The Confederate flag is no longer flying over Fort Sumter.

[Willow]

... Pres. Lincoln included the song Dixie among his favorites. Sounds like someone else that was for something, before he was against it, didn't know what he was doing, and made a mess of it.

Sounds like your knowledge of history is as skewed as some others on here have been and I have noticed the extreme skewing has been on both sides of this discussion.

Abraham Lincoln was never against the South.  Abe was born and spent much of his formative years in Southern culture.  He was devoted to keeping the U. S. of A. as one nation and that was his motivation for the position he took from 1861 to 1865.  Abraham Lincoln insisted that no punishment or other imposed repercussions be put upon the South as the war drew to an end and it was obvious the Union would prevail.  John W. Booth did a great disservice to the South by killing the one man that would have protected them from what became the very destructive years of "reconstruction" after the end of the War between the States.   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahlgren_Affair 

I'm missing your point, hubcapsc, but we'll have to discuss it another time.  I'm on my way out the door for a long while.

[The emperor has no clothes]

the shooter said he did it because of all the white women being raped by black men---FBI statistics show some 14,000 white men have raped by black men yearly and no black woman have been raped by white males--google it---black on white crime is 40X higher than the opposite--it is all about the beat down of the european male in this country --google who owns the media in the U.S.--It is all very sad

He meathead we agree on something else
Even if true it has ZERO to do with the topic at hand.

I would say it has some relevance. It shows the mindset of SOME who are in support of the battle flag.

[hubcapsc]

... Pres. Lincoln included the song Dixie among his favorites. Sounds like someone else that was for something, before he was against it, didn't know what he was doing, and made a mess of it.

Sounds like your knowledge of history is as skewed as some others on here have been and I have noticed the extreme skewing has been on both sides of this discussion.

Abraham Lincoln was never against the South.  Abe was born and spent much of his formative years in Southern culture.  He was devoted to keeping the U. S. of A. as one nation and that was his motivation for the position he took from 1861 to 1865.  Abraham Lincoln insisted that no punishment or other imposed repercussions be put upon the South as the war drew to an end and it was obvious the Union would prevail.  John W. Booth did a great disservice to the South by killing the one man that would have protected them from what became the very destructive years of "reconstruction" after the end of the War between the States.   

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dahlgren_Affair 

I'm missing your point, hubcapsc, but we'll have to discuss it another time.  I'm on my way out the door for a long while.

It is a cool story, also about a plot to assassinate the president, and it ties in at the
end to Booth's plot.

-Mike

[signart]

... Pres. Lincoln included the song Dixie among his favorites. Sounds like someone else that was for something, before he was against it, didn't know what he was doing, and made a mess of it.

Sounds like your knowledge of history is as skewed as some others on here have been and I have noticed the extreme skewing has been on both sides of this discussion.

Abraham Lincoln was never against the South.  Abe was born and spent much of his formative years in Southern culture.  He was devoted to keeping the U. S. of A. as one nation and that was his motivation for the position he took from 1861 to 1865.  Abraham Lincoln insisted that no punishment or other imposed repercussions be put upon the South as the war drew to an end and it was obvious the Union would prevail.  John W. Booth did a great disservice to the South by killing the one man that would have protected them from what became the very destructive years of "reconstruction" after the end of the War between the States.  

Skewed, hardly. Lincoln loved the south, and he loved big government. So much so, on April 15, 1861 he ordered 75,000 troops to invade Dixie and for the next 4 years proceeded to eliminate a full 20% of the southern population to promote a liberal agenda. Yep he loved the south enough to do that. He did not have the skills to save the union constitutionally, much the same as we have today. Booth is no hero to me, but we don't need any Northification, now or then.

[Oss]

Anyone who thinks it was all Lincoln, or all Davis should read history seriously


Start with this book if you have time to tear away from Wheel of Fortune you can finish in a week or less
Its not perfect but it does fairly show the tumult over 40 years leading to the Great War from the perspective of the people who sat in the big chair in the White House,

Here is the title of the book

The Presidents' War: Six American Presidents and the Civil War That Divided Them
by Chris DeRose


There was a hot potato nobody would face head on, Lincoln just happened to be there when the shitstorm started and the Democrats force the issue of secession,  Yes he said what he would do ahead of time, so did Obama for that matter Just how many of you read HIS book and voted for him anyway?


The other thing I think of when reading this thread is a Red Skelton sketch on the pledge of allegiance

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZBTyTWOZCM

[Patrick]

... Pres. Lincoln included the song Dixie among his favorites. Sounds like someone else that was for something, before he was against it, didn't know what he was doing, and made a mess of it.

Sounds like your knowledge of history is as skewed as some others on here have been and I have noticed the extreme skewing has been on both sides of this discussion.

Abraham Lincoln was never against the South.  Abe was born and spent much of his formative years in Southern culture.  He was devoted to keeping the U. S. of A. as one nation and that was his motivation for the position he took from 1861 to 1865.  Abraham Lincoln insisted that no punishment or other imposed repercussions be put upon the South as the war drew to an end and it was obvious the Union would prevail.  John W. Booth did a great disservice to the South by killing the one man that would have protected them from what became the very destructive years of "reconstruction" after the end of the War between the States.  

Skewed, hardly. Lincoln loved the south, and he loved big government. So much so, on April 15, 1861 he ordered 75,000 troops to invade Dixie and for the next 4 years proceeded to eliminate a full 20% of the southern population to promote a liberal agenda. Yep he loved the south enough to do that. He did not have the skills to save the union constitutionally, much the same as we have today. Booth is no hero to me, but we don't need any Northification, now or then.

Liberal agenda ?
Lincoln had his hands full. It wasn't just about slavery. It was about maintaining the union and the constitution, with its limited government.
Once Lincoln was gone, reconstruction didn't go as he had planned. I guess not much went on as he had planned.

[signart]

Right, he was the first big government pres. He wanted to expand the government and expand power over states rights. Take time to read Lincoln's inaugural address. States rights
have diminished to the point that they are unrecognizable from where this country was intended when it was established. States rights was intended to be bigger than the union. The whole nation was a confederation.
This country was setup as a confederation of states, a body of states united loosely so that all the states would retain sovereign power. The central government was to be dependent on the will of the states. Read the Articles of Confederation and decide for your self.
Seems no one can stand to hear the truth.

Read the actual words of the people that lived it, north or south. Read the words of the leaders, the generals, the letters of the soldiers, north or south. Forget what you have been told and search for truth. Peace & Love

[Patrick]

Right, he was the first big government pres. He wanted to expand the government and expand power over states rights. Take time to read Lincoln's inaugural address. States rights
have diminished to the point that they are unrecognizable from where this country was intended when it was established. States rights was intended to be bigger than the union. The whole nation was a confederation.
This country was setup as a confederation of states, a body of states united loosely so that all the states would retain sovereign power. The central government was to be dependent on the will of the states. Read the Articles of Confederation and decide for your self.
Seems no one can stand to hear the truth.

Read the actual words of the people that lived it, north or south. Read the words of the leaders, the generals, the letters of the soldiers, north or south. Forget what you have been told and search for truth. Peace & Love

I understand our history books were/are wrong and have spent decades trying to find the real history. I just don't see it as you do.

[Jess from VA]

Since it has now been referred to as Succession several times, it should be pointed out that the proper term is Secession.  

I like all three.  






While each has a bit different meaning, they all reflect American patriotism for me. 

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Since it has now been referred to as Succession several times, it should be pointed out that the proper term is Secession.  

Thanks my friend. If spell check doesn't fix it for me then I'm lost. 

[hubcapsc]

I understand our history books were/are wrong and have spent decades trying to find the real history. I just don't see it as you do.

Revisionist history...

[Jersey mike]

Well, as a northerner, from New Jersey ya see, when I see the flag I  have the same feeling as someone else pointed out, it reminds me of rebellious (Don't Tread on Me) attitude.

It also reminds me of Daisy Duke and I don't think that's a bad thing, the show was fun to watch too when I was a kid.

I don't think I had any ancestors who fought in the Civil War, at least from my fathers side.

[Jess from VA]

Since it has now been referred to as Succession several times, it should be pointed out that the proper term is Secession.  

Thanks my friend. If spell check doesn't fix it for me then I'm lost. 

I'm not throwing stones man, there are a number of words I misspell by hand or on a keyboard (especially the keyboard) my whole life.  It's like spelling dyslexia. 

[BF]

I'd better start buying Dukes of Hazzard DVDs while they're still available!

Next thing ya know, they'll be want'n to ban Daisy Dukes. 

[The emperor has no clothes]

I'd better start buying Dukes of Hazzard DVDs while they're still available!

Next thing ya know, they'll be want'n to ban Daisy Dukes. 

Blasphemy !!! BF. Blasphemy !!!

[Oss]

Thanks Jess, spell checker kept giving the wrong one and I was too lazy to check myself

BF................dude !

Thanks

[Crackerborn]

I believe my handle pretty well tells where I fall on the flag issue. As a southern boy living in the Great White North (snow, not race), I see as much racial disparity up here as I ever saw in the southlands. I see the battle flag of Virginia flown often by children that have no concept what it really means to those of us born and raised in the Deep South. I understand that those who refuse to actually read about this country’s history and be led by puppet masters will never understand the long tradition of independence that this flag represents. Unfortunately, by banning the battle flag, the supposed racial emblem will become just that, a symbol of racial hatred and become a banner for the haters, much like the swastika, which was a Hindu symbol of unity long before the Nazi’s stole it from them. It is said that history is written by the winners, in this case history is being subverted by the willingly led.

[RP#62]

Good on ya Atlantans

https://ca.news.yahoo.com/july-4-crowds-ignore-call-boycott-georgia-park-203102664.html

-RP

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Since it has now been referred to as Succession several times, it should be pointed out that the proper term is Secession.  

Thanks my friend. If spell check doesn't fix it for me then I'm lost. 

I'm not throwing stones man, there are a number of words I misspell by hand or on a keyboard (especially the keyboard) my whole life.  It's like spelling dyslexia. 

I knew you weren't and I appreciated the correction.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

I'd better start buying Dukes of Hazzard DVDs while they're still available!

Next thing ya know, they'll be want'n to ban Daisy Dukes. 

One of the many great things about this club is that virtually any conversation can suddenly become "scenic". 

[threevalks]

                    Just as with the gun bans that caused gun sales to skyrocket.  The flag ban has started a huge sale and showing of Confederate battle flags.
                  Ripley West Virginia has one of the largest small town 4th of July celebrations in the country. Bush was there during his presidency in 2002. Yesterday there were confederate flags flying everywhere.
                 The squeaky wheel gets the grease.  It's about time the majority of the people become the squeaky wheel, and put a stop to all the nonsense in this country. We are headed to hell in a hand basket.

[Smokinjoe-VRCCDS#0005]

                    Just as with the gun bans, that caused gun sales to skyrocket.  The flag ban has started a huge sale and showing of Confederate battle flags.
                  Ripley West Virginia has one of the largest small town 4th of July celebrations in the country. Bush was there during his presidency in 2002. Yesterday there were confederate flags flying everywhere.
                 The squeaky wheel gets the grease.  It's about time the majority of the people become the squeaky wheel, and put a stop to all the nonsense in this country. We are headed to hell in a hand basket.

Well said ... I agree 

[Pappy!]

Ditto......the Liberal PC mindset is really getting to be a drag on the country.

[Bighead]

Ditto......the Liberal PC mindset is really getting to be a drag on the country.

I am jus
I am damn tired of them "knowing" what is best for everyone else

[signart]

Looks like the flag will come down from the monument in S.C. as early as Thursday if the politicians have their way. There will be NO vote by the people to which the property belongs. If the people of S.C. don't take a stand, it will be lost and will snowball from there. Stand, and I'll be there to stand with you, but it's S.C.'s fight to wage.

[Patrick]

From what I saw and understand there were more confederate flags at the NASCAR race yesterday than ever. I saw one mounted above the Stars and Stripes.
Apparently no one took 'advantage' of the exchange program.

[..]

I saw lots of proud flag flying over the weekend whilst I was around the Cherohala Skyway.

All of "the flags" were of course flying below the Stars and Stripes.

[Jess from VA]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2015/07/06/nascar-faces-rebellion-as-confederate-flags-fly-at-daytona/

[..]

Prats

https://youtu.be/ic7XamDyy_s

[Davemn]

A Hartland volunteer firefighter was suspended Sunday for flying a Confederate flag on the back of a fire truck during Friday’s Third of July Parade, and he said he expects to be asked to resign.

Brian Nielsen, 43, who has been with the department for about 10 years, said in an earlier interview that he flew the flag because he’s fed up with political correctness and that so many people across the country are trying to change history by taking the flag away. He said he didn’t think flying the flag would spur as much discussion as it has.

He said neither his town nor his department had anything to do with it.

“It was my decision and I didn’t think it was going to be a big deal, but boy was I wrong,” Nielsen said.

He said Hartland Fire Chief Trent Wangen suspended him Sunday pending an investigation.

“More than likely I’ll probably be asked to step down,” Nielsen said. “I respect that and will do that if they want.”

The display has sparked controversy in the community, across the state and even in other states.


Lester said she was in disbelief when she saw the Confederate flag on the back of Hartland’s fire truck.

“In years previous it would have been offensive, yes, but considering the current events that go along with the Confederate flag — whether you think it stands for that or not — makes it all the more shocking,” she said.

Lester said she is glad that people are talking about the issue on social media but wishes people could be more civil in their discussions about it. She said the responses she has received from people who are against her about the issue have been disrespectful, and she has even questioned whether Albert Lea is a community where she wants her family to live because of the insults she has witnessed. She also wishes the city could get more recognition for the positive things it does, rather than the negative.

She said though some may view the Confederate flag as a symbol of states’ rights versus the national government, that is not what it represents for ancestors of union soldiers or ancestors of slaves.

“This isn’t about erasing that part of our history,” she said. “It’s about acknowledging that that was an ugly part of our history.”

Lulu Walker, another Albert Lea resident, said she was upset to see the flag on the back of the Hartland truck after spending a majority of the day before the parade reading news about several predominantly black churches in the South being set ablaze because someone did not like the color of a person’s skin.

“For a fire department to display the symbol that these arsonists champion is sickeningly ironic, uninformed and done in bad taste,” she said. “I believe in freedom of speech, but I also believe in the freedom to worship without fear of being killed.”

Nielsen said he was told the Chamber of Commerce is having a special meeting on the subject Tuesday. He said he’s willing to go and make a public apology.

“I’m sorry for what I caused my town, the Hartland Fire Department and even my family,” he said.

Nielsen, who is white, said he’s not a racist.

“I don’t see race,” he said. “Black and white are the same to me. My belief is that ‘politically correct’ is going too far.”

[signart]

That fireman is clearly an arsonist and should be tried for burning churches. We all know that all black church fires are caused by arson. All arsonist are white, this is a fact because everybody says so. We should burn and loot all the businesses in that town, so this will never happen again. Even if found innocent, he should never hold a job of any kind.

[Xtracho]

In fact we have a confederate flag that was captured by The 1st Minnesota from South Carolina in a museum. We won't give it back. Lots of lives lost, lots of Union soldiers too.

Kind of hypocritical that a captured confederate flag carries with it the symbolism of "lots of lives lost" in Minnesota but that same symbolism is being eradicated for those of us with true southern heritage. And not giving it back clearly cements that sentiment.

I've been reticent to comment on this post, mostly following along and trying to keep my blood below the boiling point. But this comment is beyond the pale.

I had ancestors that fought & died under that flag. Namesakes they were. As I am sure many that are posting in this thread. Never have I thrust upon anyone my pride in my heritage. Well now that's changed. I'm fed up with revisionist history and its agenda to erase every last vestige of the ancestry and heritage that many of us hold near and dear to our hearts. Once again, playing the race card has hatched the mouth breathers that are so steeped in the lies that the South is a hot bed of racism. That the flag represents that racist stereotype.

Conservative or not, gun owner or not....that quoted comment is disgusting on its face.

[Varmintmist]

I've always heard the saying. "The South will rise again" and I think this is or should be the time to follow thru. 

If they do, they owe my family a bunch of cash from when they stole and burned everything from the farm when they burned Chambersburg, and I still have the receipts, in 1860's dollars. Horses, cattle, hay, fence posts all itemized. Of course the first income tax came about because of the uprising, so thanks to that, I likely wouldnt see much anyway.

[signart]

I've always heard the saying. "The South will rise again" and I think this is or should be the time to follow thru.  

If they do, they owe my family a bunch of cash from when they stole and burned everything from the farm when they burned Chambersburg, and I still have the receipts, in 1860's dollars. Horses, cattle, hay, fence posts all itemized. Of course the first income tax came about because of the uprising, so thanks to that, I likely wouldnt see much anyway.

Chump change, gladly paid plus interest after the feds pay for burning, murdering, and looting the entire South all the way to the sea. Start by paying for my Great Grand fathers farm in Tennessee, looted and burned, taking all the food and crops he raised to feed his family, and killing what animals the yanks didn't steal.
No one killed in Chambersburg, but several farms saved by compassionate Confederates, at least one officer arrested for refusing to participate. Several Rebels died in ambush by northerners from Chambersburg.
Chambersburg, the only northern town destroyed by the Confederates, for that I regret.

We have saying in the South, don't start nothin' and there won't be nothin'.

[KG]

Here in Memphis all the civil war parks have been renamed, Confederate Park is now the Health and Sciences Park.

The black mayor wants to remove the statue and body of Nathan Bedford Forrest and his wife from the Park. When asked if he was also going to tear down the Lorraine motel also he refused to answer.

[FryeVRCCDS0067]

Here in Memphis all the civil war parks have been renamed, Confederate Park is now the Health and Sciences Park.

The black mayor wants to remove the statue and body of Nathan Bedford Forrest and his wife from the Park. When asked if he was also going to tear down the Lorraine motel also he refused to answer.

Renaming the park. Sounds like something right out of 1984. Sad indeed. We need to win this next election!

[hubcapsc]

I've always heard the saying. "The South will rise again" and I think this is or should be the time to follow thru. 

If they do, they owe my family a bunch of cash from when they stole and burned everything from the farm when they burned Chambersburg, and I still have the receipts, in 1860's dollars. Horses, cattle, hay, fence posts all itemized. Of course the first income tax came about because of the uprising, so thanks to that, I likely wouldnt see much anyway.

Ol' Jube burned Chambersburg as retribution for all the towns the Yankees had already burned
in the South...

Lynchburg VA June 1st 1882

Dear Sir

            In reply to your enquiries I have to inform you that the Town of Chambersburg was burned on the same day in which the demand on it was made by McCausland and refused – It was ascertained That a force of the enemy’s cavalry was approaching, and there was no time for delay – Moreover the refusal was peremptory, and there was no reason for delay, unless the demand was a mere idle threat –

            As to the other enquiry – I had no knowledge of what amount of money there might be in Chambersburg – I knew that it was a town of some Twelve Thousand inhabitants – The Town of Fredrick in Maryland, which was a much smaller town than Chambersburg, had in June very promptly responded to my demand on it for $200.000 – Some of the inhabitants, who were friendly to us, expressed a regret that I had not put my demand at $500,000. There was one or more National Banks at Chambersburg, and the Town ought to have been able to raise the sum I demanded − I soon heard that the refusal was based on inability to pay such a sum, and there was no offer to pay any sum. The value of the houses destroyed & h…[?], with their contents, was fully $100,000 in gold, and at the time I made the demand the price of gold in greenbacks had very nearly reached $3.00, and was going up rapidly. Hence it was that I required the $500,000 in greenbacks, if the gold was not paid. To provide against any further depreciation of the paper money.

I would have been fully justified by the laws of retaliation in war, in burning the town, without giving the inhabitants the opportunity of redeeming in.

            Very Respectfully Yours

            J A Early

[hubcapsc]

I needed a motorcycle ride, having missed several good ones recently.

I plotted out back roads to Columbia and when down to mix with
the lunatic fringe at the State House...

I parked the bike eight or ten blocks away, and as I reached the
State House, it looked like this:



I went up the steps and stood in the shade with some flag holders...
it was kind of a circus, a few people yelling at each other, a bunch
of reporters and camera men, and lots of police and sled agents
with armor on... you can see a couple of armored sled agents
down in the left of this picture paying attention to an argument
in the crowd...



-Mike "**** it, let's ride  "

[Bighead]

There were 4 rallies within 40 miles of my house on Saturday and there were hundreds of the Stars and Bars flying.  
DaveMN I don't know where the town you speak of is but I for one commend him for standing up for something he believes in and if they ask him to resign who is it hurting? Just the town as he was A Volunteer Fire fighter and I know of no Volunteer FF's that are paid.

[Patrick]

The South Carolina senate has just voted to take down or ban the flag.  Where will this go from here ?

If that POS that shot those 9 folks in Charlestown had not had the flag in that picture of him this may not have been such an issue.