The Mother of All Bombs Dropped in Afghanistan

[Reb]

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2017/04/13/us-drops-largest-non-nuclear-bomb-in-afghanistan-after-green-beret-killed.html

The U.S. military dropped its largest non-nuclear bomb in eastern Afghanistan on Thursday, just days after a Green Beret was killed fighting ISIS there, a U.S. defense official confirmed to Fox News.

The GBU-43B, a 21,000-pound conventional bomb, was dropped on an ISIS tunnel complex in Nangarhar Province.

The Massive Ordinance Air Blast was first tested in 2003. (DOD)


The MOAB -- Massive Ordinance Air Blast -- is also known as the "Mother Of All bombs." It was first tested in 2003, but hadn't been used in combat before Thursday.

WHAT IS THE 'MOTHER OF ALL BOMBS'?

The MOAB is so massive it had to be dropped out of the back of a U.S. Air Force C-130 cargo plane.

"We kicked it out the back door," one U.S. official told Fox News.

For comparison to the 21,000-pound MOAB, each Tomahawk cruise missile launched at a Syrian military air base last week was 1,000-pounds each.

"As [ISIS'] losses have mounted, they are using IEDs, bunkers and tunnels to thicken their defense," Gen. John Nicholson, commander of U.S. forces in Afghanistan, said in a statement. "This is the right munition to reduce these obstacles and maintain the momentum of our offensive against [ISIS]."

The statement said U.S. forces took every precaution to avoid civilian casualties.


Modern Marvels on MOAB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i9H50tHiHjs

[GiG]

That's pretty cool crap, Reb!

It's not new technology, is it?

Hasn't MOAB been available the last, say, 8 years?

"AMAZING" what the current president can accomplish while traveling and playin golf in FLA, aint it!  

[Patrick]

Well, the man isn't afraid to 'test the waters'.  Only time will tell how this STUFF works out.

[Valkorado]

Mega-boom!   

[NewValker]

only 1 ??
Craig

[Robert]

Brings a whole new meaning to reach out and touch someone.

[Hooter]

Was available in 2002.

[RDAbull]

I hope they drop the Father next week.

[Robert]

This bomb is particularly deadly and even for those in tunnels its the shock wave that actually kills. This below is out of Wikipedia. This is what this bomb was designed for.

The [blast] kill mechanism against living targets is unique–and unpleasant.... What kills is the pressure wave, and more importantly, the subsequent rarefaction [vacuum], which ruptures the lungs.... If the fuel deflagrates but does not detonate, victims will be severely burned and will probably also inhale the burning fuel. Since the most common FAE fuels, ethylene oxide and propylene oxide, are highly toxic, undetonated FAE should prove as lethal to personnel caught within the cloud as most chemical agents.

According to a U.S. Central Intelligence Agency study "the effect of an FAE explosion within confined spaces is immense. Those near the ignition point are obliterated. Those at the fringe are likely to suffer many internal, and thus invisible injuries, including burst eardrums and crushed inner ear organs, severe concussions, ruptured lungs and internal organs, and possibly blindness." Another Defense Intelligence Agency document speculates that because the "shock and pressure waves cause minimal damage to brain tissue…it is possible that victims of FAEs are not rendered unconscious by the blast, but instead suffer for several seconds or minutes while they suffocate".

[old2soon]

This bomb is particularly deadly and even for those in tunnels its the shock wave that actually kills. This below is out of Wikipedia. This is what this bomb was designed for.

The [blast] kill mechanism against living targets is unique–and unpleasant.... What kills is the pressure wave, and more importantly, the subsequent rarefaction [vacuum], which ruptures the lungs.... If the fuel deflagrates but does not detonate, victims will be severely burned and will probably also inhale the burning fuel. Since the most common FAE fuels, ethylene oxide and propylene oxide, are highly toxic, undetonated FAE should prove as lethal to personnel caught within the cloud as most chemical agents.

According to a U.S. Central Intelligence Agency study "the effect of an FAE explosion within confined spaces is immense. Those near the ignition point are obliterated. Those at the fringe are likely to suffer many internal, and thus invisible injuries, including burst eardrums and crushed inner ear organs, severe concussions, ruptured lungs and internal organs, and possibly blindness." Another Defense Intelligence Agency document speculates that because the "shock and pressure waves cause minimal damage to brain tissue...it is possible that victims of FAEs are not rendered unconscious by the blast, but instead suffer for several seconds or minutes while they suffocate".

nudder words one HUMONGOUS bitch slap!  RIDE SAFE.

[gordonv]

2002 - 2003' ? I thought this was used/tested in Vietnam. It was a fuel air burst bomb to clear landing sites for helicopter, used on the top of hills.

There was some bomb they used this name on, and they also called it a MOAB. I remember it, because of the Moab desert.

[Serk]

2002 - 2003' ? I thought this was used/tested in Vietnam. It was a fuel air burst bomb to clear landing sites for helicopter, used on the top of hills.

The Vietnam bomb was the BLU-82B "Daisy Cutter", a 15,000 pound bomb...

This new bomb is the GBU-43 Massive Ordnance Air Blast (MOAB), coming in at 22,600 pounds.

[sleepngbear]

I hope they drop the Father next week.

Russia actually has the 'father', reportedly four times more powerful than the MOAB. Scary. 

http://www.businessinsider.com/heres-the-father-of-all-bombs-russias-answer-to-the-moab-2017-4

[Alpha Dog]

The one tested in circa 2003 sent a mushroom cloud up to 10k feet.  Probably in Rebs youtube he inserted.  Trump has said he has given Generals full range to use what they deem necessary and to take off the shakels of the lawyers from the previous administration and frankly the Bush administration to some degree.  I have heard a few officers interviewed in last few days and the rules of engagement and lawyers just leaves one shaking their head.  There is new excitement within the ranks of rules changes.  All this should come as no surprise.  The Potus said he was going to bomb the hell ( may have used more choice words at times ) out of Isis.

[Reb]

This bomb is particularly deadly and even for those in tunnels its the shock wave that actually kills. This below is out of Wikipedia. This is what this bomb was designed for.

The [blast] kill mechanism against living targets is unique–and unpleasant.... What kills is the pressure wave, and more importantly, the subsequent rarefaction [vacuum], which ruptures the lungs.... If the fuel deflagrates but does not detonate, victims will be severely burned and will probably also inhale the burning fuel. Since the most common FAE fuels, ethylene oxide and propylene oxide, are highly toxic, undetonated FAE should prove as lethal to personnel caught within the cloud as most chemical agents.

According to a U.S. Central Intelligence Agency study "the effect of an FAE explosion within confined spaces is immense. Those near the ignition point are obliterated. Those at the fringe are likely to suffer many internal, and thus invisible injuries, including burst eardrums and crushed inner ear organs, severe concussions, ruptured lungs and internal organs, and possibly blindness." Another Defense Intelligence Agency document speculates that because the "shock and pressure waves cause minimal damage to brain tissue...it is possible that victims of FAEs are not rendered unconscious by the blast, but instead suffer for several seconds or minutes while they suffocate".

nudder words one HUMONGOUS bitch slap!  RIDE SAFE.

After last week's Tomahawk missile throw down from the world's finest Navy... the USAF decided to show them up 

Air Force always trying to 1 up us ole sea dawgs 

[3fan4life]

The one tested in circa 2003 sent a mushroom cloud up to 10k feet.  Probably in Rebs youtube he inserted.  Trump has said he has given Generals full range to use what they deem necessary and to take off the shakels of the lawyers from the previous administration and frankly the Bush administration to some degree.  I have heard a few officers interviewed in last few days and the rules of engagement and lawyers just leaves one shaking their head.  There is new excitement within the ranks of rules changes.  All this should come as no surprise.  The Potus said he was going to bomb the hell ( may have used more choice words at times ) out of Isis.

Trump is a President that will put qualified people into place and then let them do their jobs.

Any President worth his salt will let the Generals run the war.

"ANYTHING" that kills Terrorist is OK with me.

I hope that we have a million or so of these things in our arsenal and that we aren't afraid to use them.

[rocketray]

yep  Korea,'nam,Afghanistan,Iraq...we just keep runnin' up the score of ....losses...try "antiwar.com" the American century--we are only 75 years into it and hundreds of millions killed...and 25 more years to go...try on you tube..Professor Pape ..Dying to win"  a Dept of Defense/Donald Rumsfeld sponsored study...the facts put a pinprick in all the wars

[3fan4life]

yep  Korea,'nam,Afghanistan,Iraq...we just keep runnin' up the score of ....losses...try "antiwar.com" the American century--we are only 75 years into it and hundreds of millions killed...and 25 more years to go...try on you tube..Professor Pape ..Dying to win"  a Dept of Defense/Donald Rumsfeld sponsored study...the facts put a pinprick in all the wars

Don't worry President Trump is well on to his way of fixing this.

AMERICA WILL ONCE AGAIN BE KNOWN AS A NATION THAT KICKS ASS AND TAKES NAMES!!! 

[old2soon]

This bomb is particularly deadly and even for those in tunnels its the shock wave that actually kills. This below is out of Wikipedia. This is what this bomb was designed for.

The [blast] kill mechanism against living targets is unique–and unpleasant.... What kills is the pressure wave, and more importantly, the subsequent rarefaction [vacuum], which ruptures the lungs.... If the fuel deflagrates but does not detonate, victims will be severely burned and will probably also inhale the burning fuel. Since the most common FAE fuels, ethylene oxide and propylene oxide, are highly toxic, undetonated FAE should prove as lethal to personnel caught within the cloud as most chemical agents.

According to a U.S. Central Intelligence Agency study "the effect of an FAE explosion within confined spaces is immense. Those near the ignition point are obliterated. Those at the fringe are likely to suffer many internal, and thus invisible injuries, including burst eardrums and crushed inner ear organs, severe concussions, ruptured lungs and internal organs, and possibly blindness." Another Defense Intelligence Agency document speculates that because the "shock and pressure waves cause minimal damage to brain tissue...it is possible that victims of FAEs are not rendered unconscious by the blast, but instead suffer for several seconds or minutes while they suffocate".

nudder words one HUMONGOUS bitch slap!  RIDE SAFE.

After last week's Tomahawk missile throw down from the world's finest Navy... the USAF decided to show them up 

Air Force always trying to 1 up us ole sea dawgs 

Never met a zoomy that understood-turn into the wind to launch/recover aircraft. Try to splain salt stains on the belles of antisub aircraft and rotary winged air vehicles!  RIDE SAFE.

[Jess from VA]

After last week's Tomahawk missile throw down from the world's finest Navy... the USAF decided to show them up  Angry

Air Force always trying to 1 up us ole sea dawgs  Grin

I dunno Reb, in the poker game of munitions, 50 tommyhawks beats a single fat boy bomb every time.

(though the tommys may not get as far down into the caves as the fat boy)

And last I checked, no poor Navy guys have to ride the tommys to their destination, unlike the USAF Herky Bird crew dogs (who had to fly it to the bad guys, and actually push it out the back door).

High tech vs old dumb bomb tech.  

Those tommys (or air lauched cruise missiles - ALCM) also come with nuclear tips.  The B52 BUFF can carry a rotary ALCM launcher with 8 of them on one mission. 

[Reb]

After last week's Tomahawk missile throw down from the world's finest Navy... the USAF decided to show them up  Angry

Air Force always trying to 1 up us ole sea dawgs  Grin

I dunno Reb, in the poker game of munitions, 50 tommyhawks beats a single fat boy bomb every time.

(though the tommys may not get as far down into the caves as the fat boy)

And last I checked, no poor Navy guys have to ride the tommys to their destination, unlike the USAF Herky Bird crew dogs (who had to fly it to the bad guys, and actually push it out the back door).

High tech vs old dumb bomb tech.  

Work smarter not harder.....
Pushing a button 50 times  has to be easier than kicking a 21,000Ibs payload out the back door.  

[cookiedough]

I see no harm in dropping dozens of these bombs if intelligence knows there are ISIS in underground bunkers and tunnels in the middle of nowhere where very few civilian lives will be lost besides EVIL ISIS or to their underground infrastructure much like the darn moles digging tunnels in my yard last year.
If dynamite was legal in town,  I would like to use a few sticks myself if further away from my underground electrical and gas lines..

I just hope WWIII does not come about with Russia or North Korea in the next 4 year term...

[shortleg]

   Jess sometimes I feel maybe we should let the Buffalo loose tomdomit,s deed.
But we all know too many innocent  people that  should  never have to see these things would
be lost.
   On the other hand I hate to think of all this good stuff just hanging around going to waste

[scooperhsd]

Relations may be a bit chilly, but I don't see USA going to war with Russia or China - too many economic ties.

North Korea - that is a hell of a nutjob running that country, with almost no incentive to NOT go to war with S Korea. I honestly think he doesn't care how many die. Then again - with 3 carrier battle groups off the North Korea coast - that alone is more firepower than alot of countries have in total - and what we have there doesn't include AF / marine assets in the theater. If he is crazy enough to try a first strike - God help him....

[ridingron]

Work smarter not harder.....
Pushing a button 50 times  has to be easier than kicking a 21,000Ibs payload out the back door.  Grin 

I don't think they pushed it. I think the pallet was on wheels or one of those roller racks.  Just open the back door and ask the pilot to go into a steep climb.   

[Jess from VA]

Jess sometimes I feel maybe we should let the Buffalo loose tomdomit,s deed.
But we all know too many innocent  people that  should  never have to see these things would
be lost.

Really, this continues to beg the same age old question of collateral damage that has been around since man made and learned to use weapons, chose up sides and began to kill each other (with enthusiasm).

The Haig and Geneva Conventions and international law of armed conflict even attempt to codify it.  It comes down to a simple balancing test, referred to as the rule of proportionality.

War is made on combatants, not innocents.  War on innocents is criminal.

When making war on combatants, one makes every effort to limit and minimize damage to innocents (and their property).  This is lawful war.

The bigger, more important, more strategic the target or objective, the more innocents you can kill or hurt, so long as you continue to make all honest efforts to minimize innocent casualties.  This is the rule of proportionality in action, and still lawful war.

So you do not bomb one antiaircraft gun on the roof of a legitimate hospital containing both enemy combatants (who are now out of combat, but will return if possible), but also innocent women and children.  But if you discover they are assembling nuclear, biological or chemical weapons in the hospital basement, then you bomb the hospital and weapons assembly into oblivion (and all the innocents too).

This rule is as applicable to the actions of a single rifleman or rifle company in the field as it is to use of massive bombing or even nukes.  But it is the latter that will get all the press and debate.

The bigger question and problem to me (and many) is what exactly is our national strategy in the Middle East?  Is there really a national strategy at all, or have we been involved in a 20 year boxing match over there where we have hundreds or thousands of battles, attrit each other down, replenish, and then go at it again.  Didn't we annihilate the Germans, Italians and Japanese in about five years (with the help of some allies)?  (I hate to say it, but it sure seems like another Vietnam, though with many differences, and across many countries).  

If we have an identifiable enemy worthy of war, then we should go to war and win, and come home.  If we have no will to win a war, then we should never go over there in the first place.  A pretty damn good argument can be made that the US national interest (and also world interest) would have been better served, if Saddam, Mubarak, Gaddafi, Assad, and others had been left in place to terrorize their own populations, but keep general peace in the Middle East as well (also stabilizing world politics).  

A pretty good argument can also be made that that our 20-year presence over there (with allies, such as they are) is the very reason the Taliban, ISIS and others have proliferated as well as they have with volunteers from all over the world.  Mohammedan murder and terrorism has been around for a very long time, but it only galvanized into standing armies, seeking to take and hold ground and establish a world Caliphate, since we went over there (not counting the middle age Crusades, which also came about from westerners trying to take over the Middle East).  

Our action in Gulf 1, in securing Kuwait and largely destroying the Iraq military inside one year was a nice piece of national strategy with rather unbelievably small losses to us (other than expense of huge national treasure).  Since then, I am not so sure.

We're in it now, and there's no going back.  But it would be nice to think we could get a good national strategy going, letting our warriors go to work, with some kind of end in sight.  Things are looking up these days, but I remain skeptical.  

Rules of engagement should be relaxed and the military leadership (if we have any left) should be allowed wide latitude.  But we must still make honest efforts to limit collateral damage.... lest the entire Middle East (including women and children) sign up for service against us.

[old2soon]

Reb-read an article bout that M O A B and it stated that after the Air Force built/assembled it the only color they had was supposedly-John Deere green! Thought ya might like ta know dat! RIDE SAFE.

[Serk]

A pretty good argument can also be made that that our 20-year presence over there (with allies, such as they are) is the very reason the Taliban, ISIS and others have proliferated as well as they have with volunteers from all over the world.  Mohammedan murder and terrorism has been around for a very long time, but it only galvanized into standing armies, seeking to take and hold ground and establish a world Caliphate, since we went over there (not counting the middle age Crusades, which also came about from westerners trying to take over the Middle East).  

Word is the cave complex that was bombed was initially built with money provided by.......

The USA via the CIA for the Mujahideen "Freedom Fighters" during the Soviet's adventure in Afghanistan.

IMHO we need to either commit fully and be willing to beat the entire populations of these nations down into utter fear of us, which would include hundreds of thousands of civilian casualties, or we need to get out and stop giving them shiny targets.

Today's freedom fighters quickly become tomorrow's terrorists. We've got better places we can spend our blood and treasure.

(And yes, I get the "Better to fight them over there then over here" mentality, but by being there we're providing recruitment for them to come over here.)

[cookiedough]

Just found out my older brothers kid in the army as a medic, etc. is tomorrow going to be about 10 miles from where that 21 ton bomb went off for next 9 months, home only for thanksgiving and christmas, as far as I know.  Not somewhere I would want to spend a 9 month deployment. 

I say keep dropping BOMBS all over Afghanastan and hopefully have fewer troops over there. 

[Robert]

Limited engagement is only limited to those sitting back in Washington calling the shots. The front line guy takes all the punishment. If we are going to war then take the handcuffs off the military. If when we had gone into places instead of pulling out and leaving a vacuum had established a thriving government we may not have seen all this happening. Failed diplomacy and badly executed pull outs have only led to the loss of US lives. The fact that now we are fighting a religion/ideology is a possible never ending scenario and almost corrupt since it costs lives with no real winnable goal. The end to the Vietnam war was continual bombing of the area, I understand about innocents but really if the enemy hides in among the innocents and they say nothing are they innocents or accomplices. This also does not address what kind of life do they really have with fighting going on all the time.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Just found out my older brothers kid in the army as a medic, etc. is tomorrow going to be about 10 miles from where that 21 ton bomb went off for next 9 months, home only for thanksgiving and christmas, as far as I know.  Not somewhere I would want to spend a 9 month deployment. 

I say keep dropping BOMBS all over Afghanastan and hopefully have fewer troops over there. 

You shouldn't be giving out locations.

[scooperhsd]

The big difference in WWII and all the actions since then (except Gulf War I ) is that the two named had a stated goal.  I'm a believer in the "politicians define the goal and the warriors execute to the goal" kind of warfighting. However, this requires the politicians to define a proper, sustainable, realistic goal. This has been the biggest problem with Vietnam and most of the other Middle East actions (maybe Korea as well). There is no doubt we have highly trained, well equipped, capable military forces - it's putting them to proper use that is the issue.

IMO.

[old2soon]

FAILED "policy" as set up by the talking heads in deception central-fer some cursed reason or another right off the top of my gourd-Nam springs to mind. IF you've never fought a war up close and personal HOW in the hell can you THINK you'd Know how zackly to fight one from half a world away? The Folks with the boots on the ground when the crap hits the fan are Only interested in Eliminating the enemy and Surviving. George C. Scott as Patton hit on that-Americans have an in bred desire to Win. Losing is repugnant and foreign to us. Well least ways losing used to be foreign to us.  RIDE SAFE.

[Gavin_Sons]

Just found out my older brothers kid in the army as a medic, etc. is tomorrow going to be about 10 miles from where that 21 ton bomb went off for next 9 months, home only for thanksgiving and christmas, as far as I know.  Not somewhere I would want to spend a 9 month deployment. 

I say keep dropping BOMBS all over Afghanastan and hopefully have fewer troops over there. 

You shouldn't be giving out locations.

Why? It's not like he is on a top secret mission. That is probably public knowledge.  Hillary gave out top secret information and she was still going to be yor queen.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Just found out my older brothers kid in the army as a medic, etc. is tomorrow going to be about 10 miles from where that 21 ton bomb went off for next 9 months, home only for thanksgiving and christmas, as far as I know.  Not somewhere I would want to spend a 9 month deployment. 

I say keep dropping BOMBS all over Afghanastan and hopefully have fewer troops over there. 

You shouldn't be giving out locations.

Why? It's not like he is on a top secret mission. That is probably public knowledge.  Hillary gave out top secret information and she was still going to be yor queen.

Weren't in the military I take it. (Your)

[Robert]

Well today is the 16th in North Korea and we did not hear anything about an atomic blast and Kim didn't look like his usually smiley self. It was Bill Clinton that was responsible for selling N Korea the reactors that they used to make the bomb material. They could have sold them reactors that weren't capable to make bomb material but they didn't.  North Korea attempted to launch a missile on Sunday near Sinpo, on its east coast, but it is believed to have failed, South Korea's military said, but at least it was not nuclear.

[Alien]

So...Um... Which Darkside tire do y'all recommend for extended riding in a post-apocalyptic environment?

Ride Safe,

Alien

[Patrick]

So...Um... Which Darkside tire do y'all recommend for extended riding in a post-apocalyptic environment?

Ride Safe,

Alien

An MOAT of course !