No start (part 2)

[Hook#3287]

98 gl1500 ct 45k.

I did a complete front end tare down and clean this winter.

Went to take her out, put the charged 1 yr old battery in, hooked up the cables, turned the key and no start.

Battery checks out at 12.78 volts sitting, 12.35 volts when key is on and the same when starter button is hit.   I hooked a second battery showing 12.7 volts sitting, to the bike battery, just for added boost, no change.

Thought maybe I missed some wiring connections in the headlight, but all is good.

Light goes out when start button is hit.  Does that rule out the start switch not working?  I would seem so to me.  The switch dims the light, so it works? Right?  I'll do a cleaning anyways, but if it dims the light?

No starter relay clicking.  Haven't tested it yet.  How should I go about doing that?  Take it apart like the manual says, or can I do it still on the bike?  If I connect the two posts on the relay, should that start the bike?

Dog bone fuse and 10 amp starter fuse good.

I didn't spend alot of time on it, cause I had to go.

Any suggestions?

[The emperor has no clothes]

Bill, the 2 times that my starter switch needed cleaning it acted just like you are describing. The headlight would go out but nothing. Sometimes I could push down on the switch while pushing it in and it would make contact. But a good cleaning is probably what's needed.   You'll be glad to hear you won't have to worry about it with your new I/S.

[Hook#3287]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try.

You'll be glad to hear you won't have to worry about it with your new I/S.

And why is that? Different switch?

[Bighead]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try

First thing I would do is make sure the kill switch is on next clean the starter switch

[Hook#3287]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try

First thing I would do is make sure the kill switch is on next clean the starter switch

Yeah, second thing I checked after making sure the stand was up.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try.

You'll be glad to hear you won't have to worry about it with your new I/S.

And why is that? Different switch?

No, it's because they put relays on the Interstates. Keeps that power for the headlights from going thru the switch. I think if I was to ride my Standard much I would get one of those SmartSwitches from BonS. If you plan on riding your Tourers much it would probably be money well spent.  Luckily the times mine have messed up on me I was able to get it going, but it would suck to be dead in the water out here in the desert at 120*.

[Hook#3287]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try.

You'll be glad to hear you won't have to worry about it with your new I/S.

And why is that? Different switch?

No, it's because they put relays on the Interstates. Keeps that power for the headlights from going thru the switch. I think if I was to ride my Standard much I would get one of those SmartSwitches from BonS. If you plan on riding your Tourers much it would probably be money well spent.  Luckily the times mine have messed up on me I was able to get it going, but it would suck to be dead in the water out here in the desert at 120*.

Ok, relays, I'm showing my Interstate ignorance 

[The emperor has no clothes]

Thanks Rob, cleaning is the first thing I'll try.

You'll be glad to hear you won't have to worry about it with your new I/S.

And why is that? Different switch?

No, it's because they put relays on the Interstates. Keeps that power for the headlights from going thru the switch. I think if I was to ride my Standard much I would get one of those SmartSwitches from BonS. If you plan on riding your Tourers much it would probably be money well spent.  Luckily the times mine have messed up on me I was able to get it going, but it would suck to be dead in the water out here in the desert at 120*.

Ok, relays, I'm showing my Interstate ignorance 

I predict you are going to love your I/S. I hardly ride my Standard much any more. 

[BobB]

One could always try to jumper the large contacts of the starter relay with a screwdriver.  If it rolls over, your problem is in the starter relay or in the circuits that trigger it.  The starter switch, kill switch, side stand switch, neutral switch and clutch switch are all involved...

[hukmut]

Yeah, I was about to say the clutch switch. Mine corroded and the bike would not start. Replaced it and, voila! Easy.


Ride safe...

[Hook#3287]

Finally got the time to check it out.

The start switch was a little dirty and somewhat messed up.  Can't remember if I've been in there before or not and to lazy to check my log, so I'm going with, yep, been there before.   Looked like it was a little burnt, but could be broken from taking it apart before.

Cleaned it up, stretched the little spring under the copper 2 ball plate thingie and put it back together with out a difference to the no start issue.

Made the connection at the relay as BobB suggested and she turned over.

Did the check on page 18-16 in the manual, checking for continuity between the red/green wire and ground and got none. 

30 amp fuse in the relay was good.

Going to go with the relay, so I 'll order one up and get a new start switch at the same time.  Sucks you have to buy the whole assembly just for that little switch

Heading out tomorrow for GA to get my NTM Interstate, so not gonna have the opportunity to fix this girl till I get back in May.

[pancho]

Hook, before you start buying parts, a little time with a voltmeter and the wiring diagram in section 21 of the SM will lead you right to the problem. You stated you did   "a complete front end tare down ",     which I assume means you had undid all the wiring in the headlight bucket to remove it...  I would start there with a voltmeter. 

Good luck on your trip,, the best kind of trip, for a new bike.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Finally got the time to check it out.

The start switch was a little dirty and somewhat messed up.  Can't remember if I've been in there before or not and to lazy to check my log, so I'm going with, yep, been there before.   Looked like it was a little burnt, but could be broken from taking it apart before.

Cleaned it up, stretched the little spring under the copper 2 ball plate thingie and put it back together with out a difference to the no start issue.

Made the connection at the relay as BobB suggested and she turned over.

Did the check on page 18-16 in the manual, checking for continuity between the red/green wire and ground and got none. 

30 amp fuse in the relay was good.

Going to go with the relay, so I 'll order one up and get a new start switch at the same time.  Sucks you have to buy the whole assembly just for that little switch

Heading out tomorrow for GA to get my NTM Interstate, so not gonna have the opportunity to fix this girl till I get back in May.

Ride Safe my friend 

[Hook#3287]

Hook, before you start buying parts, a little time with a voltmeter and the wiring diagram in section 21 of the SM will lead you right to the problem. You stated you did   "a complete front end tare down ",     which I assume means you had undid all the wiring in the headlight bucket to remove it...  I would start there with a voltmeter. 

Good luck on your trip,, the best kind of trip, for a new bike.

Pancho, thanks for the advice, but to late, I ordered the relay.  Actually, I ordered two.  Having spares is something I seem to like.  I figure, if I need one, I'll need another sometime.

Not having time to check everything, having the relay here when I get back is good.  I did check to see everything was connected in the headlamp.

There was some corrosion on the terminals and I don't hear any "clicking" when I hit the start button, so I suspect the relay.

To be continued.

Rob, thanks for the post.

[gordonv]

Some have had to service the starter switch twice, before getting it to work.

[NewValker]

Bill, have a good ride back and be safe.
Enjoy the time with the nephew!
Craig

[Hook#3287]

I hate electrical issues, they suck.

Ok, so I'm back and am working on the 98 ct.

I put a new starter switch/kill switch assembly on with NO difference, still no start. The switch was suspect, old  and getting so I couldn't count on it, so it needed to be swapped.

I swapped the starter relay with one out of Penny, I know it works cause it did just before swap.

Still no start.

Relay's are good according to the test on page 18-17 in the manual.

No continuity at the relay ground, as per test on page 18-16.

No voltage at the relay, as per test on page 18-16.

Power to the relay cause the starter turns when I jump the cable connectors at the relay.

Clutch lever switch has continuity.

Side stand switch must be working cause the light goes out, right?

If that's true, I believe that leaves the neutral switch.

Do I need to remove the tank to check it?  The manual states to check it at the red connector, but was hoping someone knows a better way.  Maybe? Hopefully?

Did I mention how much I hate electrical issues?

Any help is GREATLY appreciated.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I hate electrical issues, they suck.

Ok, so I'm back and am working on the 98 ct.

I put a new starter switch/kill switch assembly on with NO difference, still no start. The switch was suspect, old  and getting so I couldn't count on it, so it needed to be swapped.

I swapped the starter relay with one out of Penny, I know it works cause it did just before swap.

Still no start.

Relay's are good according to the test on page 18-17 in the manual.

No continuity at the relay ground, as per test on page 18-16.

No voltage at the relay, as per test on page 18-16.

Power to the relay cause the starter turns when I jump the cable connectors at the relay.

Clutch lever switch has continuity.

Side stand switch must be working cause the light goes out, right?

If that's true, I believe that leaves the neutral switch.

Do I need to remove the tank to check it?  The manual states to check it at the red connector, but was hoping someone knows a better way.  Maybe? Hopefully?

Did I mention how much I hate electrical issues?

Any help is GREATLY appreciated.

Hey Bill, you've already had to go further than I have needed to in the past. So I'm just throwing out some ideas. How about a removal and cleaning of the kill switch ? Also wouldn't the neutral switch only come into play if it wouldn't start in neutral ? It seems your problem is also when in gear with the clutch in.

[Firefighter]

Book says to test netural switch through the right steering cover.

Disconnect the 4P (red) connector and check for continuity between the light green/red wire terminal of the engine sub-harness side connector and ground.

There should be continuity when the transmission is in netural and no continuity when the transmission is in gear.

Also I think the bank angle sensor could cause a no start.

[Firefighter]

The failed test that you did the 18-16 ones indicate one of the switches you have been testing are not working or a bad connection, broken wire etc. The starter worked fine before your front rebuild right?
I know you checked your work but,,,,, sure seems your problem is in the origional wiring or connections you had apart or moved around. Think I would push pull stertch wires and make sure.

[Hook#3287]

How about a removal and cleaning of the kill switch ?

Rob, brandy new.

Book says to test netural switch through the right steering cover.

Yeah, I was hoping for a different approach.  Being lazy, I hoped to not have to remove the tank.  Not looking so good.

The starter worked fine before your front rebuild right?

Yep.  And I can get it to work by jumping the posts at the relay.

I know you checked your work but,,,,, sure seems your problem is in the origional wiring or connections you had apart or moved around.

Did that again today, found one that looked like it might not have been connected completely, but no diff.  Maybe I'll check once more when I get my patience back.

Also I think the bank angle sensor could cause a no start.

I thought of that, but, no reason for it to be triggered, didn't touch it and didn't drop the bike.  How do I rule that out? Unplug it?

Did I mention how much I hate electrical issues?

[Firefighter]

Looks like they used a special tool to test the bank angle sensor, looks like a special wire harness.

Another test requires you to remove the sensor.

There is also an angle sensor relay, ain't this fun?

[Crashgordon74]

Not sure if this will help but try cleaning the end of the ground strap where it fastens to the engine block. Just take it loose and lightly sand the block and the connector at the end of the ground cable. You have to go under the alternator to get to the connection. Be prepared for muttering under your breath, loud screams, furrowed brows and gnashing of teeth. If your hands are larger than mine..... may god go with you my son. Anyway I had most of your symptoms earlier this year. I cleaned the starter switch, cleaned the relay/solenoid as best I could and bought a new battery even though NAPA said mine was o.k. Nothing worked until I cleaned the ground connection. Good luck.

                                                                Crash

[Hook#3287]

There is also an angle sensor relay, ain't this fun?

Oh Great!  Angle sensor relay!  For joy, For joy!

I'm having a BLAST!

Anyways, I guess I lied when I said I didn't touch the angle sensor, I did, when I moved the position of my air shocks valve which is mounted on the middle cover.

But it was only moved forward a bit and then put right back and has been upright since, about 3 months, and the key has been off and on about a hundred times since, so it should have reset, right?

Not sure if this will help but try cleaning the end of the ground strap where it fastens to the engine block

Crashgordon74, I'll give that a try, can't hurt.

Looks like I'll remove the dang gas tank so I can get to the red dohicky under the right front tank side cover.

[da prez]

Bill , sent you a PM. Call me anytime as rain cancelled two jobs.

                                 da prez  (Ross)

[Paladin528]

The bank angle sensor should have reset.  I have had mine out and it will operate as long as it is oriented correctly.  You have to rotate it quite far or it to kill the engine.
The Ground is a really good suggestion.