Gun Carriers . . . Ever Pulled It For Reason??

[donaldcc]

  I grew up in south around guns all the time, but now hardly ever.  I have friends that could start WW3 from their home.

  After reading Fudgie's post on leaving his gun behind, I began to wonder.  ???

  It sounds like a lot of bikers have and carry guns.  I wonder why.  The obvious answer is defense, but in my own case I am rarely in any situation where I would feel the need to have a gun.  There could be many other reasons, some not so complimentary.  Not to say I can't imagine a situation where gun would be good.

  I can understand the gun in the home, but the carried weapon I don't understand as well.

  So . . . for you who carry a gun, how long have you done so and why?  And have you ever pulled the gun for a reason other than to clean, show it around, etc.

[RoadKill]

I have never needed the airbag in my steering wheel or the seatbelt in my car either

[Serk]

  After reading Fudgie's post on leaving his helmet behind, I began to wonder.  ???

  It sounds like a lot of bikers have and wear helmets.  I wonder why.  The obvious answer is protection, but in my own case I am rarely in any situation where I would feel the need to have a helmet.  There could be many other reasons, some not so complimentary.  Not to say I can't imagine a situation where a helmet would be good.

  I can understand a helmet on the racetrack, but wearing a helmet on normal roads I don't understand as well.

  So . . . for you who wear a helmet, how long have you done so and why?  And have you ever needed the helmet for a reason other than to clean, show it around, etc.



----------------------------

Sometimes the best way to answer a question is to reword the question and ask the person a very slightly modified version of their original question... 

[fudgie]

  After reading Fudgie's post on leaving his helmet behind, I began to wonder.  ???

  It sounds like a lot of bikers have and wear helmets.  I wonder why.  The obvious answer is protection, but in my own case I am rarely in any situation where I would feel the need to have a helmet.  There could be many other reasons, some not so complimentary.  Not to say I can't imagine a situation where a helmet would be good.

  I can understand a helmet on the racetrack, but wearing a helmet on normal roads I don't understand as well.

  So . . . for you who wear a helmet, how long have you done so and why?  And have you ever needed the helmet for a reason other than to clean, show it around, etc.
----------------------------
Sometimes the best way to answer a question is to reword the question and ask the person a very slightly modified version of their original question... 

Thats 2 different questions. lol I ride without my helmet but never without my gun!  I only 'need' my helmet in helmet states.  If we go down on the bike, somewhere under that road rash, wipe away my grey matter, there will be a smile on my face. Rather go out livin, then not live at all. 

[musclehead]

its the condom answer, better to have it and not need it.

as a trucker there are places I don't spend the night. thats why I have never "needed" to be packing.

[fudgie]

Been hunting since I was in single digits. Started carring when I was 18. Grew up around guns. I carry to protect myself and the ol lady, and possibly others. Supreme court ruled years ago that the police have no duty to respond or protect you. You have to protect yourself. You can only match force for force up to a certain point. Sure I live in a safe town. I am not willing to bet I will be safe in every store I go to. Upscale sides of town are just as unsafe as the low side is in every part of the country. No body really knows 'when' they will need it. Leaving it at home cause your going somewhere 'safe' is poor judgement. If you know you are gonna need it why go there anyway?  School shootings happen and they are 'gun free zones'. WTF? Drug store shootings, Lane bryant, etc. They happen everywhere.
I have never pulled it but I have been shot at before on my property. The guy is now a felon. Dad has pulled his twice that I know of. Once in chicago in the 70's as thugs were robbing a old lady and 15 yrs ago at home. He was weed eating along the road and was carring his .357 as he was going over to the other farm to shoot sod poodles. A car full of teens veered off the road to 'try' and hit him just to scare him. Well he pulled it and they shot back up on the road as fast as they came off.
Its 2nd hand to carry. Except today when I forgot.  Even Kit is use to doing her make up in the morning and strapin her .38 sp to her hip before she gets her boots on. She freaks out when she leaves it at home. Alot of people are into how they look by others if you have a gun. I dont do it for them, I do it for myself. Carry how it best fits you, open or cc.

[RP#62]

I never have.  My wife has twice.  Fortunately, drawing it was all that was required to stop what was going on. 

We lived in Miami during the riots and that opened our eyes about a lot of things.  The first thing that happens is that they close all the gun shops, so whatever guns and ammo you have is all you have.  A good friend of mine lived in the curfew zone.  His house was being threatened.  He called the police.  They told him that they're at capacity, and that he's on his own.  They told him to do whatever he has to do and they'd help him with the paperwork later.  Granted, this is not a usual situation, but it taught us not to take things for granted.
-RP

[Mr. Nuts]

A great collection of gun quotes below. Thankfully I have never had to "pull" a gun on a human in 37 years of carry. But it has given me great confidence and security just having it in my possession. And in carrying I am actively using my right to do so. Rights not used can become stale and are more easily taken from us. Because I carry, and a lot of my fellow bikers do too, those of you who don't carry are also made safer. Those who would happily just bump us off the road can never be sure which of us is armed and which aren't. In Montana we have abundant wildlife and many times I have had to use my firearm to dispatch suffering animals after cars and trucks had hit them. Unarmed drivers often feel pretty bad watching these animals flop around while they are helpless to do anything about it. Irresponsible to drive without one in Montana imho. Technically, they can call a cop or Fish and Game, but it can be hours out here before they show up.

Cops carry guns to protect themselves, not to protect you.

Never let someone or thing that threatens you get inside arms length and never say "I've got a gun".  If you feel you need to use deadly force for heavens sake let the "first sound they hear be the safety clicking off", and they shouldn't have time to hear anything after that if you are doing your job.

'The average response time of a 911 call is over 23 minutes the response time of a .44 magnum is 1400 feet per second.'

Clint Smith, Director of Thunder Ranch, is a drill instructor (Thunder Ranch is a firearms training facility in Arizona ). Here are a few of his observations on tactics, firearms, self-defense and life as we know it in the civilized world.

"The most important rule in a gunfight is: Always win and cheat if necessary."

"Don't forget, incoming fire has the right of way.."

"Make your attacker advance through a wall of bullets. You may get killed with your own gun, but he'll have to beat you to death with it, cause it's going to be empty."

"If you're not shooting', you should be loading'. If you're not loading', you should be moving', if you're not moving', someone's going to cut your head off and put it on a stick."

"When you reload in low light encounters, don't put your flashlight in your back pocket.. If you light yourself up, you'll look like an angel or the tooth fairy... and you're going to be one of 'em pretty soon."

"Do something. It may be wrong, but do something."

"Shoot what's available, as long as it's available, until something else becomes available."

"If you carry a gun, people will call you paranoid.. That's ridiculous. If you have a gun, what in the hell do you have to be paranoid for?"

"Don't shoot fast, unless you also shoot good."

"You can say 'stop' or 'alto' or use any other word you think will work, but I've found that a large bore muzzle pointed at someone's head is pretty much the universal language."

"You have the rest of your life to solve your problems.. How long you live depends on how well you do it."

"You cannot save the planet, but you may be able to save yourself and your family."

"Thunder Ranch will be here as long as you'll have us or until someone makes us go away, and either way, it will be exciting."


More Excellent Gun Wisdom:

The purpose of fighting is to win. There is no possible victory in defense. The sword is more important than the shield, and skill is more important than either. The final weapon is the brain. All else is supplemental.

1. Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.

2. If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck.

3. I carry a gun cause a cop is too heavy.

4. When seconds count, the cops are just minutes away.

5. A reporter did a human-interest piece on the Texas Rangers. The reporter recognized the Colt Model 1911 the Ranger was carrying and asked him 'Why do you carry a 45?' The Ranger responded, 'Because they don't make a 46.'

6. An armed man will kill an unarmed man with monotonous regularity.

7. The old sheriff was attending an awards dinner when a lady commented on his wearing his sidearm. 'Sheriff, I see you have your pistol. Are you expecting trouble?' 'No ma'am. If I were expecting trouble, I would have brought my rifle.'

8. Beware of the woman who only has one gun, because she probably knows how to use it very well.

'The true soldier fights not because he hates what is in front of him, but because he loves what is behind him.' G. K. Chesterton

A people that values its privileges above its principles will soon lose both.

"Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not..." - Thomas Jefferson.

[ArmyValker]

Has anyone been in a situation where you needed one and didn't have it?

[YoungPUP]

I'd rather have it and not need itn than need it and not have it. When I started carrying I traded beers with a state trooper  that was very informative, in that If you're forced to draw your weapon any hesitation you make can get you killed, and never draw your weapon unless you intend to kill.
 
The om time that I was forced to draw I was picking up a roll-off box (construction dumpster) early in the morning in a sketchy area, in a truck that I was unfamiliar with, In stead of looking out my mirrors I was turned around in the driver seat with the door open. I got punched in the back of the leg, and told to hand over my wallet. I was polite enough to hand over the front of my springfield XD 9 subcompact that I kept strapped to the center console. Thankfully that was enough persuasion to change his mind. He's in jail now. Turned out to be some individual wanted for a few wallet grabs.  Wont be doing that again any time soon....Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it!!!!

[designer]

Wolves, sheep and sheepdogs.  Just say baaaaaaa!

http://www.mwkworks.com/onsheepwolvesandsheepdogs.html

Enough said!

[Mosa]

um, nope. but nice to have it if needed... been in a coupla hairy situations where it was almost needed, but my feets beat it outta there beforehand...   

Mosa

[donaldcc]

Been hunting since I was in single digits. Started carring when I was 18. Grew up around guns. I carry to protect myself and the ol lady, and possibly others. . . .

 I too was hunting just about everything that you could as a kid and we had a lot of guns with my dad and 2 brothers along with cousin I hunted a lot with.  My uncle was a judge in Tampa, FL who dealt with murderers, rapists etc.  He always had a gun strapped to his ankle when on the bench because of the people he dealt with.  There was an incident in another courtroom where armed gangbangers tried to free one of their buds from the courtroom of another judge.  Not successful and one of gangbangers shot.

He said he only pulled it once as he was driving home and saw a guy beating the crap out of a woman on street corner in bad part of town near courts.  He got out of his car with weapon out and ordered the guy away.  Successful.

My nephew is long haul trucker and ALWAYS  has his firearm.  Me.  I just haven't felt the need.   

[Valker]

Has anyone been in a situation where you needed one and didn't have it?

Only situations where I would have used it were vehicles trying to either "play" or kill me outright. Once back in 1976 a car tried four times to run me off a road in Amarillo. He finally got away when I reached into my boot and pulled out my thumb and forefinger in a black glove pointed at him.
Second time was in 2002 with my teenage son riding behind me. In a construction zone on I-40 (two way traffic with concrete dividers on the left and no shoulder on the right) in Arkansas, a large dump truck started tailgating me. I did the brake light thing, hand motions to back off, speeding up, etc. He simply kept getting closer. I would have exited, but there was NO place to get off or out of the way. I ended up going almost 100mph with him less than 20 feet behind. When I pointed to my son, the driver just laughed. Finally, an exit showed (this took about 5 miles) and I got off and got away. Had I been carrying, I would have put 3 in the HUGE radiator just beyond arm's reach. If that had not IMMEDIATELY had the desired effect, I would have most definitely put the fourth one through his windshield. I am firmly convinced he was set on murdering me and my son. I was assuredly in fear of my and my son's life.

I did NOT have a good time that time.

[bentwrench]

I think it was Winston Churchill that said "a gentleman will rarely have need of a pistol but when he does he will need it badly".
We are very fortunate to have the right to be armed citizens,We should protect that right jealously.
BentiamasheepdogtooWrench

[fudgie]

Has anyone been in a situation where you needed one and didn't have it?

Yes, when I and some friends were shot at. Granted I was in no power to have a gun as Jack Daniels was on my side....... 

[Jess from VA]

I have shown a pistol twice; produced, but not pointed.  Both times an individual decided he wanted to do me bodily harm, and closed with me to do so (both were bigger than me, both acting irrationally) (I did not know if they were armed, but they did not show a weapon) (I did not start either altercation, and I used no 'fighting words' of provocation, but they did).  I never spoke a word, just stared with a questioning look; if I had spoken, I would have said. 'I will not fight you, but I will kill you.'  On each occasion, that was the minimum show of force necessary to end it, and they decided they wanted to be somewhere else.

[RoadKill]

Been hunting since I was in single digits. Started carring when I was 18. Grew up around guns. I carry to protect myself and the ol lady, and possibly others. . . .

He said he only pulled it once as he was driving home and saw a guy beating the crap out of a woman on street corner in bad part of town near courts.  He got out of his car with weapon out and ordered the guy away.  Successful.

Now, we must all fear evil men. But there is another kind of evil which we must fear most, and that is the indifference of good men.
 
 Thanx for the lack of indifference !

[Kymbo]

As you probubly know over here we are not alowed to CC ,Own a hand gun unless in a club and meet all the requirements of a club shoot several times a year .They took all our Semi Autos years ago and you can only have them now if you are a primary producer and can proove you have a legitamate reason for owning one.The latest is talk about restricting caliber size in relation to property size that you can shoot on.So you guys that carry ,Fight damn hard to keep that right.

I LIKE THIS ONE!!
 
 
An Arizona Department of Safety Officer pulled over a pick-up truck owner
For a faulty taillight. When the officer approached the driver, the man
Behind the wheel handed the officer his driver’s license, insurance card and
A concealed weapon carry permit. The officer took all the documents, looked them over and said. "Mr. Smith, I see you have a CCP. Do you have any weapons with you?" The driver replied, " Yes sir, I have a 357 handgun in a hip holster, a
.45 in the glove box and a .22 derringer in my boot."

The officer looked at the driver and asked, "Anything else?" "Yes sir, I have a Mossberg 500 12 gauge and an AR-15 behind the seat."

The officer asked if the man was driving to or from a shooting range and the man said he wasn't, so the officer bent over and looked into the driver's face and said "Mr. Smith, you're carrying quite a few guns.
May I ask what you are afraid of?"

Mr. Smith locked eyes with the officer and calmly answered, "Not a f-----g thing!"
 

[junior]

i will prob get told that i am an ass,and dont know squat.................... all you gun toaters?  i aint agenst carrying guns, i have had been pulled upon several times. the queston is are you really gonna pull that trigger? or risk haveing your own wepon used on you? all of you can say YES I WOULD!!!!!!!!!!! but i doutpt it. it takes alot to pull that trigger on another human it aint like killing a critter. ask any LEO

[alph]

my parents owned a gas station, i use to run it.  it was about 1 am, i heard some noise in the back room, i got up, saw a guy coming in through the back window, i had a .22 ruger, pointed it at the guy and said stop, he said he was thirsty and he wanted a coke!!  i said get down, he jumped out of the window and ran, it took the police about a half an hour to show up. 

another time i had a raccoon on the power line, shorting himself off on the transformer.  he wasn't dead, but he wasn't doing good either!! i called the police and they said it wasn't their problem, i called animal control and he said he had a wedding to go to and that if i had a gun to go out and shoot it and put it out of it's missery, so i did.

the third time was when we had a dog that got hit by a truck.  took him out in the woods, that one was a bit harder.

[Hoser]

I shot a deer once that I hit with my pickup that was thrashing around in agony in the middle of the road.  The deputy that showed up later was a little miffed, guess he wanted it to suffer and block traffic until he got there, the Sheriff had no problem with it.  Hoser  ???

[Jabba]

I have a friends Dad that was a Ranger in Viet  Nam.  He summed it up for me very precisely. 

"I don't want to kill the VC.  If it was up to me we'd play poker for all the marbles.  But, at some point it comes down to him, or me.  And when that happens that Fuc%er HAS to go!"

I had 4 kids in a car slam on the brakes in the middle of the road one morning and all 4 of them get out and head to my car to do no good.  I simply "produced" my Sig P226, and they changed their minds.

My brother got stopped once for speeding.  Gave the LEO his license, registration and CCW.  LEO asked if he was carrying, and he said yes.  There is a .44 Mag under the seat of the truck.  LEO asks if it was loaded.  My brother says... "Of course... it might as well be a rock if it wasn't!"

Same sort of deal with me on a traffic stop.  The LEO took the weapon and unloaded it... ran all my info and gave me a verbal warning.  Then lectured me about carrying with a round in the chamber.  I simply asked him if HIS sidearm had a round chambered or not?  He looked at me sort of dumb for a moment, and then said.  "Sir, you make a very good point.  Have a good night."

Jabba

[Titan]

i will prob get told that i am an ass,and dont know squat.................... all you gun toaters?  i aint agenst carrying guns, i have had been pulled upon several times. the queston is are you really gonna pull that trigger? or risk haveing your own wepon used on you? all of you can say YES I WOULD!!!!!!!!!!! but i doutpt it. it takes alot to pull that trigger on another human it aint like killing a critter. ask any LEO

[thumper]

Drew mine on my sister and started blasting.....realized that I was out of caps!

She beat the crap out of me.

[MacDragon]

i will prob get told that i am an ass,and dont know squat.................... all you gun toaters?  i aint agenst carrying guns, i have had been pulled upon several times. the queston is are you really gonna pull that trigger? or risk haveing your own wepon used on you? all of you can say YES I WOULD!!!!!!!!!!! but i doutpt it. it takes alot to pull that trigger on another human it aint like killing a critter. ask any LEO

You're certainly welcome to your opinion.  
I would not have a problem with it at all... Been shooting all my life and a member of the NRA since I was 12.
If it comes down to having to pull it... there would be nothing in my mind to stop it from discharging.  Me or him if the threat of life is there.  That's the only reason to unholster it... and the only reason to let the lead fly.  Center mass and stop the threat at all cost.  Only if absolutely nessessary.

[Titan]

Here's an article that should be read by anyone who questions why people should carry a gun.

Read it and then tell us all how carrying a gun is a bad idea.


luby's cafeteria shooting. 
http://www.gunownersalliance.com/hupp-10.htm

[Doc809]

Had just emptied my wallet at the gas station the other day and was waiting to pull out into traffic when a red/white Lincoln Cont. cut me off from the street.  I knew better but honked the horn fully expecting to get "flipped off" and him drive away.  Instead he gets out of the car.  I thought, Oh crap here we go.  Rolled down the window and said "don't come around the corner of that car."  He is wearing a black pinstripe suit with a white tie, his little hat with the feather (getting the picture?) and says "who the $%%^^& you think you is honking at me?"  Like an idiot I respond with "who the $%%^ you think you is cutting me off"? STUPID of me letting this escalate.  Now I said "do not come around the corner of that car" to which I receive a "what the $%%^ you think you gonna do if I does"?  In my most kind voice I could muster I answered "if you come around the corner of that car there will be one dead pimp on this parking lot" and opened the console of the truck.  That's all it took.  Never had to pull or show.  Just the action of opening the console was enough.  He got in his car and drove away.  Once I regained control from trembling and sweating, I realized how dumb I had been to let that almost get out of control.  Drove away resolved to keep my hand off the horn (at least for a while).

[ricoman]

i will prob get told that i am an ass,and dont know squat.................... all you gun toaters?  i aint agenst carrying guns, i have had been pulled upon several times. the queston is are you really gonna pull that trigger? or risk haveing your own wepon used on you? all of you can say YES I WOULD!!!!!!!!!!! but i doutpt it. it takes alot to pull that trigger on another human it aint like killing a critter. ask any LEO

I have to agree, Junior.
I think many believe they have the balls, but I doubt it.
I also fail to see what Titan thought was so humerous in your post.
If you feel a need to pull a weapon but are not 100% ready to use it, you would be better off leaving it at home.

[mojo]

Touchy subject.  I went through the class on Ohio Laws. I understood that when carrying a firearm:
1.  It can't be shown for any other reason than defending you or your spouse's life. (Brandishing, felony) Lesser charge if the gun is brandished unintentionally.
2.  You cannot shoot someone unless they are threatening you or your spouse's life with a weapon.  Beating beaten and knocked out will not justify you shooting someone.
3.  The ONLY reason to ever bring the gun out is to stop an armed individual who is going to kill you or your spouse.  Women have an alternate justifiable reason and that is rape.
4.  A person with a permit cannot use the weapon to stop anyone who is harming another person no matter what.  Only the permit holder and his spouse can protect themselves.  I asked the question, "What if I see someone shooting at a group or individual?"  The answer was repeated, "Only if you or your spouse's lives are threatened by someone with a deadly weapon."

The Ohio laws may be different than elswhere but this is my understanding from the NRA National Instructor that gave us our required course for obtaining a permit.

He also told us that if there ever was a "shooting" to be prepared for a lengthy and costly legal affair.  NRA is a good protection for that.

All of that being said; I personally wouldn't tell anyone if I were to carry a firearm except for the required "Declaration" (Per Ohio Law) if encountered by Law Enforcement.  It's controversial I know but that's the way it is for me..

My 10 cents and .45ACP

mojo

[Valker]

the queston is are you really gonna pull that trigger? or risk haveing your own wepon used on you?

Yes, and if they kill me with my own gun, they will have to beat me to death with it since it will be empty of all rounds by then.
I love dogs, but if one attacks me,I'd kill it in a heart beat. I killed a pitbull that was attacking a student of mine a long time ago, had to use my bare hands since I was at school and had zero weapons with me.

[Serk]

I sincerely, deeply, truly hope I NEVER have reason to point a gun at someone and pull the trigger... I really hope I never have to do it.

BUT... If someone ever gives me reason to do so, if the choice is me or them, my family or him, there's no question, no hesitation, they're going down. And yes, I know that's a very powerful moment in a person's life, one I hope I never have to encounter, but if that choice needs to be made, I have thought it through fully and am peace with having to do what needs to be done.

...and, if it ever does happen, I sure hope it's in a state with Castle Doctrine in effect!

[x]

Have I ever pulled a gun... and why?
 
Well, yes... I withdrew my S&W 38 snubnose hammerless revolver about 3/4's of the way out of the right hand pocket of the leather jacket I was wearing.
 
The reason I did this is because two yahoos in a Chevy pickup with LA license plates ran a stop sign and turned right in front of me, causing me a seriously large pucker and a huge pull on the brake to avoid an accident.  I blew the hell out of my horns, which happened to be Rivco... and for those gentlemen who own these, you know they put out substantial volume.

About two blocks up there is a stoplight... red.  The Chevy is in front of me.  The doors open... the two yahoos exit... fairly large specimens of LA redneck.  One has a large stick in his hand.  I assume they want to come over and say howdy until I see the looks on their faces and the dude with the stick seems to be going into a windup.
 
I retract my revolver from my pocket and as soon as it becomes clear that I am not pulling a rabbit out of my pocket, but rather a weapon, these fine gentlemen turn around, return to their truck, and drive away.  Light turns green, the gents are on their way, and a situation that might have become ugly for someone is avoided.

[rodeo1]

as a viet nam vet, and 15 years as a police officer, you better beilieve i've used it. i still carry except when i travel ! huh ? yep, i am a 100% disabled vet. i travel with the CMA ministry so know i have better protection than a gun anyway. however, in the bible when Jesus sent the deciples out to minister to the world, he told them if they did not own a sword, to sell something and buy one. he never intended for them to go unarmed, or unprotected.

the reason i don't carry when i travel is that i stay on military bases (they all have r.v. parks) in my kwik kamp, and most do not allow guns on base. so i bought me a pretty pink barbie bat (t-ball bat) made of solid aluminum. i figure it this way. how would you like to be a gangbanger having to explain to your gang how some old grey headed retired sailor just beat your ass with a "pink" barbie bat. ha !

[Jess from VA]

Touchy subject.  I went through the class on Ohio Laws. I understood that when carrying a firearm:
1.  It can't be shown for any other reason than defending you or your spouse's life. (Brandishing, felony) Lesser charge if the gun is brandished unintentionally.
2.  You cannot shoot someone unless they are threatening you or your spouse's life with a weapon.  Beating beaten and knocked out will not justify you shooting someone.
3.  The ONLY reason to ever bring the gun out is to stop an armed individual who is going to kill you or your spouse.  Women have an alternate justifiable reason and that is rape.
4.  A person with a permit cannot use the weapon to stop anyone who is harming another person no matter what.  Only the permit holder and his spouse can protect themselves.  I asked the question, "What if I see someone shooting at a group or individual?"  The answer was repeated, "Only if you or your spouse's lives are threatened by someone with a deadly weapon."

The Ohio laws may be different than elswhere but this is my understanding from the NRA National Instructor that gave us our required course for obtaining a permit.

He also told us that if there ever was a "shooting" to be prepared for a lengthy and costly legal affair.  NRA is a good protection for that.

All of that being said; I personally wouldn't tell anyone if I were to carry a firearm except for the required "Declaration" (Per Ohio Law) if encountered by Law Enforcement.  It's controversial I know but that's the way it is for me..

My 10 cents and .45ACP

mojo

Those laws flat suck, and do not follow ordinary self defense rules.  

Two or more (unarmed) adult males against one is a threat of deadly force.  A huge single (unarmed) musclebound man against one small or weak or old or disabled man or any woman is a deadly threat.  You have every right to use deadly force in defense of any person or persons (other than you and your spouse), if they themselves are under deadly threat.  It is a reasonable man balancing test applied to the facts then present.  Threat of serious bodily injury with hands, clubs, or weapons (short of intent to kill) is also a deadly threat, against which you can use deadly force.

Another cockamamie OH rule is that an unloaded gun together with either a loaded mag or speed loader is considered a loaded gun for concealed weapons violations.  If you have a permit or reciprocity, you are OK...... but if you travel thru OH with no permit, and the gun is unloaded and you have either loaded mag or speed loader, even if stored separately using the two-container rule, you are still carrying a concealed weapon in violation of OH law.

[Bobbo]

as a viet nam vet, and 15 years as a police officer, you better beilieve i've used it. i still carry except when i travel ! huh ? yep, i am a 100% disabled vet. i travel with the CMA ministry so know i have better protection than a gun anyway. however, in the bible when Jesus sent the deciples out to minister to the world, he told them if they did not own a sword, to sell something and buy one. he never intended for them to go unarmed, or unprotected.

the reason i don't carry when i travel is that i stay on military bases (they all have r.v. parks) in my kwik kamp, and most do not allow guns on base. so i bought me a pretty pink barbie bat (t-ball bat) made of solid aluminum. i figure it this way. how would you like to be a gangbanger having to explain to your gang how some old grey headed retired sailor just beat your ass with a "pink" barbie bat. ha !

Jesus also warned that if you take up the sword, you will die by the sword.  You should be careful if you ever get into that situation, as it looks like you will be shot to death...

[Jabba]

Jesus also warned that if you take up the sword, you will die by the sword.  You should be careful if you ever get into that situation, as it looks like you will be shot to death...

Only of you believe in the literal word of the bible.

Me... not so much.

In Indiana, you are not limited to you or your spouse.  Or your kids... or any other dumbass limitation.  You can use deadly force to defend anyone's life.  And we have castle doctrine as well.

Jabba

[0leman]

Dang I am glad I live in a quiet portion of the country.  I use to carry when I worked in the woods that had a bad Rabies problem.   Really haven't thought about carrying since.  I do have enough weapons in our home to start a small war if necessary, most are locked up in a safe.  Though one or two pistols are laying around in easy reach.   If I start getting the feeling that the portion of the world I live in is getting dangerous, then I will get a CC permit and start carrying.  Since most of my pistols are of good size, it will be pretty clear that I am packing.

As several have pointed out, killing a person will have an effect on one.   BUT I feel I could/would shoot to kill (have killed a lot of critters in the pass without it effecting me other than filling my stomach).  A good friend, who is a Policeman in WY, told me if I start shooting to not stop till the individual stops moving or you run out of bullets.  Since I would be shooting with a 45, every shot will cause them to move.   I would follow his advice to the letter.

[ptgb]

Touchy subject.  I went through the class on Ohio Laws. I understood that when carrying a firearm:
1.  It can't be shown for any other reason than defending you or your spouse's life. (Brandishing, felony) Lesser charge if the gun is brandished unintentionally.
2.  You cannot shoot someone unless they are threatening you or your spouse's life with a weapon.  Beating beaten and knocked out will not justify you shooting someone.
3.  The ONLY reason to ever bring the gun out is to stop an armed individual who is going to kill you or your spouse.  Women have an alternate justifiable reason and that is rape.
4.  A person with a permit cannot use the weapon to stop anyone who is harming another person no matter what.  Only the permit holder and his spouse can protect themselves.  I asked the question, "What if I see someone shooting at a group or individual?"  The answer was repeated, "Only if you or your spouse's lives are threatened by someone with a deadly weapon."

The Ohio laws may be different than elswhere but this is my understanding from the NRA National Instructor that gave us our required course for obtaining a permit.

He also told us that if there ever was a "shooting" to be prepared for a lengthy and costly legal affair.  NRA is a good protection for that.

All of that being said; I personally wouldn't tell anyone if I were to carry a firearm except for the required "Declaration" (Per Ohio Law) if encountered by Law Enforcement.  It's controversial I know but that's the way it is for me..

My 10 cents and .45ACP

mojo

I am not a supporter or detractor of concealed carry... so I have no opinion.

But as far a the Ohio Concealed Carry Laws... I see nothing that refers to any of that. Below, is right from the Ohio Attorney General:

From page 19 on...

http://www.ohioattorneygeneral.gov/getattachment/02ff1ca7-b17e-46e2-9f1f-505beac65926/2009-Concealed-Carry-Laws-Booklet.aspx

[rodeo1]

well boobo

that ain't what he meant. he meant those who carry the sword with malice (looking to hurt someone, gang members, rapists and the like) would then die by the sword (and they do) he wasn't talking about those who carry to defend the lives and property of others. you probably haven't had the honor of defending this country, or coming back and defending your community, many have not. for those of us who have, well we have a different opinion than you. it don't make us wrong, just different.

for all who carry. those of you who have killed another person with a gun (bobo, please notice i said killed, not murdered) know that when you take that plunge, you live with it forever. it visits you in your sleep. right or wrong, it still comes calling.

be careful, get educated, never carry with the intention of hurting anyone.