I would like some info on buying a rifle

[Jess Tolbirt]

I am thinking of buying a new toy and was thinking in the 30 cal range,,i like the 30-30's but which would be a wiser choice, a 30-06 or 308? what about a 17 hmr? good for long distance? i think its time i got ready for the next civil war...

[Serk]

If this is for man-sized predators, I'd go with .308 or 30.06, not the .17 HMR. The .17 HMR is awesome for rabbits, coyotes and such.

Ballistically the 30.06 and .308 are nearly identical, but if I had to only choose one, I'd go with the .308, being a current military caliber, it would be more readily available in a SHTF scenario...

[wobray]

I like the .308 for what you described as your need.
.17hmr is a good no recoil round but very small round.
30.06 is an all around powerful down range round.
Would be nice if you had a friend that would allow you to  fire these rounds.

[Jess Tolbirt]

many years ago i had a 7.62 Italian carcano rifle which i thought was the best,,, but yea i want to get one that would be able to get ammo for when the SdoesHTF

[fudgie]

.223 is a popular varmit cal.

[gregc]

17 remington is a center fire, the 17 hmr is a rim fire round. I think the 17 hmr is a necked down 22 rimfire magnum.   I wouldn't put much faith in a rim fire round for self defense.

[cookiedough]

What you going to use the rifle for and in what conditions?  Have experience with a Remington 700 bolt action in .270 caliber, a Ruger M77  bolt action .30-06, and a winchester lever action top ejection .30-30, along with a Savage lever action .308.  All have  their specific speciality.  The 30-30 is a good brush gun ONLY up to 100 yards before the bullet drops too much to be as accurate as I'd like but will kill deer easily enough like said up to 125 yards or so.  If in heavier cover, the short double barrel although heavy is very nice to have being shorter and if a shorter or younger person, not as much kick.  I can round out the 6 shot capacity lever action very quickly almost as much as a semi-automatic just like 'the rifleman' use to do in the old black and white movies I liked to watch as a kid.  Great first gun or like said, in heavy brush where shots are 100 yards or less.

The .270 and .30-06 are nearly identical with the flatter trajectory longer distances going to the .270 but the .30-06 has slightly more knockdown power especially longer 200-300 yard distances.  Both I can shoot very accurately up to 300 yards and kill deer efficiently being bolt action are more accurate and very reliable.  My brothers Remington .270 barks a little more than my Ruger .30-06 and is also slightly heavier though.

The lever action Savage .308 is not my favorite gun though.  I understand it has it's military use, but the longer distance shots are not as accurate (at least for me but could be gun) and the bullet drops more so at 250-300 yards than a .270 or .30-06 and is a slower bullet, not by much though.  Plus, the diameter of the hole it makes in deer really blows up a lot of the meat more so than the .30-06 or .270.  It is a good gun, just that I wouldn't buy one though for that reason.  Plus, the barrel in that older lever action savage is so light that the recoil is not bad on the shoulder but the kickup of the barrel goes up thus if you have a scope on the .308, you better not put your eyebrow too close to the scope or you will get popped and bleed.  Never happened to me but to my Dad and 2 other shooters who fired it.

I never really liked semi-automatic rifles since the few I have been around that others in our hunting party has had do jam up very seldom though along with pump action rifles not fond of either, only in shotgun pump action form.  

If moose/elk/bear hunting or longer distance than say 300 yard shots, go bigger in a bolt action 7mm or 7mm-08 or something else?  since the .30-06, .308, and .270 would work but not longer than 250 yard shots or so due to not enough knockdown power.  My .02 cents, others may disagree?

[Jess from VA]

Jess, besides caliber, what type rifle do you want?

Bolt, lever, pump, semiauto?

Do you like ammo capacity of 5 (bolt), 7-10 (lever), 20 (semiauto .308) or 30 (semiauto .223)?  

Is you primary purpose small game, large game, target, or two legged predators?

Do you want iron sights, scopes or red dot/holosights?

And what is a ballpark for your spending limit?

The 30-30 straightwall cartridge has taken more deer than all others put together.  It has tremendous knockdown power in a softnose bullet, but range is limited (maybe 200), and it is a lever gun.  .308 and 30.06 bottlenose cartridge also has tremendous power/velocity, and can be good to 4-800 meters (bolt, semiauto, and a few pumps).  30.06 has 200fps higher velocity than .308, but requires a long action, the .308 is short action (the favored Western/NATO military semiauto highpower cartridge), and a bit cheaper to shoot.

My only lever gun is the 1894 Marlin .44 mag, 10 shot capacity.  They also make an 1894C lever gun in .38 Spl/.357 also 10 round capacity.  These are nice brush gun carbines with pistol calibers at higher velocities because of longer bbls, and use the same ammo as your revolvers. Not great for long range, but very good at 100+ meters.

I have family in MI that has a very nice (older pre-crossbolt safety) Marlin 1894 .38/.357 with a 2.5 power European reticle scope for sale, reasonable.

However, if you don't have a WWII M1 Garand, that 8-shot, semiauto 30.06 in a good shooter is a marvelous rifle.

[Thunderbolt]

I just bought one of these. A 1967 model.

A Marlin 336 RC .30-30 is a tube fed, centerfire lever action rifle (carbine) made by Marlin Firearms. The 336 is normally considered a "brush gun" used for hunting animals like deer, black bear and wild hogs at close range in wooded areas. The 336 is an "improved" model of the 1893 Marlin and has been manufactured since 1948. RC signifies "regular carbine", the gun has two bands holding the magazine tube to the barrel, a pistol grip stock and a 20 inch barrel. The .30-30 Winchester cartridge is the first American civilian cartridge developed to use smokeless powder and dates from 1895. The 30-30 is a centerfire rimmed cartridge which fires a 150 grain .308 (7.62mm) bullet at 2400 feet per second or a 170 grain bullet at 2200 feet per second. The metric designation of the .30-30 is 7.62X51Rmm. There is information about both the Marlin 336 and the .30-30 in Wikipedia.

Read more: http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_a_marlin_336_RC_3030#ixzz1vkA0UszU

[musclehead]

I need more mags for my ruger ranch rifle chambered in .223.  besides the "stock" 5 round mags for hunting I have a 40 and a 25.

couple that with a berretta 9mm with 2-13 round mags and 2-15 round mags

and for added firepower my XD 45 .45 cal  3 15 round mags. thats like 161 rounds leaving out the small 5 round mags.  I need something belt fed 

[Sodbuster]

Jess -
What kind of rifle totally depends on what you're going to use it for.  A .223 is a relatively cheap round to shoot for coyotes but can be used for small deer with the right bullet and placement. I shoot a .270 for Antelope and Mule Deer for when I go out to Wyoming and bring the .223 for small game.

Another thing to consider is a short action (i.e. 308, .270 WSM, etc.) will be a little lighter and can make a BIG difference if you have to carry it far.

Check out this site ....
http://www.chuckhawks.com/index2e.rifle_cartridges.htm

[The Anvil]

Yeah, what you plan to use the gun for is very important.

.308 and 30-06 are both relatively expensive to shoot and overpowered for most purposes. 30-06 is also a relic cartridge. Advancements in powder technology made the larger case of the 30-06 unnecessary (i.e. more efficient burn from less powder) and the US military switched to the 7.62x51mm case and got roughly the same performance from the projectile. Unless I were planning on bringing down really big game or buying an M1 Garand then I would not even look at 30-06. If you are in fact looking to hunt big game then there are better cartridges than that. 270 Magnum, .338 Lapua come to mind...

If you ARE indeed looking for a SHTF gun then you want something that shoots ammo that's cheap and plentiful. Stock up now because if TEOTWAWKI comes ammunition will be like food and clean water. You will be limited to what you have on hand or can capture. Ammo will be currency. So look into .223 Remington and 5.56 NATO (a rifle that's chambered for 5.56 NATO will shoot .223 Remington no problem, a rifle chambered for .223 Remington will probably fire 5.56 NATO but maybe not, they are NOT 100% interchangeable) and AK platform rifles in 7.62X39mm (AK47) and 5.45X39mm (AK74). You can buy 2160 round crates of 5.45X39mm Russian surplus for about 300 bucks if you keep your eyes open for deals. Likewise with handgun calibers. Stick with 9mm P, .40 S&W and .45 ACP.

Also, keep a couple of .22lr's handy. You can hunt small game (which is good eating and plentiful year round) and you can stock up on many thousands of rounds for very short money.

[Hoser]

I have a 30.30 Winchester lever action with a 4x power scope that shoots straight, has adequate ballistics to take whitetail deer, and is a classic.  It is my favorite long gun. Ammo is not unreasonable, Is light and compact with a sling, can carry it all day.  Had it for 30 years.    Hoser

[Jess from VA]

Another nice .30 rifle on the cheap is the SKS (model 1946, forerunner of the famous AK47).  Shoots a shortened .30 (7.62 X 39) of Soviet/Chinese/Eastern Block.  Takes 10 rounds in the std magazine (and I believe now can legally be converted to 20 or 30 rd detachable box mags).  And can shoot steel cased Russian/Chek cheap (lacquer and polymer coated) ammo with no problems.  More accurate than the AK and a cheaper rifle to buy Milsurp.  10-rd strippers fit the receiver and quickly reload an empty rifle. A nice rear battle sight can be dropped on easily.

Resources:

http://www.sksboards.com/smf/index.php

http://www.yooperj.com/

http://www.tech-sights.com/sks.htm

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/AMM6406-1.html

http://www.wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=8788&dir=18|830|852

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/CategoryListing.aspx?catid=69

http://www.gunsamerica.com/Search/Category/634/2/Guns/Rifles/SKS-Rifles.htm

http://www.google.com/search?q=sks+rifles&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=Jh4&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&channel=np&prmd=imvns&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=xKK9T_HTOIeH6QHDheS1Cw&ved=0CJcBELAE&biw=1051&bih=483

[The Anvil]

Another nice .30 rifle on the cheap is the SKS

Yeah and if you throw your hat in the 7.62X39 ring and go stocking up you can keep an AK as your primary rifle and grab a couple of cheap SKS's as backups that will shoot the same ammo. There are a lot of converted SKS rifles that take AK 30 round mags out there now but owners are loathe to part with them.

The SKS is the Russian service rifle that preceded the AK47. Then they wanted a piece of the small-caliber, hyper velocity pie and went to the AK74 in the early 70's. Kind of like how the US went from the M1 Garand (7.62X63mm/30-06) to the M14 (7.62X51mm/.308) to the M16 (5.56mm NATO/.223 Rem). I always get a chuckle out of how the rifle adoptions paralleled each other more or less.

[RP#62]

It all depends.  Is this for zombies or space aliens, or either one.  Are these the fast zombies that can run and climb, or the slow night of the living dead zombies?

[Varmintmist]

It all depends on what you want it for, and what you consider long range.
06 and 308 are pretty similar, the same bullets being used in each. The 308 was developed as a more effecient 30 cal than the 06. This came from case design. Remember, the powders that you use in a 308, you can use in a 06, and there is no replacement for displacment, you have to burn more powder to go as fast, but you can put in more and go faster. The 06 is better when you go heavy, period. You cannot load a 220gr bullet into a 308 and get anything worthwhile out of it. On the lighter side, 150-165gr bullets, whatever you hit with a 308 wont be complaining that it was moving 200fps slower than if it left a 06. All but one rifle I load for is a lot happier with mid range loads. Both loaded with std velocity ammo will keep the hole inside of a 6 inch circle out to around 300 yards using the same aimpoint, Look up MPBR (max point blank range). You have to start adding elevation on any rifle after 300, including any Mag-du-juor that is the latest and greatest. Either one is capable of 1000 yd shooting if you have the platform and skill for it. My pet load is a 165gr Sierra Gameking in a 06 moving at a reasonable pace. Nothing ever said it was going to slow.

30/30 is a different animal. You are moving a flat nosed bullet out of a shorter bbl at a lower speed. (unless you are shooting a 30-30 bolt gun then you can use spitzers) Nothing wrong with that, My daughter is 4 shots for 4 deer with a 125gr Sierra Prohunter I loaded to 2200fps. Max range with flat nose bullets is about 150 for most carbines IMHO. Ammo is cheap and plentiful, carbines make a heck of a home defense gun.

[Jess Tolbirt]

wow,,thanks guys, i will read this over and over...i am thinking 1 will be a 30-30 lever with a scope. and a 22mag henry lever action, just need the most common big gun to decide from,,i didnt know there was a 17 center fire...i also want to look up the ballistics on a 250-3000 savage,,

[The Anvil]

I love lever action rifles. I used to watch The Rifleman as a kid and that's always stuck with me.

[donaldcc]

I am thinking of buying a new toy and was thinking in the 30 cal range,,i like the 30-30's but which would be a wiser choice, a 30-06 or 308? what about a 17 hmr? good for long distance? i think its time i got ready for the next civil war...

  sounds like you are just wanting to have rifle.  for civil war go with 308. go practice. for fooling around smaller ones suggested above. 

[X Ring]

Depending on what you really want to do with it, at the present time I would buy a M1 Garand from the Civilian Marksmanship Program for $625 and as many clips and surplus ammo as I can afford.  Currently there is a run on military style .308s and about the only surplus 7.62x51mm ammo you can find is Pakistani and you will pay for it.  There is currently a run on rifles and ammo due to the upcoming elections and the fear of our economy/civilization collapsing.

Marty

[sugerbear]

It all depends on what you want it for, and what you consider long range.
06 and 308 are pretty similar, the same bullets being used in each. The 308 was developed as a more effecient 30 cal than the 06. This came from case design. Remember, the powders that you use in a 308, you can use in a 06, and there is no replacement for displacment, you have to burn more powder to go as fast, but you can put in more and go faster. The 06 is better when you go heavy, period. You cannot load a 220gr bullet into a 308 and get anything worthwhile out of it. On the lighter side, 150-165gr bullets, whatever you hit with a 308 wont be complaining that it was moving 200fps slower than if it left a 06. All but one rifle I load for is a lot happier with mid range loads. Both loaded with std velocity ammo will keep the hole inside of a 6 inch circle out to around 300 yards using the same aimpoint, Look up MPBR (max point blank range). You have to start adding elevation on any rifle after 300, including any Mag-du-juor that is the latest and greatest. Either one is capable of 1000 yd shooting if you have the platform and skill for it. My pet load is a 165gr Sierra Gameking in a 06 moving at a reasonable pace. Nothing ever said it was going to slow.

30/30 is a different animal. You are moving a flat nosed bullet out of a shorter bbl at a lower speed. (unless you are shooting a 30-30 bolt gun then you can use spitzers) Nothing wrong with that, My daughter is 4 shots for 4 deer with a 125gr Sierra Prohunter I loaded to 2200fps. Max range with flat nose bullets is about 150 for most carbines IMHO. Ammo is cheap and plentiful, carbines make a heck of a home defense gun.

[/color]

didn't somebody come out with a "soft nose" pointed round for the lever action 30-30?

[shooter64]

There seems to be a good bit of firearms knowledge on here. To clear up something that you might be wondering about: You notice that common calibers like .270, .308, 30-06 etc are not available in say, a very common rifle like a Marlin 336. The reason tube magazine rifles (like the 336) are only chambered in 30-30, 35 Remington, 44 mag, .444 Marlin, 45-70 etc (all rounds that have a flat point-no sharp pointed bullets) is to reduce the possibility of a round going off in the magazine with the sharp point of a round sitting against the primer of the round ahead of it in the tube magazine. You can get box magazine lever actions (Browning BLR for instance) in those calibers if you like lever action in longer range calibers.
I would try to recommend a rifle also if you mention the intended use. Your lifestyle comes into play in a recommendation also. A high power rifle would be a bad recommendation for someone wanting a home defense gun that lives in an apartment complex for instance.

[Mr.BubblesVRCCDS0008]

I was told a long time ago that if you only have one gun it should be a 30-06. Good all round gun for either small or large targets. Good out to 300yds if you know the drop and the weapon. I shoot a 308 and a 7mm mag and like both guns. Son has a 25-06 and it is a nail driver for sure. I just got into blackpowder CVA optima and I'm still learning but a 50 caliber is a hoot to shoot. I think this deer season I'm gonna shoot the black powder all season long.

[solo1]

As many have mentioned here, it depends on what you want the rifle to do.

30-06 is a good round but the .308 is better from a standpoint of a smaller cartridge with roughly the same power.  .270 is a good flatter shooter, along with the 7mm mag but the ammo is not as common.

30/30 has been around for awhile but generally guns chambered for it are lever actions.  The 7x39 has roughly the same power as the 30/30 but ammo is easy to find. 

I have a Russian SKS which uses the 7x39 ammo.  It has a red dot scope. Accuracy is fair. I also have a Savage bolt action rifle in .223 ,heavy barrel, 4x16 scope. Accuracy is superb.  Both are ok for my use.

Although both of these guns could be used for deer hunting (depending on the states regs) a more common and more powerful caliber like .308 would be more suitable.

[musclehead]

It all depends.  Is this for zombies or space aliens, or either one.  Are these the fast zombies that can run and climb, or the slow night of the living dead zombies?

according to the zombie survival guide zombies can't climb.  fast zombies and zombies that climb are an invention of hollywood 

[X Ring]

It all depends on what you want it for, and what you consider long range.
06 and 308 are pretty similar, the same bullets being used in each. The 308 was developed as a more effecient 30 cal than the 06. This came from case design. Remember, the powders that you use in a 308, you can use in a 06, and there is no replacement for displacment, you have to burn more powder to go as fast, but you can put in more and go faster. The 06 is better when you go heavy, period. You cannot load a 220gr bullet into a 308 and get anything worthwhile out of it. On the lighter side, 150-165gr bullets, whatever you hit with a 308 wont be complaining that it was moving 200fps slower than if it left a 06. All but one rifle I load for is a lot happier with mid range loads. Both loaded with std velocity ammo will keep the hole inside of a 6 inch circle out to around 300 yards using the same aimpoint, Look up MPBR (max point blank range). You have to start adding elevation on any rifle after 300, including any Mag-du-juor that is the latest and greatest. Either one is capable of 1000 yd shooting if you have the platform and skill for it. My pet load is a 165gr Sierra Gameking in a 06 moving at a reasonable pace. Nothing ever said it was going to slow.

30/30 is a different animal. You are moving a flat nosed bullet out of a shorter bbl at a lower speed. (unless you are shooting a 30-30 bolt gun then you can use spitzers) Nothing wrong with that, My daughter is 4 shots for 4 deer with a 125gr Sierra Prohunter I loaded to 2200fps. Max range with flat nose bullets is about 150 for most carbines IMHO. Ammo is cheap and plentiful, carbines make a heck of a home defense gun.

[/color]

didn't somebody come out with a "soft nose" pointed round for the lever action 30-30?

Yes.  Hornady did.  Polymer tipped hollow points.

http://www.hornady.com/store/LEVERevolution-FTX/

Marty

[solo1]

couple of cheap SKS's  quote.

The SKS market is no longer cheap as in 100 bucks or so.  Evidently, the collectors are into them now.   Prices vary from the cheapest Chinese 56, at about $200.00 to over $400 for variants from different countries.

Mine is a Russian made variant, with threaded receiver, not riveted.  An SKS is cheaper than the AK's out there but it uses a stripper clip.  I have not modified mine to a magazine.   if I ever needed a 30 round magazine,  the world would have gone to Hell anyway.

[Varmintmist]

It all depends on what you want it for, and what you consider long range.
06 and 308 are pretty similar, the same bullets being used in each. The 308 was developed as a more effecient 30 cal than the 06. This came from case design. Remember, the powders that you use in a 308, you can use in a 06, and there is no replacement for displacment, you have to burn more powder to go as fast, but you can put in more and go faster. The 06 is better when you go heavy, period. You cannot load a 220gr bullet into a 308 and get anything worthwhile out of it. On the lighter side, 150-165gr bullets, whatever you hit with a 308 wont be complaining that it was moving 200fps slower than if it left a 06. All but one rifle I load for is a lot happier with mid range loads. Both loaded with std velocity ammo will keep the hole inside of a 6 inch circle out to around 300 yards using the same aimpoint, Look up MPBR (max point blank range). You have to start adding elevation on any rifle after 300, including any Mag-du-juor that is the latest and greatest. Either one is capable of 1000 yd shooting if you have the platform and skill for it. My pet load is a 165gr Sierra Gameking in a 06 moving at a reasonable pace. Nothing ever said it was going to slow.

30/30 is a different animal. You are moving a flat nosed bullet out of a shorter bbl at a lower speed. (unless you are shooting a 30-30 bolt gun then you can use spitzers) Nothing wrong with that, My daughter is 4 shots for 4 deer with a 125gr Sierra Prohunter I loaded to 2200fps. Max range with flat nose bullets is about 150 for most carbines IMHO. Ammo is cheap and plentiful, carbines make a heck of a home defense gun.

[/color]

didn't somebody come out with a "soft nose" pointed round for the lever action 30-30?

Hornaday, leverevolution
  http://www.hornady.com/store/leverevolution

You are still going to be buying fp's because they are available all over.

[Varmintmist]

wow,,thanks guys, i will read this over and over...i am thinking 1 will be a 30-30 lever with a scope. and a 22mag henry lever action, just need the most common big gun to decide from,,i didnt know there was a 17 center fire...i also want to look up the ballistics on a 250-3000 savage,,

250-3000 Savage is the first commercial cartridge to break 3Kfps. Nice solid performer, but not a barn burner by any means today. If you like quarterbores, a 25-06 can be shweeet, a .257 bullet in a necked down 30-06 case. Uses a lot of powder to get the job done, but there is no question that the job gets done. Dont pass up a 257 Roberts either.

If you go with a lever gun, don't over scope it. The thing with carbines is they are handy, if you hang a big objective 3x9 on it, you are defeating the purpose.

[PAVALKER]

I have had a Marlin 30/30 336C since I was a teen (a looooong time).  I have used it for hunting, target shooting and it's available for Urban Defense if needed.   I think having a lever action or other non-magazine feed weapon has it's advantages; I don't need to buy or carry the magazines and the weight of them, and can reload the gun as needed, when needed or even partially if needed, without having to reload a magazine and then load the magazine into the gun.  I do have some magazine fed firearms, but do lean toward the non magazine ones for some reason.  

Awhile back there used to be an "accelerator" round for the 30/30, it was a 223 (I believe) in a sabot that permitted it to be shot from the 30/30.  I liked them, and had I known they would no longer be made years later.... I would have picked up a bunch.  I guess they didn't sell well and were discontinued (as are many other things).    IMO, the 30/30 is a formidable, flexible and relatively inexpensive round, compared to some others.

Here is some interesting reading on the 30/30    http://www.warriortalk.com/showthread.php?649-The-Tactical-30-30-Lever-Action-Rifle

Personal Defense - Marlin Model 336	powered by Aeva

[musclehead]

wow,,thanks guys, i will read this over and over...i am thinking 1 will be a 30-30 lever with a scope. and a 22mag henry lever action, just need the most common big gun to decide from,,i didnt know there was a 17 center fire...i also want to look up the ballistics on a 250-3000 savage,,

250-3000 Savage is the first commercial cartridge to break 3Kfps. Nice solid performer, but not a barn burner by any means today. If you like quarterbores, a 25-06 can be shweeet, a .257 bullet in a necked down 30-06 case. Uses a lot of powder to get the job done, but there is no question that the job gets done. Dont pass up a 257 Roberts either.

If you go with a lever gun, don't over scope it. The thing with carbines is they are handy, if you hang a big objective 3x9 on it, you are defeating the purpose.

I've got a 25-06, it's a tack driving-flat shooting sweeet rifle! 

[czuch]

Whatever you do for SHTF, private sale. No 4473 that way.

[cookiedough]

sounds like you are highly considering a lever action 30/30, good choice.  It will be cheaper to buy upfront and shells a few bucks per 20 round cheaper also than a .270, .308, or .30-06 bolt action rifle.  Bolt actions are slighly more accurate, not much, but the shorter .30-30 lever action is more fun rounding the shells out just like in the old west.  The ONLY reason I upgraded to my ruger .30-06 is after 125 yards, the .30-30 was dropping the bullet down too far for my longer range shooting 200-250 yards for deer and wasn't as accurate.  Just remember, if you want to shot deer out in the open field more than say 150 yards, the .30-30 is not the gun for you, trust me I know.  I kept shooting the legs off the darn rodents with the .30-30. 

Marlin's .30-30 is side ejection meaning a good quality 4x scope is easier to mount on top (and more natural feel) vs. my winchester .30-30 had top ejection and I still had a 4x scope mounted on top but had to have it mounted  (top mounts angled to the side of the gun) to the left more so than I liked so the shells can eject on top without hitting the scope.  It was a little awkward to get use to the scope mounted over to the left another inch or so, but it worked just fine.   I like the old school looks of the winchester better but the Marlin is also a good gone.  Check them both out and see which one you like the feel for better.

All good comments here since most of us seem to have a few guns in their day.  I just can't believe the price hike of say remington 20 ct.rifle  rounds use to be like 10 bucks and now lucky to find them for 15 bucks.  Gotta pay to play I guess?

[Jess Tolbirt]

well i will be getting 3 guns a 22 and a 30-30 and probably a 308 but maybe a 30.06 it will be for 2 purposes in life, a deer every now and then and for when the shtf if it comes down to it..

[cookiedough]

for .22, hard to beat for the price a stock ruger 10/22 with 4x scope with 10 shot rotary clip.

My .02 cents although some may disagree, the bolt action .30-06 has a flatter trajectory and shoots longer distances than .308 rounds with slightly more power plus the .30-06, at least around me, can come in more choices of grains of bullets to use for heavier big game or lighter grain rounds for smaller animals like deer or coyote, etc.    Plus, for whatever reason, my experience is the .308 blows up more meat in a deer than the .30-06 does maybe because the larger diameter bullet with shorter casing being a slower bullet and grain of bullet matters also.  That being said, I would not hesitate to buy a .308 over a .30-06 or .270 if a good deal came along on a used .308 that was say 70-80 buck cheaper than a comparable .30-06/.270 rifle.

The only other gun I would like to get is a .223 semi-auto for varmint shooting although a .22 is cheaper to shoot but the .223 has more knockdown power and faster bullet for coyotes and foxes, etc. and just as fun to shoot.  Someone mentioned you can use a .223 for deer, but that I believe is illegal here in WI and most other states as well and wouldn't at all recommend it since not enough knockdown kill power for anything much larger than a coyote.  

[Serk]

maybe because the larger diameter bullet with shorter casing

Not trying to be argumentative, but .308 and 30.06 use the exact same diameter bullets, both are .308 inches in diameter.

[musclehead]

maybe because the larger diameter bullet with shorter casing

Not trying to be argumentative, but .308 and 30.06 use the exact same diameter bullets, both are .308 inches in diameter.

correct sir! the .308 is the diameter I believe and the 30.06 was a 30 cal developed in 1906.
no ryhme or reason in the naming of calibers, a 45-70 I think is a 45 cal bullet in front of 70 grains of black powder.

[Patrick]

This subject has been covered well and my opinion certainly isn't needed,, so,, I'll be a PITA and jump in anyway..
The 17,, neat little caliber but they get pushed around quite a bit by any wind..
The 30,, Like the others I think it depends on what you're doing and the gun you want.. 30-06 is a long action and the 308 a short action.. The performance between these two is pretty close and the deer you kill couldn't tell you the difference between them.. In an auto-loader I prefer the short action and I really really like my Browning in 308.. I also like my early model 70 in 30-06.. But they are used in different situations..
It sounds like you have your heart set on a lever gun.. I really like my Savage 99 [300] and Winchester 71 [348],, but,, they rarely see the light of day.. It is difficult [ at least for me] to get set up quickly for a second shot.. The old 71 did kill 2 deer with one shot one night quite a few years ago..
The only pump action center-fires I have are Remingtons.. The 308 is more reliable than the 30-06 so I think the difference between the actions makes the difference..
That said,, I also think there are times for light fast stuff and there are times for heavy slow stuff.. But I just may be old-fashioned..

[flcjr]

Springfield M1A  in any config  offered  is my choice. Shoots .308  7.62x51.  ammo available anywhere and big enough to hunt anything in the lower 48.