The first commutation ?

[The emperor has no clothes]

Seems kind of odd that Trump's first commutation of a sentence would be for someone who's business was based on hiring illegal aliens. 
https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-commutes-sentence-kosher-meatpacking-executive-225329336--politics.html

[Ramie]

It's a universal law that politicians no matter what side their on always have to take care of their friends aka donners.

[..]

How long should he have been kept in jail?

[¿spoom]

It's a universal law that politicians no matter what side their on always have to take care of their friends aka donners.

This is a rather unique case, as over 100 people from both parties signed a petition to release him, for reasons easy to find if anyone cares to. It appears that the original "false financial paperwork" charges may have been orchestrated, leaving the matter of all those illegals working for him as the real reason to jail him. On that, it's quite the Catch 22-I believe strongly in long jail time for those who knowingly hire illegals, but then there's those who would want to jail ME for daring to even ask if someone is a citizen. People like Nancy Pelosi, who signed the petition to release him.

[Gryphon Rider]

It's a universal law that politicians no matter what side their on always have to take care of their friends aka donners.

Was Rudolph involved in this too?

[The emperor has no clothes]

It's a universal law that politicians no matter what side their on always have to take care of their friends aka donners.

Was Rudolph involved in this too?

He was busy. Blitzen was there though. 

[Robert]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

[Serk]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

This was his first commutation. Joe Arpaio received a pardon, not a commutation of sentence.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Serk pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

[3fan4life]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Azeri pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

Could it be possible that you are so blinded by your hatred for Trump that what you see as Irony is actually proof that President Trump is a fair and compassionate human being?

[Gryphon Rider]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Azeri pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

Could it be possible that you are so blinded by your hatred for Trump that what you see as Irony is actually proof that President Trump is a fair and compassionate human being?

Can't an action that is ironic also be motivated by good intentions?  Does seeing the irony of someone's actions imply hatred towards that person?

When I do something that appears fair-minded and compassionate, it could be that I am fair-minded and compassionate, or it could mean that I want to appear fair-minded and compassionate.  When my virtuous action doesn't cost me personally, it is not proof of anything.  Proof of virtuous intentions is provided when I exhibit that virtue when no-one is watching, and/or when my virtuous action actually costs me something, without an anticipated personal benefit.

Regardless of Trump's motivation for commuting Rubashkin's sentence, it appears to correct an injustice of excessive punishment.

[3fan4life]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Azeri pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

Could it be possible that you are so blinded by your hatred for Trump that what you see as Irony is actually proof that President Trump is a fair and compassionate human being?

Can't an action that is ironic also be motivated by good intentions?  Does seeing the irony of someone's actions imply hatred towards that person?

When I do something that appears fair-minded and compassionate, it could be that I am fair-minded and compassionate, or it could mean that I want to appear fair-minded and compassionate.  When my virtuous action doesn't cost me personally, it is not proof of anything.  Proof of virtuous intentions is provided when I exhibit that virtue when no-one is watching, and/or when my virtuous action actually costs me something, without an anticipated personal benefit.

Regardless of Trump's motivation for commuting Rubashkin's sentence, it appears to correct an injustice of excessive punishment.

Talk about something that we could argue over the Semantics about until the cows come home.

Basically, I cannot dispute your "logic" because you have applied it to yourself.

Besides it is sound enough that disputing it would be an exercise in futility.

Of course just because a  logical conclusion is sound, doesn't mean that it is absolute.

The basis of your logic in this could easily be Matthew 6:5

And when you pray, you shall not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Truly I say to you, They have their reward. (NKJV)

This is one of my favorite verses in the Bible because it speaks out against hypocrisy.


Could President Trump have done this for the recognition?

I suspose so.

He might garner some good will from it, but not if the MSM can help it.

If he did it solely for the publicity that would make him a hypocrite.

My feeling is that he did it because he felt that it was the right thing to do.

If he does garner some positive press that's OK too.

As President there is NO way that he could do something like this in secret.

Come to think of it, He can't do anything good or bad without someone putting a negative spin on it.

[Robert]

Could it be possible that you are so blinded by your hatred for Trump that what you see as Irony is actually proof that President Trump is a fair and compassionate human being?

 

I have not gotten the story wrong, I know what you are saying but the statement above is simple and direct and to the point I was making.  

Would you ride with someone you have disagreements with as long as you could both enjoy the ride and talk about pleasant things. Then if yes then maybe you can understand Trumps actions.

As for his sentence,

For the middle-aged father of 10, it amounted to a de facto life term.

Prosecutors initially sought a life sentence, then changed their request to 25 years in prison. When U.S. District Judge Linda R. Reade sentenced him to 27 years, many observers noted that it was nearly three years longer than the term former Enron chief executive Jeffrey Skilling received for his role in the collapse of the energy giant. Most murders dont receive this long on a sentence either.

I guess either you took your statement from this in the article or you and Teig have something in common.

But Robert Teig, a former assistant U.S. attorney in Iowa who was involved in Rubashkin’s prosecution, told the Associated Press the commutation “makes no sense” given Trump’s vows to crack down on illegal immigration.

As for motivation Trump has done many things that helped people, there are numerous examples so I would think speaking to actions and motivations its an act of true compassion unlike the past administrations that used every situation in promotion themselves when in fact did nothing. Trump has consistently fought the press and has not done things to garner attention unless it was a real plus for the people. I think that may be forgotten here. It cost him to listen to a problem, find the truth of the matter and being one of the only people that could help took the compassion to sign and have him released and stand and take any critisim if it followed. That to me is a very costly gamble and use of power that could have come back on him.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Azeri pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

Could it be possible that you are so blinded by your hatred for Trump that what you see as Irony is actually proof that President Trump is a fair and compassionate human being?

You can believe what you will. But I truly don't hate Trump. I disagree with probably 75% of his thinking. I don't like his morals. I think he is rude. But that is a long way from hate. Does this commutation not seem ironic to you ? Is his angst for illegal immigration only directed at the Mexicans themselves but not the people who employ them ?

[Skinhead]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Serk pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

But there was no intent.  If they put hilleryin jail for 27  years, I would support putting this guy back in.

[The emperor has no clothes]

I posted this on another post and actually it was his second commutation.

 I am not surprised that that some here would not understand the human interest motives in doing the right thing from a president, as we have not had anyone who was capable of this type of behavior in the past. The usual is not doing something unless you are going to get something back.

The idea of not understanding that the enforcement of laws is not an excuse to ruin totally someones life, regardless of the platform you are trying to enforce, that is called compassion. Something again we have not seen in a long time from a president. I am not surprised that some don't understand this kind of behavior from a person much less a president but that would be the definition of a good man.

I doubt if given the same circumstances if anyone on the left would have done the same thing and it shows the mindset.

 Someone powerful enough to throw you in jail for life but compassionate enough to realize you may have gotten a raw deal and correct it no matter the ideology of the person who did the crime.


Story here:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/21/how-trump-came-to-commute-an-ex-meatpacking-executives-27-year-prison-sentence/

The Obama administration rebuffed the efforts. But on Wednesday, President Trump commuted Rubashkin’s sentence.

The White House said in a statement that Trump made the decision at the urging of officials, scholars and congressional leaders from both sides of the aisle, including House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) and Sen. Orrin Hatch (R-Utah). The statement offered few details, but noted that the action was not a presidential pardon vacating his conviction.

In your blind obedience to all things Trumpian you have gotten most of the story wrong. As Serk pointed out it was his first commutation of a sentence. He was not sentenced to life as you say but for 27 years. As to whether it was a just sentence, I have no idea. I first heard of the story this morning. The whole point of the post (which seems to be lost on you), is that he chose someone who encouraged illegal immigration. The main focus of his campaign was building “The Wall” to stop illegal immigration. Seemed pretty ironic to me. But most seem to overlook the irony.

But there was no intent.  If they put hilleryin jail for 27  years, I would support putting this guy back in.

No intent by whom ?

[Hook#3287]

"Authorities rounded up 389 undocumented immigrants, more than 20 of them minors, who described a long list of abhorrent working conditions, including 12-hour shifts without overtime pay and exposure to dangerous chemicals. A spokesman for a food workers union compared it to scenes from Upton Sinclair’s “The Jungle.”"

It doesn't seem this statement has been called false.

What should the punishment be for crimes of this magnitude?

Isn't exposure to dangerous chemicals life threatening?

It seems the ones that got the short end of the stick was the loan companies.

[Robert]

You can believe what you will. But I truly don't hate Trump. I disagree with probably 75% of his thinking. I don't like his morals. I think he is rude. But that is a long way from hate. Does this commutation not seem ironic to you ? Is his angst for illegal immigration only directed at the Mexicans themselves but not the people who employ them ?

Why does he have to be a case of hating Mexicans or illegals so much to take it out on and be blinded to situation of one man so much so to not have compassion on him when he effectively received a death sentence? That would be vengeful and vindictive. How about its compassion to protect US jobs and citizens but in this case just because one man got caught and the sentence didn't fit the crime Trump had compassion on and righted the situation.

You could argue the point that it was lax laws in the Obama era that allowed the use of illegals and this man got caught for. Maybe if the laws had been consistent and not cut corners the penalty to allow illegals to work would have been clearer.

[The emperor has no clothes]

"Authorities rounded up 389 undocumented immigrants, more than 20 of them minors, who described a long list of abhorrent working conditions, including 12-hour shifts without overtime pay and exposure to dangerous chemicals. A spokesman for a food workers union compared it to scenes from Upton Sinclair’s “The Jungle.”"

It doesn't seem this statement has been called false.

What should the punishment be for crimes of this magnitude?

Isn't exposure to dangerous chemicals life threatening?

It seems the ones that got the short end of the stick was the loan companies.

It's amazing that after all this time this still happens in the meat packing industry.