New generation MagnaCharger supercharger issues.

[CamTom12]

Subscribing!

[fstsix]

Glad to hear about the radiator, you don't have to buy one. My idle changes like yours but maybe 150-200 sometimes higher. When it warms up it kind of smooths out. The thing is it is not consistent and I don't know what is normal for this system. The thing that bothers me a little is between the idle and the power is kind of spongy/mushy on the throttle. When I back off the grip and hit it again it is mushy.
Just got to figure out what is normal.

Dan

Dan some fine tuning will cure this, Pump nozzle #, and what slow jet they put in, and if Bill used a custom taper needle, i have a # 95 needle Richest available, and 1 step larger pump nozzle, also what clip is the needle on? lots of little things, do some plug checks and put some miles on it and i have some notes on what slow jet number i have, i had the fits dialing this thing in but it has no flat spot at all except in 5 gear @ 55 you have to step down a gear if you really hammer it or it will not take all the fuel at once, but just like any double pumper carb would do. also i have a turnbuckle rig i use to tighten my belt if it slips you will have a erratic power band and tuning will be impossible. BTW nice job on that Air filter setup 

[dreamaker]

Sorry I guess I am a bit old fashion and things go over my head and I am curious what they mean. First CamTom12 I don't understand your statement and what does BTW mean

Dan

[fstsix]

Sorry I guess I am a bit old fashion and things go over my head and I am curious what they mean. First CamTom12 I don't understand your statement and what does BTW mean

Dan

BTW= by the way

[dreamaker]

Glad to hear about the radiator, you don't have to buy one. My idle changes like yours but maybe 150-200 sometimes higher. When it warms up it kind of smooths out. The thing is it is not consistent and I don't know what is normal for this system. The thing that bothers me a little is between the idle and the power is kind of spongy/mushy on the throttle. When I back off the grip and hit it again it is mushy.
Just got to figure out what is normal.

I
Dan

Dan some fine tuning will cure this, Pump nozzle #, and what slow jet they put in, and if Bill used a custom taper needle, i have a # 95 needle Richest available, and 1 step larger pump nozzle, also what clip is the needle on? lots of little things, do some plug checks and put some miles on it and i have some notes on what slow jet number i have, i had the fits dialing this thing in but it has no flat spot at all except in 5 gear @ 55 you have to step down a gear if you really hammer it or it will not take all the fuel at once, but just like any double pumper carb would do. also i have a turnbuckle rig i use to tighten my belt if it slips you will have a erratic power band and tuning will be impossible. BTW nice job on that Air filter setup 

Don't know at this point. But I asked Bill what his statement meant when he says pre tuned, he stated he made the changes with the internal components and only have to set the air mixture. So maybe I'll have to pull the carb. and see. What should the needle clip be at.

Dan

[fstsix]

Jeff K, I am surprised these Flat top Cast pistons are alive still, actually i am impressed, i don't even think the factory used Hypereutectic pistons, i guess i have the attitude that 'don't fix it unless it's broke', i have had several motors in the years past some Turbo, some with 12-1 comp, and detonation is death, i do run additives if i am out Solo, but when 2 up i just go easy on it, just found a friend that has a Dyno and hope to get some #'s this next 2 weeks gonna run some Racing fuel in it to set the timing up a  little for some extra HP, but gonna set my rev limiter back down, he will most likely bring up till it kicks in, don't want it @ 8000 for too many pulls. and i have been looking to borrow some ported heads.......

[fstsix]

Glad to hear about the radiator, you don't have to buy one. My idle changes like yours but maybe 150-200 sometimes higher. When it warms up it kind of smooths out. The thing is it is not consistent and I don't know what is normal for this system. The thing that bothers me a little is between the idle and the power is kind of spongy/mushy on the throttle. When I back off the grip and hit it again it is mushy.
Just got to figure out what is normal.

I
Dan

Dan some fine tuning will cure this, Pump nozzle #, and what slow jet they put in, and if Bill used a custom taper needle, i have a # 95 needle Richest available, and 1 step larger pump nozzle, also what clip is the needle on? lots of little things, do some plug checks and put some miles on it and i have some notes on what slow jet number i have, i had the fits dialing this thing in but it has no flat spot at all except in 5 gear @ 55 you have to step down a gear if you really hammer it or it will not take all the fuel at once, but just like any double pumper carb would do. also i have a turnbuckle rig i use to tighten my belt if it slips you will have a erratic power band and tuning will be impossible. BTW nice job on that Air filter setup 

Don't know at this point. But I asked Bill what his statement meant when he says pre tuned, he stated he made the changes with the internal components and only have to set the air mixture. So maybe I'll have to pull the carb. and see. What should the needle clip be at.

Dan

3rd clip from the bottom But that all depends on what # needle you have and if it is not modified. How do your plugs look?

[dreamaker]

Plugs look clean at this point. Guess I have to put some miles on it don't want to get to lean.

Thank You Again

Dan

[fstsix]

Plugs look clean at this point. Guess I have to put some miles on it don't want to get to lean.

Thank You Again

Dan

Try turning your AIR screw in 1/2 turn, this will increase fuel mixture, could be lean, Also if you have the stock headpipe exhaust with Glasspack mod, your tuning may differ than with a free flowing Viking exhaust.

[CamTom12]

Sorry I guess I am a bit old fashion and things go over my head and I am curious what they mean. First CamTom12 I don't understand your statement and what does BTW mean

Dan

No worries. I was just posting to the thread to make it easier to keep up with what y'all are talking about. Instead of trying to find the thread over and over again, now I can just go to the 'show new replies to your posts' link and it'll pop up if anything new's been posted.

[dreamaker]

Plugs look clean at this point. Guess I have to put some miles on it don't want to get to lean.

Thank You Again

Dan

Try turning your AIR screw in 1/2 turn, this will increase fuel mixture, could be lean, Also if you have the stock headpipe exhaust with Glasspack mod, your tuning may differ than with a free flowing Viking exhaust.

Well I have been cruising the past few days, not a ton of miles. Performance is good, only went a little over half throttle feels kind of hairy. The thing I can't stand is between idle and power.  Its hard to explain, but when taking off or quick twist of the throttle the response just floats. It feels like it wants to die but if you twist the second time it wants to serge.  I hope this is not normal, hope there is better response control. Once you get rolling its fine till you come to a light, it feels like I am just learning how to drive a bike again. Got an Aux. tank ordered so I can tweak the carb. with the Valk. tank off.

Dan

[fstsix]

Sounds like your slow jet is too small, it is having a hard time at transition to the main, basically i just went one step in slow jet at a time and kept checking plugs, at one point i went to the next jet size and it was just too rich and fouled the plugs, at that point i went back one step and could work it out on the mixture screw, It is better to be a little fat than LEAN on forced induction your plugs should be a little brown. If i where closer i would be happy to let you try my bike so you know that is is just tuning. i had lots of aggravating moments with 2 different carbs but i cannot tell you how many times i had my tank off, i can remove it in less than 5 minutes LOL!! check those plugs if they look too clean or gray white you are lean. mine are lite cocoa brown. The good news is i have not had the tank off in 3 years.....air filter is dirty LOL!!! before you pull the jet, as you said try to turn that AIR screw in and see if that takes that flat spot out. I bought the jet kit from Sudco,it has needles slows and mains and pump nozzles.

[dreamaker]

Sounds like your slow jet is too small, it is having a hard time at transition to the main, basically i just went one step in slow jet at a time and kept checking plugs, at one point i went to the next jet size and it was just too rich and fouled the plugs, at that point i went back one step and could work it out on the mixture screw, It is better to be a little fat than LEAN on forced induction your plugs should be a little brown. If i where closer i would be happy to let you try my bike so you know that is is just tuning. i had lots of aggravating moments with 2 different carbs but i cannot tell you how many times i had my tank off, i can remove it in less than 5 minutes LOL!! check those plugs if they look too clean or gray white you are lean. mine are lite cocoa brown. The good news is i have not had the tank off in 3 years.....air filter is dirty LOL!!! before you pull the jet, as you said try to turn that AIR screw in and see if that takes that flat spot out. I bought the jet kit from Sudco,it has needles slows and mains and pump nozzles.

I guess I have to figure out the combination. Did a little tweak on the mixture and it ran a little better but no cigar. I guess Bill set the carb. at 1 1/2 turns I dropped it down to 1 1/8 turns and it is not there. I know you used the 95 needle on your carb. Now are you using the Mikuni 45 or the CV on yours. Also if you are using the Mikuni 45 which jet kit did you get from Sudco. They have a couple.  I assume you are still using the "J" tube on yours. Also here is a pic of my plug, which in color is little more gray then it shows.

Dan

[fstsix]

Yep i have the old style J tube bypass and Tossed the P.O.S Hardley carb out to a friend, I have HSR45 Mikuni for 7 years, jet kit is kinda complicated it is for the HSR42 and that kit is # KHS-025 jet tuning service kit. it does NOT come with the 95 needle i had to purchase separately, It only comes with the biggest 170 main i drilled mine Out to 240! The Slow jet i have in now is #27.5 and i have almost 3 turns out on my AIR screw real close for being too rich, but this will stop that stumble for OFF idle you have, start Only with the slow jet change first, Do not do any other changes or you will not know witch change is effective, Don't ask me how i know this  That plug has black on the ring from idle too long typical, but the electrode is light you should step up your slow jet it may solve your problem. P.O.S means, piece of $hit 

[dreamaker]

What a pain in the a$$ trying to find the jet kit. Went to Sudco and Mikuni and they give you distributors but don't deal with the public. When you finally find someone to deal with they tell you they don't have it in stock. I appears that no distributors have it in stock across the US, the next shipment from sudco/mikuni is 5/30/10. I did find a place that had a similar kit with a old stock number that even has the 95 needle in it, it is a 44 piece kit and they says it is for a 45. They will ship it on Tues. from TX. should be here Thurs.  Being north of Detroit we have got allot of traffic and don't want to stall in the middle of it.

Dan

[Sludge]

Ive been thinking about doing this upgrade to my bike.  I understand that the kit doesnt come with new cables does it?  Also, on Spookshows page he mentioned that the intake adapter for the blower wasnt in the kit either.  If this is the case, why should I buy the kit?  Why not just buy a carb for $370 or so and do the mod yourself? 

Its a Mikuni 45mm flat slide right?  Just mimic the jet recommendations you guys listed above and start from there.  Or are there other mods to this carb he has done? 

BTW, I have plentiful access to these carbs and jets locally.  Im friendly with a custom bike shop down the road kind like OCC.  They have Mikuni's running out their ears and carry the complete line of jets etc.

[rdunbar123]

no the kit doesnt come with new cables. I do have one question for the group: it would be nice to ride for a while. get the bike really warmed up and then adjust the carb with the tank on. could you take off the engine hanger on the left side, or would this cause the bike to move so you couldn't get the hanger back on. or is it just a stabilizer.

[fstsix]

 I port matched my J tube manifold for the 45, opened it way up, 1 1/2 inch spacer on the front tank mount, To answer your question about what do you have to due special to a 45?. just Dial it in, and jet it, but i am fine with everybody keeping their HD carb, because i will smoke ya!  $370 for the carb-$120 jet kit- Air filter $55- Holley Fuel regulator $ 35, Upgrade NOS fuel pump $90, braided hoses and fuel pressure Gage $100 just under $800 not counting your free time to Jet and port match. Not necessary to port match.

[dreamaker]

Far as the cables I used the stock ones. I just pull it out from between the triple trees and the tubes. I just  run the cables down the handle bars and run the cables on top of the frame in front of the tank tunnel. I then made the extension for the pull cable and it works OK. The problem I had is were to fish the cable and turn the handle bars and not have the throttle bind up. If you check the second page of this thread I have pics. of the adaptor and some ball park specs.

Dan

[dreamaker]

Took the bike to Wed. cruise  night in Mt Clemens Mich. Have to tell you it was comical to watch people checking out my bike looking for the carbs.  Oddly enough they don't see the super charger staring them in the face. Did noticed that  HD guys look and just walk away, I think they know it could be an embarrassing moment for them.

Dan

[dreamaker]

Just updating, with help from the boys in the band.  My Mikuni had #25 slow jet, #70 nozzle and #97 needle.  My issue was it felt unpredictable and felt like it was going to stall, always had to feather the throttle.  
I went to #27.5 slow jet. #70 nozzle and #95 needle. It ran like new bike, throttle is responsive and stable, idle is more stable and can start without choke. Have to make some runs and tweak the air mixture.

Dan

[Sludge]

Thanks for the info. That gives me a good place to start.  I have a loaner 45mm carb right now from a local bike shop to check dimensions etc on to modify the intake.  I just havent had time to play with it lately.  Damn work always gets in the way... 

[dreamaker]

Quick question for Fstsix. Still dry here and got the bike back together, so I went for a quick run and realized I had a small issue. When I cruise and take off from the light and go through the gears a little aggressive it was find. But when I want to go through the gears normal, when you go to the next gear it wants to chug if you don't twist the throttle a little aggressive. Just driving normal. Not really sure what to do at this point to correct it.

Dan

[fstsix]

Sounds like your getting closer, Do a plug check lets see what they look like, try 2/1/2 turns to Richen on your Air screw, not sure what clip your Needle is on? If the plugs are not Black you would still be lean, These things like to drink  but it really depends on your plugs, you may have lift your needle one notch. still the idle circuit needs tweaking.

[dreamaker]

My needle is at the third notch and the air screw is set at 2 1/2 turns now.  Wasn't sure whether to richen or lean, since this is backwards to the stock carbs.  Well I guess I will turn it in quarter turn and test it out if it don't rain tomorrow. This is the new settings after 30 mile ride beating the rain.

[fstsix]

My needle is at the third notch and the air screw is set at 2 1/2 turns now.  Wasn't sure whether to richen or lean, since this is backwards to the stock carbs.  Well I guess I will turn it in quarter turn and test it out if it don't rain tomorrow. This is the new settings after 30 mile ride beating the rain.

Move that Needle (UP) witch would be move the C clip down 1 notch, i was reluctant to speculate....because fouled plugs will make it run sluggish also, Those are not fouled, when i said 3rd notch ? sorry it's been 7 years cant remember from the top of the needle or the bottom move that needle.. also looks like that Carb was shipped W/O mods done to it. by looking at your notes, The 45 i purchased from a MC shop came from Mikuni with the same jets? i did not specify what it was going on when i ordered it, Try the needle.....if that doesn't cure this you may have to check the Main jet i will tell you what Drill # i used to open it up. BTW... if it was too rich them bad boys would be BLACK....don't ask me how i know this Also see those freckles on that white part of the electrode that is a sign of detonation

[dreamaker]

Well got off my lazy a$$ and pulled the tank off, pulled the top of the carb. off.  Rolled the Magna #97 needle on the table to make sure it is strait. Popped it in and started the bike. WOW what a difference between the #95 needle and the Magna #97 needle.   Allot of idle drift at 3 turns, so turned it in about to 2 1/4 turns, seemed to level out. At this point, it has some drift and when it idles it sounds like a cam with allot of duration. Took it for a short ride down the main road. At a slight roll I nailed  it.  I felt the rear tire slip and grab,it was climbing fast, then I hit second and was going 75 and climbing, then I shut down.
About it for now, going to let my brain take it easy today and maybe take it for ride tom
Dan

[fstsix]

Sounds like your slow jet is too small, it is having a hard time at transition to the main, basically i just went one step in slow jet at a time and kept checking plugs, at one point i went to the next jet size and it was just too rich and fouled the plugs, at that point i went back one step and could work it out on the mixture screw, It is better to be a little fat than LEAN on forced induction your plugs should be a little brown. If i where closer i would be happy to let you try my bike so you know that is is just tuning. i had lots of aggravating moments with 2 different carbs but i cannot tell you how many times i had my tank off, i can remove it in less than 5 minutes LOL!! check those plugs if they look too clean or gray white you are lean. mine are lite cocoa brown. The good news is i have not had the tank off in 3 years.....air filter is dirty LOL!!! before you pull the jet, as you said try to turn that AIR screw in and see if that takes that flat spot out. I bought the jet kit from Sudco,it has needles slows and mains and pump nozzles.

# 27.5 slow jet

[dreamaker]

I'm running the 27.5 slow jet in it now.

Dan

[fstsix]

Excellent news!! time to Rock and Roll  did your clutch start slipping ? after 3rd gear....that back tire WILL HATE YOU LOL!!!

[Murdoc]

I'm running the 27.5 slow jet in it now.

Dan

I finally have my new kit installed and took my IS on the road for the first time today.  Out of the box, it seems to run fairly well, but it looks like I will be following everyone else on changing out the jets, etc.  It seems to go lean pretty quick and that makes me worried.  I'm a little puzzled though on what the final jet sizes you landed on and whether or not you went back to the needle that came with the carb.  It looks like you got a 95, but then went back to the stock 97?

Thanks!

[dreamaker]

As of now I have 27.5 slow jet, the carb comes with a 25 slow jet.  If you have  the Mikuni 45 from Magna,  the needle marked 97 is modified and is not a standard 97 needle.


As you know I bent the #97 needle, actually it had only a bow in it. I did straiten it out but as a reaction I ordered a new one and it came in today. When I compared it to the one that came with the supercharger it was night and day. Did you get  your Mikuni 45 from Bill from Magna or did you get it online.  I loaded a pic so you can see, ignore the ark of the top and bottom needles it is due to the shape of the lens.  Notice the difference between the two 45mm needles. Wondered if I should have changed the needles, it gets confusing, just will have to roll with it for now. Bill claims the new generation should get mid 30s for mileage. I don't think he had anyone testing the new system for him other wise the system would be closer foe initial setup for dialing in. Also the air filter issue would have been known.

Dan

[Murdoc]

Yes, I got the new kit from Bill last year, but haven't had time to work on the install till recently.  I haven't pulled apart the carb yet and am hoping to only have to do that once...    Did you find a supplier for the needed jets, etc. that actually had them in stock?  I'm trying to get this ready for the trip to Inzane.

[dreamaker]

Let me start with the jets and needles.  I bought jets for the Valk carbs. and got them nearly the next day, now trying to get parts for the Mikuni is an other story.  Here is the story, I have found the parts come from either Mikuni or Sudco then goes to a distributor which does not sell to the public. You got to find a dealer, here is the fun part. First off, from my experience do not go to Jet R Us .com or Narley Choppers.com. They took about two weeks to send it to me and lied through there teeth to me for the reasons of delay.  Sometimes I make things harder then they have to be and never considered going to my local Harley Dealer for the parts.
Fstsix has been helping me through the transition, but there is a difference between him and I. He bought his Mikuni out right and did not get the modified needle from Magna, that is why we talked about the #95 needle.  The other difference is he is running the first generation MagnaCharger with the  J-tube and the Mikuni so his mods may not totally apply to the new generation MagnaCharger issues. I am the new generation MagnaCharger.
Here is what I do know, when I did the first mod. I changed the jet form 25 to 27.5 and changed the needle to a 95. I definitely could see a positive change. I just made the second mod. change, is to switch the 95 needle back to the Magna 97 needle.  (needle that came with the MagnaCharger) I noticed a positive difference switching the needle back. Idle and take off is smother for me.  So bottom line at this point I would say use the needle that came with the MagnaCharger.  I would buy a 27.5 and a 30 slow jet which is one step up each for the Mikuni.  
My issues are from idle to power, what took a 1/4 turn now takes less then a 1/8 turn. For me the power transition on taking off should be smoother.  Now far as cruising, that is no issue.  The engine just hums, nice even sound not even a hiccup. I just want the take off to be smother, maybe I am just spoiled.

Dan

[fstsix]

I'm running the 27.5 slow jet in it now.

Dan

I finally have my new kit installed and took my IS on the road for the first time today.  Out of the box, it seems to run fairly well, but it looks like I will be following everyone else on changing out the jets, etc.  It seems to go lean pretty quick and that makes me worried.  I'm a little puzzled though on what the final jet sizes you landed on and whether or not you went back to the needle that came with the carb.  It looks like you got a 95, but then went back to the stock 97?

Thanks!

I strongly recommend just do the slow jet first you will be surprised at the results, I had no real help years ago when i did the upgrade for the Mikuni,on past experience with my Turbocharged Sand Rail VW....and had the same problem had a fella at the Glamis Sand dunes (Engine Builder) camping next to me give the tip on the Slow jet, it was just a flash back of the 'School of hard knocks'   25 years ago   Weber 40 MM Sidedraft Carb

[fstsix]

Also, The main jet must be opened also...i had read this after the drilling of my own Main jet and it made complete sense.... read Faster and faster...http://www.timskelton.com/valkyrie/gen_interest/bonnevalk.htm

[dreamaker]

Keep in mind I am not a full throttle person that has to be on it all the time, I would like to just cruise or go camping.  I guess my question is what drill size is equal to the 240 or the 245 jet size.

Dan

[fstsix]

Keep in mind I am not a full throttle person that has to be on it all the time, I would like to just cruise or go camping.  I guess my question is what drill size is equal to the 240 or the 245 jet size.

Dan

Dan, I got to go buy a magnifying glass to read the numbers on the drill  from what you have pointed out, the needle has been modified...so the carb that was sent has had mods done to it....i don't understand the #25 slow jet that was in it...but every bike will respond different, even exhaust will change the signal the idle circuit will respond to. I did have to move that 95 needle around as for clip position and it was also critical for tuning. did you put the Magna needle back in the same clip when you removed it ? also the the 42MM Jet service kit 97 needle is not the same as the 45MM # 97 needle, do you have the Sudco Mikuni tuning manual it is helpfull but all in all....you don't have to hold it down at the salt flats when running lean to break your ring lands from detonation. also i run my Dyna on #5 advance/ with retard -4  run it a little while and do a plug check again. Greg

[rdunbar123]

Hi. finally put the supercharger back on . I think I am now the record holder for the four bolts. about 30 minutes. So far no leak. I had decided not to mess with a bigger filter until I was sure my blower didn't leak oil.  Run fairly well, hard to warm up but idles decently. my problem and question now is:
if I accelerate moderately no problem , good response. However if I give the throttle a hard twist it will speed up and then stall. Sometimes will then stutter and catch. I at first thought about rev limit but this happens below 5000 rpm. What is the rev limit BTW. I wonder if this is a function of the smaller filter. as I mentioned I have one that went on My raider big air kit that is larger. any thoughts. I have not done anything with the needles. and my screw is 2.5 turns out. I am going to run it for a while and then read the plugs. I may turn to you guys for help if i can become competent at taking and posting pics. At least I am learning a lot about the bike. Thanks.

Ron

[dreamaker]

Greg, I put the clip on the third groove as it originally came on the Magna needle.  From what I understand about the needles, the 45mm and 48mm needles are the same. The 42mm needle taper is lower down the shaft closer to the tip. Now far as the jets they use the same jets for the 42mm and the 45mm, don't recall if they work in the 48mm.

I am wondering what effect the snorkle type air filter would have on the setup.

Dan