New Bolts Or Not...???

[mrgeoff]

Hey, I am getting ready to replace rear tire and work on the rear drive (99 CT)...According to manual, states that the Damper Holder Bolts should be replaced when replacing the Dampers...Is this only if the Damper Holder Bolts look bad or worn?...Is this an option or a necessity...???

[Houdini]

I don't replace them, put on a dab of locktite and screw them back in.

[Chrisj CMA]

Use blue loctite and don't over tighten them, should not need to replace them.

[mrgeoff]

Thanks...My thought that was the answer...Just checking...!!!

[Skinhead]

The original bolts have adhesive on them, removing them destroys their ability to lock.  That is why they tell you to replace them,  The torque on these bolts is way too low to get into the plastic deformation range, so you can reuse them if you apply some blue loctite in to keep them from loosening up.

[Valker]

I disagree with the majority. Replace them. After they've been used, they are stretched and can easily snap off. DAMHIK

[Skinhead]

I disagree with the majority. Replace them. After they've been used, they are stretched and can easily snap off. DAMHIK

I disagree.  While I don't have proof of my claim, I suspect you don't have proof of yours either.  I stand by my statement that the torque is too low to get into plastic deformation, or stretch.  Many fasteners in joints are"torque to yield"which provides a more consistent clamp load.  The torque spec is too low on these to be in that range.  Only way to prove who's right is with a device to measure not stretch, not worth pursuing to me.

[hubcapsc]

According to manual, states that the Damper Holder Bolts should be replaced when replacing the Dampers.

I'd be lost without the manual, but it also says to take off the pipes to remove the rear
axle, and to put silicone grease in your brake calipers... 

I've reused them... they're about $2.50 each...

-Mike

[Valkorado]

Guess I'm a gambler.  I just did this and reused mine (with blue loctite) and no torque wrench. Plus I put a the darkside tire back on.

[Gryphon Rider]

I've reused mine.

[WintrSol]

The charts in the manual do provide some insight. The parts diagrams say that they are 6x17, and the standard torque values in the chart at the front of the service manual gives a range of 7 to 9 lb-ft, while the value given in the wheel section says 14 lb-ft. Clearly, those must be a higher-strength steel than the standard fasteners, but that IS a lot more torque. IMO, it would be worth the ~$13 for peace of mind.

[baldo]

I changed the dampeners the last time I did a rear end service. I began to torque per manual, and promptly sheared off the head. I did the rest br feel.....

[Skinhead]

I changed the dampeners the last time I did a rear end service. I began to torque per manual, and promptly sheared off the head. I did the rest br feel.....

Sounds like you need a new torque wrench, or the bolts are bottoming out in the holes.

[98valk]

Pro Honda Hondalock 2HT    is a red color high temp medium strength thread locker. should be used on damper bolts and brake caliper bolts.  reason manual calls for replacement cause new bolts are coated with this.
Rocky has most of Honda's chemicals. the threadlocker prices are usually cheaper than in auto parts stores. Honda doesn't follow common thread locker color strengths.
https://www.rockymountainatvmc.com/p/941/-/843714/Pro-Honda-Hondalock-2HT-10-cc

[indybobm]

Those bolts do stretch when they are tightened to spec. I checked the length after they were torqued and each time they stretched and did not return to the original length. I would use blue loc-tite and and just snug them good.

[Chrisj CMA]

I changed the dampeners the last time I did a rear end service. I began to torque per manual, and promptly sheared off the head. I did the rest br feel.....

This is why I keep saying.  Learn what tight is.  Learn how to judge what that fastener is doing.  For that plate those bolts aren't doing a whole lot.  They are just stopping the plate from turning.  They don't have to be a quarter turn from breaking to accomplish that.  You just don't want one to back out.  Locktite them in and get them good and snug, and it will be just fine.

That factory torque setting is meant for virgin threads, new bolts and pristine condition.  Anything else and it's a crap shoot. 

I think more bolts are broken using torque wrenches than not. 

About the only thing I use a torque wrench on is axle nuts, and even then when I had to wing it once it was really close to specs

[WintrSol]

I can't figure why the manual calls for that much torque, even on new bolts. Sure, the rotation of the wheel works against them, but really, that much? Does it take that much to activate the coating?

[baldo]

I changed the dampeners the last time I did a rear end service. I began to torque per manual, and promptly sheared off the head. I did the rest br feel.....

This is why I keep saying.  Learn what tight is.  Learn how to judge what that fastener is doing.  For that plate those bolts aren't doing a whole lot.  They are just stopping the plate from turning.  They don't have to be a quarter turn from breaking to accomplish that.  You just don't want one to back out.  Locktite them in and get them good and snug, and it will be just fine.

That factory torque setting is meant for virgin threads, new bolts and pristine condition.  Anything else and it's a crap shoot. 

I think more bolts are broken using torque wrenches than not. 

About the only thing I use a torque wrench on is axle nuts, and even then when I had to wing it once it was really close to specs

I agree. It felt a little off, and just as I thought that something wasn't right......ouch.

[da prez]

I always clean out a blind hole before installing a bolt. I run a tap in that is a bottoming tap. I then put a rag over the hole and use a blow gun to blow the chips out. I then spray brake clean in and repeat with the blow gun. The bolts go to the wire wheel to get the threads cleaned. Then , locktite and proper torque.

                                        da prez

[WintrSol]

I always clean out a blind hole before installing a bolt. I run a tap in that is a bottoming tap. I then put a rag over the hole and use a blow gun to blow the chips out. I then spray brake clean in and repeat with the blow gun. The bolts go to the wire wheel to get the threads cleaned. Then , locktite and proper torque.

                                        da prez

Not a bad idea, but thread chasers were made for this; a tap is for cutting threads, not cleaning. But, if that's all you have - you need more tools!

[Houdini]

I always clean out a blind hole before installing a bolt. I run a tap in that is a bottoming tap. I then put a rag over the hole and use a blow gun to blow the chips out. I then spray brake clean in and repeat with the blow gun. The bolts go to the wire wheel to get the threads cleaned. Then , locktite and proper torque.

                                        da prez

Always?  Every single bolt you remove?  You must charge by the hour.

[Jess from VA]

Honda says to replace any bolt on the bike that comes dipped in their goop. 

I use my own goop and keep on using them.

Rotors come to mind, which take more stress than any damper plate. 

[da prez]

  Wintrsol , if I would have said thread chasers , there would be questions. I have taps with different G ratings. I have thread chasers. They are in American and metric. I also have acme and british witworth in a few sizes.
  Houdini , yes , I charge hourly , but some jobs are flat rate. I buy and rehab Valks.
Years ago I had a customer replace an axle flange gasket. It was leaking again after the repair. The bolts started breaking off. When he brought it to me for repair , the blind hole was full of silicone. (can you say hydro lock) The axle was never tightened down. I removed the broken bolts and cleaned out the sealer and reset the axle.  It is my way of working. I get paid once to do a job. Rework is bad for reputation.

                                                 da prez

[WintrSol]

  Wintrsol , if I would have said thread chasers , there would be questions. I have taps with different G ratings. I have thread chasers. They are in American and metric. I also have acme and british witworth in a few sizes.
  Houdini , yes , I charge hourly , but some jobs are flat rate. I buy and rehab Valks.
Years ago I had a customer replace an axle flange gasket. It was leaking again after the repair. The bolts started breaking off. When he brought it to me for repair , the blind hole was full of silicone. (can you say hydro lock) The axle was never tightened down. I removed the broken bolts and cleaned out the sealer and reset the axle.  It is my way of working. I get paid once to do a job. Rework is bad for reputation.

                                                 da prez

He who has the most tools, wins!