A TRUE 1800 Super Valk?

[pago cruiser]

Wow! Not sure I want to go to a 7 degree set of trees, but it would certainly provide enough room for the radiator! Nice collection of hardware as well.

Spent a good bit of the day trying to get this pig aligned.  What a b!tch!  EVERYTHING is based upon the output shaft to final drive connection - fore and aft, left to right, up and down, pitch, yaw, and roll.  Dang!  Just like a fricken sailboat!!  And just like a boat, there is almost nothing flat or straight that is the same on both sider of the bike.
 
Took me hours to figure this out and get it to the point I was comfortable with it working:


Ended up verifying level of the bike based upon the front seat mount steel:


And matching the GL1800 engine to it based upon the throttle bodies:


Ended up bolting these rails on to try and get an idea of "straight".



Got a crude version of the front mount fabbed up.  This is just to hold everything in alignment until I figure out what I want to do for a final solution.  Cut off the casting and bend a tube to insert with welded plate for the mounts; or make a nominal 1/2" thick piece of steel and then cust a counterpart hole in the existing tube - then weld them together.  Or maybe just a steel version of what I made, then just throw on a bunch of weld to make a suitable shape out of it...




Unfortunately, based upon the output shaft alignment, the entire engine is about 1/2" to port of being centered on the Valk mounts; no way to get around it, unless I was to re-engineer the GL1800 swingarm to ride 1/2" more to starboard in the Valk frame.  But right now, that ain't gonna happen; gotta keep moving forward. 

But as I think about it, I rented a FB6 a couple weeks ago for a weeks ride with some guys at work.  Great bike, good handling, lots of power; but I don't think I'll be buying one.  But I now remember that taking my hands off the bars, the bike would ALWAYS ease to the left.  I had to lean wayyy to the right to keep the bike going straight.   Wonder if something similar is going on with that bike?  But I digress...

Last thing I did was spend some time on the airbox.  Not sure what material I will use, but they mate up pretty nice - and I think the Valk airbox is actually larger than the GL1800.  Will need to kick out the Valk air box a bit on the sides to provide a bit more wall to entry clearance - and still fit within the Valk top frame tubes:




As I kind of indicated above, I am just going to try and keep moving forward; which means I am going to go with the u-joint determined engine placement as is.  Have a lot of stuff still to do, and it is too easy to get mired.  When it's a runner, may have to come back to this.  But for now, I'm just going top kick that can down the road...

This week I should get the front engine cover and the cam chain adjustment tower from ebay - both of these will affect the radiator placement.  The 5.25" radiators should also show up, so next problem will be getting a radiator mounted.  And as mentioned a long time ago by another poster, I am seriously thinking about Daryl's 4 degree trees.    I'm also going to drop the pipes off at a friends and have him cut out the interior welded flanges from the Valk headers, and weld in the GL1800 bungs with the floating flanges.  That should make easy work of the exhaust.   

[larue]

Very impressive, please keep them updates coming 

[mello dude]

Very nice work - keep up the posting 

[pago cruiser]

Thanks guys,
I'm doing my best to maintain some momentum this time.  Its hard getting going again on a complicated project on hold for a year.  Or 2...  I've probably spent a dozen hours in the last couple weeks just looking for parts that I know I have - somewhere...

So. Got the front case cover in today and was able to play with the radiator a bit more.

Here is radiator to VTX1300 fender clearance on my solo Valk:


And here it the clearance on the Valk Magnum:


Profile:



No way in hell will that work.  So today I bit the bullet and ordered a set of 4 degree trees from Daryl.  With Daryl's info and as confirmed by Leathel in an earlier post, I should pick up ...almost... enough to fit.  Should find out in another 2 weeks or so.  That is a really frustrating part of this project; everything I need to test fit or move forward is generally multiple weeks away.  Heck, the darn waterjet guy has now been almost a month on a revised upper shock mount.  I'm about to ready to tell him forget it, and I will have the NC Machine guy make one.  But at least it is not holding me up. Sigh.

Have another option on the radiator; if I can remove this stand-off:


I may be able to use a slightly shorter radiator, and tuck it above the cases.  Like this:


Posted a query over on the GL1800 site - hopefully someone will reply.  Spent about an hour going through the GL1800 manual but I could not find the bracket with all the crap hanging off it that is bolted to this standoff in a photo.

Pretty sure that a shorter (in height) radiator, also tucked back will then clear the fender with the 4 degree trees. The Valk radiator is 8.25" tall x 18" length x 1.375" thick, with a resulting 148 sq inches of surface (counting the tanks).  If I assume that I will need 20% more cooling (from the Valk 100 HP to the Wing 118), I'll need about 178 sq inches.   My pattern is 6.5" in height, and it appears to fit good - although I may have to re-engineer the cam chain tensioner when it gets here (hopefully) end of this week to fit.  If I extend the radiator width to 26", that will get me about 167 sq inches.  Close.  I would then be counting on a slight increase in thickness (from 1.375" to 1.5") to make up the difference. 

Oddly enough, in making measurements this evening I discovered that the Wing engine is narrower than the Valk, by almost 2" per side! That's about as weird as figuring out that Honda used the same sizes and spacing of exhaust ports and headers...

Now if I can just find some pliable abs blanket material to join the air box pieces into one assembly...   I started bending some pieces using a propane torch - this is gonna take awhile...
 

[pago cruiser]

Still playing with the radiator.  The riser centered above the 1800 front cover (earlier post) is for the GL1800 reversing hardware - which I am not going to be using.  I cut it off, and bolted some wood together to simulate the radiator.  Seems to fit well - although the radiator MUST be recessed above the front case cover, which puts the radiator about in the same spot as the Valk.  Sorry, no pics - my bike camera got left at work.

But here is why the radiator cannot be further forward - I do not think Daryl's raked trees will help much this close to the triple tree centerline: handlebars cranked hard left against the fork stops - about 3/16" clearance from the lower triple tree.



Found a shop online doing custom aluminum radiators - about 3/5 the price of our local (Phoenix) race car shop.  https://wizardcooling.com/.  Need to generate a drawing this weekend.  Here's one off his site for a 76-96 XJS Jag:


Have not yet ordered, as I need to do a final wood mockup with Daryl's 4 degree trees.

Will also be working on these:


It is incredible how many hoses are on this bike  .  I did verify with a helpful gent (Techdude) over on the GL1800 forum that removal of the PAIR system is similar to the Valk - with no problems from the computer.  Another task I hope to work on is to fit the Valk Battery box around the monoshock - and find a place for the CPM and 1800 fuse box, and a home for the coils. 

   



While the Valk battery box area is severely violated by the shock mount, the space for the Valk carbs is almost empty.  But there is definitely less room on the Valk - may need to go a Shorai type battery - pretty incredible size and weight difference:



Once I get these and a few more things figured out (primarily the forks/radiator, and the battery) I'm going to take the roller into our local Indy Wing Shop - Roger at C&R Cycles if anybody needs a good Wing Mech.  Will have him confirm the engine/u-joint/driveshaft alignment - although he will prolly shake his head, smile,  and say "come back in a week"   ....  This is prolly more critical than the shock - and it is a booger having nothing to go from.  From the GL1800 forum:


Hopefully I can make some good progress this weekend. Almost ready to order a 2014 wiring harness - keep hoping something will turn up on ebay...

[Blackduck]

Had to make a new inner fender/wheel arch for my 86 F350.
Used ABS and found an El Cheapo hot air gun does the job very well without worrying the Propane will burn the ABS.
Melting small chips/swarf of ABS in Acetone makes a good cement for joining.
Cheers Steve

[Firefight100]

As for the wiring call these guys, Bikestrippers.  They are here in Florida and have an ebay store.  But they have a ton of stuff not on ebay.  (321) 327-5539.

[Firefight100]

also as for cooling, what if you used 2 rads like the Wing and you could install them down on top of the heads.  They would be in close.  You would want to seal off the back of the engine compartment so incoming air has to exit thru the rads on the side.  Rads something like this? Inlet outlets and rad cap can be speced anywhere on them. Could always be covered with a nice exit scoop also.
You can then use the area upfront to install the coils.  That is where they were meant to be.  Also might be able to fit an overflow tank there in front.

[pago cruiser]

Dangit!
Posted a reply with some radiator mockup pics, and when I went to "Preview", the site gave me a "Session Verification" error, and all was lost... 

Bummer.  Have to wait.  I'm tired and going to bed.
DAM

[Jess from VA]

When working on any long post (especially with multiple pics, links, etc), or on any post that is taking you some time to put together (like leaving it open while you run out and take more pics), it is always a good idea to copy-save all your work when finished, before you hit post, so if the site has crashed or slowed down to the point the post will not load (the little arrow just goes round and round forever) while you were working on that post... you have it saved so you can log on later and paste it back in then.  Just don't forget and copy/overwrite something else in the mean time.

Also, most of the time, if you hit post and get a fault or a problem, you can hit the back button and get back to the post you just just created (but sometimes not).  If you can, then you can copy-save at that point, to post later.  

This is especially a good thing to remember if posting while the site has been on and off, or really slow lately.  But even if the site is up and running fine, if you leave the post open for long enough, you can lose your work from a time out... or something like that.

[indybobm]

What I do is to start the post and copy and paste it to word. I finish it in word and then copy and paste it back into the post.

[pago cruiser]

OK, once more...

Thanks for the tip of keeping a copy in WORD - just one more thing to remember.
NOTE: And it worked!  Hit "Preview", it spit me out with the same error - went back to WORD, copy/pasted, and then all I had to add was this diatribe...

Thanks for the reminder of the ABS "glue" - used it awhile ago to repair fairing mounts on my Valks - our washboard driveway is really hard on equipment.

Thanks for the Bikestrippers tip; I'll call them Monday - sure would be nice to find a salvage wiring harness.  The most expensive parts for this project (so far) has been the 1)donor, 2)the 4 degree trees, and 3)the battery. A ne wiring harness would immediately go into the number 2 slot...

I am really trying to keep the look of the Legacy Valk - hence the front mount radiator - and at least my mockup shows it should work...

Had to cut off the cast-in post at the top front of the cases - based upon a very knowledgeable gent over on the GL1800 forum (Techdude), this was used for mounting the reverse hardware - which I will not be using.  It is a pretty complicated bit of hardware, controls, and wiring.  Cut off pic:


26" x 6.5" radiator mockup using 2x4's:Note the spacing between the cylinder head cover and the crash bar.  Honda was indeed able to make the 20% larger engine smaller, at least in width.


Could not be located any further due to the interference with the lower triple tree.  This one clears by about the same distance as the stocker:


The original mounting brackets worked well as a template:


The coils look like they will fit just behind the throttle body:


But not with the stock bracketry - will have to redesign the brackets to "stack" the coils.  They are about 1/2" too wide to fit between the top rear engine mounts:


Cut down the battery box to allow for the monoshock perforation:


While it kind-of fits, will need to raise the bottom about an inch - the aluminum 1800 swingarm is dimensionally greater than the Legacy Valk.  Would not be good for the swingarm to impact the bottom of the battery box at compression 


Update:
The (2) 5.25" fans did not fit... The only fit if the radiator is further forwards.  Ordered a 6.5" fan from the same vendor in Phoenix.

Next up:
1. Keep modding the box (shorten it), as well as for the Shorai battery here in another week.
2. Fit the coils, hopefully to use the same wiring - note: as I am planning to use the 2014 Valk wiring/PCM/Meter, the coils are from a 2010.
3. Finish the radiator mockup - with the new fan when it gets here.
4. Fit he radiator hoses to the 1800 engine and the radiator mock up.
5. When the 4 degree trees arrive, fit those before ordering the radiator. 
6. Weld bungs into the Valk pipes for current O2 sensors - O2 sensors from a F6B.  Seems Honda changed them in 2006 (went from narrow to wide band type) and are not compatible.  I just hope the F6B sensors are compatible with the 2014 Valk - different  part numbers.  No Valk sensors (or many 2014+ Valk parts at all) on ebay - and new ones from Honda are about $150 each!  

Next pita part is coming up with rear lower mounts, using the Valk rails as a basis. This is going to take considerable bracketry.  May get another set of rails to cut some parts off of to re-purpose. Note the beefiness of the GL1800 frame mounts.  Most of this is due to the use of aluminum.  Our steel mounts are heavier, smaller, but at least as good, if not better, in tensile, shear, and bending.


 
More to come.  But I have to blow the rest of today changing my solo Valk fork seals (dam washboard road), changing to winter windscreen, putting on the electric gear controllers, oil change, etc...

Never enough time...
Sigh.

[mello dude]

Great building work! I love build it threads to see everyone's ideas and skillz...



As a btw, what are you using for posting photos?

[The emperor has no clothes]

Great building work! I love build it threads to see everyone's ideas and skillz...

he's doing excellent work .

[pago cruiser]

Now using Smugmug - which (as I have been told) is owned by the family that owns ADVRider.  So all the pics should not be held ransom like those Photobucket a$$hats....

Thanks for the comments.  Was able to get a little more done today. 
Shortened up the battery box to clear the swingarm.  Making an aluminum bottom as a template, then will make a final out of stainless:


Which lead to the conclusion that I do not have room for the stock size 1800 battery.  Dang. 


That's a stock size Valk battery in the cut down tray.  Looked at the Shorai for the Valk, and while it is about the same size, it has more both CCA and AH capacity.  Since this is literally the largest I can fit, looks like I'll be ordering a new new battery.  When the one for the 1800 gets here, need to see if I can return it.  Dang it.

Good news learned is that the PCM looks like it will just fit.  Using one from the 2003 1800; I am hoping the 2014+ Valk unit is the same size:


More good news, is that the coolant tank fits:

[Disco]

Wow, pc!  I just found your build thread for the first time and read it from the start.  Great project and great documentation.  

I've probably missed some other good stuff here, too, but I quit visiting the Tech Board several years ago out of frustration with so much bad and incorrect advice being slung around unchecked.  But I digress.  

Regarding your radiator / fork / lower tree clearance issue, did Daryl mention any option other than increased rake?  Years before I got here, Two Brothers Racing (TBR) built a steering stem/upper & lower tree replacement that maintains the factory rake but decreases trail by pushing the fork tubes forward by some dimension.  The two people I know who have that mod says it makes the Valkyrie feel like it has power steering.  They love it.  I'm certain that one of the guys' setup is TBR.  IIRC, Daryl built the other.

Keep up the great work!  I can't wait to see the final product!

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

Wow, pc!  I just found your build thread for the first time and read it from the start.  

Keep up the great work!  I can't wait to see the final product!

My first view of this thread as well and I agree .... Very cool 

[pago cruiser]

Thanks guys.
I did talk to Daryl about which method he recommended, and it was the rake vs the offset.  He is shipping early next week, so hopefully the trees will be here by the weekend. Have to get them installed b4 I order the radiator.

Got the new radiator fan delivered and did a test; it's about 1/4" too large in diameter  fit - hits the front case bolt.     Will post a pic this weekend.  I may have to remove the fan ring, trim the blades, and build a new one.  Or find yet again a slightly smaller fan...

Good news is that the smaller battery came in: cannot believe the weight.  It's packaged like a computer CPU!







Good to see it also has side-posts - don't think I'd have the room for top screws.

Ordered the 2014 Valk wiring harness, meter, and ecm; should be picking them up tomorrow.  Spent the last several evenings trying to figure out all the sensors on this engine - dang!
Baro sensor, IACV, CMP, IAT, MAP, TP, Knock sensor, VS sensor, CKP sensor, O2 sensors, Bank angle sensor.  Could not have done this without the 2014+ Valk AND the F6B Shop manual - the Valk's is about 1" thick - but the and the F6B manual is almost 3" thick!

Seems most of the Valk sensor part numbers do not match the GL1800 - so I don't know if the difference is mounting or something else.  Been hunting around on ebay, but there is almost nothing for the 2014+ Valk - lots more for the F6B, and boatloads of components for the GL1800. 

Hop to be able to get the wiring harness and ECM at least layed out on the Valk frame.   

[gordonv]

Just make sure your read the manual for that FeIr battery. Did you buy the charger also? I did. Be careful plugging it into those little leads.

Then all those foam pieces are for supporting the battery, when find out how small it is for the space you have to put it into.

[hubcapsc]

Just make sure your read the manual for that FeIr battery. Did you buy the charger also? I did. Be careful plugging it into those little leads.

Then all those foam pieces are for supporting the battery, when find out how small it is for the space you have to put it into.

I both like and worry about lithium batteries. I got my Valkyrie's lithium battery
back when the batteries in the Dreamliners were catching on fire, and since
then there's all those vaping pipes that have gone off like rockets in people's
pockets and phones that burn up... but my Valkyrie's battery still works
well and I've had no problems... it sure is light and small...

-Mike

[98valk]

Just make sure your read the manual for that FeIr battery. Did you buy the charger also? I did. Be careful plugging it into those little leads.

Then all those foam pieces are for supporting the battery, when find out how small it is for the space you have to put it into.

I both like and worry about lithium batteries. I got my Valkyrie's lithium battery
back when the batteries in the Dreamliners were catching on fire, and since
then there's all those vaping pipes that have gone off like rockets in people's
pockets and phones that burn up... but my Valkyrie's battery still works
well and I've had no problems... it sure is light and small...

-Mike

LiFePO4 battery technology is not a problem as long as max charging voltage is below 14.4volts.  So a battery charger with desulfator function is a no-no.  The ones u mentioned catching fire where a different Lithium technology.
lots of great info here http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/motorcycle-batteries-agm-gel-wet-lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.757934/

been using them for a few yrs now.

[hubcapsc]

Just make sure your read the manual for that FeIr battery. Did you buy the charger also? I did. Be careful plugging it into those little leads.

Then all those foam pieces are for supporting the battery, when find out how small it is for the space you have to put it into.

I both like and worry about lithium batteries. I got my Valkyrie's lithium battery
back when the batteries in the Dreamliners were catching on fire, and since
then there's all those vaping pipes that have gone off like rockets in people's
pockets and phones that burn up... but my Valkyrie's battery still works
well and I've had no problems... it sure is light and small...

-Mike

LiFePO4 battery technology is not a problem as long as max charging voltage is below 14.4volts.  So a battery charger with desulfator function is a no-no.  The ones u mentioned catching fire where a different Lithium technology.
lots of great info here http://advrider.com/index.php?threads/motorcycle-batteries-agm-gel-wet-lithium-iron-phosphate-lifepo4.757934/

been using them for a few yrs now.

LiFePO4 battery technology

Mine says LFP-4, so I reckon it is the kind you are talking about...



I think (I looked at the metadata in the original image on my disk) I got the
battery 2014:12:22 ...

I like it 

-Mike

[pago cruiser]

Did not get the charger for the Shorai - but at the speed I make progress, maybe I should have - it's supposed to stay charged for a year.... I hope ai am done in that time.
I really hope the Shorai is as ...durable as the AGM's I have been using. Seeing it packed like a computer cpu makes me think it may be a bit fragile; I have a 3 mile long washboard driveway that is hard on equipment...  Guess I'll find out... if I ever get done!

Any how... Woohoo! Dropped some plastic, and got some more plastic (and copper...) stuff in return.

New Shorai fits better (slightly smaller) than the Legacy Valk battery:


New Valk fuse block is a little bigger than the Legacy Valk's: 12 fuses vs 6: Its also about half the size of the F6B/GL1800 fuse block - would you believe 22 fuses and 21 relays! 



The new Valk's computer is about 3/4 scale from the GL1800:


Profile:


New Valk wiring harness: about 1/2 the weight and way less complex than the GL1800.  Complex is a relative term however: I counted 43 separate connectors.



I've got about 8 sensors on order; and I know what the big red and black connectors are: only 33 to go!

[mello dude]

Did not get the charger for the Shorai - but at the speed I make progress, maybe I should have - it's supposed to stay charged for a year.... I hope ai am done in that time.
I really hope the Shorai is as ...durable as the AGM's I have been using. Seeing it packed like a computer cpu makes me think it may be a bit fragile; I have a 3 mile long washboard driveway that is hard on equipment...  Guess I'll find out... if I ever get done!

Any how... Woohoo! Dropped some plastic, and got some more plastic (and copper...) stuff in return.

New Shorai fits better (slightly smaller) than the Legacy Valk battery:


New Valk fuse block is a little bigger than the Legacy Valk's: 12 fuses vs 6: Its also about half the size of the F6B/GL1800 fuse block - would you believe 22 fuses and 21 relays!  



The new Valk's computer is about 3/4 scale from the GL1800:


Profile:


New Valk wiring harness: about 1/2 the weight and way less complex than the GL1800.  Complex is a relative term however: I counted 43 separate connectors.



I've got about 8 sensors on order; and I know what the big red and black connectors are: only 33 to go!

Whoa! Kudos to you! Wiring harness like that are where my brain crashes... I can figure it out, but I hate it....

On the Shorai Battery LiFePO4 battery -- just keep in mind that you dont treat it like a lead acid or AGM. Dont over nite charge the thing, its better to do a fast charge. - Generally with a bike charging system in good shape, the LiFePO4 batterys are fairly relieable... my last one lasted 5 years. Also just sitting static, the charge is good like they say for a year and more...

Keep up the good work, right now this is the coolest thread going on this forum...

[The emperor has no clothes]

Did not get the charger for the Shorai - but at the speed I make progress, maybe I should have - it's supposed to stay charged for a year.... I hope ai am done in that time.
I really hope the Shorai is as ...durable as the AGM's I have been using. Seeing it packed like a computer cpu makes me think it may be a bit fragile; I have a 3 mile long washboard driveway that is hard on equipment...  Guess I'll find out... if I ever get done!

Any how... Woohoo! Dropped some plastic, and got some more plastic (and copper...) stuff in return.

New Shorai fits better (slightly smaller) than the Legacy Valk battery:


New Valk fuse block is a little bigger than the Legacy Valk's: 12 fuses vs 6: Its also about half the size of the F6B/GL1800 fuse block - would you believe 22 fuses and 21 relays!  



The new Valk's computer is about 3/4 scale from the GL1800:


Profile:


New Valk wiring harness: about 1/2 the weight and way less complex than the GL1800.  Complex is a relative term however: I counted 43 separate connectors.



I've got about 8 sensors on order; and I know what the big red and black connectors are: only 33 to go!

Whoa! Kudos to you! Wiring harness like that are where my brain crashes... I can figure it out, but I hate it....

On the Shorai Battery LiFePO4 battery -- just keep in mind that you dont treat it like a lead acid or AGM. Dont over nite charge the thing, its better to do a fast charge. - Generally with a bike charging system in good shape, the LiFePO4 batterys are fairly relieable... my last one lasted 5 years. Also just sitting static, the charge is good like they say for a year and more...

Keep up the good work, right now this is the coolest thread going on this forum...

without a doubt 

[pago cruiser]

Weekend Update! Although prolly not quite a salacious as the SNL version yesterday.. Jeeze.

Did not get a lot done, but did some planning, and then figured I needed to order some more parts. :

1. handlebar controls,
2. throttle cables,
3. rear fender sub harness,
4. turn signal relay (would you believe the new Valk turn signal relay has 13 fricken wires goin to it??? - I was going to do my usual aftermarket type for LED's but this thing is more complex than our Legacy Valks - and $100 prolly saved a day of time trying to re-engineer it,
5. air guide plate (from our Legacy Valks, keeps the radiator heat off of our carbs - , but I will still need it for keeping heat off the throttle bodies and coils, 
6. fuel pump.  This was a tough one.  But it is going to  be challenging getting everything to fit in our smaller frame.  Could not find a reasonable size place - so I decided to follow Honda's example and stick it in the tank.  May even be able to replace the LV (Legacy Valk) variable resistor to the NV (New Valk) model - this would allow the NV cool LCD display fuel gauge to function.  Although it will not be calibrated to tank shape... it will be good enuff!

Played around more with alignment.  This is still a bugger.
Had to mod the left side hangers a lot more than the right side in order to get the top of the throttle bodies level; this is literally the only thing I can find to level from:




Unfortunately, when I levelled the throttle bodies and secured in place, it messed up the u-joint alignment.  May be hard to tell from the angle, but the joint is 1/4" closer to the starboard (closest side) than the port:


Also figured out that the early GL1800 radiators are exactly the same height (6.5") as what my mockup shows will be needed.  A pair of these at about $100 each from ebay is exactly the size I came up with as needed - and coincidentally, the same size Honda provided!   Who woulda thunk it?
  Ordered one to see how it might work. 


Finally pulled the jack out from the engine - looking more like a bike than an assemblage of parts..


Actually, the only reason I did this was that I needed the jack to change the rear wheel/tire on my LV commuter - I go through about 2-3 rear tires/ year.  I now just keep a spare wheel in the garage with a new tire installed.  I ride 100 miles a day, all year, all the time - almost.  The only thing stops me is ice... Tread grooves were getting flat, but there was still a bit more I could have coaxed out it - and no rain is in the forecast this week....  So I was going to put it off another week - which is 500 miles.  Then that spidey sense kicked in... the time to do it is when you think about it - just like shortening sail on a boat...

Found this:

Yikes! I sure don't remember running over a metal shard... but something did this.

Daryl is supposed to ship the 4 degree trees Tuesday, so hopefully can get those installed and the radiator figured out next weekend - as well as re-visit the $^#@! alignment issue.



 

[pago cruiser]

Weekend update.

1 step forward and 2 steps back...

Did not get to the trees (yet), as I have been stymied by the engine alignment.
Seems I can't get the engine "square" in the frame (same offset front and rear), and also have the u-joint centered in the swingarm discharge. 

Here is the u-joint centered in the swingarm at the pivot:


Which yields the result of the engine being skewed a bit to port - left to all you landlubbers...


There is only about 3/16" clearance between the u-joint and top/bottom, and 7/16" left/right (the tubular part of the yoke).  Using straightedges bolted to the cylinder heads (see pic above - about the only surfaces I could find that are both parallel and "straight") the offset is 3/8" at the swingarm pivot and 3/4" at the engine mounts, a distance of about 24".

I have verified that the GL1800 swingarm flange is square to the Valk frame.  But for whatever reason, the engine is still skewed slightly in the Valk frame.

Unfortunately, I can’t get the radiator finalled, or the coil mounts, or the airbox, because all those depend upon the exact engine placement. 

Plan now is to modify the frame to move the starboard swingarm mount out about 3/8”.  I can mill off the threads on the inside of the Valk cast swingarm bearing pocket, and weld a plate on the outside for the new pocket - I'm hopefull it would ...almost... look stock - the plate would just stick out a little further.  The other side should be easier with a machined spacer to recess the bearing “in” the same 3/8”.



   
This will have the result of centering the rear tire (go back a few posts for that item)...


as well as reducing the offset at the front engine mounts from 3/4" to to 3/8”.  That’s about as good as it will get. 

In other news… the 2014 Valk fuel pump looks like it will fit nicely in the Legacy Valk tank.
Here's the 2014 Valk fuel pump - with integral level sensor.


Bottom of the Valk fuel tank:


Bottom after 20 minutes with a die grinder with a cutoff wheel:


Bottom of the Valk tank with the tank on the bike.  Its going to be tight, but much easier than trying to find seperate locations for the fuel pump and pressure regulator:

[larue]

Bump bump 

[pago cruiser]

Holiday update: Nuttin, nada, zip.
Been waiting on my machinist/welder for the swingarm horizontal offsetting plate and the vertical offsetting of the reinforcing rails above and below the swingarm pivot. By the time he got to my project, his welder took a crap.  Then the ordered parts were incorrect.  Sigh.  Unfortunately, fabbing and machining 1/2" steel plate and major frame welding is beyond my skillset within my current time allocations - really wish I had the time to get better at all the things I would like to do... roll:

I did find a great source for the required 30mm (!) tap for the swingarm mount extension.  My local machinist supply house wanted $125! Yes, made in China - but as another poster has said... sure glad these people are working for us!    



In the meantime...
This puppy followed me home on Christmas.



Got a really sweet deal on a really fun ride - and as a bonus, I now have a template for my Magnum Valk project.  I can now verify weight distribution, ground clearance, engine alignment, swingarm alignment, and have a functional reference 2 feet away when I start getting into electrics and sensors and all the myriad little gizmos that make these things work so well.

Its a win-win! With the possible exception of being able to retire earlier...

[Icelander]

Congratulations on the new ride! Really appreciate your documenting this build.

Happy (and productive) New Year!
Icelander

[pago cruiser]

Picked up the frame yesterday - looks good.  Will post an update later. Been kinda wrapped up in my meager spare time with a luggage rack and Saddlebags on the 2014 Valk.
Meantime, for some incremental progress... the NC machine spit these babies out...

[VALKen]

..., did Daryl mention any option other than increased rake?  Years before I got here, Two Brothers Racing (TBR) built a steering stem/upper & lower tree replacement that maintains the factory rake but decreases trail by pushing the fork tubes forward by some dimension.

Raked trees do not change the rake (i.e. steering angle) of the bike. That is the angle of the steering pivot centre (i.e. stem) and no matter what you do with triple trees (yokes to us in the UK), it does not affect the rake. Raked trees are no different from changing the offset, i.e. fork leg plane to stem. The angle of the fork legs will be different from the 2 methods, but is essentially irrelevant to the handling of the bike which is dependant only on the steering angle (rake) and the trail. It matters not whether the fork legs are parallel to the stem, it's just easier to manufacture if they are.

Either method could be used to move the wheel forward to clear the rad. Raked trees will cause the forks to look more 'raked' than by simply increasing the offset, although both methods require new trees/yokes.

If you do need to change the rake, the frame would have to be cut and welded with the headstock (and steering centre) at the different angle.

Really interesting thread. But I can't help thinking it would be simpler to start with the 1800 Wing engine and frame and then modify the ancillaries to get the look you want. I would be very interested in doing that with a new 2018 Wing to create a 7 speed DCT Valkyrie with FFE (Funny Front End). Or will Honda oblige.

[VALKen]

... I need to find a driveshaft place that can make or find a front yoke that has the same spline size as the GL1800.  Tried the Valk's, and the spline diameter is a bit (maybe 1/16"?) smaller than the GL1800.

...At any rate, the Valk u-joint is ..almost... the correct length.  They are exactly the same size in tubing diameter and splines...

I'm confused by this. In the earlier post the OP stated that the Valk splines are not the same diameter as those of the GW1800. He even mentioned trying to broach them larger. But in the later post it appears that the front end of the Valk shaft can be used, i.e. with the splines that were apparently too small.

I'm also confused by discrepancies in a couple of pictures. Initially, the front end of the Valk shaft is shown in comparison to the cut down GW 1800 shaft, showing the Valk end is much shorter. Then, after the Valk front end has been fitted to the 1800 shaft, in the picture that shows the comparison between that and a std. GW1800 shaft, the Valk front end is very much longer than in that earlier picture.

I am not knocking the OP as his work and effort have been amazing, but I am just trying to understand it all as it pertains to work I myself am attempting on a Valk.

Can anyone explain these discrepancies?

[Mapper]

Old post... but a pretty amazing effort!  Was this a dead end, or did you finish? 

[mello dude]

Yes... curious as to what happened with the project??

[pago cruiser]

Not a dead end; just... on hold.  Like a lot of my projects.
Seems work now runs my life.  All.the.f'ing.time.
When a 60 hour average work week is on top of a 2 hour daily commute... there is pretty much only time for the essentials. FML (google it - hilarious sometimes)

At 65yo in a salary job, I know what a rented mule feels like... and looking at ...alternatives, I now know what age discrimination is as well...

Anyhow... About a year ago I got the offset swingarm mount in the frame welded up.  It took about a month and a half for my machinist/welder friend to get to it.  I can confirm that the $28 tap worked fine...

Next step is to put the empty engine case in the modded frame, mate the swingarm to the frame and shaft to the motor, finish motor mounts, sort the radiator, and I should have a roller. Getting the frame modded to use the SS swingarm was prolly the most technical part of this. I'm sure wiring will be fun as well, but its way easier when you are working on a roller as opposed to a pile of parts... 

I just hope all the pics stay in this thread to remind me of WTF I was doing when I get back to this...



 

[rhubarbray]

And here are nearly a year later,.............waiting with baited breath,............ so are you done? Or retired? Or working even more?

[larue]

Would be nice to know what happened. This was by far the most interesting tech read I have ever seen on this forum. I’d like for it to come alive

[rhubarbray]

Aaaaaand? I've been following this thread and would eagerly look forward to an update.

Did you retire? Or are you now you working 80 hour weeks? I'm only partly sarcastic, I'm up to 10 hour days and either 5 or 6 days a week.

Retirement is definitely starting to have an appeal.