Garage Build Update - Been Busy

[ptgb]

Had posted in October about my garage build for the Valkyries. http://www.valkyrieforum.com/bbs/index.php/topic,48033.0.html


Made a ton of progress since then. Here's an update:




The building itself was finished in early November. Concrete sealed and ready to finish the inside.





Picked up this scaffold on a Black Friday sale at Tractor Supply. Sure has come in handy for the inside work.




Outside lights mounted up in a snowstorm. Exactly the ones I wanted. Going for a old style service station/industrial look.





All the romex runs installed. 14/2 for plugs, etc. 12/2 for the overhead lights. I am eventually going to have 300W equivalent CFLs (105W) in the ceiling fixtures (16 total - 8 on each circuit). 8 fixtures pull about 14 amps so went with 20 amp circuits to those lights. The subpanel feed is 100 amp, 2-2-2-4 aluminum mobile home feeder, run through underground conduit from the house (about a 35' run).





2 - 10/2 220v runs. One under the window frame-out as I decided to add a 24,000 BTU air conditioner for summer work. Going to have a smaller glass block window above the A/C unit. The other 10/2 runs to the back wall for future compressor or welder, etc.





High 14/2 run to the back corner for heater power. Going with a 75,000 BTU forced-air, natural gas hanging unit.





All the wiring was hooked up today by my uncle (40 yr. electrician). Right now have regular 200W bulbs in the fixtures, will change out to CFLs in the future. Was surprised at the brightness with just the 200W bulbs.




All the plugs installed. Have a total of 42 plugs on 4 circuits. Should not ever have a problem finding a place to plug in something!



Really coming along nice. Next is running gas line and getting the heater mounted, then on to insulation...

[Hook#3287]

Nice

I'm jealous

[salty1]

Thanks for the update, I read your previous post. Keep us informed as you move ahead. Are you going to sheet rock the walls?  ??? 

[Davemn]

You need more outlets. Ha
Very nice work.

[Davemn]

Question. Is the bottom plate a treated 4x4? Havent seen that before. Up here typically there is 1 course of block. Looks nice.

[BF]

You build different than we do down here.  We pour a slab and then stick build up off of it. 

[ptgb]

Thanks for the update, I read your previous post. Keep us informed as you move ahead. Are you going to sheet rock the walls?  ??? 

I am going to finish the walls in 1/2" plywood. More expensive, but I can hang stuff wherever I want. Worth the extra cost to me. Don't know yet if I am going to drywall or plywood the ceiling. Really don't want to have to mud and tape the ceiling.

Question. Is the bottom plate a treated 4x4? Havent seen that before. Up here typically there is 1 course of block. Looks nice.

It is common here for a pole building-type foundation. They sink 4x4 posts 48" in the ground (below frost line) every 6 feet, couple bags of cement in each hole. They then put a 2x10 on each side and cut the posts off. Place a treated 2x8 on top and then stick build on top of that. Builder gives a 50 year warranty on the foundation; not that either of us will be around in 50 years.

[cookiedough]

I think you did more than enough in terms of lighting and electrical outlets, dare I say overkill?  My 20x24' standard garage has 2 plug ins and only one 100w light bulb in the middle of the garage and fits my needs, although 1-2 more outlets would be nice at times but that is what extension cords are for along with a trebel light.  A/C and heat in a garage, now that is going to be a very nice man cave for sure once done.  I'd leave the rafters open so you can store larger items up there if ned be on 4x8 sheets of plywood.  I would never in my standards 20x24' garage install a drop down ceiling since I have the entire upper rafters filled with crap I use very rarely or get down once per year and put up for winter, etc.    Gonna be extremely nice when you get it all done - great job!  

[Master Blaster]

In my 40X60X16 pole I used 6ea high pressure sodium outdoor lights for the overhead.   This was before CFLs, and a double row of 8ft neons under the loft in the tool storage area.  The high pressures are energy efficent and really light up the place.  Really like your setup, good job.










t

[big d]

Garage is looking good Pete. I like the addition of the ceiling fans. Smart, very smart. Before I left to go downstate to see family for Christmas I had two 30,000 btu ventless heaters installed on the back wall of my barn. Once I get back after the new year I am calling and having propane bottle delivered so I will finally have heat. Keep going and keep the pics coming.

[wiggydotcom]

That's simply awesome. I can tell you've planned things out really well. Can't wait to see the finished product! Keep posting pics!

I couldn't tell from the pics, but did you happen to put in a floor drain so you could have a wash bay? That would really be a nice touch.

[JimC]

I am going to finish the walls in 1/2" plywood. More expensive, but I can hang stuff wherever I want. Worth the extra cost to me. Don't know yet if I am going to drywall or plywood the ceiling. Really don't want to have to mud and tape the ceiling.

I am building a garage also, consider using steel siding on the ceiling, I just put it on my garage ceiling, and had it in my last shop. it makes it very bright as the light bounces off of it. No painting, no taping, blow it off with an air gun, spray it off with a hose.

I am also going with the 105watt CFL bulbs, (400 watt equivalent). Right now I only have two up there, I have to get busy running the wire to the rest of the fixtures.



Jim

[Clark]

42 PLUGS... is that some sorta WORLD RECORD???

[ptgb]

I couldn't tell from the pics, but did you happen to put in a floor drain so you could have a wash bay?

Yep, have a floor drain installed.

I think you did more than enough in terms of lighting and electrical outlets, dare I say overkill?

No such thing as overkill in this garage, as long as the wallet can support it (and the wallet is getting lighter by the day).  

I figured that plugs, boxes, and 14/2 are cheap. I have a panel with enough circuit capacity to support it, so what the heck. If I ever get into a position in which I need to find an open plug in there, I am in pretty big trouble!  

I am building a garage also, consider using steel siding on the ceiling, I just put it on my garage ceiling, and had it in my last shop. it makes it very bright as the light bounces off of it. No painting, no taping, blow it off with an air gun, spray it off with a hose.

That's a great idea Jim, I am going to research that, thanks. I see in your picture what looks like the Chamberlain Liftmaster 3800 for you garage door opener? If so, how do you like it? Any issues with install or operation of it? I am planning on getting two 3800's for my doors, so I am interested in you thoughts on them. Thanks.

[Jess Tolbirt]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,
also you are only allowed 8 openings per circuit as rule of thumb,,,
as for the 220 you should have run 10/3 with a ground,,,, never know when you might need a neutral for something,,,

[KY,Dave (AKA Misunderstood)]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,

Was thinking the same thing 

[jimmytee]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,

Was thinking the same thing  

Me too,and the 10/3 . Plus If it were me I'd put in a heavier circuit for a welder. Just my 2 ¢

[ptgb]

Well hell's bells boys.... I'm not running a machine shop here with 27 employees or anything. Just me, myself, and I out there. 15 amp breakers on 15 amp plugs will suffice for my purposes.

[Varmintmist]

Well hell's bells boys.... I'm not running a machine shop here with 27 employees or anything. Just me, myself, and I out there. 15 amp breakers on 15 amp plugs will suffice for my purposes.

Looks great, and I like the steel siding idea for a lid.

I would have ran a 10-3 to the back myself    

[Jess Tolbirt]

Well hell's bells boys.... I'm not running a machine shop here with 27 employees or anything. Just me, myself, and I out there. 15 amp breakers on 15 amp plugs will suffice for my purposes.

15 amp breakers and 15 amp plugs? do they still make those?
lets see i have a drill that pulls 6 amps and a vacuum cleaner that pulls 12,
i am not posting this to be mean, just think you would like to go a little heavier,, a quartz light will pull 10 amps,,,
42 plugs? whats that a plug every foot apart? 10 on a circuit?
now i have to go out in my garage and add more plugs,, actually i have quads every 6 feet apart,,,
and i lost almost 1/3 of my garage to Bev because she had to have a tanning room, so thats 130 sq. ft. i lost

[alph]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,

Was thinking the same thing 

i am an electrician, and that's exactly what i was thinking too.  i ran 12/2 to my recepticles, next to each 120v recepticle i ran a seprate 12/3 for a 220v incase i switched my motors to a higher voltage (higher voltage will use less amps saving money on the electric bill, also the motor will run cooler).  the only thing i would have done differently in my shed would be to install radiant heat in the floor.  a simple ten gallon hot water heater would keep that shop nice and toastie!! what you did isn't the end of the world, it'll work fine.   

i didn't want to chime in, but others did, so i figured what's said is said.  too late now.....

[olddog1946]

The garage is looking good. I already got my spot marked out for the Chevelle and it's rotisserrie, just don't forget the welder outlets..!! Just kidding about the Chevelle.

I firmly believe in no such thing as overkill. I do know from my experience over my lifespan that if you put in 42 outlets there will be a time when half or more will be used, meaning the circuits will eventually be overloaded. I'd agree about the heavier wire for the outlets and lighter wire for the lights. Or use color coded outlets so you can easily check and ensure you don't have too many outlets in use on the same circuit at one time.
Kinda like work benches, the more you have the more crap you'll have one em. I didn't notice the height of the outlets, but you will want some above your work benches if you put some in.

[Jeff K]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,

Was thinking the same thing 

i am an electrician, and that's exactly what i was thinking too.  i ran 12/2 to my recepticles, next to each 120v recepticle i ran a seprate 12/3 for a 220v incase i switched my motors to a higher voltage (higher voltage will use less amps saving money on the electric bill, also the motor will run cooler).  the only thing i would have done differently in my shed would be to install radiant heat in the floor.  a simple ten gallon hot water heater would keep that shop nice and toastie!! what you did isn't the end of the world, it'll work fine.   

i didn't want to chime in, but others did, so i figured what's said is said.  too late now.....

Cold water heater... if you had hot water you wouldn't need to heat it. 

[Jess from VA]

What a fantastic man cave!! (green with envy).  Great post and pics, thank you.

I was just thru Youngstown twice on my trip back to MI and back (on the Turnpike), and thought of you.  The snow and white-knuckle driving was so bad on the way home I contemplated pulling off and looking you up thru the PD.  

My brother's giant pole barn (holding aircraft, 3 tractors, cars, trucks, Hi-lo, aircraft tug, is so cold in winter he just walled off/insulated the machine shop side and installed a wood burning stove, so he could work in winter without frostbite.

[custom1]

Looks good. You will never be sorry that you have that many outlets. I could pile on about the 14-2, but you will be fine. Even if you have stuff plugged into every one of them, you will only ever be running one or two things at a time.

Be careful with that scaffolding. I have two sets that are very similar. I had a guy do the drywall on the walls and 12' ceiling. I asked that they tie the two sections together like a "T" so they couldn't tip over. He said "We do this all the time" "It will be fine". Well they were going along the wall taping and mudding, sort of shuffling the scaffold along by shifting his weight...... Well when he tried to go around the corner the wheel turned under on the short side and down he went. I was about 10 feet away and heard the crash and turned to look just in time to see his back hit the cement. I'm having flashbacks thinking about it. It's a long story, but the short version is he spent the day in the hospital and nothing was broken. He was sore for while and missed some work. If he would have landed on his head, well....... A lot of stuff goes through your head about fault and insurance etc. But he was a stand up guy and admitted he shouldn't have been doing it that way.

Anyway just be careful. Safety first. You can see how when the wheels are turned in and under how if you have your weight on the edge of the platform you are not supported.

[JimC]

PTGB
The liftmaster is great, it is very quiet and I like the way it starts off slow, and slows down near the end. The automatic deadbolt is a great feature also. I did not install it, it was part of a package deal from the door installer that my son subs work to. So far it has been flawless in operation, I would do it again without even thinking about it.

On the wire issue, I also thought you had the wire sizes reversed in your post, however, it is not the end of the world. Like you say, it is spread out enough that it should not matter. One thing you will want to consider is to run 12/2 to the area you want to run any larger machinery. I had a 14/2 line running to my table saw in my old garage and it made the table saw start really slow, I know it was not good for the motor.

Jim

[CajunRider]

You will never be sorry that you have that many outlets.

Until you have them all full and you wish you had more!!    

Awesome shop!  I'm jealous!

[henry 008]

I am going to finish the walls in 1/2" plywood. More expensive, but I can hang stuff wherever I want. Worth the extra cost to me. Don't know yet if I am going to drywall or plywood the ceiling. Really don't want to have to mud and tape the ceiling.

I am building a garage also, consider using steel siding on the ceiling, I just put it on my garage ceiling, and had it in my last shop. it makes it very bright as the light bounces off of it. No painting, no taping, blow it off with an air gun, spray it off with a hose.

something we have used here are used garage door pannels. kind of a pain to work with until you get the have of it. then you have and insulated steel ceiling!  looking good pete!      ;)hope to see you at the bike show soon! 

I am also going with the 105watt CFL bulbs, (400 watt equivalent). Right now I only have two up there, I have to get busy running the wire to the rest of the fixtures.



Jim

[ptgb]

Looks good. You will never be sorry that you have that many outlets. I could pile on about the 14-2, but you will be fine. Even if you have stuff plugged into every one of them, you will only ever be running one or two things at a time.

Exactly    I only have two hands. How much stuff can I run at one time? 

[fudgie]

15 amp breakers and 15 amp plugs? do they still make those?

Yup. Most box stores have the 15a plugs for like $0.40. The 20A are hard to find.

[fudgie]

Looks good.  I'd do plywood on the ceiling. Drywall will just start and sag after awhile. Esp if its not heated and cooled constantly. I used 1/2" R-board on my ceiling. Its just foam backed with fiberglass.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

Looks great Pete I wish I had that attached to the side of my house. My garage is more barn than garage its 40X40 and built with power poles and rough cut sawmill lumber covered top and side's with metal roofing ....Nice job you did 

[f6john]

     Building code for Kentucky is 14-2 for outlets. I built my house back in 1980 and most outlets would accept 12-2 wire easily. Now the outlets that have the rear opening push in connecters will only accept 14 gauge wire on the 15 amp outlets. You can purchase 20 amp outlets but seldom see them except for special use circuits such as for a fridge. I see no need for 20 amp 12 gauge for a normal residential garage.


    I do have a question about the foundation as that was a new one on me too. After the 2x10's are added but before the 2x8 is added, is there anything used to fill the cavity that is created? I need to add on to my garage and I'm thinking this may be the way for me to go.


    I second the steel roofing for the ceilings. My brother-in-law has a 48x60 with the metal on the ceiling and walls and I can see no draw backs. My personal 28x40 garage built in 1985 has 5/8" drywall on the ceilings and recently the taped  joints have started coming loose. Just this past week I have been pulling off loose tape and screwing the drywall back up tight.

[ptgb]

I do have a question about the foundation as that was a new one on me too. After the 2x10's are added but before the 2x8 is added, is there anything used to fill the cavity that is created? I need to add on to my garage and I'm thinking this may be the way for me to go.

No fill in between the 2x10's. This type of foundation is very common around here. There have been no issues that I am aware of even with buildings years ago. My brother-in-law has a two car of the same type foundation that he had built in 1997 or so; the foundation still looks brand new.

[hairyteeth]

I agree with the use of steel for inside lining...I heard mention the use of a welder and cringe at the thought of a hot spatter rolling under wooden paneling only to ignite hours later. I lined my shop with steel but I bought indoor seconds, from the siding supplier. Less money and you can't tell it from outside first quality grade. A neighbor of mine tried to save money and used particle board to line his shop... when the fire dept. got thru tearing down the walls to put out the fire it was a total loss. As far as the outlets go we were just concerned when we come over for a wrench party and plug in a couple a crock pots and a coffee maker we didn't want to trip a breaker...Congrats on the great garage!
HT

[dan7uk]

Just a suggestion, you might want to rethink your lighting.  I believe you will be happier with fluorescent lighting instead of incandescent.  Eight foot strip lights work great in garages, cheaper to run and the bulbs last longer.  Eight footers butted end to end will light it up.  Your initial cost will be greater for the fixtures and if your garage is not going to be heated I would go with HO (high output) fixtures, they won't ficker when cold.  Fluoescent lighting is common in garages.

[wiggydotcom]

well lets see here, before you cover the walls you might want to have a talk with your electrician,,,
if you ran 14-2 to the plugs and 12-2 to the lights, you have it backwards the wire will be to small for the plugs and ok for the lights,,,

Was thinking the same thing 

i am an electrician, and that's exactly what i was thinking too.  i ran 12/2 to my recepticles, next to each 120v recepticle i ran a seprate 12/3 for a 220v incase i switched my motors to a higher voltage (higher voltage will use less amps saving money on the electric bill, also the motor will run cooler).  the only thing i would have done differently in my shed would be to install radiant heat in the floor.  a simple ten gallon hot water heater would keep that shop nice and toastie!! what you did isn't the end of the world, it'll work fine.   

i didn't want to chime in, but others did, so i figured what's said is said.  too late now.....

I'm an electrician too...and you're partly correct. Switching your motors to a higher voltage saves electiricity how? It's the same power(wattage) whether you run 240v at 4 amps or 120v at 8 amp, is it not? I'm in agreement with the crowd that would have run 12/2 to the outlets and a bigger 220 circuit for a future welder, etc.
Radiant heat in the floor would have been an excellent idea.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

What is the metal strip that runs around near the top ?

[Jeff K]

What is the metal strip that runs around near the top ?

Seam for 8' sheets would be my guess

[Hook#3287]

What is the metal strip that runs around near the top ?

Seam for 8' sheets would be my guess

That looks to be T-111 siding which is a "Press Board" product.  Great stuff for the $$, but you need to protect it from rain.  The strip is a drip cap for the top of the bottom piece.