NRA says bump stocks, devices used by Las Vegas shooter, should be regulated

[Rams]

NRA says bump stocks, devices used by Las Vegas shooter, should be regulated

http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/nra-says-bump-stocks-devices-used-by-las-vegas-shooter-should-be-regulated/ar-AAsXoCT?OCID=ansmsnnews11&ffid=gz

The National Rifle Association (NRA) said in a statement Thursday that the the device the Las Vegas shooter used to convert his semi-automatic weapons to fire automatic should be subject to additional regulations. 

"In the aftermath of the evil and senseless attack in Las Vegas, the American people are looking for answers as to how future tragedies can be prevented," said Wayne LaPierre, the NRA's CEO, and Chris Cox, executive director of the NRA Institute for Legislative Action  in a joint statement.
While they said "unfortunately" the first response from some politicians has been to call for gun control, they said, "The NRA believes that devices designed to allow semi-automatic rifles to function like fully-automatic rifles should be subject to additional regulations."

A growing number of congressional Republicans have expressed that they're open to investigating the legality or even banning bump stocks.

Watch: Senator proposes nationwide ban on bump fire stocks

Since the mid-1980s, machine guns that fire multiple shots with one pull of the trigger have been illegal but bump stocks, a gun accessory, is currently legal and allowed the gunman last Sunday to shoot more than 500 people at a country music festival. The shooter killed 58 people and wounded more than 500.

While Republicans, including President Trump, have dismissed the idea of tightening gun laws and have stressed that it's not the time to politicize the tragedy, some say they want to look into bump stocks and place restrictions on them. 


 

[Serk]

I've contacted them for clarification, close to tearing up my NRA Benefactor Life Member card if what it says they're saying is really what they're saying.

[Rams]

A good friend of mine tells me: The NRA is trying to trade national reciprocity for a ban on bump stocks. Since defending bump stocks is a losing battle, I hope we can at least get national reciprocity out of it.

Don't know but, I would view that as a pretty good deal.   YMMV.

[Serk]

Won't do us any long term good.

A bump stock can be kicked out quickly and easily by a 3D printer, it doesn't need to be a high strength part. This just punishes the law abiding.

Anyone wanting to cause carnage will just print their own bump stock (Or even print the parts to make a REAL fully automatic firearm) and then after the next whacko does so we'll be expected to sacrifice another right.

Another thought - The current push is to catalog bumpfire stocks as machine guns under the NFA. Okay, we do that, they'll have to repeal the Hughes Amendment to allow these existing "machine guns" to be added to the NFA registry.

[Psychotic Bovine]

Let's be honest, here, the bump fire stock is a gimmick, toy, and ammo waster.  I am for the NRA wanting to get them regulated.  Look at it this way:  bump stocks are useless, geeky items.  The NRA looks like it's doing something "positive" to the public while basically wanting to be rid of a useless item. I know of no shooters that even own one, and our range specifically bans their use on the range.
This is a win for the NRA.  We, the NRA, "compromises", but we lose nothing.  The antis think they win, but gain nothing.

[Rams]

Serk,
You may be right.   Can't/won't argue the point.

But, I do think the bump stock legislation is going to go through with very few voting against it.  
The way I see it, it might be better to compromise and get something out of it.  (This time)

IOWs, pick yer battles. 

As I heard someone say the other day, I don't give up, I remember and wait.............

[Sorcerer]

And with a little practice you really don't need a " bump stock". So a law, out lawing commercialy made bump stocks is going to stop some one with ill intent from making one in there work shop, how? " camels nose" under the tent. They'd next have to ban semi auto anything. How do you eat an elephant? One bite at a time.

[solo1]

I agree with my son.  Bump stocks are toys, we don't need them.  Good for bragging rights and firing off a lot of rounds of ill aimed shots.  As a long time shooter I've watched the gun accessory industry come up with many 'innovations', some of which make no sense to me.

I take the shooting sports seriously and we should act responsibly for our Right.  

I'll stay with the NRA. It's not worth it to sacrifice our Voice for the sake of a 'innovative' toy.

I don't see the statement as giving up any rights or opening the door. In fact, i think that it'll give us the power to do reciprocal licensing and eventually suppressors. Yeah, and i know the trend will be to quit the NRA, that will make the libs very happy and they'll quote the losses.

Fire away but you will NOT change my mind.

[Jess from VA]

I don't like conceding one single thing to the grabbers, but if there had to one thing, this might be it.

Of course the new leftist proposal is way inclusive of many more things than just the bump fire.  Like Timney triggers.

[Sorcerer]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

[The emperor has no clothes]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

"we are still outgunned by the military"  You are wanting equal footing with our military ?

[baldo]

They're playing the odds here.  Everyone knows of the silencer legislation coming up. The NRA is giving on this because it's a loser. They want something in return.

[solo1]

At the ripe old age of close to 90 and a shooter all of my life, I do NOT need a lecture on what the 2nd amendment means, just read the 46th Fed Paper.

To me, anything that cannot send bullets to an aimed target is useless for defense.  That makes it a toy or close to one.

As for the military,  if it came down to the wire right now, we would have friends.  I'm a retired Korean War Vet and I belong to the US Army Association.  I know what they're thinking.

[Jess from VA]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

"we are still outgunned by the military"   You are wanting equal footing with our military ?

Absolutely!!  Both military AND police.  (with all infantry small arms, including  machine guns) (not missiles, nukes, tanks, ships, or artillery)    That is exactly what the 2d Amend means after all.  

[98valk]

all high rise building must have unbreakable bullet proof glass. problem solved. anti-americans from the senate and congress that are against bump stops and the 2nd will have zero argument. problem solved.

[Serk]

I had a very angry, hot headed reply typed out, but I erased it.

This is exactly what the gun grabbers want, the good guys bickering among themselves.

I won't give in to the emotion, but I will stand for our rights. ALL of them. Even the ones I don't care about or the ones I think are unimportant.

Unless they do an immediate 180 the NRA has seen their last penny from me.

National Association of Gun Rights has just received my membership and will be receiving (With the GOA) what donations I would previously have given to the NRA.

[The emperor has no clothes]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

"we are still outgunned by the military"   You are wanting equal footing with our military ?

Absolutely!!  Both military AND police.  (with all infantry small arms, including  machine guns) (not missiles, nukes, tanks, ships, or artillery)    That is exactly what the 2d Amend means after all.  

Ok, at the risk of looking stupid two days in a row. You will not think our society is fair until you have equal armament to the military ?

[The emperor has no clothes]

I had a very angry, hot headed reply typed out, but I erased it.

This is exactly what the gun grabbers want, the good guys bickering among themselves.

I won't give in to the emotion, but I will stand for our rights. ALL of them. Even the ones I don't care about or the ones I think are unimportant.

Unless they do an immediate 180 the NRA has seen their last penny from me.

National Association of Gun Rights has just received my membership and will be receiving (With the GOA) what donations I would previously have given to the NRA.

I do appreciate your integrity.  To call people looking to help our country, but have differing views than you about it "gun grabbers" is as rediculous as calling the other viewpoint "the good guys". 

[RP#62]

Maybe its just me, but to propose any type of legislative action before the investigation is complete and we understand what happened means that those proposing it don't care what happened, or whether what they are proposing would have prevented it.  Its just an opportunity to advance an agenda.  Reminds me of the joke where the police seeing the bank robber run into a building immediately surround an adjacent smaller building.  When asked why, they said they didn't have enough people to surround the bigger building.

-RP

[solo1]

Interesting that the Firearms Act of 1934 prohibited owning fully automatic weapons without the ok from the Feds and it has never been changed and now a simple bump stock, which everyone admits can be easily duplicated, has people all pissed at the NRA. Have the needs changed?

I have no angry words except for those that think i need to be educated on the 2nd amendment.  I have been a shooter longer than most of you have lived.  

I will not give up my membership of the NRA.  I will wait and see how this plays out.

If any here are po'd about my stand, you have that right but honestly, I don't give a rat's patootie and I won't argue the point. I wish to stay friends.

[The emperor has no clothes]

It seems like pretty simple legislation to me. Are we so set in stone that we can't agree the bump stock serves no good purpose other than to be more lethal ? Do we truly need more lethality in our society ? Seems to me we have more than plenty.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Maybe its just me, but to propose any type of legislative action before the investigation is complete and we understand what happened means that those proposing it don't care what happened, or whether what they are proposing would have prevented it.  Its just an opportunity to advance an agenda.  Reminds me of the joke where the police seeing the bank robber run into a building immediately surround an adjacent smaller building.  When asked why, they said they didn't have enough people to surround the bigger building.

-RP

Doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out he got many more people because of the bump stock.

[Robert]

Maybe its just me, but to propose any type of legislative action before the investigation is complete and we understand what happened means that those proposing it don't care what happened, or whether what they are proposing would have prevented it.  Its just an opportunity to advance an agenda.  Reminds me of the joke where the police seeing the bank robber run into a building immediately surround an adjacent smaller building.  When asked why, they said they didn't have enough people to surround the bigger building.

-RP

I actually agree with you on this and wonder why no one is questioning why there is no information coming forward from what has been found already. There was a note but they are not saying what was on the note, but said it was not a suicide note. There is a LV cabby that recorded gun shots and some sound like they are in her car and others are far away. The fact that 30 guns to do the job of 3 that were used, why all the extra guns? Some seemed to be displayed around and all from a 64 year old man not in good shape and no military training. Of the shots of the room I have not seen any shell casings on the floor either. Could it be we are loosing focus on whats really important like getting some answers from the investigation.

I think we should stop with questioning gun legislation and start wondering what really happened.

[98valk]

Maybe its just me, but to propose any type of legislative action before the investigation is complete and we understand what happened means that those proposing it don't care what happened, or whether what they are proposing would have prevented it.  Its just an opportunity to advance an agenda.  Reminds me of the joke where the police seeing the bank robber run into a building immediately surround an adjacent smaller building.  When asked why, they said they didn't have enough people to surround the bigger building.

-RP

Doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out he got many more people because of the bump stock.

per your scientist thinking ban all semi-autos, only single shot bolt action allowed.  actually this is part of the UN agenda backed by the anti-americans in congress and the senate going back to the '80s.

[The emperor has no clothes]

Maybe its just me, but to propose any type of legislative action before the investigation is complete and we understand what happened means that those proposing it don't care what happened, or whether what they are proposing would have prevented it.  Its just an opportunity to advance an agenda.  Reminds me of the joke where the police seeing the bank robber run into a building immediately surround an adjacent smaller building.  When asked why, they said they didn't have enough people to surround the bigger building.

-RP

Doesn't take rocket scientist to figure out he got many more people because of the bump stock.

per your scientist thinking ban all semi-autos, only single shot bolt action allowed.  actually this is part of the UN agenda backed by the anti-americans in congress and the senate going back to the '80s.

"only single shot bolt action allowed" What a BS piece of argument. The proposal is to ban bump stocks.

[Jess from VA]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

"we are still outgunned by the military"   You are wanting equal footing with our military ?

Absolutely!!  Both military AND police.  (with all infantry small arms, including  machine guns) (not missiles, nukes, tanks, ships, or artillery)    That is exactly what the 2d Amend means after all.  

Ok, at the risk of looking stupid two days in a row. You will not think our society is fair until you have equal armament to the military ?

Already asked, and answered.  (and that not what I said)

On small arms (as that term is understood), as clear in the 2d amendment, yes absolutely.   How else could an armed citizenry ever stand up to a tyrannical nation?  (again, exactly what the 2d Amendment means).  

We still lose against tanks, nukes, artillery, choppers, planes, dumb and smart bombs... but we have a constitutional RIGHT to a parity of small arms.

Fair is not really the issue.  The military will always be heavily armed well beyond small arms.  The 2d amendment doesn't give the people full parity, just a fighting chance.

[The emperor has no clothes]

How many like Finstien do you think would sign a bill with national carry in it? Only if the think they see an end around down the road for further laws to limit rights.
Lastly you may want to beleave bump stock is a " toy/ gimmick. How ever we the people are still out gunned by our military by a huge margin. So does a " bump stock" have a real value to the man on the street. You bet it does. The right to bear arms was never about putting food on the table or putting holes in paper.

"we are still outgunned by the military"   You are wanting equal footing with our military ?

Absolutely!!  Both military AND police.  (with all infantry small arms, including  machine guns) (not missiles, nukes, tanks, ships, or artillery)    That is exactly what the 2d Amend means after all.  

Ok, at the risk of looking stupid two days in a row. You will not think our society is fair until you have equal armament to the military ?

Already asked, and answered.  (and that not what I said)

On small arms (as that term is understood), as clear in the 2d amendment, yes absolutely.   How else could an armed citizenry ever stand up to a tyrannical nation?  (again, exactly what the 2d Amendment means). 

We still lose against tanks, nukes, artillery, choppers, planes, dumb and smart bombs... but we have a constitutional RIGHT to a parity of small arms.

Fair is not really the issue.  The military will always be heavily armed well beyond small arms.  The 2d amendment doesn't give the people full parity, just a fighting chance.

So, the same rifles and handguns ? Grenade launchers or anything else ?

[phideux]

You know with a heavy rubber band, your fingers and a little technique you can get the same effect as the "bump-stock". Are we going to outlaw rubber bands and fingers next????
Why does everyone always blame the tool instead of the person wielding the tool???
Why don't they just make shooting into a crowd from a hotel window illegal, that'll stop all this.

[Jess from VA]

I actually agree with you on this and wonder why no one is questioning why there is no information coming forward from what has been found already. There was a note but they are not saying what was on the note, but said it was not a suicide note. There is a LV cabby that recorded gun shots and some sound like they are in her car and others are far away. The fact that 30 guns to do the job of 3 that were used, why all the extra guns? Some seemed to be displayed around and all from a 64 year old man not in good shape and no military training. Of the shots of the room I have not seen any shell casings on the floor either. Could it be we are loosing focus on whats really important like getting some answers from the investigation.

I think we should stop with questioning gun legislation and start wondering what really happened.


They have reported there is no suicide note.  The paper on the table is probably a room service chit, or something like that.  I too want to understand a motive.  None is forthcoming (at all).  I can see no investigative reason to withhold a suicide note, or at least to report they have one.  They don't.  We might find something out from his autopsy.  Or we may never know why he had a worm in his head.

When you use bump fire or full auto for extended periods, the barrels self destruct in short order, unless you allow time to cool.  This is why military squad auto rifles and heavy machine guns have easy switch barrels (or are water cooled).  His planning was good enough to have considered this, by having multiple rifles to switch to (though we still do not know how many were actually used).  He didn't need that many for 10 minutes, but he might have for two hours.

But he only fired for 10 minutes, then stopped.  Once the hotel security man came to the door and got shot through the door, Paddock never fired out the windows again.  Paddock seems to have directed all his attention to the door (and his cameras) from then on.  (I think he knew he would kill himself at the end, but he thought he'd have more time, and was screwing up his courage to eat a gun, so he stayed focused on the door.)  So the cops wait 70 more minutes for swat.  He fires at swat through the door again, then kills himself as they blow the door.  Everyone is damn lucky he only shot for 10 minutes.  

How much training do you think it takes to operate an innacurate bump fire spray and pray in a general direction of a crowd of 22K (or any rifle or pistol or even a shotgun for that matter)?  Not much.  No real marksmanship necessary.  Change mags when empty and repeat (and I already noted it was taking him half to a full minute to change mags: rookie performance).  Or maybe he was changing rifles on every mag.  We don't know... but they do.

The pictures I've seen, there are shell casings all over the place.

As far as the gun grabbers go, striking while the iron is hot and emotions high is their MO.  It has always been so.  If all they could get was a ban on derringer pistols, entirely unrelated to this incident, they'd take it (and proclaim victory).   Ptouy

[Psychotic Bovine]

I actually agree with you on this and wonder why no one is questioning why there is no information coming forward from what has been found already. There was a note but they are not saying what was on the note, but said it was not a suicide note. There is a LV cabby that recorded gun shots and some sound like they are in her car and others are far away. The fact that 30 guns to do the job of 3 that were used, why all the extra guns? Some seemed to be displayed around and all from a 64 year old man not in good shape and no military training. Of the shots of the room I have not seen any shell casings on the floor either. Could it be we are loosing focus on whats really important like getting some answers from the investigation.

I think we should stop with questioning gun legislation and start wondering what really happened.


They have reported there is no suicide note.  The paper on the table is probably a room service chit, or something like that.  I too want to understand a motive.  None is forthcoming (at all).  I can see no investigative reason to withhold a suicide note, or at least to report they have one.  They don't.  We might find something out from his autopsy.  Or we may never know why he had a worm in his head.

When you use bump fire or full auto for extended periods, the barrels self destruct in short order, unless you allow time to cool.  This is why military squad auto rifles and heavy machine guns have easy switch barrels (or are water cooled).  His planning was good enough to have considered this, by having multiple rifles to switch to (though we still do not know how many were actually used).  He didn't need that many for 10 minutes, but he might have for two hours.

But he only fired for 10 minutes, then stopped.  Once the hotel security man came to the door and got shot through the door, Paddock never fired out the windows again.  Paddock seems to have directed all his attention to the door (and his cameras) from then on.  (I think he knew he would kill himself at the end, but he thought he'd have more time, and was screwing up his courage to eat a gun, so he stayed focused on the door.)  So the cops wait 70 more minutes for swat.  He fires at swat through the door again, then kills himself as they blow the door.  Everyone is damn lucky he only shot for 10 minutes.  

How much training do you think it takes to operate an innacurate bump fire spray and pray in a general direction of a crowd of 22K (or any rifle or pistol or even a shotgun for that matter)?  Not much.  No real marksmanship necessary.  Change mags when empty and repeat (and I already noted it was taking him half to a full minute to change mags: rookie performance).  Or maybe he was changing rifles on every mag.  We don't know... but they do.

The pictures I've seen, there are shell casings all over the place.  

I saw the crime scene pic of the aftermath of his suicide (gun in the mouth).  Lots of shell casings all around, as you would expect.

[Serk]

Copy and paste from elsewhere:

Everyone who cherishes the 2nd Amendment needs to understand why the "bump fire" stock came into being.
Republicans were working to combat liberal jurisdictions and the BATF in the mid 80's, which were prosecuting and imprisoning American citizens simply for exercising their 2nd Amendment rights. This effort was called the Firearms Owner's Protection Act of 1986. The purpose of this Act was entirely to prevent government abuses against the citizenry for exercising their rights under the 2nd Amendment
The ultra-liberal New Jersey Senator William J. "Bill" Hughes introduced a "poison pill" amendment to the bill that banned civilian sale of any machine gun manufactured after implementation of the Act (May 19, 1986). He was hoping that supporters of the FOPA would decline to vote for the bill due to the amendment, so that his state could continue violating the 2nd Amendment rights of Americans unimpeded. Even if they went ahead and passed it, he would effectively be denying the rights of all the citizenry in the country to own a machine gun. Everyone except approximately 175,000, which is the estimated number of legally transferable machine guns in the NFA Register.
In essence, Senator Hughes created a "loophole" for the government to deny the citizenry their 2nd Amendment rights. How can you defend that it's perfectly OK and legal for 175,000 Americans to own and use machine guns, but no one else, forever?
Enter Slide Fire Solutions owner USAF SSgt (RET) Jeremiah Cottle. Recognizing a desire, he created the bump fire stock. He was awarded a U.S. Patent and BATFE legal concurrence in 2010 to manufacture and sell them to the citizenry, which as closely as possible reinstated their lawful ability to obtain something that had been denied to them for a quarter century.
So contrary to what the media and politicians are telling you, the bump stock is a "loophole" to partially restore a 2nd Amendment right that was taken from us in 1986. Spinning this any other way is flat out 100% wrong.
So if you believe bump stocks should be banned, you are in lockstep with Bill Hughes and the State of New Jersey. You can't spin it any other way. To attempt doing so is misleading and disingenuous. You must decide whether you'll abandon your principles and rights, or stand and fight. Tread carefully

[PAVALKER]

[Since the mid-1980s, machine guns that fire multiple shots with one pull of the trigger have been illegal but bump stocks, a gun accessory, is currently legal and allowed the gunman last Sunday to shoot more than 500 people at a country music festival. The shooter killed 58 people and wounded more than 500.

While Republicans, including President Trump, have dismissed the idea of tightening gun laws and have stressed that it's not the time to politicize the tragedy, some say they want to look into bump stocks and place restrictions on them. 


 

Uhhhh,  machine guns are NOT illegal.  They are strictly regulated, but they are not illegal.  Regular citizens can purchase them.  Is this your statement or a quote?   Either way, it's incorrect.

[Robert]

This whole thing to me seems to not add up and sounds more like a scene out of Miami Vice that the deal went bad.

The guy is a ghost, has money but no apparent income except for gambling. Yet wires his girlfriend 100k and she thought that was a goodbye. Which if you have money you could do at anytime, meaning a millionaire giving money would be no problem and not to say goodbye. Guy worked for the IRS and a mailman, the house he lived in was nothing special and we have not seen the inside, not lavish at all. The lifestyle was not lavish at all either. Who lives like a normal guy who has millions? The Casinos document all winnings and report them to the government. Especially in the numbers that this guy was betting and winning. 100k on the table and thats all he sends his girlfriend, many would have setup another account for her and regularly deposited money in it for her personal needs.  No friends and those around said he was not friendly at all, Living in a adult community. Who approved him in the adult community with all their interviews and approvals and who paid for his house? Why has the news not done a personal workup on the guy, I have never seen a mass murder that the news was not tripping over themselves to paint the guy one way or another. How about how the guy dressed polyester for a successful gambler or businessman?

  The note could have been anything but then state what it was.  So many guns yet how many did he actually use? Why is the window in 2 suites broken out? He could have gotten all it done from one. Why did the first responders say he was trying to escape, could it be that he knew he was going to die from this and he didn't do it and was some kind of bad deal that he was doing?

 The investigators believe he had someone else to help him and there was even talk that someone left the room before the police arrived. What if he was left holding the bag on a deal gone bad like to ISIS? Now the NY Times could be publishing this article with some real information that some serial killers are not solved or they could be trying to get us to accept that fact since the truth is already known.

If you want to kill people why do you fire at a fuel tank? More terror is instilled when people drop from gun fire.

Bank records with the transfer of money investigators should have a better profile on this guy, yet we have heard NOTHING. Like was he a successful businessman or even gambler but we have not heard either. Even if the guy was a retired real estate developer what was his company, did he really retire, is the company still in business, why didn't anyone or any deal done speak on his behalf? Where is the rest of his money if he was so wealthy and why dont we hear a personal story from the bank of how good a patron he was. Why dont you see pictures of his family life or his vacations or anything about him except one or two pics? Relationships that came forward saying that I knew him or he dated me, even if they didnt want to admit it.

Whose prints were on the shell casings, on the gun, on the room, why did he put a camera outside the room if he planed to kill himself?

I would say motive is not the only thing missing here. Its this guys life is missing.

No Manifesto, No Phone Calls: Las Vegas Killer Left Only Cryptic Clues
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/05/us/vegas-motive-mass-shootings.html


If I was the government had a guy that knew the system and like they said, they knew him. Had a father that was a criminal, the son maybe off a bit mentally, not a real relationship kind of guy and one not taken to things of this world. Maybe a bit of a split personality or manic depressive but highly intelligent but could not function well on his own and I could use him in situations, this is the perfect guy to use. Someone no good on their own but perfect to setup and use like a puppet and setup in life in any situation the handlers/government want. They would take care of him and he would do their bidding although a bit hard to control sometimes. If you think of the stereo type of any cop show who is the snitch? A perfect informant One that because of the father I was familiar with and wanted to keep in touch with so I could keep up on the father and I knew the family background. Do you really think the government doesn't know the family completely being the father gave them a black eye?

  Something went wrong though and they lost him in one way or another. I doubt it was Paddok that was to blame, did you look at the pic of him not shaven looking like he crawled out from under a rock. Yea thats a successful businessman/gambler that went off the deep end. He never was off the deep end. The comments of anyone who met him sounds like the typical introvert, manic type. Not able to function in society, rude, abrupt, base living and could be out on the streets if left to his own.

I have not seen to many times a brother being that gregarious about another brother that just killed 58 people, open almost animated about his description of the the brother and situation.

Nope sorry something went terribly wrong and we are having a debate over guns over something like fast and furious or some other operation that went wrong and not focusing on the situation. when the Sheriff is having doubts about looking into this guy, what normal citizen do you think is that far off the radar I could be way wrong but it fits better than any other explanation.

[Rams]

[Since the mid-1980s, machine guns that fire multiple shots with one pull of the trigger have been illegal but bump stocks, a gun accessory, is currently legal and allowed the gunman last Sunday to shoot more than 500 people at a country music festival. The shooter killed 58 people and wounded more than 500.

While Republicans, including President Trump, have dismissed the idea of tightening gun laws and have stressed that it's not the time to politicize the tragedy, some say they want to look into bump stocks and place restrictions on them. 


 

Uhhhh,  machine guns are NOT illegal.  They are strictly regulated, but they are not illegal.  Regular citizens can purchase them.  Is this your statement or a quote?   Either way, it's incorrect.

Quoted from the article.................

[solo1]

for getting miffed during the post on bump stocks. While i won't change my mind, I really don't need to add to the tearing apart of our nation's fabric. That might sound slightly poetic but that's what I see.

Lots of hate, lots of violent disagreements, lots of UnChristianlike behavior.

I don't feel that this apology is showing weakness.  It isn't, just sadness at what's happening to our country.

Wayne, solo1

[Patrick]

It isn't, just sadness at what's happening to our country.
end quote



It is sad what's happening. I keep wondering when and where things went wrong.

[Serk]

This is a very emotional issue. I disagree on our willingness to try to make a deal with the devil, but I still respect you and still hope to one day meet you and shake your hand.

Unfortunately, this is a little too accurate:

Gun owners discussing 1911 Vs. Glock, semi auto vs. revolver, "high capacity" magazine ban, "assault weapon" bans:



Gun owners discussing a potential "bump fire stock" ban/regulation:

[The emperor has no clothes]

This is a very emotional issue. I disagree on our willingness to try to make a deal with the devil, but I still respect you and still hope to one day meet you and shake your hand.

Unfortunately, this is a little too accurate:

Gun owners discussing 1911 Vs. Glock, semi auto vs. revolver, "high capacity" magazine ban, "assault weapon" bans:



Gun owners discussing a potential "bump fire stock" ban/regulation:

"gun grabbers" , "the devil" ? Any more superlatives you want to throw out there ?

[Serk]

"gun grabbers" , "the devil" ? Any more superlatives you want to throw out there ?

For those who seek to enslave the citizens of this great nation? You bet, I've got tons of things I'd refer to them as. But for the sake of the spirit of this thread I'll not start listing them here.

[Robert]

for getting miffed during the post on bump stocks. While i won't change my mind, I really don't need to add to the tearing apart of our nation's fabric. That might sound slightly poetic but that's what I see.

Lots of hate, lots of violent disagreements, lots of UnChristianlike behavior.

I don't feel that this apology is showing weakness.  It isn't, just sadness at what's happening to our country.

Wayne, solo1

Wayne I understand by why is it any different when we see the stocks go up on oil and the price of gas go up for no reason just to satisfy the profit margin of a company at the cost of some who dont have the money for gas.