Gremlins! Electrical kind

[Bigwolf]

For the first time in what seems like two months, The ice, snow, and salt were off the roads on a day that I did not have to be somewhere else.  So I got my fat lady out and headed to town for some erands.  A gremlin went with us!     First stop I made, she would crank good but would not start.  I pushed her off and she started immediately.  Next time I stopped, she would not even turn over but again started right away when I pushed her.  I rode directly to a parts store and had the battery checked.  It tested good but the man said the voltage dropped to 10.1 when I started it.  Yes, that's right, it started right off there.  Shut it off, put the seat back on and the lady cranked up like with a new battery.     When I got home, I again pulled the seat and my meter never went below 12.2 volts when cranking the bike which again was starting like new.  Before I got home I made two more stops.  The fat girl started right off at one stop but would not crank well at the other stop.  I had to push her off again.

So I am thinking. ...... All these weeks I could not ride and have been petting the hand grips, occassionally starting her just to hear her run, and petting the tank,  I would have done better to have petted some of the wiring to remove any problems such as corrosion.

I have seen some posts here that suggest an extra ground wire run from battery to the frame as well as the original that goes to the engine.  That is sounding to me like a good idea so I will do that while I am cleaning up all the other main connections.

Well it did feel nice to be in the wind with my legs wrapped around my fat girl.
Bigwolf

[sandy]

That ground could be your problem, but I'd also clean the starter contacts.

[Bigwolf]

Good idea!  I cleaned them last year but have been in some hard rains since then.

[Ken Tarver]

Bigwolf
you got a float battery maintainer? give it a try for a day. but if it dropped to 10.1 volts when starting, you gonna need a new battery.

Ken

[Bigwolf]

Bigwolf
you got a float battery maintainer? give it a try for a day. but if it dropped to 10.1 volts when starting, you gonna need a new battery.

Ken

I do have a battery tender.  Using my own test meter when I got home, the lowest reading when starting was a good 12.2 volts.  What I tried to point out in the first post is that the voltage and amperage were all over the place today.  Sometimes starting very well and sometimes not enough to turn the engine over.  A dead battery would just be a dead battery.  It is possible that the battery has a broken plate which would account for the sometimes start and sometimes no start.  I have had that happen before.  However, until I have removed, cleaned and replaced all the main battery connections (both ends of cables), I am not gonna run out and buy a new battery.  Poor terminal connections can cause this same intermittant condition.

Bigwolf

[Chrisj CMA]

I would just replace the battery...........be sure it gets a full proper charge BEFORE using it

[Bigwolf]

I pulled the battery out, cleaned and reset a bunch of wire conections.  All the connections looked good before cleaning so I went back to further testing of the battery. 

I put the battery back in the bike, hooked my volt tester to it and started the bike.  I shut it off and restarted twice more in quik succession.  The first 2 starts the voltage held good.  It dropped to 11.8 for the third start.  I shut the bike back off right away and the battery showed itself.  It immediately went to 8.O volts, then up to 9.6 before falling back to 9.2 and then climbing again.  Now I am satisfied that there is no other problem than the battery.  Thanks Ken and ChrisJ.  You had it right. 

I appreciate the input.  But, I am just a bit annal about being sure and knowing exactly what caused an electrical problem though.  A new battery is on the bench being warmed up by a tender.

Bigwolf

[Ricky-D]

A tender won't do it!

All the conversation (this thread and others) always say "charger".

They are not the same.

***

[Chrisj CMA]

I pulled the battery out, cleaned and reset a bunch of wire conections.  All the connections looked good before cleaning so I went back to further testing of the battery. 

I put the battery back in the bike, hooked my volt tester to it and started the bike.  I shut it off and restarted twice more in quik succession.  The first 2 starts the voltage held good.  It dropped to 11.8 for the third start.  I shut the bike back off right away and the battery showed itself.  It immediately went to 8.O volts, then up to 9.6 before falling back to 9.2 and then climbing again.  Now I am satisfied that there is no other problem than the battery.  Thanks Ken and ChrisJ.  You had it right. 

I appreciate the input.  But, I am just a bit annal about being sure and knowing exactly what caused an electrical problem though.  A new battery is on the bench being warmed up by a tender.

Bigwolf

I thought battery tenders were to maintain already charged batteries.  My estimation is just using a tender on a new battery will be much like just putting it in the bike and letting the alternator charge it.  I did that once and that new battery didnt last a year.  2A charger till the green light comes on is what I do now.

[Jess from VA]

As I said earlier (elsewhere), my Battery Tenders will not bring up a dead or very low (or newly filled) battery at all, and will not even try.  It shows a green light, which usually means charging is done, but in this case it would mean no charging is or will ever happen.

I would never charge a new battery with a trickle charger either.  It needs to be a few decent amps for a number of decent hours.  Car and bike batteries have different requirements.

[Bigwolf]

I followed the instructions with the new battery.  My "tender" actually says "Maintainer/Charger was putting out the voltage the instructions called for and the temperature was also correct.  I do not know what amperage my tender was putting out although it is a 2 amp Maintainer.  I do know that after a 13 hour rest from the Maintainer the new battery checked out as 100% charged.  (again tested per instructions with new battery except for rest time).

I have had great success using a tender to charge dead batteries.  Mostly car batteries though.  Maybe there is something about a motorcycle battery that makes a big difference.  Or maybe it has something to do with the tender itself.  Mine is just a cheap one and is actually called a maintainer/charger.  NPower dual port 2 amp.  This is a new one to me since my old one died last year.

I never use a trickle charger for anything!  The modern day "trickle charger" will destroy a perfectly good battery.  The last one I checked was pushing out 27 volts.

By the way, the battery I took out had 3/20/08 marked on the side.  So I guess it was time for a new one anyway.

Bigwolf

[wd40]

The age of your battery suggests it was simply bad; but, the symptoms point to a possible bad battery terminal.  Wife's bike had this happen, man what a PITA to diagnose!!  Sometimes good, sometimes bad, sometimes the vibration of the starter trying to engage would break the contact!

[TDL]

Most of the time an intermittent electrical problem comes from bad cable connections. You need to take them off to check them. Sand down spot where ground contacts frame and add star washer. I have also found resistance between where copper part of cable goes into cable end.

[Ken Tarver]

bigwolf

glad you found the problem. i too have run the circle chasing my tail trying to find a problem other than the battery. i'm as cheap as anyone else here and try not to spend my money on essentials, the desire is to buy more bling and toys for the bikes, right?

happy riding
Ken