It's On, Trump vs Clinton

[baldo]

yep,, now its all Bush's fault again. 

lolol....did I say anything about it being his fault? Nooooooo, but thanks for playing.   

[Moonshot_1]

Now video has come out that she may have had a small box and ear piece on during the debate and may have been told what to say. I hope this is true and she digs her own grave, I'll gladly kick her off the edge into it.

I don't know what that is. Maybe she borrowed it from Dubya....

That is the outline of a bullet proof vest being worn.

[baldo]

Now video has come out that she may have had a small box and ear piece on during the debate and may have been told what to say. I hope this is true and she digs her own grave, I'll gladly kick her off the edge into it.

I don't know what that is. Maybe she borrowed it from Dubya....

That is the outline of a bullet proof vest being worn.

I hadn't thought of that. It makes sense on the RH pic, but the left looks like a box.

And since when does the POTUS wear them?

[DK]

Why is it so necessary for so many of you guys to concoct so many excuses for Trump's worse than lackluster performance in this debate?

Mention of Hillary in regard to his failures are totally irrelevant except within the context that she humiliated him to the point of incoherence in the end.

For the limited purposes of this debate Trump's preparation for and performance in this debate can be likened to riding a bald tire bike 130 mph. Often doing this doesn't end well but it's nobody's fault but your own.

Perhaps he will take it more seriously next time. 

[cookiedough]

Why is it so necessary for so many of you guys to concoct so many excuses for Trump's worse than lackluster performance in this debate?

Mention of Hillary in regard to his failures are totally irrelevant except within the context that she humiliated him to the point of incoherence in the end.

For the limited purposes of this debate Trump's preparation for and performance in this debate can be likened to riding a bald tire bike 130 mph. Often doing this doesn't end well but it's nobody's fault but your own.

Perhaps he will take it more seriously next time. 

I respect your opinion but  I disagree I do not think Trump did that bad in this debate.  Hillarys fake smile was enough to make most US citizens throw up being my opinion. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

Even he knows he got whipped. He immediately started making excuses. Microphones, moderators, media. He got thrown off his game the minute he felt insulted by her saying he got 14 million from his Dad. It was downhill for him the rest of the way. Then he comes out the next morning and starts trashing a girl for gaining 12 lbs. ?   This dude has got issues.

[Wizzard]

Even he knows he got whipped. He immediately started making excuses. Microphones, moderators, media. He got thrown off his game the minute he felt insulted by her saying he got 14 million from his Dad. It was downhill for him the rest of the way. Then he comes out the next morning and starts trashing a girl for gaining 12 lbs. ?   This dude has got issues.

Lol, how do you really feel?  

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid. In Hillary's words,, what difference does it make?  I think it was designed to put Trump on  the defense right from the get go. And it worked. But why have a bias from the start?

[Alpha Dog]

He was right about the microphone.  Yesterday I heard some astute audiophiles explain what was happening although I do not understand it all that much.  In essence his microphone was compressed or using compression to pick up different sounds.  What was being picked up was him breathing through his nose.  Listen to a compressed soundtrack of Gordon Lightfoot's Sundown and you will hear him breathing while singing.  That is the one song I always wondered what was going on.  Now I know.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Even he knows he got whipped. He immediately started making excuses. Microphones, moderators, media. He got thrown off his game the minute he felt insulted by her saying he got 14 million from his Dad. It was downhill for him the rest of the way. Then he comes out the next morning and starts trashing a girl for gaining 12 lbs. ?   This dude has got issues.

Lol, how do you really feel?  

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid. In Hillary's words,, what difference does it make?  I think it was designed to put Trump on  the defense right from the get go. And it worked. But why have a bias from the start?

As I recall that was about half way thru the debate . And he still can't answer the question. Don't you think he should have been ready for that question ? Don't get me wrong, it's not over. Obama got his ass handed to him 4 years ago also. But the difference is he admitted he screwed up and went on from there. This dude is trying to blame everyone but himself.

[Hooter]

Generally in business if Trump has a  dispute it's handled in the private sector with attorneys or other professional people on his side. Now he is not in that setting and is doing what he does in front of millions of people. I think this whole setting un-nerves him more than we know.

He places his people in those positions to protect  him and his interest. A group thing if you will. In the debate situation he is on his own with only preparation on his side. He can't or is having trouble being on his own, thus he becomes defensive and assaultive  when he is lost.

IF he becomes POTUS he will surround himself with the same kind of people that he has in his busuness. If Trump could manage his anger and insultive bahavior I think he would be steps ahead. But it may be too late for that.  He spends too much time stepping on his own anatomy.

[3fan4life]

Newt Gingrich says that Trump won the debate:
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/09/27/newt-gingrich-trump-won-debate-dont-believe-intellectual-yet-idiot-class.html


If Newt says so, that's good enough for me.  

[Wizzard]

Who won is a matter of opinion. And you all know what opinions are

[baldo]

Newt Gingrich says that Trump won the debate:
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/09/27/newt-gingrich-trump-won-debate-dont-believe-intellectual-yet-idiot-class.html


If Newt says so, that's good enough for me.  

Yeah, don't believe the smart kid......

[3fan4life]

Newt Gingrich says that Trump won the debate:
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2016/09/27/newt-gingrich-trump-won-debate-dont-believe-intellectual-yet-idiot-class.html


If Newt says so, that's good enough for me.  

Yeah, don't believe the smart kid......

I've known alot of people who were extremely "Book Smart" that didn't have enough common sense to pour piss out of a boot.

Even if the instructions were written upside down on the heel.

[f6john]

 We will know who won on election day. Donald could have beat Hilliary to a pulp with her record on the destroyed e-mails, Benghazi, ect but he didn't even try. Not sure why, I thought he would have been loaded for bear on this first round. Looking for a different strategy next time.  

[Romeo]

I especially liked the part when the Trumpster admitted that he pays zero income tax, and claimed "because I'm smart"... Also that he "takes advantage of the laws and declared bankruptcy", how many times? How can you declare bankruptcy when you're a gazillionaire?

Good times.

a simple question for ya. Did he break laws in not paying taxes?
Are we or are we not, a nation of laws?
Do you believe in following the laws?
Always hilarious to me when someone gets critisized for following the laws, because they understand them better than others.

[Romeo]

I especially liked the part when the Trumpster admitted that he pays zero income tax, and claimed "because I'm smart"... Also that he "takes advantage of the laws and declared bankruptcy", how many times? How can you declare bankruptcy when you're a gazillionaire?

Good times.

lets talk about bankruptcy.
I live in the Detroit area. We have a little company called General Motors. They declared bankruptcy, in order to save as many jobs as they could. If they would have been allowed to dissolve many many folks in this region would have been damaged beyond repair, let alone the ones spread across the globe. Bakruptcy laws are there to protct people as well as corporations, which after all, are made up of people.
Something that is obviously lost on some people.

[Romeo]

Even he knows he got whipped. He immediately started making excuses. Microphones, moderators, media. He got thrown off his game the minute he felt insulted by her saying he got 14 million from his Dad. It was downhill for him the rest of the way. Then he comes out the next morning and starts trashing a girl for gaining 12 lbs. ?   This dude has got issues.

Lol, how do you really feel?  

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid. In Hillary's words,, what difference does it make?  I think it was designed to put Trump on  the defense right from the get go. And it worked. But why have a bias from the start?

why the bias from the start. Because NBC is obviously biased toward libs. Effing hypocrites.

[baldo]

I especially liked the part when the Trumpster admitted that he pays zero income tax, and claimed "because I'm smart"... Also that he "takes advantage of the laws and declared bankruptcy", how many times? How can you declare bankruptcy when you're a gazillionaire?

Good times.

a simple question for ya. Did he break laws in not paying taxes?
Are we or are we not, a nation of laws?
Do you believe in following the laws?
Always hilarious to me when someone gets critisized for following the laws, because they understand them better than others.

A simple answer for ya once you stop laughing. You think all laws are just? Like I mentioned before, just because it's legal, doesn't make it right.

In regard to his bankruptcies, how many thousands of people got screwed by him working the system to get out from under his various debts, union contracts, etc. How much money did he have at his disposal in his other business ventures? He could declare bankruptcy one day, then reopen under a different name. I'd be shocked if he didn't.

These bankruptcy laws are written by and enacted for corporations (people, my friend). They absolutely control Congress who gets these laws passed.

If you were a builder who bid and was awarded a contract to build a huge mansion for him, and was told at the end of the job that he didn't like the way you had framed the windows. Therefore he wasn't going to pay the last third of the contracted price. That could be in the millions of dollars. Is that something you'd be willing to live with? Would you maybe find no way out except to declare bankruptcy?

How in the hell can you stand there and parrot that ridiculous line, 'it's the law'? He's legally screwed thousands and thousands of people out of untold $$$$$, and you think that's alright? And all this, because he's a greedy psychopath of an asshole with the temperament of a spoiled eight year old?

Now, I'm at a loss for words.

[Romeo]

I especially liked the part when the Trumpster admitted that he pays zero income tax, and claimed "because I'm smart"... Also that he "takes advantage of the laws and declared bankruptcy", how many times? How can you declare bankruptcy when you're a gazillionaire?

Good times.

a simple question for ya. Did he break laws in not paying taxes?
Are we or are we not, a nation of laws?
Do you believe in following the laws?
Always hilarious to me when someone gets critisized for following the laws, because they understand them better than others.

A simple answer for ya once you stop laughing. You think all laws are just? Like I mentioned before, just because it's legal, doesn't make it right.

In regard to his bankruptcies, how many thousands of people got screwed by him working the system to get out from under his various debts, union contracts, etc. How much money did he have at his disposal in his other business ventures? He could declare bankruptcy one day, then reopen under a different name. I'd be shocked if he didn't.

These bankruptcy laws are written by and enacted for corporations (people, my friend). They absolutely control Congress who gets these laws passed.

If you were a builder who bid and was awarded a contract to build a huge mansion for him, and was told at the end of the job that he didn't like the way you had framed the windows. Therefore he wasn't going to pay the last third of the contracted price. That could be in the millions of dollars. Is that something you'd be willing to live with? Would you maybe find no way out except to declare bankruptcy?

How in the hell can you stand there and parrot that ridiculous line, 'it's the law'? He's legally screwed thousands and thousands of people out of untold $$$$$, and you think that's alright? And all this, because he's a greedy psychopath of an asshole with the temperament of a spoiled eight year old?

Now, I'm at a loss for words.

pretty much what i thought. You dont think we should be a nation of laws. You are smarter than those who wrote the laws.
Do we have unjust laws? Of course we do. But who gets to choose which ones are unjust, and why, and therefore not have to follow them? You? Me? If that's the case, we beacome a nation of men. And in that instance, the rich, powerful man always wins. Always.

[baldo]

I especially liked the part when the Trumpster admitted that he pays zero income tax, and claimed "because I'm smart"... Also that he "takes advantage of the laws and declared bankruptcy", how many times? How can you declare bankruptcy when you're a gazillionaire?

Good times.

a simple question for ya. Did he break laws in not paying taxes?
Are we or are we not, a nation of laws?
Do you believe in following the laws?
Always hilarious to me when someone gets critisized for following the laws, because they understand them better than others.

A simple answer for ya once you stop laughing. You think all laws are just? Like I mentioned before, just because it's legal, doesn't make it right.

In regard to his bankruptcies, how many thousands of people got screwed by him working the system to get out from under his various debts, union contracts, etc. How much money did he have at his disposal in his other business ventures? He could declare bankruptcy one day, then reopen under a different name. I'd be shocked if he didn't.

These bankruptcy laws are written by and enacted for corporations (people, my friend). They absolutely control Congress who gets these laws passed.

If you were a builder who bid and was awarded a contract to build a huge mansion for him, and was told at the end of the job that he didn't like the way you had framed the windows. Therefore he wasn't going to pay the last third of the contracted price. That could be in the millions of dollars. Is that something you'd be willing to live with? Would you maybe find no way out except to declare bankruptcy?

How in the hell can you stand there and parrot that ridiculous line, 'it's the law'? He's legally screwed thousands and thousands of people out of untold $$$$$, and you think that's alright? And all this, because he's a greedy psychopath of an asshole with the temperament of a spoiled eight year old?

Now, I'm at a loss for words.

pretty much what i thought. You dont think we should be a nation of laws. You are smarter than those who wrote the laws.
Do we have unjust laws? Of course we do. But who gets to choose which ones are unjust, and why, and therefore not have to follow them? You? Me? If that's the case, we beacome a nation of men. And in that instance, the rich, powerful man always wins. Always.

Do me a favor and stop putting words in my mouth. Where did I say that? And you don't have to be fing Einstein to know that these corporate laws do absolutely nothing for you and me, and everything for the corporation.

If a working Joe has to declare, how much is he allowed to keep? Not fing much, believe me. Like I said before, at two points in my life it was a consideration. After we examined how it works, and the fact that I didn't want to do it in the first place, we toughed it out and got out of that hole.

Look at these kids graduating college with huge debt, and can't find a decent job. The GD banks made fing sure that bankruptcy would not discharge those debts. You think corps have to worry about that crap? JFC !

[Romeo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

[Wizzard]

Baldo,, I have forgot more about bankruptcy than you know. There are good reasons for it but I will not go into it here. I have personally seen the best reason for it and the great outcome because of it. I have also been on the receiving end of loosing over 100k from those who filed on me. Hated it to the max.
But for every good reason for a law there are always those that abuse it.
I was also on the board of a bankruptcy case and the guy who filed got to keep his mercedes convertible. Very frustrating but we cannot base all things just on what we as individuals see. There is more to it.

[Wizzard]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

[baldo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

[Wizzard]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

[John Schmidt]

I think I got more out of the debate than most who watched it, mainly 'cuz I didn't watch one second of it.  Plus, every time any TV program started talking about it with excerpts of the charade, I switched channels. I still haven't figured out which one is the best, I do know which one is the least honest and it's on a rather grand scale. One has to keep in mind re. HC, if she had still been Sec'y. of State when she did all her shenanigans with the email and had been caught, she would have been relieved of her position as required. Now she's looking for a promotion above that position?  I'm afraid that gives me pause, big time?

I'm still thinking I just may put Willie Nelson as a write in. Can you imagine what his cabinet meetings would be like!    Heck, he even has his own golf course where one hole he claims is a par 24. When questioned, he simply said it's his course....his rules.  I'd love to play a round with him some time.  I'd bring my own refreshments however.  

[G-Man]

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid.

No it wasn't a waste of time.  It was done intentionally.  If you recall, he didn't just question him about it, he asked the question in the context of racism, trying to confirm Hillary's assertions that Trump's a racist.

Lester Holt: "For Five Years You Perpetuated A False Claim That The Nation's First Black President Was Not A Natural Born Citizen"

The fact that Obama is black had nothing to do the birther issue.  Only in eyes of a racist would it.  You see racists think about these things in there own minds and then project them onto others.  Lester could have just asked him about it, leaving out Obama's skin color, right?

[The emperor has no clothes]

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid.

No it wasn't a waste of time.  It was done intentionally.  If you recall, he didn't just question him about it, he asked the question in the context of racism, trying to confirm Hillary's assertions that Trump's a racist.

Lester Holt: "For Five Years You Perpetuated A False Claim That The Nation's First Black President Was Not A Natural Born Citizen"

The fact that Obama is black had nothing to do the birther issue.  Only in eyes of a racist would it.  You see racists think about these things in there own minds and then project them onto others.  Lester could have just asked him about it, leaving out Obama's skin color, right?

It must have just been a coincidence that 43 White Presidents weren't asked for their birth certificate .

[G-Man]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

Your nephews didn't HAVE to take those loans, they chose to.  They also chose a field of study that doesn't have jobs waiting for them.  Who's fault is that?

[baldo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

[baldo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

Your nephews didn't HAVE to take those loans, they chose to.  They also chose a field of study that doesn't have jobs waiting for them.  Who's fault is that?

How in the hell do you know what they chose? That's a pretty lame statement to make with absolutely zero knowledge. They took the loans because they wanted to better themselves and lead a productive life. Is that a bad thing?

[Wizzard]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

So what I hear you saying is, ,they should not be forgiven their debts, the banks should charge less interest and  they will pay it back. Am i right? And education should be affordable, but to whose standards?

[baldo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

So what I hear you saying is, ,they should not be forgiven their debts, the banks should charge less interest and  they will pay it back. Am i right? And education should be affordable, but to whose standards?

I never said they should have their debts forgiven. What started this whole thing is Trump being the Bankruptcy King. That led to talking about not being able to discharge student loans in bankruptcy.

Banks shouldn't be charging such high interest on student loans. How can they possibly expect a new graduate  to be able to pay that off? What is the interest charge on 60K at 8% ? I shudder to even think about it. That's higher than a mortgage, which they'll never be able to get. The banks stand a better chance of getting their payments on time if those payments are affordable.

As far as affordable education, it should definitely be part of a governmental program to subsidize higher education. They have no problem paying big agribusiness, big oil corps, and the GD banks. They're getting nothing for it. Pay for some quality education and bring these new minds into the world, you'll reap huge rewards.

pssst.....don't even start crying Socialist either.

[Wizzard]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

So what I hear you saying is, ,they should not be forgiven their debts, the banks should charge less interest and  they will pay it back. Am i right? And education should be affordable, but to whose standards?

I never said they should have their debts forgiven. What started this whole thing is Trump being the Bankruptcy King. That led to talking about not being able to discharge student loans in bankruptcy.

Banks shouldn't be charging such high interest on student loans. How can they possibly expect a new graduate  to be able to pay that off? What is the interest charge on 60K at 8% ? I shudder to even think about it. That's higher than a mortgage, which they'll never be able to get. The banks stand a better chance of getting their payments on time if those payments are affordable.

As far as affordable education, it should definitely be part of a governmental program to subsidize higher education. They have no problem paying big agribusiness, big oil corps, and the GD banks. They're getting nothing for it. Pay for some quality education and bring these new minds into the world, you'll reap huge rewards.

pssst.....don't even start crying Socialist either.

Don't put words in my mouth. I am trying to have a civil discussion here. If I am going to go to school and I know the govt is not paying for it, then I have to plan. If I do not think I can pay for the plan then I do not do it. I don't execute the plan then 5 years later decide I can't pay for it. That not only goes for education ,, that goes for lots of stuff in life. Best one learns that early. If i cannot afford the education of a "doctor" then I best not be a doctor. Maybe I have to work a few years and save up so I can afford it. That is just an example.
As to education,, again,, who pays for it? Who pays the teachers , books,, room and board ,, ect?
Who is paying big agribusiness, big oil corps, and the banks? What are they paying and how?

[baldo]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

So what I hear you saying is, ,they should not be forgiven their debts, the banks should charge less interest and  they will pay it back. Am i right? And education should be affordable, but to whose standards?

I never said they should have their debts forgiven. What started this whole thing is Trump being the Bankruptcy King. That led to talking about not being able to discharge student loans in bankruptcy.

Banks shouldn't be charging such high interest on student loans. How can they possibly expect a new graduate  to be able to pay that off? What is the interest charge on 60K at 8% ? I shudder to even think about it. That's higher than a mortgage, which they'll never be able to get. The banks stand a better chance of getting their payments on time if those payments are affordable.

As far as affordable education, it should definitely be part of a governmental program to subsidize higher education. They have no problem paying big agribusiness, big oil corps, and the GD banks. They're getting nothing for it. Pay for some quality education and bring these new minds into the world, you'll reap huge rewards.

pssst.....don't even start crying Socialist either.

Don't put words in my mouth. I am trying to have a civil discussion here. If I am going to go to school and I know the govt is not paying for it, then I have to plan. If I do not think I can pay for the plan then I do not do it. I don't execute the plan then 5 years later decide I can't pay for it. That not only goes for education ,, that goes for lots of stuff in life. Best one learns that early. If i cannot afford the education of a "doctor" then I best not be a doctor. Maybe I have to work a few years and save up so I can afford it. That is just an example.
As to education,, again,, who pays for it? Who pays the teachers , books,, room and board ,, ect?
Who is paying big agribusiness, big oil corps, and the banks? What are they paying and how?

Wizzard, not trying to put words in your mouth. If you're referring to the Socialist remark, it was meant to be with a wink. Reading it now, it doesn't come across that way. I appreciate the civil discussion. Too many are not.

As far as the biz payments, look into the farm subsidies. No shortage of info out there. Hell, there are even some Congress members getting these payments. And I'm sure you've heard of oil companies being subsidized.

I've got to run for now, but look into these things and I can chat more a bit later on if you want.

Bob

[Jersey mike]

Now video has come out that she may have had a small box and ear piece on during the debate and may have been told what to say. I hope this is true and she digs her own grave, I'll gladly kick her off the edge into it.

the small box I believe is the transmitter for the jacket microphone they wore.

I saw the photo of the ear piece last week and it was hard for me to tell if it was an ear piece.

these days it's a tough call on what is real and is photoshopped on the internet but I wouldn't put it past her to try and sneak in a earpiece.

[Jersey mike]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

I hear you,, so you think they should be forgiven? Who picks up the tab.
I and my son both went to school with a degree and worked and paid for it. We worked while we were in school. Education is a privilege not a right! If I cannot afford the education then I best not be doing it. Whats the answer in your eyes?

No not forgiven. But these graduates aren't able to refinance their loans. How can these banks justify 8% and higher? They're hamstringing all these kids before they even get a chance to start making their way in the world. They'll never be able to afford to own a home. And in the worst cases, that debt never dies. In fact, it might even transfer to the parents, even if they didn't co-sign. I think I read something about that recently.

I, too, paid for our kids education. They both have very small Stafford loans to pay off. I'm very happy we were able to do this for them.

As far as education being a privilege. Why do you say that? As a society, wouldn't it be beneficial for anyone with the inclination to study, be allowed to? Wouldn't we all be better off with the next generation able to think on their feet, instead of follow the pack?

I don't want to step in too far here but taking a loan for college isn't the same as taking a loan for a car. there's no collateral to repossess if the loan is defaulted on by the college student, they get to keep the education. Should someone default on a car loan, the bank takes the car.

is 8% high, in today's world yes, but what else are banks in business for. if I remember correctly college loans do not begin accruing interest until the student graduates.

Many students then combine their 4 years of loans (8 semesters) into one loan and can usually find a lower interest than the initial rate.

[G-Man]

I was disapointed in the moderator. Asking the "birthing" question was a waste of time and stupid.

No it wasn't a waste of time.  It was done intentionally.  If you recall, he didn't just question him about it, he asked the question in the context of racism, trying to confirm Hillary's assertions that Trump's a racist.

Lester Holt: "For Five Years You Perpetuated A False Claim That The Nation's First Black President Was Not A Natural Born Citizen"

The fact that Obama is black had nothing to do the birther issue.  Only in eyes of a racist would it.  You see racists think about these things in there own minds and then project them onto others.  Lester could have just asked him about it, leaving out Obama's skin color, right?

It must have just been a coincidence that 43 White Presidents weren't asked for their birth certificate .

So, a question asked to the only black president has to be a racist one if it wasn't asked to the others?  

What if there happened to be a Jewish president.  Would question asked of him be considered antisemitic if never asked before?

[G-Man]

Temper, temper.
Btw, enjoy the ride next weekend, and say hi to Oss for me.

Lol,, i used to say when I was in a debate the if I got the other person so frustrated they started swearing and calling me name,, I knew I won. 

Apologize for the unfortunate use of the single contraction. I have two nephews that are currently saddled with over $60K in loans and no jobs in sight. It's a sore spot for me.

Your nephews didn't HAVE to take those loans, they chose to.  They also chose a field of study that doesn't have jobs waiting for them.  Who's fault is that?

How in the hell do you know what they chose? That's a pretty lame statement to make with absolutely zero knowledge. They took the loans because they wanted to better themselves and lead a productive life. Is that a bad thing?

No, not a bad thing at all, and I hope it works out eventually for them.  I got my info from YOU.  You said they have the loans and can't get work.  How was I wrong?  I'm in the same boat but I'm clear headed.  My daughter went to the school she wanted to go to, and she majored in what she wanted to.  She's lucky she doesn't have loans because we paid.   But there's no job waiting for her either.  So far not a very good investment on my part.  She is working, but not making anything near what she would have to if she had to pay back loans.  Had the kids chosen a different field, one with jobs waiting, we wouldn't even be discussing it and the average student debt of $30,000 would be nothing.  The cost of an average car is not so terrible of an investment into ones future.