Deceleration, do you engine brake & rev match?

[Mr Whiskey]

Jus' curious who uses the engine & who uses the brakes.

[Patrick]

Almost always the brakes, but, when using the engine I try to match engine speed correctly. I try to be smooth in everything.

[Big Rig]

Shared pretty evenly...always situational. If it allows or calls for....

[wingrider02]

It sort of depends on how quick I have to stop.  I almost always rev to meet engine speed.  If I have to stop quick, it is brakes and rev, otherwise we let the engine haul us down till we drop down into 1st.

[..]

Shared pretty evenly...always situational. If it allows or calls for....

+1

BUT it does depend if one is a blipper or not.

http://www.sportrider.com/downshifting-blipping-throttle

This applies to all bikes apart from autos. I think.

[Big Al of Tennessee]

Engine Braking is good.

Brake Pads are cheaper than Clutches and Gears.

Roll up in 6th,,,,pull the Clutch in at 1200 rpm and then shift five times

from 6th to 1st then up one to neutral.

At least I try to do that every time.

Some folks thinks it is a sin to sit at a traffic light in neutral.

I do it anyway.

[Serk]

As Big Al alluded to... I don't wanna move stresses off of easily replaceable inexpensive parts (Brake Pads) and on to very expensive difficult to replace parts (Engine and drive train). I use very little engine braking.

[bill-jr]

I like to down shift twice and let the rear tire squeel and spin ...

[Mr Whiskey]

Engine Braking is good.

Brake Pads are cheaper than Clutches and Gears.

Roll up in 6th,,,,pull the Clutch in at 1200 rpm and then shift five times

from 6th to 1st then up one to neutral.

At least I try to do that every time.



Some folks thinks it is a sin to sit at a traffic light in neutral.

I do it anyway.

I aint worried 'bout ya sittin' at a light or stop sign in neutral waitin' to get rear ended, that's you a$$, but the thought of you COASTING in behind me in high gear on nothin' but brake DOES make me kinda nervous. You never had a brake failure Al? You wouldn't do that in a big truck would ya? Do you coast like that into turns without engine/tranny matched in proper gear for road & speed?
Always be 1 gear lower than you think you need to be, & never, ever trust your brakes.
My .02 worth Brother.

[Chrisj CMA]

I use the engine in whatever gear I happen to be in.  Just let off the gas and as she slows I use the brakes,  when it gets too slow for that gear I pull the clutch and its all brakes from there.  I NEVER downshift and use the clutch to slow the bike.  The Valkyrie is too heavy to be doing that all the time.

[Bighead]

Depends on the situation. I frequently use both

[Rams]

How I slow depends on the situation and what/who I have on board, if trailering, I use both brakes and downshifting.    Down shifting keeps me in the engine's power band should I need to use that power.    Coasting down in high gear just means I have to down shift several times to have the rpm/power I want to go when I want to go.    Not using all the tools Mother Honda gave us just doesn't make sense to me but, to each their own.    I simply ask those that choose to do so, keep that following distance stretched out a bit.  

[signart]

The engine is for acceleration and the brakes are for slowing down. Just remember if you like to engine brake a lot, there are a couple reasons front tires last longer than rear tires.  

[eric in md]

   i dont have brakes..

[Big Al of Tennessee]

Engine Braking is good.

Brake Pads are cheaper than Clutches and Gears.

Roll up in 6th,,,,pull the Clutch in at 1200 rpm and then shift five times

from 6th to 1st then up one to neutral.

At least I try to do that every time.



Some folks thinks it is a sin to sit at a traffic light in neutral.

I do it anyway.

I aint worried 'bout ya sittin' at a light or stop sign in neutral waitin' to get rear ended, that's you a$$, but the thought of you COASTING in behind me in high gear on nothin' but brake DOES make me kinda nervous. You never had a brake failure Al? You wouldn't do that in a big truck would ya? Do you coast like that into turns without engine/tranny matched in proper gear for road & speed?
Always be 1 gear lower than you think you need to be, & never, ever trust your brakes.
My .02 worth Brother.

Trucks yes,,,,,,,,,,gear down.

Bikes,,,,,,,read your manual for Christs Sake,,,mine says do just that.

Preventive Maintenance,,,,,,,,Never ever not once, exp a brake failure.

I use the front brake more than the rear,,,,,,good habit in a panic stop to not

have to remember both brakes are the only way to WOW her down.

[Woton]

Another one of these "Gee, I've never really thought about that..." threads.  Interesting.

Riding in fourth or high gear and seeing a stop ahead I typically engine break until the clutch needs to be engaged, and then I brake while downshifting for the stop. 

In lower gears I tend to clutch in/downshift and use the brakes more to avoid the lurching. 

I do all this because it seems most natural/comfortable for me and the bike and not for style points

I tend to sit at a stop in neutral as well - especially near the end of a long day riding when I'm starting to poop out.  And certainly if I'm familiar enough to know the red light is a long one.  Probably not a good idea, but honestly in a multi-lane traffic light situation with cars all around you where are you going to go IF...

Someone please help me understand the engine and tire wear comments in this thread.  Do some of you down shift to slow/stop to the point that you actually over rev and bark the rear tire?

[..]

Another one of these "Gee, I've never really thought about that..." threads.  Interesting.

Riding in fourth or high gear and seeing a stop ahead I typically engine break until the clutch needs to be engaged, and then I brake while downshifting for the stop.  

In lower gears I tend to clutch in/downshift and use the brakes more to avoid the lurching.  

I do all this because it seems most natural/comfortable for me and the bike and not for style points

I tend to sit at a stop in neutral as well - especially near the end of a long day riding when I'm starting to poop out.  And certainly if I'm familiar enough to know the red light is a long one.  Probably not a good idea, but honestly in a multi-lane traffic light situation with cars all around you where are you going to go IF...

Someone please help me understand the engine and tire wear comments in this thread.  Do some of you down shift to slow/stop to the point that you actually over rev and bark the rear tire?

Some riders pull in the clutch as they close the throttle and change down. They then release the clutch as they open the throttle. Most of the time the engine speed will not be sufficent to match the speed that the wheels are turning. This will cause the rear tire to "bark" or "squeal".

Other who "blip" the throttle as they pull in the lcutch and change down do match the engine speed to the wheels. This is a much quicker series of movements that doesn't make the rear tire misbehave.

Novices do over rev slightly and may cause the bike to slightly acclerate (lurch) as the clutch is released.

Practice, practice, practice.

http://www.sportrider.com/downshifting-blipping-throttle

[ricoman]

Someone please help me understand the engine and tire wear comments in this thread.  Do some of you down shift to slow/stop to the point that you actually over rev and bark the rear tire?

Some riders pull in the clutch as they close the throttle and change down. They then release the clutch as they open the throttle. Most of the time the engine speed will not be sufficent to match the speed that the wheels are turning. This will cause the rear tire to "bark" or "squeal".

Other who "blip" the throttle as they pull in the lcutch and change down do match the engine speed to the wheels. This is a much quicker series of movements that doesn't make the rear tire misbehave.

Novices do over rev slightly and may cause the bike to slightly acclerate (lurch) as the clutch is released.

Practice, practice, practice.
http://www.sportrider.com/downshifting-blipping-throttle
[/quote]

Good stuff, Britman
I have a very hard time comprehending how one can ride a motorcycle and not downshift as a part of normal riding.
Sounds like a lot here are more used to a Farmall or a Deere.
Saving the trans? For pete's sake it's a motorcycle and it's made to be ridden, not treated like an antique.
Coasting to a stop? It's not a bicycle, it a motorcycle.
I'm guessing these same riders would debate counter-steering because they don't understand that either.

[john]

                              never       
           no abuse ... ever     

[Alien]

I'm a downshifter.  I guess I'm a "blipper" too, as I take pride in smooth shifts with the speed and rpm matched.  Most of this mindset is left over from my big rig driving days where you are not supposed to coast longer than the length of the vehicle (at least that was the rule in CA at that time).  Of course, back then, I'd float an 18 speed all day long, only using the clutch to take off from a stop.

[Mr Whiskey]

Trucks yes,,,,,,,,,,gear down.

Bikes,,,,,,,read your manual for Christs Sake,,,mine says do just that.
Oh, well...................... if you learned it from a manual..........
Preventive Maintenance,,,,,,,,Never ever not once, exp a brake failure.
New's spelled NEW, not GOOD. It'll only take once.
I use the front brake more than the rear,,,,,,good habit in a panic stop to not

have to remember both brakes are the only way to WOW her down.
God love 'em! Ride safe Al!

[Mr Whiskey]

Never heard it called "Kid Skidding" before but this explains it better than I ever could.
Principles are the same regardless of what you ride, jus' not as dramatic.
Been practicing this technique on the Dragon since my first cb360t, & before ya start hollerin it caint be done on an 800 pound machine, ask my wife! I could do it on the Valk, & still can on the Wing, 2 up, with a 205 car tire. Like I said, it's jus' not as dramatic.

kid skidding with valentino rossi

[..]

What they didn't mention is the the bike is kept more upright doing this.

[Big Al of Tennessee]

Another one of these "Gee, I've never really thought about that..." threads.  Interesting.

Riding in fourth or high gear and seeing a stop ahead I typically engine break until the clutch needs to be engaged, and then I brake while downshifting for the stop. 

In lower gears I tend to clutch in/downshift and use the brakes more to avoid the lurching. 

I do all this because it seems most natural/comfortable for me and the bike and not for style points

I tend to sit at a stop in neutral as well - especially near the end of a long day riding when I'm starting to poop out.  And certainly if I'm familiar enough to know the red light is a long one.  Probably not a good idea, but honestly in a multi-lane traffic light situation with cars all around you where are you going to go IF...

Someone please help me understand the engine and tire wear comments in this thread.  Do some of you down shift to slow/stop to the point that you actually over rev and bark the rear tire?

What WOTON said..

He gets it. I like the way you think Woton.

[Big Al of Tennessee]

Trucks yes,,,,,,,,,,gear down.

Bikes,,,,,,,read your manual for Christs Sake,,,mine says do just that.
Oh, well...................... if you learned it from a manual..........
Preventive Maintenance,,,,,,,,Never ever not once, exp a brake failure.
New's spelled NEW, not GOOD. It'll only take once.
I use the front brake more than the rear,,,,,,good habit in a panic stop to not

have to remember both brakes are the only way to WOW her down.
God love 'em! Ride safe Al!

NEW? where did I say new.

Who said I did not use the brakes when allowing the bike to slow for the stop.

I just don't shift until I need to pull the clutch in to bring it to a halt.

[Mr Whiskey]

Engine Braking is good.

Brake Pads are cheaper than Clutches and Gears.

Roll up in 6th,,,,pull the Clutch in at 1200 rpm and then shift five times

from 6th to 1st then up one to neutral.

At least I try to do that every time.



Some folks thinks it is a sin to sit at a traffic light in neutral.

I do it anyway.

I aint worried 'bout ya sittin' at a light or stop sign in neutral waitin' to get rear ended, that's you a$$, but the thought of you COASTING in behind me in high gear on nothin' but brake DOES make me kinda nervous. You never had a brake failure Al? You wouldn't do that in a big truck would ya? Do you coast like that into turns without engine/tranny matched in proper gear for road & speed?
Always be 1 gear lower than you think you need to be, & never, ever trust your brakes.
My .02 worth Brother.

Trucks yes,,,,,,,,,,gear down.

Bikes,,,,,,,read your manual for Christs Sake,,,mine says do just that.

Preventive Maintenance,,,,,,,,Never ever not once, exp a brake failure.

I use the front brake more than the rear,,,,,,good habit in a panic stop to not

have to remember both brakes are the only way to WOW her down.

Trucks yes,,,,,,,,,,gear down.

Bikes,,,,,,,read your manual for Christs Sake,,,mine says do just that.
Oh, well...................... if you learned it from a manual..........
Preventive Maintenance,,,,,,,,Never ever not once, exp a brake failure.
New's spelled NEW, not GOOD. It'll only take once.
I use the front brake more than the rear,,,,,,good habit in a panic stop to not

have to remember both brakes are the only way to WOW her down.
God love 'em! Ride safe Al!

NEW? where did I say new.

Who said I did not use the brakes when allowing the bike to slow for the stop.

I just don't shift until I need to pull the clutch in to bring it to a halt.

You didn't say new, I did, but what is "preventative maintenance" Al? Doesn't that involve the "systematic inspection, detection, and correction of incipient failures either before they occur or before they develop into major defects". Would you call that a fair definition Al? If so, then wouldn't that involve the replacement of worn/defective parts when they are encountered?
So, I'm curious, what do you replace said parts with AL?
My obvious point being, even if you've never had a brand new, right outta the package, well inspected (by both those who made it & yourself or mechanic) brake line rupture, then you've been more blessed than you know, & have no reason to distinguish between the two spellings, new & good.
Go ahead & ride those brakes in, don't downshift. Trust 'em, & don't bother having the engine & tranny matched up for the road & speed.
I was jus' tryin' to learn ya sumthin & possibly save ya some grief down the road.
All parts can fail, new, used, PM'd, & if it happens on your brakes (assuming you survive) you damn sure learn in a hurry to ALWAYS be in the proper gear. Like I said, it only takes once!

[Big Al of Tennessee]

I Feel safe with separate braking systems.

One Front, One Rear.

New Fluid every year.

I even have a fail safe..

The ole lay her down maneuver. Not that I would.

Next time your riding down the road,,,with no one around you.

Hit the kill switch in 5th gear at 50mph.

That will knock the hell off the speed you are carrying.

Now I have a 4th way to panic stop.

[Mr Whiskey]

Next time your riding down the road,,,with no one around you.

Hit the kill switch in 5th gear at 50mph.

That will knock the hell off the speed you are carrying.

Gotta say, been there, done that & everybody had to turn around & come back for me. I thought I'd dun kill'd the sum b1tch or sumthin. Was so embarrassed!

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Depends on how I'm ridin'. In the city, slow speed, stop and go, I pull in the clutch and glide to a stop on brake power alone most of the time making sure to flash my brake lights. Frequently dropping down a few gears at a time while coming to a stop.

Otherwise, I usually blip and match engine speed to wheel speed as smoothly as possible. In this way I'm in the right gear to accelerate if needed or wanted.

In traffic when I'm worried about cagers paying attention to me I'll sometimes run a lower gear than normal to let my Mark T's announce my presence.