked some menial jobs in his highschool/college days, he grew up in a VERY wealthy family in an affluent neighborhood. Not Romney money, but certainly not average Joe money, either.  He went to private (Catholic) school, college, and immediately went to Washington after graduating.  Nothing wrong with any of that, but lets not make him into something he's not.

Soooo! What's your point? He has my support for all the reasons given above.

The OP made an assertion that Paul Ryan came from "very humble beginnings", which is demonstrably not true, unless your bar for "humble beginnings" is set at an unreasonable level.  I didn't say there was anything wrong with how he came up....in fact I even stated, "Nothing wrong with any of that" in the post you quoted.

[Bob E.]

What I know about Paul Ryan is that he introduced a budget, in a time when NONE of the people in charge had the balls to do so.  A controversial budget that ALMOST all of the me too Republicrats hated.

The man showed his courage there if you ask me.

That's enough for me.

I am still gonna vote for Gary Johnson... but I hope he and Romney win since the RIGHT guy doesn't have a prayer.

Jabba

Even conservative economists have called his so-called budget a "fantasy", devoid of any basic math or reality.  He gets too much credit for something that is actually a total farce.  Furthermore, during the Bush years, he voted for every budget-busting policy that came across his desk.  He didn't get religious on the budget until Obama was elected.  And there is a youtube clip from around 2003 where he gives a full-throated endorsement for passing a keynsian stimulus spending.  Watching that next to his recent statements about the Obama stimulus is almost comical.

[Bob E.]

Bob, since when is having money a bad thing. Oh, that's right, since Obama got into office. It used to be the norm for all Americans to strive for a better life. Now you are thought of as a criminal and out of touch.

When did I say anything of the sort?  The only thing wrong with it is that, for some people, growing up in a life of privelege isolates them from the struggles of the less fortunate.  And therefore they don't understand and cannot relate to them.  Similarly, if you grow up poor, your attitudes towards society and government are also affected.  I grew up poor.  I can remember being on welfare and foodstamps for awhile, making trips to the local food bank.  So I can relate to how important those programs can be for many people.  So when you are choosing someone to represent you in your government, you have to decide whether that person understands your issues enough to act to your benefit and for the good of your community.  I honestly believe this is true of Mitt Romney.  For example, he made the statement that if you want to succeed, you should borrow money from your parents and start a business.  Most people don't have parents with a bunch of money laying around.  It doesn't make him a bad guy.  He just doesn't understand.

[Trynt]

What I know about Paul Ryan is that he introduced a budget, in a time when NONE of the people in charge had the balls to do so.  A controversial budget that ALMOST all of the me too Republicrats hated.

The man showed his courage there if you ask me.

That's enough for me.

I am still gonna vote for Gary Johnson... but I hope he and Romney win since the RIGHT guy doesn't have a prayer.

Jabba

Even conservative economists have called his so-called budget a "fantasy", devoid of any basic math or reality.  He gets too much credit for something that is actually a total farce.  Furthermore, during the Bush years, he voted for every budget-busting policy that came across his desk.  He didn't get religious on the budget until Obama was elected.  And there is a youtube clip from around 2003 where he gives a full-throated endorsement for passing a keynsian stimulus spending.  Watching that next to his recent statements about the Obama stimulus is almost comical.

It was chief Keynsian proponent Paul Krugman that called Ryan's budget a "fantasy". Calling Krugman a conservative is like calling Genghis Khan a pacifist. Furthermore anyone who expresses a desire for a space alien invasion as a means to solve our economic woes (as Krugman did) loses any credibility when criticizing the reality of Ryan's ideas.

http://www.presstv.ir/usdetail/256183.html
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/noel-sheppard/2011/08/14/paul-krugman-calls-space-aliens-attack-earth-requiring-massive-defens

In 2003 the national debt was 6.8 trillion dollars. It is nearly 16 trillion today.  We recently tried the largest Keynsian package in history and in the opinion of most, it failed. Circumstances have changed. Heck, I'll bet you've even changed a few of your beliefs over time.

[5_19]

Bob E, where did Obama get his money and oh believe me he's rich so again explain where he got his money! (Loaded question, I know where he got his money)

Your political leanings truly interest me, on almost all subjects but politics I find you interesting and obviously intelligent. Even when you are commenting on politics your writing indicates a high level of intelligence.

So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

Call me old fashion but I truly think our rights come from God or not being too spiritual from nature and not from the government.

No man, party or government has the natural right to tread on me, or my family.

Communal living may be right for some, share the work and the benefits, but I believe again we have the right as living beings to chose if we want to live in a a collective... or not.

Obama has lost a large percentage of the black vote due to his stand on gay marriage. America's youth have all but abandoned him. I see so many college graduates sitting in there old bedrooms staring at fading Obama Posters unable to get jobs with there educations.

I'm watching my wife's family in complete awe, all Irish Catholics who voted for Obama the first time around now hell bent with their bellies full of fire to remove this hater of Catholics who wants the government to force their Catholic organization to pay for abortions.

I listened to Obama talk about the horrid 10 trillion dollars America owed when he took office but some how he's managed to add another 5 trillion to that debt.

The time spent on unemployment benefits has more than doubled since he's been in office.

And maybe I am so biased because I've seen over 1000 employees in the hospital system I work in lose there jobs since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, a direct impact and I feel personal attack on health care in America.

And his health care plan intends to remove 700 billion from Medicare, shoot I wait all these years paying for something I'm not going to get as his plan is to move us old farts into Medcade (sp?) or some part of his Affordable healthcare scheme.

But all that read this, if the ACA/Obamacare is not revoked I just can't wait for your experience when some government bureaucrat steps between you and your own doctor concerning decision on your care.

Okay, I'll get off my damn soapbox now.

+1. .................Now,

lets take the Valk out for a spin!!! That makes this political thread Valkyrie related. Sure makes me wish I had recorded all the speeches from the GOP convention so I could play them again while riding.     

My 0.02.  We have to get common sense back in the oval office and get this country back on track.... ....After all this is the USA we are talking about and we can do it. Don't make me regret becoming a US citizen just 2 years ago so I can help vote the current administration OUT ASAP!!

[Jabba]

Everyone is giving the POTUS too much credit.  He can't REALLY do that MUCh.  The power is in the CONGRESS.

Now with the advent of Czars (Bush II) and exploited profusely by Obama, and the very prolific Executive Order they are getting too much power, and need to be reigned in IMO.

[Willow]

Everyone is giving the POTUS too much credit.  He can't REALLY do that MUCh.  The power is in the CONGRESS.

Now with the advent of Czars (Bush II) and exploited profusely by Obama, and the very prolific Executive Order they are getting too much power, and need to be reigned in IMO.

"Reined in," John.  Reigning is indeed the problem.  Perhaps that was an all to Freudian slip.    

Let's de-reign the office.    

[Jabba]

Willow... I are an Enjunear.  Spealing is not my bestest subject. 

I am actually NOT an engineer.  But I play one at work. 

Love me or don't... 

Jabba

[G-Man]

Unfortunately, NONE of this really matters anyway here in the good ole U. S. of A. because more Americans watched an episode of Honey Boo Boo than Paul Ryan's RNC speech.

Yes I am yelling as I am mortified.       

[Jabba]

I like that he suggests limiting the Fed's budget to a % of the GDP.  He mentions 20%.  i don't know if that's the right number or not... But I like the concept and have been saying that VERY thing for YEARS.

Jabba

[oZ]

Bob E We'll take this a question at a time (O:
So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

I guess mainly because those assertions are not true.

Obama: Favors universal access to health care and associated benefits as a critical expansion of the welfare state.
Obama: Favors progressive taxes on the rich to redistribute income and wealth from winners to losers and to ensure that all pay their fair share. (As he has said: "When you spread the wealth around, it's good for everybody.")
Obama: Favors collective responsibility (as defined by the federal government) to protect all from social risks through food stamps, welfare programs, extended unemployment benefits, guaranteed health care, the bailing out of big companies, forcing renegotiation of mortgages, class action law suits, and other measures. (Instead of opportunity and incentive to succeed, no one is allowed to fail).
Obama: Favors carbon taxes, higher energy prices, restricted drilling and refining, and subsidies of green technology for the "common good," even at the expenses of higher conventional growth and jobs.
Obama: Shows a distrust of market forces and advocates selective regulation, subsidies, and taxation to persuade or coerce business to promote the general welfare as he defines it. Industries not part of his collective endeavor (oil and gas and coal) are penalized. Industries that serve his conception of "general welfare" (green technology) are to be promoted even if the market rejects them.
Obama: Advocates a strong state that offers the "positive right" of political and economic justice to its citizens. He complains that the U.S. Constitution is a "charter of negative liberties," that dictates what government "can't do to you, but it doesn't say what the federal government or the state government must do on your behalf."

So again you infer Obama is not a socialist?

source: Paul Roderick Gregory, Forbes Magazine.

[musclehead]

Bob E, where did Obama get his money and oh believe me he's rich so again explain where he got his money! (Loaded question, I know where he got his money)

Sure, he's rich now, but certainly didn't start out that way.  He is the beneficiary of our great American system of investment in our youth and their education and was able to attend the best of universities, even though he grew up in a poor, single-parent, mixed-race home.  It didn't hurt that he was intelligent enough to make the most of those opportunities.  He worked at a law firm for 10 years and eventually ended up at Columbia University where he wrote a couple of books.  I believe the year he was elected, I think I remember that his income was a couple million, primarily from the sale of those books and lectures.

Your political leanings truly interest me, on almost all subjects but politics I find you interesting and obviously intelligent. Even when you are commenting on politics your writing indicates a high level of intelligence.

Thanks.

So why would you want a president with a socialist agenda, owned by the unions, influenced by George Soros and bent on class warfare which is at the center of all his campaign initiatives?

I guess mainly because those assertions are not true.

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

I'll answer this question with another...Who makes up that 50%?  Seniors on SS?  College kids?  Stay-at-home-moms?  The disabled?  Veterans? Do you really want to go after those folks and accuse them of being "on the dole"?  Furthermore, do people like Romney, who pay capital gains but pay little to no "income" taxes count in that 50%?  I saw a stat that showed that over 1400 people with incomes over $1M actually paid zero income tax or even got a refund.  Did you know that many people who are "on the dole" actually are people who work?  But they aren't making enough money to even cover their personal and dependent standard deductions?  There was a report, I think it was from Ohio, that the number of those people was actually about 75%.

Call me old fashion but I truly think our rights come from God or not being too spiritual from nature and not from the government.

Believe what you want, but the fact is that our government is secular, not theocratic...thank God.

No man, party or government has the natural right to tread on me, or my family.

Not sure what you are getting at here...

Communal living may be right for some, share the work and the benefits, but I believe again we have the right as living beings to chose if we want to live in a a collective... or not.

So, is everyone supposed to build their own roads?  Teach their own kids? Hire their own personal fire and police?  What about utilities?

Obama has lost a large percentage of the black vote due to his stand on gay marriage. America's youth have all but abandoned him. I see so many college graduates sitting in there old bedrooms staring at fading Obama Posters unable to get jobs with there educations.

Have you seen the recent poll showing Obama with 94% of the black vote, compared to Romney's 0%?  Getting those folks out to vote is certainly another thing, but it isn't like they all are turning Republican either.

I'm watching my wife's family in complete awe, all Irish Catholics who voted for Obama the first time around now hell bent with their bellies full of fire to remove this hater of Catholics who wants the government to force their Catholic organization to pay for abortions.

Wow...that's pretty far out there.  When exactly did he make them pay for abortions?  I thought it was only contraception, a rule that already existed without controversy in something like 28 states, and a service that most Catholic institutions already provided making them seem a bit hypocritical.

I listened to Obama talk about the horrid 10 trillion dollars America owed when he took office but some how he's managed to add another 5 trillion to that debt.

How much of that debt is due to legacy spending due to legislation passed before he came into office?  How much of that debt is due to 2 wars that were ongoing when he took office?  How much of that debt is due to the economic collapse that reduced gov't revenues to historic lows?  He could have passed zero policy, and the debt would be the same or worse than it is now.

The time spent on unemployment benefits has more than doubled since he's been in office.

We have been in a recession, you know.  Why would this not be the expected outcome?  Furthermore, what would you suggest be done when folks run out of unemployment benefits?  They would just qualify for welfare, then.  Is that any better?

And maybe I am so biased because I've seen over 1000 employees in the hospital system I work in lose there jobs since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, a direct impact and I feel personal attack on health care in America.

We've had this conversation before and I'm still not sure which parts or policy within the ACA are contributing to your hospital firing all these people?  My mom is a nurse, and her experience is quite different.  They are having trouble hiring enough good nurses and aides.  But all I keep hearing about is this big mystery boogie man that nobody has been able to clearly identify without just reciting the talking points, many of which are either deceiving or outright false, that Republicans have repeated enough times to become at least anecdotally true.

And his health care plan intends to remove 700 billion from Medicare, shoot I wait all these years paying for something I'm not going to get as his plan is to move us old farts into Medcade (sp?) or some part of his Affordable healthcare scheme.

Again, a distortion from the Republicans.  According to the CBO, the savings in future payments to providers and insurance companies, which is what this $700 is, actually extends the solvency of Medicare 8-12 years.  Additionally, the ACA has actually expanded benefits to Seniors by closing the prescription donut hole and eliminating copays for preventative care.  Benefits to seniors were not cut.  Also, in negotiating the law and getting all of the big players to buy off on it, most providers agreed that the reduction in uninsured (and therefore non-paying) customers would clearly offset the reduction in future payments.

But all that read this, if the ACA/Obamacare is not revoked I just can't wait for your experience when some government bureaucrat steps between you and your own doctor concerning decision on your care.

Yeah, I've heard this arguement.  However, how is this different than the insurance co bean counter doing the same thing?  The fact that this was happening...alot...is one reason the ACA was so necessary.  Furthermore, look at how politically toxic it is for anyone who messes with SS and Medicare.  Do you really think that the American public would stand for their reps doing that?

Okay, I'll get off my damn soapbox now.

once again with the "income" tax scam, I pay income tax if you have a boss you pay income tax. Romney doesn't work for anyone ergo no income tax.

it has finally come down to alot of people seeing the sad state of our affairs and knowing there needs to be a change or there will be NO SS or medicare/caid. the blame lays with all the politicians that kicked the can down the road.

[Oss]

Oz  You have nailed it
I have polled my clients

Now before I go further you should know there are pictures of Clinton, Gore, Kerry and also signed letter from LBJ and Clinton on the wall (outside my dad's office)

So its no secret what party has been supported by the office

I also have a framed copy of Kennedy's inaugural address on the wall just outside my door
and most clients enjoy looking at that piece of history which is next to the John Wayne pic I got from Paris a long time member MIA

Anyways I ask the question  Is your life better than 4 years ago to my clients

Now Most of my clients are minority, (jamaican, guyanese, dominican, other carribean islands,
a few irish and old german folks, some nigerians and american black (I dont use the word african american as its a bullshit word  like irish american or protestant american you are either american or you are not IMHO) and a few white folks as well

NOT ONE SAID THEY ARE DOING BETTER   The folks are getting squeezed and they are not happy with the executive in charge

Curiously my carribean and american black clients are the most upset, JOBS is #1 and
lack of money for business is #2  A system that rewards tenants who dont pay the rent is #3

This also includes the Yemenite deli owners, the Indian 99Cent store owner, the Jamaican bakery,
the Manager at Wallgreen (P.R) and the born in the Bronx americans working at subway
The bank has closed as has the KFC *thats how bad it is

Again not a scientific poll as the sample is less than 200 people but it is the pulse of the Bronx
at least in my neighborhood

[oZ]

A president that has 50% of American on the dole, my thoughts are if we keep going with Obama's vision of America everything will be free... but us!

BobE  I'll answer this question with another...Who makes up that 50%? Seniors on SS? College kids? Stay-at-home-moms? The disabled? Veterans? Do you really want to go after those folks and accuse them of being "on the dole"?

There are more Americans dependent on the federal government than ever before in U.S. history. According to the Survey of Income and Program Participation conducted by the U.S. Census, well over 100 million Americans are enrolled in at least one welfare program run by the federal government. Many are enrolled in more than one. That is about a third of the entire population of the country. That figure does not even include Social Security or Medicare. Today the federal government runs almost 80 different "means-tested welfare programs", and almost all of those programs have experienced substantial growth in recent years.
Graph produced by Senate Budget Committee

Bob E PLEASE NOTE. Keep in mind that the chart posted above does not even take into account the huge numbers of Americans that are on Social Security and Medicare.

source: Survey of Income and Program Participation conducted by the U.S. Census

[oZ]

Your non-scientific observations match mine of course we both live in interesting times and interesting States! California can now be put in the ranks of Spain, Portugal, and especially Greece. Non-government worker are getting laid off while the Democrats in Sacramento keep doing as their benefactors the Unions tell them.

Anyone who is slightly informed can read about the failure and perhaps financial collapse of California. Non-Union Teachers, cops, carpenters, plumbers, firemen, etc. are being laid off, hospitals and nursing homes are closing, dangerous prisoners are being released, and critical infrastructure is crumbling.

Hey let's apply the Greece, California model to the good ol' USA - reelect Obama and his fellow socialist Democratic posse!

The red state goobers who cling to their guns and Bibles can whine all they want as long as the Golden State and the Empire state has the electoral votes. Isn't seeing who can get the most free stuff what democracy is all about?

The president will soar over California riding atop his flying unicorn dropping bundles of cash printed by his friend Ben Bernanke—paid for by all those greedy millionaires and billionaires who aren't carrying their fair share.

When fuel is so expensive I can't afford to ride my Valkyrie on the week-ends I can thank the short sighted, Kool-Aid drinking, dyed in the wool unreasonable leftists that can only answer questions with predigested talking points. God Bless them all for they will see the consequences of their blind unchangeable short sighted beliefs, and they'll ask how did this happen?
4 words, you elected the Democrats.

I hope we all agree that in the U.S. free speech is a privilege we all can agree to preserve.

What else can you say about a state whose leading growth industry is municipal bankruptcies, whose leading export is companies and citizens fleeing tax increases.

Some unemployment numbers: Nevada 12.0% Rhode Island 10.8% California 10.7%  Georgia 9.3% New York 9.1% Mississippi 9.1% Illinois 8.9% source: National Conference of State Legislatures