Why is it.........?

[MP]

When radical Muslims attack and kill people, we are Not allowed to comment about Muslims, or propose laws to stop them, or we have a phobia?  And it is forbidden.

When bad blacks riot and burn down buildings, we are not allowed to comment, or propose laws, or we are labeled "racist" and attacked by the left.

However, whenever a lone, crazy gunman kills someone, the Progressive Lefts FIRST instinct is to say we need more gun laws that affect EVERY legal gun owner, and they are all fine with lumping us together?

They keep taking about "sensible" gun laws that would STOP these killings.  Yet, it is apparent that NONE of the laws they have proposed, would have stopped these killings.

Pray tell, WHAT gun law would have stopped this?

Even if the law stopped one from "legally" buying a gun, WHAT stops them from buying in the alley?  Or from stealing a gun?

NOTHING.

The double standard PC line is so typical.

MP

[The emperor has no clothes]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

[dreamaker]

Majority of the time, the people doing the crimes use guns that are not registered to them, and often stolen, Right! But yet the people that follow the laws and the rules seem to always get blamed for the criminal’s actions.  I don't see the sense in it, its like you can't offend the offenders. Seems the logic is the longer you live in the US the more rights you lose.

[MP]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

IF you read what I said, I said that you are "NOT allowed to comment, WITHOUT being called racist, etc".  Something you, and especially DaddiO, are good at.

The point being, those who quickly call us names if we lump anyone together, immediately lump everyone together when it comes to gun control, and other liberal causes.

The PC is what PO's me, and others.


MP

[Sorcerer]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

IF you read what I said, I said that you are "NOT allowed to comment, WITHOUT being called racist, etc".  Something you, and especially DaddiO, are good at.

The point being, those who quickly call us names if we lump anyone together, immediately lump everyone together when it comes to gun control, and other liberal causes.

The PC is what PO's me, and others.


MP

Dude, I have never called you or anybody on here a racist, etc. And if you believe I did I would like to see that post. I have always done my best to refrain from name calling and inflammatory attacks. Yes I have different opinions than some on here, but I welcome all to express the views as they see them. I have learned much from opposing opinions. For you to say that about me is BULLSHIT ! And it's taking much restraint on my part right now to keep it civil. I don't want any apology from you , BUT I do want you to show where I have said those things about you or anyone else in this club.

[Pappy!]

Was watching Hannity last night and that subject came up. Liberal commentator to Hannity was exactly that. "If we close the Gun Show loophole and go to a national background check we can stop these senseless shootings because we will be taking the guns out of the criminals hands"
As if all the criminals get their guns from gun shows. Insert sound of crickets here. Typical La-La-Land liberal.
This guy probably actually believes that the same criminal will bother adhering to the "Gun Free Zone" signs.

[Wizzard]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

IF you read what I said, I said that you are "NOT allowed to comment, WITHOUT being called racist, etc".  Something you, and especially DaddiO, are good at.

The point being, those who quickly call us names if we lump anyone together, immediately lump everyone together when it comes to gun control, and other liberal causes.

The PC is what PO's me, and others.


MP

Dude, I have never called you or anybody on here a racist, etc. And if you believe I did I would like to see that post. I have always done my best to refrain from name calling and inflammatory attacks. Yes I have different opinions than some on here, but I welcome all to express the views as they see them. I have learned much from opposing opinions. For you to say that about me is BULLSHIT ! And it's taking much restraint on my part right now to keep it civil. I don't want any apology from you , BUT I do want you to show where I have said those things about you or anyone else in this club.

Meathead,,, I have not heard you call anyone racist. I dont always agree with you but I enjoy your posts and views.  Just FYI

[Serk]

Turns out this guy got his firearm legally, passed a background check, etc...

IMHO what they're gonna try to do is mandate proactive mental health screenings before you're allowed to purchase a firearm. I.E. Instead of "If you've got problems you're put on a black list and can't buy a gun" they're gonna push to make it "No one can buy a gun unless we say you can on an individual basis."


Of course, then we get to the issue of who defines "crazy"...

[Patrick]

Majority of the time, the people doing the crimes use guns that are not registered to them, and often stolen, Right! But yet the people that follow the laws and the rules seem to always get blamed for the criminal’s actions.  I don't see the sense in it, its like you can't offend the offenders. Seems the logic is the longer you live in the US the more rights you lose.

The Cato Institute released a report stating that we [USA] are now 20th of the industrialized nations in personal freedoms due to our increased secular progressive tendencies leading to our nanny state.

[Wizzard]

i still say its not a "gun problem"
Its a "heart issue"

[The emperor has no clothes]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

IF you read what I said, I said that you are "NOT allowed to comment, WITHOUT being called racist, etc".  Something you, and especially DaddiO, are good at.

The point being, those who quickly call us names if we lump anyone together, immediately lump everyone together when it comes to gun control, and other liberal causes.

The PC is what PO's me, and others.


MP

Dude, I have never called you or anybody on here a racist, etc. And if you believe I did I would like to see that post. I have always done my best to refrain from name calling and inflammatory attacks. Yes I have different opinions than some on here, but I welcome all to express the views as they see them. I have learned much from opposing opinions. For you to say that about me is BULLSHIT ! And it's taking much restraint on my part right now to keep it civil. I don't want any apology from you , BUT I do want you to show where I have said those things about you or anyone else in this club.

Meathead,,, I have not heard you call anyone racist. I dont always agree with you but I enjoy your posts and views.  Just FYI

Thank you   I enjoy yours also. It would be a pretty crappy place if we all thought alike. Though it seems some would like it.

[old2soon]

Mel-maybe just rabid hysteria. ALL the firearms I used to own-before the tragic aquatic incident-were loaded and NOT a single one of them ever discharged on their own. But I duz understand what yer sayin. In a nutshell-iffin it pisses off the obumnater-don't talk about it!   I try my very best too piss off at least one liberal everyday!   RIDE SAFE

[Gryphon Rider]

Who said you couldn't talk about any of those things ?

IF you read what I said, I said that you are "NOT allowed to comment, WITHOUT being called racist, etc".  Something you, and especially DaddiO, are good at.

The point being, those who quickly call us names if we lump anyone together, immediately lump everyone together when it comes to gun control, and other liberal causes.

The PC is what PO's me, and others.


MP

Dude, I have never called you or anybody on here a racist, etc. And if you believe I did I would like to see that post. I have always done my best to refrain from name calling and inflammatory attacks. Yes I have different opinions than some on here, but I welcome all to express the views as they see them. I have learned much from opposing opinions. For you to say that about me is BULLSHIT ! And it's taking much restraint on my part right now to keep it civil. I don't want any apology from you , BUT I do want you to show where I have said those things about you or anyone else in this club.

Yup, MP, you're talking out your back side when you accuse Meathead of name-calling.  If it's happened, I don't recall it.

[dreamaker]

Who call, who what!  Who cares!  These are only our opinions, they are like smoke in the air and are subject to change.  Lets get over it, and move on!! 

[baldo]

I sense a great butthurt in the cosmos.......lots of talk about name calling. It sounds like arguments around the dinner table when my kids were young.

[GiG]

I sense a great butthurt ...

     

[BF]

i still say its not a "gun problem"
Its a "heart issue"

It's a f'n crazy person with a gun issue. 

[baldo]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip (ahem, I mean magazine) with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?

[3fan4life]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?

You can trust in gun laws, the government and the police to protect you if you wish.

I'll trust in God and Smith & Wesson.

[Wizzard]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?

So if a gun did not have a clip it would not kill??? Where is the logic in that? I bet someone with a single hammer could kill quite a few in a short amt of time.

[Wizzard]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?
[/quote]


So if a gun did not have a clip it would not kill??? Where is the logic in that? I bet someone with a single hammer could kill quite a few in a short amt of time. And if you have 2 hands,, I suppose you could maximize using 2 hammers!

[G-Man]

Majority of the time, the people doing the crimes use guns that are not registered to them, and often stolen, Right! But yet the people that follow the laws and the rules seem to always get blamed for the criminal’s actions.  I don't see the sense in it, its like you can't offend the offenders. Seems the logic is the longer you live in the US the more rights you lose.

Cars used in crimes are stolen as well.  Pretty soon they'll ban cars.   

[art]

Baseball is getting so dangerous, it should be banned. Look how many people are getting hurt buy flying balls and broken bats. Should be a law, call your congressman.

[GiG]

Baseball is getting so dangerous, it should be banned. Look how many people are getting hurt buy flying balls and broken bats. Should be a law, call your congressman.

Yeah.  
Motorcycles too, bunch a crazy ass bikers on murdercycles tearin up the road everywhere.
Need to be BANNED.  

[Moonshot_1]

When radical Muslims attack and kill people, we are Not allowed to comment about Muslims, or propose laws to stop them, or we have a phobia?  And it is forbidden.

When bad blacks riot and burn down buildings, we are not allowed to comment, or propose laws, or we are labeled "racist" and attacked by the left.

However, whenever a lone, crazy gunman kills someone, the Progressive Lefts FIRST instinct is to say we need more gun laws that affect EVERY legal gun owner, and they are all fine with lumping us together?

They keep taking about "sensible" gun laws that would STOP these killings.  Yet, it is apparent that NONE of the laws they have proposed, would have stopped these killings.

Pray tell, WHAT gun law would have stopped this?

Even if the law stopped one from "legally" buying a gun, WHAT stops them from buying in the alley?  Or from stealing a gun?

NOTHING.

The double standard PC line is so typical.

MP

Well, let's start by refuting the claim that making such comments are "forbidden"

They are not. And those who would oppose our views of the radical muslims, the "bad blacks" rioting and burning down building are not forbidden to exercise their right to make their view known.

The "liberal view", at least the prevailing one, as it relates to guns is short sighted at best. Always wanting some kind of new law thinking that will resolve the violence. People are violent, not the guns.

Alway shake my head at businesses that post "No weapons allowed" signs. Really?

I'm certain the mad man with the gun will run up to the door, read the sign, and be dejected and simply walk away.
You can insert the sarcasm font there. 

The real result from the "liberal" approach to gun laws is to simply create an incredible safe haven for the shooter. We warehouse victims for the shooters.

The reality we want is for an environment that is toxic for a rouge shooter and that they know that going in they will be met with overwhelming resistance. Instantly. If they still want to go in  I would doubt that they would want the instant confrontation.

[Moonshot_1]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?

You want to limit the gun capacity. So the proper analogy would be to limit the chain saw to 2.5 seconds of fuel or a single dull tooth and the hammer to disintegrate after one use. That way you can't chain saw or bludgeon a bunch of people to death.

[Detn8er]

The firearm is only a tool. Only one of many tools. Walk into any place be it Dicks Sporting goods, Walmart, Target, any home building center and pick your tool. Framing hammer, crow bar, chainsaw, machty, snap blade box cutter..... Walmart, Target have some really nice cuttlery items. It is a tool until it's used as a weapon. Where there is a will there is a way.

I'd like to see a clip with 15 chainsaws or framing hammers. How would that work?

So if a gun did not have a clip it would not kill??? Where is the logic in that? I bet someone with a single hammer could kill quite a few in a short amt of time. And if you have 2 hands,, I suppose you could maximize using 2 hammers!


[/quote]

HUGE SIGH.......What the hell is a "clip"? Yes I know the answer........aaaaaaAAAARRRRGHHHH!!! 

[Serk]

Beware the assault clip!

[Detn8er]

Beware the assault clip!

Good one.....It just bugs the crap out of me when a MAGAZINE is referred to as a clip.   

[Jess from VA]

Me too, but if you think about it, whenever blatantly incorrect terminology is used (esp in the press), it instantly telegraphs that the author (and publication or network) is ignorant and unworthy of any serious consideration.

Hey, those revolvers don't even have a safety on them.      

[Bighead]

When radical Muslims attack and kill people, we are Not allowed to comment about Muslims, or propose laws to stop them, or we have a phobia?  And it is forbidden.

When bad blacks riot and burn down buildings, we are not allowed to comment, or propose laws, or we are labeled "racist" and attacked by the left.

However, whenever a lone, crazy gunman kills someone, the Progressive Lefts FIRST instinct is to say we need more gun laws that affect EVERY legal gun owner, and they are all fine with lumping us together?

They keep taking about "sensible" gun laws that would STOP these killings.  Yet, it is apparent that NONE of the laws they have proposed, would have stopped these killings.

Pray tell, WHAT gun law would have stopped this?

Even if the law stopped one from "legally" buying a gun, WHAT stops them from buying in the alley?  Or from stealing a gun?

NOTHING.

The double standard PC line is so typical.

MP

Well, let's start by refuting the claim that making such comments are "forbidden"

They are not. And those who would oppose our views of the radical muslims, the "bad blacks" rioting and burning down building are not forbidden to exercise their right to make their view known.

The "liberal view", at least the prevailing one, as it relates to guns is short sighted at best. Always wanting some kind of new law thinking that will resolve the violence. People are violent, not the guns.

Alway shake my head at businesses that post "No weapons allowed" signs. Really?

I'm certain the mad man with the gun will run up to the door, read the sign, and be dejected and simply walk away.
You can insert the sarcasm font there. 

The real result from the "liberal" approach to gun laws is to simply create an incredible safe haven for the shooter. We warehouse victims for the shooters.

The reality we want is for an environment that is toxic for a rouge shooter and that they know that going in they will be met with overwhelming resistance. Instantly. If they still want to go in  I would doubt that they would want the instant confrontation.

I work with a guy pretty good fella but there has never been a more liberal minded guy on anything. We were talking about gun control one day and he was spouting off why there needed to be such and such laws so it would take guns out of the hands of criminals, I just looked at him in kind of a stunned way and said tougher gun laws will do nothing but take guns from law abiding citizens and do you think criminals get there guns legally? He had no answer. I told him he could have all my guns and destroy them and I would never own another if he would do one simple thing he says OK what. I told him he had to put a sign in his front yard 12' x 12' that said please come Rob me and rape my wife and children because there are no guns in my house I don't believe in them. I said put that sign in your yard and leave it for 7 days all the while you went on with everyday life he could have them and he said are you crazy I said no but now you see the need for a gun? Needless to say he refused my offer

[T.P.]

I think there are some people who just want to be offended by everything!!  T.P.

[dreamaker]

I think there are some people who just want to be offended by everything!!  T.P.

I agree!  Its called misery likes company.

[baldo]

Beware the assault clip!

Good one.....It just bugs the crap out of me when a MAGAZINE is referred to as a clip.   

Very nice graphic.....I stand here, red-faced. You're absolutely right, I mistakenly referred to a magazine of chain saws and hammers to a clip. I apologize....http://www.minutemanreview.com/2008/09/clip-vs-magazine-lesson-in-firearm.html .....

You learn something new every day, sometimes from the unlikeliest of places.....

[Daddie O]

When radical Muslims attack and kill people, we are Not allowed to comment about Muslims, or propose laws to stop them, or we have a phobia?  And it is forbidden.

When bad blacks riot and burn down buildings, we are not allowed to comment, or propose laws, or we are labeled "racist" and attacked by the left.

However, whenever a lone, crazy gunman kills someone, the Progressive Lefts FIRST instinct is to say we need more gun laws that affect EVERY legal gun owner, and they are all fine with lumping us together?

They keep taking about "sensible" gun laws that would STOP these killings.  Yet, it is apparent that NONE of the laws they have proposed, would have stopped these killings.

Pray tell, WHAT gun law would have stopped this?

Even if the law stopped one from "legally" buying a gun, WHAT stops them from buying in the alley?  Or from stealing a gun?

NOTHING.

The double standard PC line is so typical.

MP

I'm wondering what the point of your post is.  It seems to be kind of a mixed up argument.  On one hand you are complaining the you aren't allowed to group wide swaths of people based on both the actions of a few, and their color of skin and/or religion, and make laws to "stop them", without being called a racist.  On the other hand you are chastising people who want to "lump together" legal gun owners, and create some gun control laws. 

What I am trying to figure out is, if you think it should be ok to lump large populations of people together based on the action of the few, then why are you against "progressive lefts" for doing so?  Do you think it wrong that "progressive lefts" do so, or are you just upset that you don't get to do the same?

Another issue is, you are talking about lumping people together based on color of skin, and making laws that target them.  That is pretty much the definition of racism, no?  If an airplane pilot crashed a plane full of people because he was drunk, don't you think it fair for people to suggest a law that pilots shouldn't drink and fly, even though most law abiding pilots would never do that anyway?  What about screening pilots for drug addiction before issuing licenses?  I think what is mostly being suggested by the "progressive left" is better screening for mental health issues before the sale of weapons.

As far as the argument that anything can be used as a weapon, such as a knife, hammer or chainsaw, their lethality potential is not equal.  If you disagree, then you can bring your knife to a gunfight.

Another issue is, these lone gunman, or terrorist cells, are not deterred by the thought of someone else having a gun.  They don't think for a minute that they are going to "get away with it", and live to tell the tale.  They are on suicide missions like kamikazes. They both fully expect, and want to be killed, so your assertion that it is only legal gun owners that prevent these catastrophes is false.  Pretty much every police officer killed is a legal gun owner, and carrying a loaded weapon at the time of their death.

I think we can all agree that we would like to see less murder.  The means to accomplish that goal is complex.  My belief is that the problem mainly lies with our culture that glorifies violence.  Violence on TV, movies, and video games may be contributing factors.  The fact that pretty much every generation of Americans are involved in war may be a contributing factor.  What are the solutions?  I don't know, but limiting the mentally ill from obtaining weapons is a step that I support.  Will it stop all gun murders?  Of course not.  Making drinking and driving illegal doesn't prevent all deaths due to drinking and driving, but would you suggest that there shouldn't be laws preventing it?

[Daddie O]

When radical Muslims attack and kill people, we are Not allowed to comment about Muslims, or propose laws to stop them, or we have a phobia?  And it is forbidden.

When bad blacks riot and burn down buildings, we are not allowed to comment, or propose laws, or we are labeled "racist" and attacked by the left.

MP

These first two lines are kind of ridiculous, and I will explain why.  Propose laws to "stop them"?  Are you suggesting there aren't laws against attacking and killing people already?  Are you really asking why you would be labeled racist for proposing laws that target a specific group because they are black?  What laws are you proposing to "stop them"?

[3fan4life]

What are the solutions?  I don't know, but limiting the mentally ill from obtaining weapons is a step that I support. 

It already is illegal:

From the Federal Firearms Application:

Question 11.b. - 11.l.  Definition of Prohibited Person:
  Generally, 18
U.S.C. § 922 prohibits the shipment, transportation, receipt, or possession in
or affecting interstate commerce of a firearm by one who:  has been convicted
of a misdemeanor crime of domestic violence; has been convicted of a felony,
or any other crime, punishable by imprisonment for a term exceeding one year
(this does not include State misdemeanors punishable by imprisonment of
two years or less)
; is a fugitive from justice; is an unlawful user of, or
addicted to, marijuana or any depressant, stimulant, or narcotic drug, or any
other controlled substance; has been adjudicated mentally defective or has
been committed to a mental institution; has been discharged from the Armed
Forces under dishonorable conditions; has renounced his or her U.S.
citizenship; is an alien illegally in the United States or an alien admitted to the
United States under a nonimmigrant visa; or is subject to certain restraining
orders.  Furthermore, section 922 prohibits the shipment, transportation, or
receipt in or affecting interstate commerce of a firearm by one who is under
indictment or information for a felony, or any other crime, punishable by
imprisonment for a term exceeding one year.

https://www.atf.gov/file/61446/download


So how is passing additional laws going to help??

Why can't we just INSIST that the laws already on the books be enforced??

[Oss]

Aha 3fan you have placed your finger on the exact issue

Like it has been said

"All animals are created equal but some are more equal than others"

The laws are not enforced equally, presently the fact is that it is so and no wishing from
either end of the political spectrum will make it not so

Here is how bad it is in NY

Yesterday I went to a NYC officer as he exited his cruiser on White Plains Rd across the street from my office (he was black but he could have been white
the answer would be the same) and attempted to report a crime in progress
Apparently the code for going to buy a snack and coffee trumps crime fighting

I was told to call the precinct  This is not the first time I have been turned away


This is why all law abiding people should be required to possess a firearm so as to be able to discharge our obligations as citizens of the republic. and all citizens should be able to go to centers located in every town to learn proper safety and marksmanship  Switzerland is the sterling example of this way of life.  When was the last time they were at war?
and what is their murder rate with access to the same video games

And how do they treat those who would force the Koran on their culture

[Bighead]

Aha 3fan you have placed your finger on the exact issue

Like it has been said

"All animals are created equal but some are more equal than others"

The laws are not enforced equally, presently the fact is that it is so and no wishing from
either end of the political spectrum will make it not so

Here is how bad it is in NY

Yesterday I went to a NYC officer as he exited his cruiser on White Plains Rd across the street from my office (he was black but he could have been white
the answer would be the same) and attempted to report a crime in progress
Apparently the code for going to buy a snack and coffee trumps crime fighting

I was told to call the precinct  This is not the first time I have been turned away


This is why all law abiding people should be required to possess a firearm so as to be able to discharge our obligations as citizens of the republic. and all citizens should be able to go to centers located in every town to learn proper safety and marksmanship  Switzerland is the sterling example of this way of life.  When was the last time they were at war?

At least in my opinion anyway

LEO should have a few days off without pay to. Rethink his choice in profession