puddle of gas

[Fudd]

I went to leave home this morning and found a large puddle of gas under my bike.  The petcock area looked and felt dry.  When I moved the bike, the last few next few drops seemed to drip from around the front of the engine.  I checked it for hydrolock and then started it.  Everything seemed normal, so I drove a hundred yards and killed it.  It looks like the leak stopped.  The tank was nearly full when I parked it last night, and it sounds like I have about a gallon left now.

Any suggestions on what I should check or do?

[hubcapsc]

Have you had your tank off lately, or messed around with stuff below it?

A couple of times when I had my tank off and on its nose, a siphon got started through the tank drain
nozzle... I only mention this because it almost sounds like you had some kind of siphon going on...
perhaps something whacky going on with your drain hose (the one that hooks to the rear of the tank)
or the vacuum hose (the one that hooks the rear left carb runner)... ?

-Mike

[Fudd]

Thanks for responding.
No I haven't had the tank off or done any work on the motorcycle. 
It's been over an hour since I moved the bike and no more leak.  I'm thinking I'll try turning off my petcock 'till I get a handle on what caused this.

[Bone]

One of my past bikes was a 4 cylinder Goldwing. One January morning 2 months into winter storage there was a big oily puddle under the bike. The full tank of gas had drained into the crankcase. Of course the new oil was ruined.
I replaced the petcock and changed my shutdown procedure.

[Fudd]

I just checked the bike again.
The gas is coming from carb #5.  The carb is wet and there is pooling under it on the engine.

[X Ring]

Time to replace that pos stock petcock with a Pingel.  When you turn it off, it's off plus you can buy one cheaper than you can buy a replacement stock one.  It's about $90 from Eastern Performance.  http://www.easternperformance.com/products.php?product=Pingel-Hex-Chrome-90-Degree-Forward-Petcock-for-Harley

Marty

[Fudd]

I thought gas would leak out of #6 if petcock was bad?  My leak is out of #5.  After again checking for hydrolock, I started the engine, shut off the fuel valve and ran it dry.  Does this still sound like petcock problems?

[Garland]

# 6 provides vacuum. At the very least you need to repair the petcock with a cover kit. I like the Pingle myself.

[hubcapsc]

I thought gas would leak out of #6 if petcock was bad?  My leak is out of #5.  After again checking for hydrolock, I started the engine, shut off the fuel valve and ran it dry.  Does this still sound like petcock problems?

There's a particular way that the petcock can fail that makes it want to leak out of the weep hole, you can see the weep
hole at the bottom of this picture..



If you plug up the weep hole, the gas seems to fill up the petcock body and run down the vacuum line to number six, that's
that happened here 



If gas is flowing at all when the bike is off, it is probably the petcock...

-Mike "almost everything that can go wrong with a Valkyrie is related in some way to the petcock  "

[Willow]

It sounds like you had two of the three requirements for a hydrolock.  Those being a petcock allowing fuel through without vacuum ( I assume you didn't have the petcock in the off position) and a stuck float.

The one you just lucked into not having is the engine stopped with the intake valve open on the cylinder with the stuck float.

I'd look at repairing those two items for sure.

[Warlock]

I just checked the bike again.
The gas is coming from carb #5.  The carb is wet and there is pooling under it on the engine.

Check were the gas is feed in the side of the carbs. With the new e10 gas I think we will see more leaks around the o-rings that feed each carb. I had to replace all the o-rings on mine. Got ready to ride it one day and gas all over. Of course it also sounds like your peckcock could be leaking also. Might have a couple issues.
David

[Fudd]

+ 1 on the multiple issues.  I dissasembled the diaphram side of the petcock, didn't find anything wrong but since I had a kit here already, I rebuilt it.  That didn't seem to help, at first no leak, but after a while there's another puddle. 

I can't see exactly where on the #5 carb the gas is comming from.  Can I run it temporarily without the air box so I can see what's going on in there?
No time is a good time to break down, but especially not today, I have plans Saturday to do a benefit ride for my friends grandson who has a heart defect.
I've called all the local shops looking for a pingle and nobody keeps one on the shelf.

[Spirited-6]

+ 1 on the multiple issues.  I dissasembled the diaphram side of the petcock, didn't find anything wrong but since I had a kit here already, I rebuilt it.  That didn't seem to help, at first no leak, but after a while there's another puddle. 

I can't see exactly where on the #5 carb the gas is comming from.  Can I run it temporarily without the air box so I can see what's going on in there?
No time is a good time to break down, but especially not today, I have plans Saturday to do a benefit ride for my friends grandson who has a heart defect.
I've called all the local shops looking for a pingle and nobody keeps one on the shelf.

Fudd, from what you say; a Pingle is NOT going to fix your problem, keep looking. 

[Fudd]

Roger that, but the pingle may take care of one of the issues. 

I've now run it 3 times for 10 mins ea time with no leaks.  However, I have been shutting the fuel valve off before killing it. 

[John U.]

If you have any side load on the petcock, that is if the on/off/reserve knob binds or doesn't move freely, the fuel may not shut off completely. That's one of the other ways the stock petcock can fail.

[Warlock]

+ 1 on the multiple issues.  I dissasembled the diaphram side of the petcock, didn't find anything wrong but since I had a kit here already, I rebuilt it.  That didn't seem to help, at first no leak, but after a while there's another puddle. 

I can't see exactly where on the #5 carb the gas is comming from.  Can I run it temporarily without the air box so I can see what's going on in there?
No time is a good time to break down, but especially not today, I have plans Saturday to do a benefit ride for my friends grandson who has a heart defect.
I've called all the local shops looking for a pingle and nobody keeps one on the shelf.

You can get a mirror and look in the valley. Find the tee on the fuel line and a line will run to both sides. They will connect to a tee on the left and right bank. This feeds some more tubes that feeds the carbs. Each of the tubes has o-rings in them. The upper tubes are for air which also has o-rings. So one of your tube o-rings could be leaking. If so only fix is pulling carbs and replacing.
David

[Fudd]

If you have any side load on the petcock, that is if the on/off/reserve knob binds or doesn't move freely, the fuel may not shut off completely. That's one of the other ways the stock petcock can fail.

Exactly what happened when i first reinstalled the tank.
Although this may be ill advised, I'm hell-bent on making a benefit dice run Saturday, so I could be taking some risks driving it.  As a matter of fact, all my "test runs" have been with an extiguisher in the saddle bags.

[Ricky-D]

The big problem is the leaky #5 carburetor.

You can drop the float bowl pretty easily and look for crap in the bowl.

Let the fuel run for a bit and see if it will clear the float needle assembly.

The floats are not adjustable so simply put the float bowl back after.

***

[Fudd]

I have yet to determine if I have have trash in the float valve or if it's leaking from the o-ring connection to the fuel line.
Q:  Wouldn't the #5 cylinder be running rough and trying to flood if the float valve was stuck open?  This machine purrs smooth as silk.

[John U.]

If the float bowl seal was bad enough yes. If it's a very small piece of grit it may not pass enough gas to cause a problem when it's running.

[Ricky-D]

It doesn't take but a few drops a minute to make a puddle in an hour or so, and John U is "right on" when he says you may not realize a difference in running.

You may have already cleared the problem when you ran the motor with the gas "off".

You could have accomplished the same result by turning the gas "off" and draining the float bowl from an easily accessible screw (very accessible on the #5 carburetor) on the bottom of the float bowl.

Stock petcocks suck for the reason that the "off" position is midway between the "on" and the "reserve" and the detent is very subtle and hard to feel when you are turning the knob of the petcock.

***

[BigBluef6]

One other possibility.  In 2010, I had a similar puddle problem on a 2001 standard with all original OEM fuel system parts.  I replaced the OEM petcock with Pingle.  I replaced all the fuel lines.  I replaced all the OEM clamps on the fuel line with ones i could screw tight.  After all that, it still leaked.  It turned out to be O-rings in the fuel rail where failing.  Check out the pictures at the links below.  The O-rings on the fuel rails (blue in the pictures) between carbs 3 and 5, and 4 and 6 lost their flexibility and with me messing and moving the "T" fittings, the O-rings started to leak.

http://redeye.ecrater.com/p/2063876/carburetor-o-ring-kit-for-honda-valkyrie#
http://s.ecrater.com/stores/55463/47bdd44719b61_55463b.jpg

I bought this o-ring kit from Redeye of which i have no affiliation.  I figured if some o-rings are leaking, it is only a matter of time for the rest to follow.  If i was going to pull everything apart to fix some o-rings, I might as well do the job right and do them all. 

http://redeye.ecrater.com/p/2063876/carburetor-o-ring-kit-for-honda-valkyrie

[John U.]

I agree with bigbluef6, The fuel rail O-rings are very possibly the culprit.
I have a very slow weeping leak that is almost impossible to detect except for the dried stains it leaves on top of the engine. This started when I had the carbs and fuel lines dry for an extended period of time a few winters ago. I replaced the slow jets, intake O-rings, installed a fuel filter and desmogged while it was apart. I also decided to replace the float bowl O-rings when I saw how flattened they were. I had to order them and wait for delivery.
I guess that was long enough to dry the fuel rail O-rings out and cause them to shrink. They leaked like a sieve when I let the fuel flow but slowed and stopped overnight, once the O-rings swelled again.
I have been watching for the leak(s) to resume and after 3 years it(they) did; or maybe sooner and I only just noticed.
That's one of the reasons I don't favor draining the fuel sustem for the winter.